Proposal to Stop Enforcing Speeding Tickets

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

Okay, sure.

What about the subject of this thread?

The decision by the council reflects the obvious truth camera placement is inequitable. Instead of making this change though, they should just add more and more and more cameras to Wards 1, 2 and 3 to make it more equitable. Residents in those neighborhoods obviously don’t want that so this is the only solution.

So it’s entirely the fault of wealthy ward 1,2,3 who can magically lobby to not get cameras in their wards, nothing to do with 44% of accidents happening in ward 7 and 8, which would explain the camera placement. The solution is to essentially decriminalize speeding by allowing repeat speeders everywhere to keep getting their drivers licenses without issue. The only fail safe being the remote possibility of a boot, for which the city has only two trucks and poor history of enforcing. Got it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

There is a camera on MacArthur Blvd.. There were two until recently. There is a camera on Arizona Ave. and also two on Reservoir Rd.. There is also the infamous camera on the K St tunnel that catches mostly suburban traffic. I'd be very happy if there were more cameras in these areas.

[Anonymous]

The Council website (https://lims.dccouncil.us/Legislation/B24-0237) says this was transmitted to the Mayor today (July 18) and that a response is due from the Mayor by August 1 (10 working days).

The Washington Post is asking her to veto it: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/07/15/dc-council-unpaid-traffic-tickets-drivers-license/

Mary Cheh is also asking the Mayor to veto it (lhttps://wamu.org/story/22/07/14/the-politics-hour-july-15-2022/), which is curious given that Mary Cheh voted for the bill. Did Mary Cheh not read it before voting for it?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

The current locations of the cameras are here: https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/publication/attachments/ATE%20Active%20Locations%2007012022.pdf. There are 137 cameras. Of these, 24 and 15 are located in Districts 6 and 7 (Wards 7 and 8, more or less). 24 + 15 / 137 = 28 percent. Wards 7 and 8 have 22 percent of the city's population. I'm sorry, but the idea that these cameras are placed predominantly in black neighborhoods is not borne out by the data.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

And yet, there are significant areas with high accident rates in NW DC where gaps in camera coverage are obvious. The racial disparities in automated enforcement could not be more obvious or more clear, no matter how you try to spin the justifications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

And yet, there are significant areas with high accident rates in NW DC where gaps in camera coverage are obvious. The racial disparities in automated enforcement could not be more obvious or more clear, no matter how you try to spin the justifications.

Ok then please move the speed cameras to my neighborhood. It is full of commuters from Maryland speeding. I have witness numerous accidents, including a hit and run. MD drivers suck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

And yet, there are significant areas with high accident rates in NW DC where gaps in camera coverage are obvious. The racial disparities in automated enforcement could not be more obvious or more clear, no matter how you try to spin the justifications.

Thanks for the heat map. Do you have another picture of where cameras are currently set up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

Okay, sure.

What about the subject of this thread?

The decision by the council reflects the obvious truth camera placement is inequitable. Instead of making this change though, they should just add more and more and more cameras to Wards 1, 2 and 3 to make it more equitable. Residents in those neighborhoods obviously don’t want that so this is the only solution.

So it’s entirely the fault of wealthy ward 1,2,3 who can magically lobby to not get cameras in their wards, nothing to do with 44% of accidents happening in ward 7 and 8, which would explain the camera placement. The solution is to essentially decriminalize speeding by allowing repeat speeders everywhere to keep getting their drivers licenses without issue. The only fail safe being the remote possibility of a boot, for which the city has only two trucks and poor history of enforcing. Got it.

I would say that booting is far more disruptive to your life than having your registration renewal held up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

Okay, sure.

What about the subject of this thread?

The decision by the council reflects the obvious truth camera placement is inequitable. Instead of making this change though, they should just add more and more and more cameras to Wards 1, 2 and 3 to make it more equitable. Residents in those neighborhoods obviously don’t want that so this is the only solution.

So it’s entirely the fault of wealthy ward 1,2,3 who can magically lobby to not get cameras in their wards, nothing to do with 44% of accidents happening in ward 7 and 8, which would explain the camera placement. The solution is to essentially decriminalize speeding by allowing repeat speeders everywhere to keep getting their drivers licenses without issue. The only fail safe being the remote possibility of a boot, for which the city has only two trucks and poor history of enforcing. Got it.

I would say that booting is far more disruptive to your life than having your registration renewal held up.

Agree. They need to start immediately booting or towing all MD and VA cars that have outstanding traffic violations including camera violations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

Okay, sure.

What about the subject of this thread?

The decision by the council reflects the obvious truth camera placement is inequitable. Instead of making this change though, they should just add more and more and more cameras to Wards 1, 2 and 3 to make it more equitable. Residents in those neighborhoods obviously don’t want that so this is the only solution.

So it’s entirely the fault of wealthy ward 1,2,3 who can magically lobby to not get cameras in their wards, nothing to do with 44% of accidents happening in ward 7 and 8, which would explain the camera placement. The solution is to essentially decriminalize speeding by allowing repeat speeders everywhere to keep getting their drivers licenses without issue. The only fail safe being the remote possibility of a boot, for which the city has only two trucks and poor history of enforcing. Got it.

I would say that booting is far more disruptive to your life than having your registration renewal held up.

Agree. They need to start immediately booting or towing all MD and VA cars that have outstanding traffic violations including camera violations.

OMG, I would love to have them boot all the crazy VA and MD commuters! Why are DC schoolchildren dying just so that exurban idiots can live out their road rage fantasies?

