Accreditors are considering dropping diversity requirements

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

There's only one segment who wants this and they actually come from those systems.... so the question is why.

They don’t like having to actually think.

Hmmm interesting self-reflection from you …

I get that you exist in a cloud of gotcha arguments, but there’s no appeal to the gaokao. Your kids probably study enough, now imagine everything they done making them behind and they’d need to restart high school at 4 times the pace, go to Saturday school, and stay till 10 pm in order to catch up with their competition

All these are just smear campaigns against those talented kids, trying to reduce them into someone who can only put in hours, as if effort without ability explains everything. as if grinding alone could produce that level of excellence. It’s projection, and a bitter attempt to drag others down to justify their own mediocrity. You can’t match the results, so you attack the method.

I can't match the result? No, I can't, because I chose Harvard over having the goal of Peking University. The systems in East Asia are toxic and awfully demanding for children.

Again, you’re equating merit based system with Chinese system, part of your smear campaign. You don’t sound too smart.

Then...talk about a merit based system that wouldn't include a dramatic resorting of our education process and intense climb in academics.

Intense climb? Really? Is it possible they’re just smarter and have better intellectual talent?

what merit system do you want? What practical changes do you want to see? Not everything needs to be a flex about your intelligence.

Something not based on one’s identity to start with. How about that?

Which would include...? I'm asking for changes in processes, not your personal propaganda.

Go back to search this thread to find out the specifics. I sssume you’re at least capable of doing that which doesn’t involve much intelligence.

Yeah, your adjectives list isn't helpful. People want to know changes to their children's education and what to prioritize. Not that you're grumpy black people got into college.

No you don’t want to know anything. You just wanted the status quo’s which isn’t happening. Too bad. Cry me a river.

? Make a point, Jesus.

You’re too dumb to see the point. It’s like dumb students keeep asking teachers to explain a simple concept again and again. Now I get your hatred towards meritocracy.

Your point has been made. You don't have anything to say, but you hate black people. We get it, but that isn't exactly an indictment of anything but your personal racism. Now, are you ready to talk about what a meritocratic system looks like or will you cower again with some other nonsensical personal insult that won't carry the conversation. You've run away every time I've basically asked you to explain your perspective.

Haha so what they say about your political ideology is true. To you people, everything is identity and you accuse people racist after losing an argument.

You haven't really made any claims other than the fact that you hate diversity, so not an unreasonable take that you may just be racist.

Okay so I’m a racist for asking not considering race in decision making. I guess you win the argument as you’ll be the last to post in this thread. Have a nice day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

There's only one segment who wants this and they actually come from those systems.... so the question is why.

They don’t like having to actually think.

Hmmm interesting self-reflection from you …

I get that you exist in a cloud of gotcha arguments, but there’s no appeal to the gaokao. Your kids probably study enough, now imagine everything they done making them behind and they’d need to restart high school at 4 times the pace, go to Saturday school, and stay till 10 pm in order to catch up with their competition

All these are just smear campaigns against those talented kids, trying to reduce them into someone who can only put in hours, as if effort without ability explains everything. as if grinding alone could produce that level of excellence. It’s projection, and a bitter attempt to drag others down to justify their own mediocrity. You can’t match the results, so you attack the method.

I can't match the result? No, I can't, because I chose Harvard over having the goal of Peking University. The systems in East Asia are toxic and awfully demanding for children.

Again, you’re equating merit based system with Chinese system, part of your smear campaign. You don’t sound too smart.

Then...talk about a merit based system that wouldn't include a dramatic resorting of our education process and intense climb in academics.

Intense climb? Really? Is it possible they’re just smarter and have better intellectual talent?

what merit system do you want? What practical changes do you want to see? Not everything needs to be a flex about your intelligence.

Something not based on one’s identity to start with. How about that?

Which would include...? I'm asking for changes in processes, not your personal propaganda.

Go back to search this thread to find out the specifics. I sssume you’re at least capable of doing that which doesn’t involve much intelligence.

Yeah, your adjectives list isn't helpful. People want to know changes to their children's education and what to prioritize. Not that you're grumpy black people got into college.

