College search has been so stressful so far

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just remembering what it was like to apply in the late 90s. I did everything including setting up the tours. Why have things changed?

Because in the 90s, most of the Ivies and 20-25% acceptance rates, not 5%. Back in the day, it was easy for a kid with a 1300+ and 3.8+ to get into most state schools---now not so much. So it was extremely easy to pick "safeties/targets/reaches". When I applied, it was extremely easy to get into VaTech, even engineering. It was basically a guarantee if you had a 2.0 and actually graduated HS (engineering was a bit "harder", but still extremely easy for a decent student in VA to get into) and UVA was not that difficult to gain admissions if you had a 1300+ and 3.8+gpa.

Majority of kids are actively involved in the process, but I know we felt the need to ensure the process was done well to ensure our kids had at least several true safeties with acceptances. My kid drives the process, with the help of a college counselor, who mainly helped us develop the best list of schools. Without that counselor, I'm not sure my kid would have even found the school they are attending (and it's a T30) or their top safety school (which my kid really liked). And the counselor was helpful for being the one to "Nag" to keep kids on a schedule (my extremely smart motivated kid is also a major procrastinator and that got worse with Covid and 16 months of online school). I was not obsessed with finding Ranked schools---I wanted to ensure my kid found the best fit, as I know success in college is about fit for the student, if they are happy, they will do well.

Sure it’s harder. But what are you expecting to happen when your kid actually goes to college and doesn’t have mom or dad or hired help to get motivated?

New poster...Why you so salty and bitter? It's perfectly fine for mom and dad to be a part of the process, try it sometime. You might find that your kid actually appreciates it and a college counselor doesn't cost that much for a couple of sessions, do you do all of the technical work in your life? Hiring an expert is pragmatic and smart especially when making a major life decision but you do you.

Yes! Similarly, while my kid will manage college on their own, I will also make sure I understand the courses they need and help double check so they are on track to graduate in 4 years, with a double major in engineering or a single major and a minor. My kid is doing all the work themselves, but I will double check because a mistake/bit of carelessness could mean an extra $80K.

No, that is not healthy. You will not always be there to perform this function. THE SCHOOL PAYS ADVISORS TO DO THIS EXACTLY. You can remind your kid to meet with their advisor when they schedule senior year classes.

Your job now is to teach your kid to use the resources at his/her college. It is not to keep checking on his progress. Really, please instead try to teach him/her to do this himself. That will also build confidence in him/her that he is maturing into a capable adult.

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just remembering what it was like to apply in the late 90s. I did everything including setting up the tours. Why have things changed?

Because in the 90s, most of the Ivies and 20-25% acceptance rates, not 5%. Back in the day, it was easy for a kid with a 1300+ and 3.8+ to get into most state schools---now not so much. So it was extremely easy to pick "safeties/targets/reaches". When I applied, it was extremely easy to get into VaTech, even engineering. It was basically a guarantee if you had a 2.0 and actually graduated HS (engineering was a bit "harder", but still extremely easy for a decent student in VA to get into) and UVA was not that difficult to gain admissions if you had a 1300+ and 3.8+gpa.

Majority of kids are actively involved in the process, but I know we felt the need to ensure the process was done well to ensure our kids had at least several true safeties with acceptances. My kid drives the process, with the help of a college counselor, who mainly helped us develop the best list of schools. Without that counselor, I'm not sure my kid would have even found the school they are attending (and it's a T30) or their top safety school (which my kid really liked). And the counselor was helpful for being the one to "Nag" to keep kids on a schedule (my extremely smart motivated kid is also a major procrastinator and that got worse with Covid and 16 months of online school). I was not obsessed with finding Ranked schools---I wanted to ensure my kid found the best fit, as I know success in college is about fit for the student, if they are happy, they will do well.

Sure it’s harder. But what are you expecting to happen when your kid actually goes to college and doesn’t have mom or dad or hired help to get motivated?

New poster...Why you so salty and bitter? It's perfectly fine for mom and dad to be a part of the process, try it sometime. You might find that your kid actually appreciates it and a college counselor doesn't cost that much for a couple of sessions, do you do all of the technical work in your life? Hiring an expert is pragmatic and smart especially when making a major life decision but you do you.

