Friend who works in pharma went on a rant about how bad Ozempic etc is for people. ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I didn’t have the nerve to tell her my dh is on it, as is my sibling, and both look and feel great.

Why do people who’ve never been on it trash these drugs? Interestingly this friend needs to lose weight related to a very serious health condition that is affected by weight. The issue seemed very sensitive so I didn’t want to argue, but I don’t understand the rigidity.

My sister is on one of these drugs. She was obese and is now very skinny. Got face lift and neck lift. Loose skin on body tightened up. Hair extensions. The works. She looks amazing. But can’t stop taking it even though she’s lost way too much muscle. She drinks protein shakes and can barely choke down food. But wants to be skinny. It’s her new obsession. Used to be food and now it’s this.

I find this very alarming and I’ve told her so. She just gets angry and says I just can’t understand. She has no disease. She was a gymnast that became an emotional eater; she needed therapy, not a drug. She’s still emotionally unhealthy. All of this is unnerving.

This example is why I think the problem is related to addiction. Addicts tend to be all or nothing types. They also will.replace one extreme behavior for another--go from drinking to obsessive exercise or to another addiction. She sounds obsessive, which she probably cannoy change but she probably feels a lot better than she did.

It's why people on these drugs are reporting that they also don't want to drink. It turns off a need. I have been taking one of the meds for almost a year. It gets rid of food obsession. That's as big a piece as is the appetite suppressant. I have OCD and I think this is probably related as well.

It's like the drugs you can take now for alcoholism. They cut the effect of the drug and the people don't have cravings. This helps the people for whom 12-step programs do not work and they really only work for some people; long term abstinence with 12-step is pretty low.

I think addiction medicine and research is where it's at in the future. It will include phone addiction and other newly created addictions after that. I think this whole side of human nature is badly understood. I think if medicine can help people, why not help.with this? Some people are really, really opposed to seeing addicts as deserving of help or think they understand the problem when they don't.

People who don't have addictions are lucky. I think anyone can become an addict if you do something long enough. It is a physical response. The notion that it stems from a trauma is not necessarily true or only one piece of it. It's possible but working on that does not change the behavior. The behavior is very hard to change! The drugs help the person stop the behavior and feel in control. Stopping the behavior is very hard to impossible for some people.

Cross-addiction or substitution addictions are real. Compulsive dieting and compulsive overeating have always been linked. Pills and shots and other drugs might help the symptoms, but the real problem is the mentality of an addict.

Addicts don't have a problem with their drug of choice. We have a problem with living.

[Anonymous]

To fiber poster- do you worry about protein? I focus on whole grains and beans and vegetables/fruits but always feel concerned about advice that floats around to eat 100+ grams of protein each day. That is very hard without hunks of meat. I am also someone that doesn’t feel full without grains.

[Anonymous]

Unless your friend is a doctor and talking about a specific patient they are treating, their opinion doesn’t matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I didn’t have the nerve to tell her my dh is on it, as is my sibling, and both look and feel great.

Why do people who’ve never been on it trash these drugs? Interestingly this friend needs to lose weight related to a very serious health condition that is affected by weight. The issue seemed very sensitive so I didn’t want to argue, but I don’t understand the rigidity.

My doctor determined that the possible risks are worth it when ozempic is controlling my blood sugar better than other medications have over time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Unless your friend is a doctor and talking about a specific patient they are treating, their opinion doesn’t matter.

Absolutely

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with your friend, OP. What does him being fat have to do with anything? He's not allowed to have an opinion about anything because he's fat? Also, what illness are completely dependent upon weight? Because I know of people with type 2 diabetes, HTN, hypercholesterolemia, etc who are thin. Just FYI, it's not always about the weight (unless it's in extreme cases). Often times, it's genetics and environment. Obviously, lifestyle factors in but that doesn't always guarantee significant weight loss. People can still be fat and see significant changes in biochemical markers with exercise and realistic diet changes. Sure, if they want to lose weight to breathe better or get around better, that's fair. But in order to do that they have to practice breathing and getting around while fat first. We live in a world where it's still acceptable to abuse fat people out in the open and think it's okay. That's what's happening in this thread. Fat people can have opinions. I wish people on these meds all the best.