No you don’t want to know anything. You just wanted the status quo’s which isn’t happening. Too bad. Cry me a river.

? Make a point, Jesus.

You’re too dumb to see the point. It’s like dumb students keeep asking teachers to explain a simple concept again and again. Now I get your hatred towards meritocracy.

Your point has been made. You don't have anything to say, but you hate black people. We get it, but that isn't exactly an indictment of anything but your personal racism. Now, are you ready to talk about what a meritocratic system looks like or will you cower again with some other nonsensical personal insult that won't carry the conversation. You've run away every time I've basically asked you to explain your perspective.

Haha so what they say about your political ideology is true. To you people, everything is identity and you accuse people racist after losing an argument.

You haven't really made any claims other than the fact that you hate diversity, so not an unreasonable take that you may just be racist.

Okay so I’m a racist for asking not considering race in decision making. I guess you win the argument as you’ll be the last to post in this thread. Have a nice day.

No you've just been screeching post over post about how much you hate diversity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

There's only one segment who wants this and they actually come from those systems.... so the question is why.

They don’t like having to actually think.

Hmmm interesting self-reflection from you …

I get that you exist in a cloud of gotcha arguments, but there’s no appeal to the gaokao. Your kids probably study enough, now imagine everything they done making them behind and they’d need to restart high school at 4 times the pace, go to Saturday school, and stay till 10 pm in order to catch up with their competition

All these are just smear campaigns against those talented kids, trying to reduce them into someone who can only put in hours, as if effort without ability explains everything. as if grinding alone could produce that level of excellence. It’s projection, and a bitter attempt to drag others down to justify their own mediocrity. You can’t match the results, so you attack the method.

I can't match the result? No, I can't, because I chose Harvard over having the goal of Peking University. The systems in East Asia are toxic and awfully demanding for children.

Again, you’re equating merit based system with Chinese system, part of your smear campaign. You don’t sound too smart.

Then...talk about a merit based system that wouldn't include a dramatic resorting of our education process and intense climb in academics.

Intense climb? Really? Is it possible they’re just smarter and have better intellectual talent?

what merit system do you want? What practical changes do you want to see? Not everything needs to be a flex about your intelligence.

Something not based on one’s identity to start with. How about that?

Which would include...? I'm asking for changes in processes, not your personal propaganda.

Go back to search this thread to find out the specifics. I sssume you’re at least capable of doing that which doesn’t involve much intelligence.

Yeah, your adjectives list isn't helpful. People want to know changes to their children's education and what to prioritize. Not that you're grumpy black people got into college.

No you don’t want to know anything. You just wanted the status quo’s which isn’t happening. Too bad. Cry me a river.

? Make a point, Jesus.

You’re too dumb to see the point. It’s like dumb students keeep asking teachers to explain a simple concept again and again. Now I get your hatred towards meritocracy.

Your point has been made. You don't have anything to say, but you hate black people. We get it, but that isn't exactly an indictment of anything but your personal racism. Now, are you ready to talk about what a meritocratic system looks like or will you cower again with some other nonsensical personal insult that won't carry the conversation. You've run away every time I've basically asked you to explain your perspective.

Haha so what they say about your political ideology is true. To you people, everything is identity and you accuse people racist after losing an argument.

You haven't really made any claims other than the fact that you hate diversity, so not an unreasonable take that you may just be racist.

Okay so I’m a racist for asking not considering race in decision making. I guess you win the argument as you’ll be the last to post in this thread. Have a nice day.

Should black students be allowed in higher education?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

There's only one segment who wants this and they actually come from those systems.... so the question is why.

They don’t like having to actually think.

Hmmm interesting self-reflection from you …

I get that you exist in a cloud of gotcha arguments, but there’s no appeal to the gaokao. Your kids probably study enough, now imagine everything they done making them behind and they’d need to restart high school at 4 times the pace, go to Saturday school, and stay till 10 pm in order to catch up with their competition

All these are just smear campaigns against those talented kids, trying to reduce them into someone who can only put in hours, as if effort without ability explains everything. as if grinding alone could produce that level of excellence. It’s projection, and a bitter attempt to drag others down to justify their own mediocrity. You can’t match the results, so you attack the method.