Yes! Similarly, while my kid will manage college on their own, I will also make sure I understand the courses they need and help double check so they are on track to graduate in 4 years, with a double major in engineering or a single major and a minor. My kid is doing all the work themselves, but I will double check because a mistake/bit of carelessness could mean an extra $80K.

No, that is not healthy. You will not always be there to perform this function. THE SCHOOL PAYS ADVISORS TO DO THIS EXACTLY. You can remind your kid to meet with their advisor when they schedule senior year classes.

Your job now is to teach your kid to use the resources at his/her college. It is not to keep checking on his progress. Really, please instead try to teach him/her to do this himself. That will also build confidence in him/her that he is maturing into a capable adult.

+1000

+1000? Are you people 12? You seem like a bunch of Taylor Swift worshiping weirdos, get a life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

Or perhaps my kid doesn't need assistance but knows it's there when needed because they are mature and smart enough to ask for help? Or perhaps you're a lazy absentee mother that doesn't communicate with their kid and assumes they have it all figured out because you can't be bothered?

[Anonymous]

I found it was stressful because many people told me it was supposed to be fun. Once I let that go and my student found some schools we could afford with a high probability of acceptance that would make him happy, it was fine with some stressful parts. And don't listen to the people who think your kid can do it all yourself (especially if you are looking for merit aid). Those people make it stressful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m just remembering what it was like to apply in the late 90s. I did everything including setting up the tours. Why have things changed?

Because in the 90s, most of the Ivies and 20-25% acceptance rates, not 5%. Back in the day, it was easy for a kid with a 1300+ and 3.8+ to get into most state schools---now not so much. So it was extremely easy to pick "safeties/targets/reaches". When I applied, it was extremely easy to get into VaTech, even engineering. It was basically a guarantee if you had a 2.0 and actually graduated HS (engineering was a bit "harder", but still extremely easy for a decent student in VA to get into) and UVA was not that difficult to gain admissions if you had a 1300+ and 3.8+gpa.

Majority of kids are actively involved in the process, but I know we felt the need to ensure the process was done well to ensure our kids had at least several true safeties with acceptances. My kid drives the process, with the help of a college counselor, who mainly helped us develop the best list of schools. Without that counselor, I'm not sure my kid would have even found the school they are attending (and it's a T30) or their top safety school (which my kid really liked). And the counselor was helpful for being the one to "Nag" to keep kids on a schedule (my extremely smart motivated kid is also a major procrastinator and that got worse with Covid and 16 months of online school). I was not obsessed with finding Ranked schools---I wanted to ensure my kid found the best fit, as I know success in college is about fit for the student, if they are happy, they will do well.

Sure it’s harder. But what are you expecting to happen when your kid actually goes to college and doesn’t have mom or dad or hired help to get motivated?

New poster...Why you so salty and bitter? It's perfectly fine for mom and dad to be a part of the process, try it sometime. You might find that your kid actually appreciates it and a college counselor doesn't cost that much for a couple of sessions, do you do all of the technical work in your life? Hiring an expert is pragmatic and smart especially when making a major life decision but you do you.

Yes! Similarly, while my kid will manage college on their own, I will also make sure I understand the courses they need and help double check so they are on track to graduate in 4 years, with a double major in engineering or a single major and a minor. My kid is doing all the work themselves, but I will double check because a mistake/bit of carelessness could mean an extra $80K.

No, that is not healthy. You will not always be there to perform this function. THE SCHOOL PAYS ADVISORS TO DO THIS EXACTLY. You can remind your kid to meet with their advisor when they schedule senior year classes.

Your job now is to teach your kid to use the resources at his/her college. It is not to keep checking on his progress. Really, please instead try to teach him/her to do this himself. That will also build confidence in him/her that he is maturing into a capable adult.

+1000

College advisors are not always accurate and if they are wrong, it's not as if the school will give you an extra semester for free. So if you miss taking a course that's a prerequisite for something else and it only meets every fall semester, it's your fault if you don't take it on time.

I do allow my kids to do everything themselves, but I also check and have discussions, and guide them to search a bit more if I think something is off. I never contacted anything at my older kid's college, ever. They did all of that. But I sure as heck advised them when they had questions and made sure they were on track.