You struggle with logic, I can see.

Is that all you got? If you can't elaborate any more than that, stay mad and STFU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your friend is probably very insecure about his own weight, and also anxious about trying this drug himself because he's in a position to read about the clinical trial dossiers and post-commercialization reports on severe side effects.

I have to say, as a biologist working in pharma, he's not wrong: some people have died due to complications from slow-moving bowels, and a lot of people taking this drug will realize they can't stop taking it, otherwise the weight will come back. If I had weight issues, I would hesitate to try it too, because I've read some research articles about it that are quite disturbing!

Let's just say it's not the miracle drug people think it is. I hope your husband and sibling are very educated about it and know the limitations of their medication.

As a biologist working in pharma you should be able to provide some data or links to studies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your friend is probably very insecure about his own weight, and also anxious about trying this drug himself because he's in a position to read about the clinical trial dossiers and post-commercialization reports on severe side effects.

I have to say, as a biologist working in pharma, he's not wrong: some people have died due to complications from slow-moving bowels, and a lot of people taking this drug will realize they can't stop taking it, otherwise the weight will come back. If I had weight issues, I would hesitate to try it too, because I've read some research articles about it that are quite disturbing!

Let's just say it's not the miracle drug people think it is. I hope your husband and sibling are very educated about it and know the limitations of their medication.

I totally disagree. I think it is a miracle drug. 75 percent of Americans are overweight. This drug helps tremendously, with relatively manageable side effects. To ignore that is so short sighted.

But people will argue vehemently that you can be fit and fat. Why are we suddenly rushing to use drugs to control weight if it doesn’t matter? Also, let’s see how these lab rats fare in a few years after continued use.

Not all people are the same.
You can be fit and fat.
Fat also increases some risks like diabetes.

Everyone including ops friend should myob

There is not a single objective health measure that improves by carrying excessive body fat other than being dramatically underweight. That's reality.

Reality is that you and the rest of the fatphobes on this forum/in this culture don't give a rat's behind about a fat stranger's health. Fat bodies are an acceptable target for your concern trolling, othering, and ableism. That's it. You hide behind "health concerns" but if you really gave a damn about a stranger's health, you wouldn't lead by insulting their intelligence, framing yourself as superior because you wear a smaller size, and then treating them like a hapless idiot who needs your help or your opinion.

Being judged for existing in the body you've got isn't good for anyone's health, doesn't motivate people to change their body shape, and can actively harm people to the point of suicidal ideation and self-harm.

There's not a single objective health measure that improves by being judged by a stranger. THAT is reality, so STFU.

AMEN.

[Anonymous]

I went on Wegovy after trying several cholesterol medications, all of which had intolerable side effects. For me, Wegovy has minimal side effects and I lost weight on a low dose. My cholesterol is now normal.

I'm currently maintaining on a very low dose, and my blood work is great.The known side effects of high cholesterol are way more likely than the rare ones of Wegovy. I'm choosing the best chance for my health.

[Anonymous]

I just worry that it’s new and long term issues with it cannot be known.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was absolutely addicted to food and gained 150 pounds over my ideal healthy weight - severe morbid obesity on my 5’2” frame. I experienced joint pain, high BP, high cholesterol, and prediabetes. I ate and ate and ate and couldn’t ever stop thinking about my next meal and FOOD.

I did all the pre-op testing for bariatric surgery but balked at going forward with it because of the potentially fatal side effects and the research that informed me of the long term very high failure rate in terms of keeping the weight off, and the very high rate of transfer addictions to other substances and high risk behaviors.

I didn’t consider the weight loss drugs because gut health is a bit of an obsession for me after suffering years of post-cholecystectomy syndrome that led to a vitamin deficiency and much of the weight gain.

Over the last year I cured my food addiction and began steadily losing weight by ditching most sugar and ultra processed foods, cutting way back on animal products, and building my diet around high fiber nutrient dense foods that provide a variety of plants to my trillions of gut bacteria. I eat for my microbiome and to protect my liver.

