It's me - the DIL with the in-laws and drama around their cabin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here -

DH's family is a mess. FIL pitched selling their primary residence undervalued as a benefit to BIL/SIL but never ended up moving out. BIL/SIL cared for FIL as he was on hospice and now care for MIL as she's still not in AL. They've had to take time off work; it's been a considerable expense and time suck for them. I check in on MIL during the day as I am self-employed and bring her lunch. DH works 4 AM - 4 PM and visits on the weekends.

SIL floated the idea of a HELOC (or a reverse mortgage) to pay for MIL's care. The suggestions on this thread make it very clear that the cabin needs to be sold—end of story. I am not going to entertain this foolishness anymore.

The challenge is that DH's family is so emotionally attached to the cabin on a sentimental level that they will fight and argue about it.

The entire time I've been reading this thread, I kept thinking SIL means a reverse mortgage, not a HELOC, but somehow I doubt she understands those are very different things. She doesn't sound financially literate, ya know? But here's the thing: if she goes in asking for a HELOC, no one is going to hold her hand and say "actually, what I think you want is a reverse mortgage," and save her from making an enormous financial mistake.

OP, I feel for you. What an eff'ing mess. I agree with everyone else here that your DH needs to wash her hands of this cabin ASAP. If his siblings refuse to sell it, he has to have enough backbone to say "No, I will not be part of this."

I just posted that I don't think a HELOC is possible. And neither is a reverse mortgage (based on my basic googling) because the mortgagee has to be living in the house.

I didn't realize the mortgagee has to be living in the house. Interesting. And I can't imagine SIL can get a HELOC..Sounds like they're all living in Fantasyland. HELOC! Reverse mortgage! FREE MONEY TO USE TO PAY FOR MOM'S CARE AND WE STILL GET THE CABIN! Yeah, no. It's like that old commerical: that's not how this works. That's not how any of this works!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My MIL is finally moving into Assisted Living after falling nearly every day. She owns a cabin that is valued at roughly 300-400K. My husband states his sister (POA) will take out a HELOC on the cabin to pay for AL. The cabin is willed to the three siblings, and DH said we would be expected to contribute a nominal amount to utilities and property taxes ($150/month), which is acceptable and fair to me.

However, when his mother dies, DH will inherit anywhere from 10 K to 100 K of debt. Depending on the equity left, we will have to keep contributing costs towards the cabin.

My issue is that I'm not on the will. We are equal income earners, and our contributions will likely go out once his mother passes away to around $750-900/month. I do not want to contribute joint income towards a real estate asset to which only one of us has a legal entitlement. We don't have a huge budget right now for extras, and it's coming out of our "extra" leftover money at the end of the month, which I usually put into savings.

Am I a PITA if I say I do not want to contribute joint income towards the cabin if I am not included in the ownership?

Sell the cabin already! They need to sell the cabin, use that money for MIL expenses. If anything is left over once she is deceased gets split 3 ways. End of story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, what happened to FIL? Wasn't he the one insisting that the cabin be kept?

OP here - he died 6 months ago.

Wow I was going to say sorry for your loss but then I read this whole thread and the previous one. Yikes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Once he receives 1/3 of the cabin, does it become joint property? If not, then I would execute a document that states you are entitled to 1/2 of your DH's share if you are contributing 1/2 of the expense.

+1

FWIW I wouldn't want to contribute AT ALL. I would tell DH he needs to sell his portion to the siblings OR they need to collectively sell th cabin to pay for her care. PERIOD.

+1 except DH doesn’t have any “portion” yet because MIL is not deceased!!
The siblings are all counting on an inheritance that isnt coming because mom clearly needs revenue to pay for her care and living expenses—and the only place she’s going to get that is from income of sale of the cabin she owns.
Siblings need a reality check that an inheritance comes AFTER your relative dies. The 1/3 ownership is not a thing bc the house belongs to DH’s mom. Sis needs to be a responsible POA and sell the cabin to pay for mom’s rent and care.
If there’s money left after OP’s MIL dues (there won’t be), then DH can get his third. Not before that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here -

DH's family is a mess. FIL pitched selling their primary residence undervalued as a benefit to BIL/SIL but never ended up moving out. BIL/SIL cared for FIL as he was on hospice and now care for MIL as she's still not in AL. They've had to take time off work; it's been a considerable expense and time suck for them. I check in on MIL during the day as I am self-employed and bring her lunch. DH works 4 AM - 4 PM and visits on the weekends.