And if you have a kid with ADHD/executive functioning issues, they can manage college and do well in life, but they might still need a bit of reminders/guidance. Until you have lived with a kid like that, you really cannot comment on how involved a parent should be. It does not mean they will not succeed in life, just means that they may need a bit more guidance and reminders than the "typical" 18yo. You'd probably suggest they are not college material, but mine graduated T50 university in 4 years (even switching majors), employed at a top notch company and thriving. But if I hadn't monitored progress for the first few years of college, it might have taken an extra year or so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

Or perhaps the kid has ADHD/learning disabilities/executive functioning issues. Doesn't mean they shouldn't be headed to college, but it might mean they still require a bit of guidance. By guidance I mean discussions and monitoring at high level, reminders to work with the disability office to put services in place, but I never ever did any of it myself---my kid did it ALL themselves. They made the calls, scheduled meetings, got documentation, talked to profs, etc. But that can be overwhelming for someone with any of those issues, so with just a small bit of guidance/discussion with a parent, they can navigate it all themselves. Parent should never ever be calling the university about anything except financial aid, unless there are extremely severe health issues.
But until you have a kid with ADHD/LD/EF issues, you don't appear to have enough empathy to truly understand what those kids/parents deal with and how many things in life have to be approached slightly differently. And I'd pity any kid of yours who happened to have any issues, as you sound as if you wouldn't get them the help they needed to succeed in life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

Or perhaps the kid has ADHD/learning disabilities/executive functioning issues. Doesn't mean they shouldn't be headed to college, but it might mean they still require a bit of guidance. By guidance I mean discussions and monitoring at high level, reminders to work with the disability office to put services in place, but I never ever did any of it myself---my kid did it ALL themselves. They made the calls, scheduled meetings, got documentation, talked to profs, etc. But that can be overwhelming for someone with any of those issues, so with just a small bit of guidance/discussion with a parent, they can navigate it all themselves. Parent should never ever be calling the university about anything except financial aid, unless there are extremely severe health issues.
But until you have a kid with ADHD/LD/EF issues, you don't appear to have enough empathy to truly understand what those kids/parents deal with and how many things in life have to be approached slightly differently. And I'd pity any kid of yours who happened to have any issues, as you sound as if you wouldn't get them the help they needed to succeed in life.

But it's no just kids with conditions you have dealt with. 18 is 18, if they ask for assistance than it should be given by any normal parent. I don't understand this mentality fo 18 and forget...just because they ask for help doesn't mean they are helpless, they are simply asking for advice on something they can't figure out on their own. If that is a problem for you as a parent than you should reevaluate your place in life cause you probably should have gave birth control another try.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

Or perhaps the kid has ADHD/learning disabilities/executive functioning issues. Doesn't mean they shouldn't be headed to college, but it might mean they still require a bit of guidance. By guidance I mean discussions and monitoring at high level, reminders to work with the disability office to put services in place, but I never ever did any of it myself---my kid did it ALL themselves. They made the calls, scheduled meetings, got documentation, talked to profs, etc. But that can be overwhelming for someone with any of those issues, so with just a small bit of guidance/discussion with a parent, they can navigate it all themselves. Parent should never ever be calling the university about anything except financial aid, unless there are extremely severe health issues.
But until you have a kid with ADHD/LD/EF issues, you don't appear to have enough empathy to truly understand what those kids/parents deal with and how many things in life have to be approached slightly differently. And I'd pity any kid of yours who happened to have any issues, as you sound as if you wouldn't get them the help they needed to succeed in life.

But it's no just kids with conditions you have dealt with. 18 is 18, if they ask for assistance than it should be given by any normal parent. I don't understand this mentality fo 18 and forget...just because they ask for help doesn't mean they are helpless, they are simply asking for advice on something they can't figure out on their own. If that is a problem for you as a parent than you should reevaluate your place in life cause you probably should have gave birth control another try.