I can't match the result? No, I can't, because I chose Harvard over having the goal of Peking University. The systems in East Asia are toxic and awfully demanding for children.

Again, you’re equating merit based system with Chinese system, part of your smear campaign. You don’t sound too smart.

Then...talk about a merit based system that wouldn't include a dramatic resorting of our education process and intense climb in academics.

Intense climb? Really? Is it possible they’re just smarter and have better intellectual talent?

what merit system do you want? What practical changes do you want to see? Not everything needs to be a flex about your intelligence.

Something not based on one’s identity to start with. How about that?

Which would include...? I'm asking for changes in processes, not your personal propaganda.

Go back to search this thread to find out the specifics. I sssume you’re at least capable of doing that which doesn’t involve much intelligence.

Yeah, your adjectives list isn't helpful. People want to know changes to their children's education and what to prioritize. Not that you're grumpy black people got into college.

No you don’t want to know anything. You just wanted the status quo’s which isn’t happening. Too bad. Cry me a river.

? Make a point, Jesus.

You’re too dumb to see the point. It’s like dumb students keeep asking teachers to explain a simple concept again and again. Now I get your hatred towards meritocracy.

Your point has been made. You don't have anything to say, but you hate black people. We get it, but that isn't exactly an indictment of anything but your personal racism. Now, are you ready to talk about what a meritocratic system looks like or will you cower again with some other nonsensical personal insult that won't carry the conversation. You've run away every time I've basically asked you to explain your perspective.

Haha so what they say about your political ideology is true. To you people, everything is identity and you accuse people racist after losing an argument.

You haven't really made any claims other than the fact that you hate diversity, so not an unreasonable take that you may just be racist.

Okay so I’m a racist for asking not considering race in decision making. I guess you win the argument as you’ll be the last to post in this thread. Have a nice day.

Should black students be allowed in higher education?

Please, you’re being racist. Are you saying black people aren’t capable of getting into any college if it’s only based on merit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

There's only one segment who wants this and they actually come from those systems.... so the question is why.

They don’t like having to actually think.

Hmmm interesting self-reflection from you …

I get that you exist in a cloud of gotcha arguments, but there’s no appeal to the gaokao. Your kids probably study enough, now imagine everything they done making them behind and they’d need to restart high school at 4 times the pace, go to Saturday school, and stay till 10 pm in order to catch up with their competition

All these are just smear campaigns against those talented kids, trying to reduce them into someone who can only put in hours, as if effort without ability explains everything. as if grinding alone could produce that level of excellence. It’s projection, and a bitter attempt to drag others down to justify their own mediocrity. You can’t match the results, so you attack the method.

I can't match the result? No, I can't, because I chose Harvard over having the goal of Peking University. The systems in East Asia are toxic and awfully demanding for children.

Again, you’re equating merit based system with Chinese system, part of your smear campaign. You don’t sound too smart.

Then...talk about a merit based system that wouldn't include a dramatic resorting of our education process and intense climb in academics.

Intense climb? Really? Is it possible they’re just smarter and have better intellectual talent?

what merit system do you want? What practical changes do you want to see? Not everything needs to be a flex about your intelligence.

Something not based on one’s identity to start with. How about that?

Which would include...? I'm asking for changes in processes, not your personal propaganda.

Go back to search this thread to find out the specifics. I sssume you’re at least capable of doing that which doesn’t involve much intelligence.

Yeah, your adjectives list isn't helpful. People want to know changes to their children's education and what to prioritize. Not that you're grumpy black people got into college.

No you don’t want to know anything. You just wanted the status quo’s which isn’t happening. Too bad. Cry me a river.

? Make a point, Jesus.

You’re too dumb to see the point. It’s like dumb students keeep asking teachers to explain a simple concept again and again. Now I get your hatred towards meritocracy.

Your point has been made. You don't have anything to say, but you hate black people. We get it, but that isn't exactly an indictment of anything but your personal racism. Now, are you ready to talk about what a meritocratic system looks like or will you cower again with some other nonsensical personal insult that won't carry the conversation. You've run away every time I've basically asked you to explain your perspective.

Haha so what they say about your political ideology is true. To you people, everything is identity and you accuse people racist after losing an argument.