SIL floated the idea of a HELOC (or a reverse mortgage) to pay for MIL's care. The suggestions on this thread make it very clear that the cabin needs to be sold—end of story. I am not going to entertain this foolishness anymore.

The challenge is that DH's family is so emotionally attached to the cabin on a sentimental level that they will fight and argue about it.

Your DH needs to do more. He visits on the weekends? He should be doing the work for his mom soley on the weekends, take a 24-32 hour shift and do it. Sleep there. Take on the care of his mother so his sibling and wife get a break. Every weekend.

Not fair your BIL/SIL are responsible for FIL and MIL. NOT COOL. My mom works FT is doing this now while her siblings (2 of which are retired) and all live within 7 minutes "visit" when they feel like it.

Until your MIL is in assisted living the other siblings need to do more. What does your DH do after work? Go over and take care of his mom to give his sibling a break. Nothing is worse than someone who "visits."

My mom said she had to stay overnight because the nurse who was meant to stay over called out sick and she went home to shower and get new clothes the next morning (a new nurse came before she left). When she went back an hour later to check on her mom her brother was there on his phone with his wife. Not paying attention or doing anything for his own mother. My mom made a comment and her brother goes, "I have been here all morning where were you?" He clearly hadn't. She left an hour ago and he wasn't there and he thought sitting on his phone was enough. Not when my mom changed diapers and was up throughout the night.

Your visits are not enough. Caregiving is draining even with the 24/7 care my grandmother gets because people cancel. Did I also mention one of her sons lives with her? He got divorced, but always goes to visit his gf/ go to the gym, so if someone cancels last minute he can't possibly cancel on his gf or not work out.

Maybe you SIL is confused with the HELOC because of all the caregiving she's had to do and can't think straight.

My mom called me in tears one day (in public) because she was so exhausted. She has only cried when her dad died and not hysterical. She felt mortified later, but told me caregiving broke her. She has like 30+ pounds all due to stress. Being a caregiver and not getting rest sometimes makes you crazy. Do more for those who care for your MIL or make your DH do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here -

DH's family is a mess. FIL pitched selling their primary residence undervalued as a benefit to BIL/SIL but never ended up moving out. BIL/SIL cared for FIL as he was on hospice and now care for MIL as she's still not in AL. They've had to take time off work; it's been a considerable expense and time suck for them. I check in on MIL during the day as I am self-employed and bring her lunch. DH works 4 AM - 4 PM and visits on the weekends.

SIL floated the idea of a HELOC (or a reverse mortgage) to pay for MIL's care. The suggestions on this thread make it very clear that the cabin needs to be sold—end of story. I am not going to entertain this foolishness anymore.

The challenge is that DH's family is so emotionally attached to the cabin on a sentimental level that they will fight and argue about it.

Why are you leaving out the part where it turned out BIL/SIL actually OVERpaid for the primary home?

At this point the person I’m most invested in is MIL. This family is never getting it together so I guess we just hope for a sinkhole to swallow the cabin while it’s empty so she gets the insurance

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, I’m not clear on the situation. The cabin is owned outright currently, yes? There are no other assets? The plan is to keep the cabin in the family. Would the other siblings buy your dh out?

OP here:

Sorry, I’m not clear on the situation
- DH wants us to contribute to a property he will inherit. In my state, inheritance or gifts are not subject to community property. I am uncomfortable contributing household income to a real property I will have zero entitlement to if we divorce.

The cabin is owned outright currently, yes?
- Owned outright - yes.

There are no other assets?
- MIL has maybe 30K in savings, which will go quickly with 12K of move-in costs.

Would the other siblings buy your dh out?
- No. One is flat broke and unsure how even he would afford the ongoing costs. [i]

This is such a bad plan. You're going to be paying not just your husband's portion, but also the broke siblings' share.