I have never felt better in my adult life. Fiber is nature’s semaglutide - getting the RDA of fiber from a variety of whole natural foods mostly colorful vegetables and fruits and legumes, nuts seeds and whole grains naturally stimulates production of glp1 and regulates hunger and food cravings. Eating fiber is the only way to produce short chain fatty acids which are critical to improving and maintaining health.

It wasn’t easy at first. Food cravings for the food addicted are intense. I slipped back many times. I still let myself have a cheat day once a week but find I am less interested in those foods with each passing week. I pay close attention to have foods make me feel and I crave bad stuff less and less often because I love how my body sings on plant foods. My palate is more sensitive and I crave the taste of clean and healthy flavors and am overwhelmed by sugar and high fat foods. I hate how fried foods make me feel and almost never indulge in those anymore.

It’s harder, but it is definitely cheaper and healthier and the results will be greater and the side effects are limited to a short period of excessive flatulence until the gut stabilizes and begins to thrive on bean and veggies and fruits - the things we evolved to eat.

Down over 50 pounds, fully expect to reach goal weight on time - slow and steady loss while lifting weights and building fitness so skin issues are minimal. Skin and hair much improved - SCFAs transform health from inside out.

Also I am really proud of the journey I’ve been on.

Try it. A fiber fueled life is a great life.

Wait til you find out the success rate for keeping off a 100-lb weight loss with diet and exercise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your friend is probably very insecure about his own weight, and also anxious about trying this drug himself because he's in a position to read about the clinical trial dossiers and post-commercialization reports on severe side effects.

I have to say, as a biologist working in pharma, he's not wrong: some people have died due to complications from slow-moving bowels, and a lot of people taking this drug will realize they can't stop taking it, otherwise the weight will come back. If I had weight issues, I would hesitate to try it too, because I've read some research articles about it that are quite disturbing!

Let's just say it's not the miracle drug people think it is. I hope your husband and sibling are very educated about it and know the limitations of their medication.

I totally disagree. I think it is a miracle drug. 75 percent of Americans are overweight. This drug helps tremendously, with relatively manageable side effects. To ignore that is so short sighted.

But people will argue vehemently that you can be fit and fat. Why are we suddenly rushing to use drugs to control weight if it doesn’t matter? Also, let’s see how these lab rats fare in a few years after continued use.

You do know it has been studied in lab rats for years, right? It was used for diabetes control

Cool. Let’s still check back in a few years and see how everyone is doing.

We’ll come back in a few years and see obesity is way down, along with cancers, heart disease, alcohol and drug abuse. Once fully understood these drugs will have big impacts and be widely used.

Exactly. It is crazy to turn our backs on these drugs. It’s such progress

Doubt it. There’s going to be an increase in cancers associated with it, gastro and bowel issues,etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your friend is probably very insecure about his own weight, and also anxious about trying this drug himself because he's in a position to read about the clinical trial dossiers and post-commercialization reports on severe side effects.

I have to say, as a biologist working in pharma, he's not wrong: some people have died due to complications from slow-moving bowels, and a lot of people taking this drug will realize they can't stop taking it, otherwise the weight will come back. If I had weight issues, I would hesitate to try it too, because I've read some research articles about it that are quite disturbing!

Let's just say it's not the miracle drug people think it is. I hope your husband and sibling are very educated about it and know the limitations of their medication.

I totally disagree. I think it is a miracle drug. 75 percent of Americans are overweight. This drug helps tremendously, with relatively manageable side effects. To ignore that is so short sighted.

But people will argue vehemently that you can be fit and fat. Why are we suddenly rushing to use drugs to control weight if it doesn’t matter? Also, let’s see how these lab rats fare in a few years after continued use.

Not all people are the same.
You can be fit and fat.
Fat also increases some risks like diabetes.

Everyone including ops friend should myob

There is not a single objective health measure that improves by carrying excessive body fat other than being dramatically underweight. That's reality.

