Husbands - low value

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Weird my husband and I were JUST having this discussion - many of my wonderful, smart, fun, professionally successful, fun to talk with and engaging girlfriends husband’s are fine but honestly kind of duds in a lot of ways. At least much more than they are. Most of them have provided financially ok so not exactly what you’re referencing but they are DEFINITELY uninspiring comparatively to the wives. and this convo was mostly led by my husband who would prefer to be friends with these guys and was identifying that these girlfriends are particularly great/smart women who he enjoys but their husbands just don’t offer a lot - make their wives do most of the work, not that interesting to talk to, just a bummer.

We decided that though we hate to say it as the parents of boys, there is just a higher percentage of engaging, high performing women and less of those number of men probably because we often hold men to pretty low standards and let them get away with a lot. We also don’t encourage and support men in building community, learning how to share their feelings in healthy ways etc, all things that make for a more full happy life.

We see 40-50yo men with good careers and job titles but zero hobbies, interests, friends, life goals beyond work, or sports / fitness. They are incredibly boring to talk with and always change the subject to work. Even with their own children. I cannot imagine them on a first date, I guess they’d talk about their early 20s or something stupid!

Meanwhile their wives are thriving at their careers, in the community, with the kids and schools, doing pilates classes with friends, and planning fun multigenerational holidays.

We live in different worlds. In my world the 40-50yo men have a lot of hobbies and interests. They are golfing, hiking, hunting and more. They are having fun. The wives seem to be bored at home.

I know women with not so successful husbands. I know many more successful men than successful women. We live in an affluent neighborhood and I can think of very few marriages where the woman is the breadwinner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Weird my husband and I were JUST having this discussion - many of my wonderful, smart, fun, professionally successful, fun to talk with and engaging girlfriends husband’s are fine but honestly kind of duds in a lot of ways. At least much more than they are. Most of them have provided financially ok so not exactly what you’re referencing but they are DEFINITELY uninspiring comparatively to the wives. and this convo was mostly led by my husband who would prefer to be friends with these guys and was identifying that these girlfriends are particularly great/smart women who he enjoys but their husbands just don’t offer a lot - make their wives do most of the work, not that interesting to talk to, just a bummer.

We decided that though we hate to say it as the parents of boys, there is just a higher percentage of engaging, high performing women and less of those number of men probably because we often hold men to pretty low standards and let them get away with a lot. We also don’t encourage and support men in building community, learning how to share their feelings in healthy ways etc, all things that make for a more full happy life.

We see 40-50yo men with good careers and job titles but zero hobbies, interests, friends, life goals beyond work, or sports / fitness. They are incredibly boring to talk with and always change the subject to work. Even with their own children. I cannot imagine them on a first date, I guess they’d talk about their early 20s or something stupid!

Meanwhile their wives are thriving at their careers, in the community, with the kids and schools, doing pilates classes with friends, and planning fun multigenerational holidays.

We live in different worlds. In my world the 40-50yo men have a lot of hobbies and interests. They are golfing, hiking, hunting and more. They are having fun. The wives seem to be bored at home.

When we lived in Texas the married men were quite social- played tennis, golfed, weekly lunches w guy friends, family trips, practiced ball sports w their kids, traveled w their wife or family. And of course, church then brunch!

Here in DC it’s 50/50. Some have Bethany beach houses, or ski in PA, or theater interests….. and the other half have nothing to talk about except other people, the news or work. Maybe they were cool in college, who knows.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women are doing better than ever and yet still complaining about the "patriarchy". None of it makes sense.

You nailed it. None of it makes sense.
Women are doing better than men but are complaining about gender discrimination.

It does make sense. Most people, men or women, aren't in positions of power, but those in position of power are still largely men.

OP is saying that in her circle, she sees a lot of women who do better career wise than their men. That doesn't mean that they are at executive level, where again, it's mostly made up of men.

When OP says her friends' husbands aren't succeeding in there careers of course she means they are stuck as ICs not reaching upper management. What else can she mean?

It's hard to put my finger on it, but there's a contradiction in applauding her friends for succeeding outside their traditional gender role, but then criticizing their husbands for not succeeding in theirs. Why should men still be measured that way, but no one can suggest maybe OPs friends just aren't attractive enough to bag an ambitious man?

And maybe they don’t want or need one? If they have a demanding career and like it maybe it’s preferable if their DH works a normal job with normal hours? This may be a deliberate choice to enable their family life. Both DH and I have deliberately chosen not to pursue super high powered jobs that we probably could have. We have good professional jobs that enable us to have a perfectly nice life and lots of time with our family.

[Anonymous]

I know a whole bunch of couples where the wives had government careers and the husbands had private sector careers. Both halves of the couple seemed to want this. The wife wanted to be provided for and the husband wanted to be the provider.

The private sector was much more competitive than the government for most of my adulthood. You could coast pretty easily in the government but usually not in the private sector. Private sector employers tended to fire people more frequently. So some men ended up making twice or even five times what their wives made, but some men ended up struggling, feeling bad about themselves and appearing uninspiring to their wives.