You haven't really made any claims other than the fact that you hate diversity, so not an unreasonable take that you may just be racist.

Okay so I’m a racist for asking not considering race in decision making. I guess you win the argument as you’ll be the last to post in this thread. Have a nice day.

Should black students be allowed in higher education?

Please, you’re being racist. Are you saying black people aren’t capable of getting into any college if it’s only based on merit?

That wasn’t the question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would hope that we aren’t supporting the idea of being fine with schools discriminating just because the far right mod of to blame everything on DEI. It’s concerning how quickly everyone is forcing the pendulum in the exact opposite direction. People need to accept a bit of balance.

Can you point to any reactionary discrimination?
Can you point to colleges discriminating against blacks and hispanics the way asian were able to prove discrimination against asians?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Choosing someone for their race constitutes discriminating against someone else for their race in college applications. And of course that should be illegal.

How would people like it if some college said, “We require at least 95% white people! Oh we aren’t discriminating against black people really! We just want at least 95% white people.” Everyone would be outraged.

We should also avoid scenario 2. What’s clear amongst republicans is they want an outright reduction and make it near impossible for poor students and students of color to enter higher ed, at least the highest rungs of higher ed. They continue to sue schools who don’t have the type of diversity they want and continue to perpetuate the idea that black students are inherently worse applicants.

It has always been nearly impossible for poor students to compete with wealthy students and compete at the highest level. It is a rare talent that can overcome large wealth differences.

It is NOT a rare talent that can overcome racial disparity. Harvard is about 15%black. Without preferences it would be 6-8% black. This is not nothing but by pushing the rope to 15% you get a situation where Harvard is cannibalizing the Columbias of the world to achieve that 15% and the least qualified black students struggle a little bit because Harvard really isn't significantly more difficult than Columbia. But then Columbia has to cannibalize the Cornells of the world and by the time Cornell tries to achieve its diversity goals it is getting URM students that would have otherwise gone to USC and Northeastern and now the differences are large enough that almost none of the URM students are among the top students and are grossly over-represented among the worst performing students. If each of these schools accepted based on merit, they would all have somewhere between 6-8% black and 8-10% hispanic with the difference going pretty evenly to asians and whites.

This isn't RWNJs saying that this is how the numbers would shake out based on race blaind admissions standards. This is Harvard and the amicus briefs saying this is how the numbers would shake out without explicit racial preferences like affimative action.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Choosing someone for their race constitutes discriminating against someone else for their race in college applications. And of course that should be illegal.

How would people like it if some college said, “We require at least 95% white people! Oh we aren’t discriminating against black people really! We just want at least 95% white people.” Everyone would be outraged.

We should also avoid scenario 2. What’s clear amongst republicans is they want an outright reduction and make it near impossible for poor students and students of color to enter higher ed, at least the highest rungs of higher ed. They continue to sue schools who don’t have the type of diversity they want and continue to perpetuate the idea that black students are inherently worse applicants.

Stop that BS propaganda! The biggest beneficiary of DEI has always been rich blacks and Hispanics (they’re actually mostly white people). It has never been about the poors.

Okay? But now trump is making it difficult for poor black and Hispanic people to go to college. His loan policies are awful and the endowment tax discourages institutions from taking in low income students.

Also questbridge, the outcomes of various top CBOs, and fly in programs combat your nonsense about “biggest beneficiaries of DEI.” The biggest beneficiaries of DEI were white women, who have soured after getting access to education and then students from impoverished, first gen backgrounds.

Questbridge accounted for almost nothing before the SFFA case gained steam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

There's only one segment who wants this and they actually come from those systems.... so the question is why.

They don’t like having to actually think.

Hmmm interesting self-reflection from you …

I get that you exist in a cloud of gotcha arguments, but there’s no appeal to the gaokao. Your kids probably study enough, now imagine everything they done making them behind and they’d need to restart high school at 4 times the pace, go to Saturday school, and stay till 10 pm in order to catch up with their competition

All these are just smear campaigns against those talented kids, trying to reduce them into someone who can only put in hours, as if effort without ability explains everything. as if grinding alone could produce that level of excellence. It’s projection, and a bitter attempt to drag others down to justify their own mediocrity. You can’t match the results, so you attack the method.