Reality is that you and the rest of the fatphobes on this forum/in this culture don't give a rat's behind about a fat stranger's health. Fat bodies are an acceptable target for your concern trolling, othering, and ableism. That's it. You hide behind "health concerns" but if you really gave a damn about a stranger's health, you wouldn't lead by insulting their intelligence, framing yourself as superior because you wear a smaller size, and then treating them like a hapless idiot who needs your help or your opinion.

Being judged for existing in the body you've got isn't good for anyone's health, doesn't motivate people to change their body shape, and can actively harm people to the point of suicidal ideation and self-harm.

There's not a single objective health measure that improves by being judged by a stranger. THAT is reality, so STFU.

You might consider that when you quote a post, the prior discussion was included.

If you bothered reading, you would find I was responding to the notion that fitness and being fat can coexist. That’s just not true. In extremely rare cases people with an obese BMI may not be carrying around significant body fat far in excess of what’s healthy. That’s not the 99.9% of Americans in the obese category. That’s what I was responding to that caused you to get all butt hurt.

So no, there is not a single objective health measure that improves by carrying around excess body fat. Maybe go work on that instead of being butt hurt by people pointing out facts. Facts aren’t judgement - you just turn them into something about you because you don’t like general facts. Maybe also work on that while you are at it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just worry that it’s new and long term issues with it cannot be known.

Nothing can ever be entirely known, but it's been used by diabetics for decades - it's not a new drug, it's newly approved for weight loss.

Meanwhile, the long term issues with being obese are well known.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your friend is probably very insecure about his own weight, and also anxious about trying this drug himself because he's in a position to read about the clinical trial dossiers and post-commercialization reports on severe side effects.

I have to say, as a biologist working in pharma, he's not wrong: some people have died due to complications from slow-moving bowels, and a lot of people taking this drug will realize they can't stop taking it, otherwise the weight will come back. If I had weight issues, I would hesitate to try it too, because I've read some research articles about it that are quite disturbing!

Let's just say it's not the miracle drug people think it is. I hope your husband and sibling are very educated about it and know the limitations of their medication.

I totally disagree. I think it is a miracle drug. 75 percent of Americans are overweight. This drug helps tremendously, with relatively manageable side effects. To ignore that is so short sighted.

But people will argue vehemently that you can be fit and fat. Why are we suddenly rushing to use drugs to control weight if it doesn’t matter? Also, let’s see how these lab rats fare in a few years after continued use.

Not all people are the same.
You can be fit and fat.
Fat also increases some risks like diabetes.

Everyone including ops friend should myob

There is not a single objective health measure that improves by carrying excessive body fat other than being dramatically underweight. That's reality.

Reality is that you and the rest of the fatphobes on this forum/in this culture don't give a rat's behind about a fat stranger's health. Fat bodies are an acceptable target for your concern trolling, othering, and ableism. That's it. You hide behind "health concerns" but if you really gave a damn about a stranger's health, you wouldn't lead by insulting their intelligence, framing yourself as superior because you wear a smaller size, and then treating them like a hapless idiot who needs your help or your opinion.

Being judged for existing in the body you've got isn't good for anyone's health, doesn't motivate people to change their body shape, and can actively harm people to the point of suicidal ideation and self-harm.

There's not a single objective health measure that improves by being judged by a stranger. THAT is reality, so STFU.

You might consider that when you quote a post, the prior discussion was included.

If you bothered reading, you would find I was responding to the notion that fitness and being fat can coexist. That’s just not true. In extremely rare cases people with an obese BMI may not be carrying around significant body fat far in excess of what’s healthy. That’s not the 99.9% of Americans in the obese category. That’s what I was responding to that caused you to get all butt hurt.

So no, there is not a single objective health measure that improves by carrying around excess body fat. Maybe go work on that instead of being butt hurt by people pointing out facts. Facts aren’t judgement - you just turn them into something about you because you don’t like general facts. Maybe also work on that while you are at it.

So you're an idiot, as well as an ass? Cool. Thanks for the information.