Trump is changing this dynamic in some households because he's firing so many government workers, some of whom were actually very high performers by the standards of their professions but low earners by private sector standards. I realize that in some households, a man with a government job is the higher earning spouse, but that's not usually the situation in my social circle. Regardless of whether the husband or wife works in the government, households depending on government salaries don't usually have a lot of spare cash and are freaking out. If you lose your job in a field where the government was the primary employer or funder, you can have a really hard time.

Between Trump firing people who weren't supporting the Trump agenda and AI making lots of positions expendable in some industries, things are getting tough for some families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Weird my husband and I were JUST having this discussion - many of my wonderful, smart, fun, professionally successful, fun to talk with and engaging girlfriends husband’s are fine but honestly kind of duds in a lot of ways. At least much more than they are. Most of them have provided financially ok so not exactly what you’re referencing but they are DEFINITELY uninspiring comparatively to the wives. and this convo was mostly led by my husband who would prefer to be friends with these guys and was identifying that these girlfriends are particularly great/smart women who he enjoys but their husbands just don’t offer a lot - make their wives do most of the work, not that interesting to talk to, just a bummer.

We decided that though we hate to say it as the parents of boys, there is just a higher percentage of engaging, high performing women and less of those number of men probably because we often hold men to pretty low standards and let them get away with a lot. We also don’t encourage and support men in building community, learning how to share their feelings in healthy ways etc, all things that make for a more full happy life.

We see 40-50yo men with good careers and job titles but zero hobbies, interests, friends, life goals beyond work, or sports / fitness. They are incredibly boring to talk with and always change the subject to work. Even with their own children. I cannot imagine them on a first date, I guess they’d talk about their early 20s or something stupid!

Meanwhile their wives are thriving at their careers, in the community, with the kids and schools, doing pilates classes with friends, and planning fun multigenerational holidays.

We live in different worlds. In my world the 40-50yo men have a lot of hobbies and interests. They are golfing, hiking, hunting and more. They are having fun. The wives seem to be bored at home.

I know women with not so successful husbands. I know many more successful men than successful women. We live in an affluent neighborhood and I can think of very few marriages where the woman is the breadwinner.

Same. I do know a lot of dual income homes where the woman and man are roughly equal earners I’d guess and both have respectable careers and interests and friends. But that’s not what op is talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Weird my husband and I were JUST having this discussion - many of my wonderful, smart, fun, professionally successful, fun to talk with and engaging girlfriends husband’s are fine but honestly kind of duds in a lot of ways. At least much more than they are. Most of them have provided financially ok so not exactly what you’re referencing but they are DEFINITELY uninspiring comparatively to the wives. and this convo was mostly led by my husband who would prefer to be friends with these guys and was identifying that these girlfriends are particularly great/smart women who he enjoys but their husbands just don’t offer a lot - make their wives do most of the work, not that interesting to talk to, just a bummer.

We decided that though we hate to say it as the parents of boys, there is just a higher percentage of engaging, high performing women and less of those number of men probably because we often hold men to pretty low standards and let them get away with a lot. We also don’t encourage and support men in building community, learning how to share their feelings in healthy ways etc, all things that make for a more full happy life.

We see 40-50yo men with good careers and job titles but zero hobbies, interests, friends, life goals beyond work, or sports / fitness. They are incredibly boring to talk with and always change the subject to work. Even with their own children. I cannot imagine them on a first date, I guess they’d talk about their early 20s or something stupid!

Meanwhile their wives are thriving at their careers, in the community, with the kids and schools, doing pilates classes with friends, and planning fun multigenerational holidays.

We live in different worlds. In my world the 40-50yo men have a lot of hobbies and interests. They are golfing, hiking, hunting and more. They are having fun. The wives seem to be bored at home.

When we lived in Texas the married men were quite social- played tennis, golfed, weekly lunches w guy friends, family trips, practiced ball sports w their kids, traveled w their wife or family. And of course, church then brunch!

Here in DC it’s 50/50. Some have Bethany beach houses, or ski in PA, or theater interests….. and the other half have nothing to talk about except other people, the news or work. Maybe they were cool in college, who knows.

Nothing to talk about ?

That is a goal in life ?

[Anonymous]

People age differently. Some people were always duds and continue to be duds. Some people have health problems.

I’m in my late forties. I don’t keep track of which part of the couple is doing better. In our circles, the men do better professionally.

Some people age poorly. I have one friend who seems to be getting better with age (plastic surgery, nutrition, self care) while her husband is withering away. When we first met them, the guy was probably more physically fit and attractive. He definitely seems like a low value man now not working, having health problems, not as sharp, etc. Once upon a time, he paid for all their bills while she was a SAHM of their two kids, was very muscular and super social. I wonder if my hot getting better with age friend will dump her husband. They were very much in love when they first got married. He seem like dead weight now.