I can't match the result? No, I can't, because I chose Harvard over having the goal of Peking University. The systems in East Asia are toxic and awfully demanding for children.

Again, you’re equating merit based system with Chinese system, part of your smear campaign. You don’t sound too smart.

Then...talk about a merit based system that wouldn't include a dramatic resorting of our education process and intense climb in academics.

Intense climb? Really? Is it possible they’re just smarter and have better intellectual talent?

Not likely, and if you think that intellectual talent is HYPSM main priority you really don’t get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.chronicle.com/article/under-pressure-from-trump-the-accreditor-overseeing-harvard-proposes-nixing-dei-standards

This is a pretty big dinner of a lot of the push for diversity over merit. You think these schools are woke? This is where a lot of it comes from

The meritocracy crowd wants us to turn into china.

So it’s okay to turn into Europe but not China?

I don’t want either. I don’t want a Gaokao or an a levels system in the US. If you do, that’s…interesting, but I don’t think there’s a massive push to make high school much much harder than it currently is.

Having merit based process and taking away racist considerations is not adopting the Chinese system. And nobody cares what you want or don’t want. You can’t stop it.

? give me a step by step as to how this leads us to a "merit based process." What does merit even look like for you? No top school is choosing solely by top SAT and gpa.

No, meritocracy doesn’t mean SAT and GPA only. But surely it doesn’t include race and sexual orientation etc.

I'd prefer that system. Just scale the SAT to be towards the top 0.01% of students rather than the bottom 50%.

Your kid would miss that by about 50% so I’m not sure why you prefer such a system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A good system would be merit, so these whiners would realize their kids are nowhere near the top of intellect.

The issue is that merit and SES go hand in hand. Which is why it makes sense to make an effort to include first gen college students and students from lower SES, regardless of race.

No we should just commit to highest intellect. Poor people can go to other schools if they aren't smart. We should be about intellect first.

If you believe that “highest intellect” can be identified using a common test and testing a population at a certain age without regard to previous circumstances it is your intellect which is lacking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would hope that we aren’t supporting the idea of being fine with schools discriminating just because the far right mod of to blame everything on DEI. It’s concerning how quickly everyone is forcing the pendulum in the exact opposite direction. People need to accept a bit of balance.

100%. I am against hiring on the basis of race, and therefore I have never been a big fan of affirmative action. But now what I am seeing is that the people crying "racism" against white and asian people are ones who don't mind racism towards black and hispanic people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would hope that we aren’t supporting the idea of being fine with schools discriminating just because the far right mod of to blame everything on DEI. It’s concerning how quickly everyone is forcing the pendulum in the exact opposite direction. People need to accept a bit of balance.

100%. I am against hiring on the basis of race, and therefore I have never been a big fan of affirmative action. But now what I am seeing is that the people crying "racism" against white and asian people are ones who don't mind racism towards black and hispanic people.

Specify what racism? It’s so obvious you’re just pretending to be a moderate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would hope that we aren’t supporting the idea of being fine with schools discriminating just because the far right mod of to blame everything on DEI. It’s concerning how quickly everyone is forcing the pendulum in the exact opposite direction. People need to accept a bit of balance.

Can you point to any reactionary discrimination?
Can you point to colleges discriminating against blacks and hispanics the way asian were able to prove discrimination against asians?

Well this all started somewhere right? we just got out of affirmative action; i wouldn't be surprised if some institutions were risk averse and weren't looking to accept black students in high volumes for the near future. Under recruitment will become more popular if the trump admin persists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A good system would be merit, so these whiners would realize their kids are nowhere near the top of intellect.

The issue is that merit and SES go hand in hand. Which is why it makes sense to make an effort to include first gen college students and students from lower SES, regardless of race.

No we should just commit to highest intellect. Poor people can go to other schools if they aren't smart. We should be about intellect first.

If you believe that “highest intellect” can be identified using a common test and testing a population at a certain age without regard to previous circumstances it is your intellect which is lacking.

Yada yada. That justified you using brute force racial quota. Cry me a river. I don’t care.