Exactly! I will always talk my kid thru stuff and make sure I stay on top of things (in the background), especially my kid with ADHD/EF functions/anxiety. But I will not do stuff for them---which means I'm not a helicopter parent. Been like that since they were little---goal in life is to raise self sufficient adults. Each kid is on a different path, some need more assistance than others. A great parent knows when to step in and provide assistance and when to sit back and let their kid lead. But I'm always here to be a sounding board and help them figure stuff out. Heck, I don't go thru life not asking others for assistance at times, it's called being smart and realizing someone else knows more than I do, so seek the help and do things right rather than screwing up. My kids will always be my kids, and I will always help them if needed, at an appropriate level (ie. not calling their boss or professors, but will walk them trhu what the discussion should be with that person if they are nervous and want to talk)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

Or perhaps the kid has ADHD/learning disabilities/executive functioning issues. Doesn't mean they shouldn't be headed to college, but it might mean they still require a bit of guidance. By guidance I mean discussions and monitoring at high level, reminders to work with the disability office to put services in place, but I never ever did any of it myself---my kid did it ALL themselves. They made the calls, scheduled meetings, got documentation, talked to profs, etc. But that can be overwhelming for someone with any of those issues, so with just a small bit of guidance/discussion with a parent, they can navigate it all themselves. Parent should never ever be calling the university about anything except financial aid, unless there are extremely severe health issues.
But until you have a kid with ADHD/LD/EF issues, you don't appear to have enough empathy to truly understand what those kids/parents deal with and how many things in life have to be approached slightly differently. And I'd pity any kid of yours who happened to have any issues, as you sound as if you wouldn't get them the help they needed to succeed in life.

But it's no just kids with conditions you have dealt with. 18 is 18, if they ask for assistance than it should be given by any normal parent. I don't understand this mentality fo 18 and forget...just because they ask for help doesn't mean they are helpless, they are simply asking for advice on something they can't figure out on their own. If that is a problem for you as a parent than you should reevaluate your place in life cause you probably should have gave birth control another try.

Good lord, you have the expository writing skills of a seventh grader.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your problem is that you have inserted a whole lot of "we" into the process. It shouldn't be "we," it should be your kid. Your job is to tell your kid how much you are willing to and can pay. That's it.

No, that's not "it". You give you kid loads of advice and direction about many things, why should this one decision - the most impactful and expensive they will make for some time in their lives - be an exception? It should not, and it is not for most normal families.

You people that jump all over the use of "we" - I just don't get it. "We decided to eat dinner at Outback Steak House" is fine but "We decided to spend $300,000 on CMU" is not?

Ridiculous.

+1

The people who say their kids can do it all alone must be full pay. We are in real life over here and working side by side with our minor child to make this enormous decision that we are paying 100s of thousands for...

It's fine as a PP said.

Yup! 18 is not a magical age where a parent says "great, you're an adult, no more help/guidance from me". My 26yo still asks for guidance and I give it. They can function on their own, but they know we are always here to help guide them and be sounding board.

It's common sense, the detractors are probably lazy $hitheads who's kids hate them anyway.

Or perhaps your child simply requires assistance because they’re not mature or smart enough to navigate the process on their own. Or perhaps you’re a stifling helicopter mom control freak who doesn’t trust their child’s judgement or work ethic.

Or perhaps the kid has ADHD/learning disabilities/executive functioning issues. Doesn't mean they shouldn't be headed to college, but it might mean they still require a bit of guidance. By guidance I mean discussions and monitoring at high level, reminders to work with the disability office to put services in place, but I never ever did any of it myself---my kid did it ALL themselves. They made the calls, scheduled meetings, got documentation, talked to profs, etc. But that can be overwhelming for someone with any of those issues, so with just a small bit of guidance/discussion with a parent, they can navigate it all themselves. Parent should never ever be calling the university about anything except financial aid, unless there are extremely severe health issues.
But until you have a kid with ADHD/LD/EF issues, you don't appear to have enough empathy to truly understand what those kids/parents deal with and how many things in life have to be approached slightly differently. And I'd pity any kid of yours who happened to have any issues, as you sound as if you wouldn't get them the help they needed to succeed in life.

But it's no just kids with conditions you have dealt with. 18 is 18, if they ask for assistance than it should be given by any normal parent. I don't understand this mentality fo 18 and forget...just because they ask for help doesn't mean they are helpless, they are simply asking for advice on something they can't figure out on their own. If that is a problem for you as a parent than you should reevaluate your place in life cause you probably should have gave birth control another try.

Good lord, you have the expository writing skills of a seventh grader.

Good lord, you have the social skills of a second grader.