OP is being quite shallow. I think there are many more men who have wives who may have mommy tracked or stayed home with kids than vice versa. It seems less about careers and more about family and compatibility. I have seen more competent women dump their husbands than husbands who keep their older wives.

[Anonymous]

It’s hard to have two go getters in one family - unless there are no children. The frequent dynamic is one goal getter and one default parent on what used to be called the mommy track.

[Anonymous]

I just met up with an old friend. The husband recently retired or got pushed out of his job. The wife is a high level executive. The wife was always demanding but now she just barks orders. The husband does most/all of the housework and shuffling kids around. I have a similar set up but I’m the wife. It didn’t look like a good look. I think it is the way she treated her husband that seemed so emasculating. I would not be surprised if they don’t make it as a couple. Wife is very engaging, beautiful and aggressive. They just seem like an off couple now. She is constantly surrounded by polished type A go getters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People age differently. Some people were always duds and continue to be duds. Some people have health problems.

I’m in my late forties. I don’t keep track of which part of the couple is doing better. In our circles, the men do better professionally.

Some people age poorly. I have one friend who seems to be getting better with age (plastic surgery, nutrition, self care) while her husband is withering away. When we first met them, the guy was probably more physically fit and attractive. He definitely seems like a low value man now not working, having health problems, not as sharp, etc. Once upon a time, he paid for all their bills while she was a SAHM of their two kids, was very muscular and super social. I wonder if my hot getting better with age friend will dump her husband. They were very much in love when they first got married. He seem like dead weight now.

OP is being quite shallow. I think there are many more men who have wives who may have mommy tracked or stayed home with kids than vice versa. It seems less about careers and more about family and compatibility. I have seen more competent women dump their husbands than husbands who keep their older wives.

What kind of surgery did she get? How did she afford to get all that if she was a sahm and he’s a dud?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Birds of a feather flock together.

This isn’t true of my friend group. My friends are more of the ilk where both were very successful until kids came along, and then he ramped up at work. She could “do what she wanted” (work, not work, work part time) as long as she didn’t ask him to work less or do anything with the house or kids. Her career set back, his took off. Everyone seems more or less happy.

I wouldn't say birds of a feather but I see the same. Only one or two of the men I know make less. The vast majority make more and the women shoulder all the home bound stuff. If you live in a small town a woman is more likely to be stuck with less productive males. This is more common in the small town I moved away from as there are few jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People age differently. Some people were always duds and continue to be duds. Some people have health problems.

I’m in my late forties. I don’t keep track of which part of the couple is doing better. In our circles, the men do better professionally.

Some people age poorly. I have one friend who seems to be getting better with age (plastic surgery, nutrition, self care) while her husband is withering away. When we first met them, the guy was probably more physically fit and attractive. He definitely seems like a low value man now not working, having health problems, not as sharp, etc. Once upon a time, he paid for all their bills while she was a SAHM of their two kids, was very muscular and super social. I wonder if my hot getting better with age friend will dump her husband. They were very much in love when they first got married. He seem like dead weight now.

OP is being quite shallow. I think there are many more men who have wives who may have mommy tracked or stayed home with kids than vice versa. It seems less about careers and more about family and compatibility. I have seen more competent women dump their husbands than husbands who keep their older wives.

What kind of surgery did she get? How did she afford to get all that if she was a sahm and he’s a dud?

She got a tummy tuck and breast implants. She gets Botox, fillers, eyelashes, brows, laser, etc.

They met when she was in grad school. He was older. They had kids right away. Now he is semi retired and she is peak of her career. She is mid forties and he is fifties.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People age differently. Some people were always duds and continue to be duds. Some people have health problems.

I’m in my late forties. I don’t keep track of which part of the couple is doing better. In our circles, the men do better professionally.

Some people age poorly. I have one friend who seems to be getting better with age (plastic surgery, nutrition, self care) while her husband is withering away. When we first met them, the guy was probably more physically fit and attractive. He definitely seems like a low value man now not working, having health problems, not as sharp, etc. Once upon a time, he paid for all their bills while she was a SAHM of their two kids, was very muscular and super social. I wonder if my hot getting better with age friend will dump her husband. They were very much in love when they first got married. He seem like dead weight now.

OP is being quite shallow. I think there are many more men who have wives who may have mommy tracked or stayed home with kids than vice versa. It seems less about careers and more about family and compatibility. I have seen more competent women dump their husbands than husbands who keep their older wives.

You sound shallow too if you think a man who supported his wife for years but now can’t and has health problem is “dead weight.”

[Anonymous]

They look like a mismatched couple now. Once upon a time, he was a tall good looking professional who adored his wife and kids. Now they have teens and she treats him like a kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They look like a mismatched couple now. Once upon a time, he was a tall good looking professional who adored his wife and kids. Now they have teens and she treats him like a kid.

Do you really think that a long marriage won’t have its ups and downs? Where one partner seems to be doing better than another?