Basically, they want to keep the cabin, but can't afford to. Well, tough. I would absolutely refuse to go along with this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Once he receives 1/3 of the cabin, does it become joint property? If not, then I would execute a document that states you are entitled to 1/2 of your DH's share if you are contributing 1/2 of the expense.

+1

FWIW I wouldn't want to contribute AT ALL. I would tell DH he needs to sell his portion to the siblings OR they need to collectively sell th cabin to pay for her care. PERIOD.

+1 except DH doesn’t have any “portion” yet because MIL is not deceased!!
The siblings are all counting on an inheritance that isnt coming because mom clearly needs revenue to pay for her care and living expenses—and the only place she’s going to get that is from income of sale of the cabin she owns.
Siblings need a reality check that an inheritance comes AFTER your relative dies. The 1/3 ownership is not a thing bc the house belongs to DH’s mom. Sis needs to be a responsible POA and sell the cabin to pay for mom’s rent and care.
If there’s money left after OP’s MIL dues (there won’t be), then DH can get his third. Not before that.

This. The whole plan is insanity. I would hope an ethical banker would not approve a HELOC or reverse mortgage but there are a lot of unethical people out there who will do things they know are wrong just to collect the fees. Tell DH the value of the cabin will be completely consumed by MIL's care and it is foolish (and financially wasteful) to try to hold onto it.

[Anonymous]

This is not only a stupid plan, but a highly infeasible one. MIL likely doesn’t have the income to qualify for a HELOC, especially at today’s rates. Unless she dies soon, the HELOC value won’t be enough to pay for AL. The cabin needs to be sold, end of story. SIL and you and DH can buy it if you want it badly enough.

[Anonymous]

OP, I'm hoping their plan will just die externally because no sane lender would agree to a HELOC or reverse mortgage in this situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here -

DH's family is a mess. FIL pitched selling their primary residence undervalued as a benefit to BIL/SIL but never ended up moving out. BIL/SIL cared for FIL as he was on hospice and now care for MIL as she's still not in AL. They've had to take time off work; it's been a considerable expense and time suck for them. I check in on MIL during the day as I am self-employed and bring her lunch. DH works 4 AM - 4 PM and visits on the weekends.

SIL floated the idea of a HELOC (or a reverse mortgage) to pay for MIL's care. The suggestions on this thread make it very clear that the cabin needs to be sold—end of story. I am not going to entertain this foolishness anymore.

The challenge is that DH's family is so emotionally attached to the cabin on a sentimental level that they will fight and argue about it.

Why are you leaving out the part where it turned out BIL/SIL actually OVERpaid for the primary home?

At this point the person I’m most invested in is MIL. This family is never getting it together so I guess we just hope for a sinkhole to swallow the cabin while it’s empty so she gets the insurance

+1
And don't forget they find the treasure under the floorboards

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, I’m not clear on the situation. The cabin is owned outright currently, yes? There are no other assets? The plan is to keep the cabin in the family. Would the other siblings buy your dh out?

OP here:

Sorry, I’m not clear on the situation
- DH wants us to contribute to a property he will inherit. In my state, inheritance or gifts are not subject to community property. I am uncomfortable contributing household income to a real property I will have zero entitlement to if we divorce.

The cabin is owned outright currently, yes?
- Owned outright - yes.

There are no other assets?
- MIL has maybe 30K in savings, which will go quickly with 12K of move-in costs.

Would the other siblings buy your dh out?
- No. One is flat broke and unsure how even he would afford the ongoing costs.

This seems like an issue between you and your husband, so I would think this would be an excellent case for a post-nup.

[Anonymous]

OP fortunately for you, no one is going to give her a HELOC or reverse mortgage. She needs to be living there for a reverse mortgage, and for the heloc, she won’t be able to demonstrate a way to make the monthly payments. You and your dh are luckily not stuck in this real estate mess and should contribute nothing. If sil is so vested in keeping the cabin, her only option seems to be selling her primary residence and buying the cabin from her mom. I couldn’t bear to read that other thread so don’t know the primary residence details, but perhaps sil could borrow against that house and buy the cabin from the mom.

[Anonymous]

The irony here is that they are going to end up trying to sell that stupid cabin and realize it’s worth far less than they think.

[Anonymous]

Can you post a link to a similar cabin for those of us following along at home? I need to picture it.