[Anonymous]

We’d love to see more speed cameras on Cleveland Park, such as all along 34th St and near the various schools. It would improve safety and punish cut-through speeders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

And yet, there are significant areas with high accident rates in NW DC where gaps in camera coverage are obvious. The racial disparities in automated enforcement could not be more obvious or more clear, no matter how you try to spin the justifications.

Thanks for the heat map. Do you have another picture of where cameras are currently set up?

The camera locations are the cyan circles. The size of the circle represents the revenue the camera generates. This is from the DC Policy Center.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

And yet, there are significant areas with high accident rates in NW DC where gaps in camera coverage are obvious. The racial disparities in automated enforcement could not be more obvious or more clear, no matter how you try to spin the justifications.

Thanks for the heat map. Do you have another picture of where cameras are currently set up?

The camera locations are the cyan circles. The size of the circle represents the revenue the camera generates. This is from the DC Policy Center.

It’s not camera placement “racism”. The cameras go where the accidents are mostly happening. Not everything is a racial issue. People are getting fed up every grievance being primarily viewed through a single lens. There are instances of terrible racism for which outrage should be allocated, however if 44% of accidents happen in a certain part of the city, and this is a very progressive city, so I’m having a hard time imagining this is just some plot by a nefarious councils of blatantly racist camera placement officials, but more so advice from traffic planners and others with a transpiration background in safety. Why jump to the most sensationalist conclusions? Jesus fking Christ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is great news. The state shouldn't be able to take away the ability of hard working people to get to their jobs. This is another nail in the coffin of generational poverty for BIPOC.

Gotta love the idea that BIPOC can’t possibly just drive safely or follow the law. Casual racism displays itself in many ways.

This. Years ago, I was offered a ride by immigrant Hispanic neighbors I knew from our kids' school. I was young and stupid and not strictly inclined to use my seatbelt, but they politely asked me to belt up so they wouldn't get stopped by MPD (or wouldn't be found to have violated any rules if they were stopped for some other reason). They were right about safety but also right to insist on basic precautions to avoid citations they couldn't afford. I don't understand why this can't be a basic expectation for everyone. People who can't moderate their speed shouldn't drive, and should expect consequences if they do.

And yet it’s been empirically proven that cameras are placed disproportionately in predominantly Black communities.
https://www.thenewspaper.com/rlc/docs/2018/dc-policycenter.pdf

I’m confused. Is your argument that speed cameras are causing black people to speed? It’s very simple, don’t speed, and you won’t get a ticket. The speed camera being present doesn’t change that.

Then why don't they put them in predominantly White neighborhoods?

There are plenty of cameras in predominantly white neighborhoods. They are put in areas where there is rampant speeding or other traffic safety issues. Traffic fatalities are much higher in areas EOTR. It would be racist for the city to not try to do something about that.

What's your source? More made up BS pulled from the crack of your arse.

Here’s the source, ya tosser: https://www.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/a2f1cca5159e4c6eae197895d2e08336

DP but what is this link supposed to demonstrate exactly?

It’s the DC crash data. It shows that fatal accidents are much higher EOTR than in the rest of the city.

Okay. But what does that have to do with why there are not more cameras in white areas of the city?

Uh, the city puts the cameras where the fatal accidents are to try to reduce the number of people being killed at those locations. More people are being killed in black neighborhoods and so, to try to stop people from being killed in those neighborhoods, that’s where the cameras go. Would you prefer that the city ignore people being killed?

I would think the city should put it in places where people speed to prevent fatal accidents from happening. I see post after post here from presumably people who live in mostly white areas complaining about MD and VA speeders in their neighborhoods. Don’t you want that behavior curtailed so that they don’t kill someone? I guess not.

Let’s take this in for a second. There is not a single speed camera on Connecticut Ave, not Wisconsin Ave, nor McArthur Blvd, nor New Mexico Ave, nor Foxhall.

There is one, and only one, camera on the entirety of Mass Ave in Ward 3 and only one on Reno Rd, which is new. There used to be one on Reno that was removed years ago.

I don’t want you to hear a single complaint from people about speeding in any Ward 3 neighborhood, ever.

As stated earlier, the city installs cameras only after studying accident rates and rate of speed. If there are no cameras on a certain street, that means there's little reason to install them.

There are five red-light cameras, two stop-sign cameras and 10 speed cameras in Ward 3. To say there aren't any is a lie.

And yet, there are significant areas with high accident rates in NW DC where gaps in camera coverage are obvious. The racial disparities in automated enforcement could not be more obvious or more clear, no matter how you try to spin the justifications.

Thanks for the heat map. Do you have another picture of where cameras are currently set up?

The camera locations are the cyan circles. The size of the circle represents the revenue the camera generates. This is from the DC Policy Center.

It’s not camera placement “racism”. The cameras go where the accidents are mostly happening. Not everything is a racial issue. People are getting fed up every grievance being primarily viewed through a single lens. There are instances of terrible racism for which outrage should be allocated, however if 44% of accidents happen in a certain part of the city, and this is a very progressive city, so I’m having a hard time imagining this is just some plot by a nefarious councils of blatantly racist camera placement officials, but more so advice from traffic planners and others with a transpiration background in safety. Why jump to the most sensationalist conclusions? Jesus fking Christ.

I guess if you view it as the outcomes are disparate than yes it’s racist. But honestly poverty correlates to crime and bad decision, as evidenced…by all studies, and it seems ward 7 and 8 have a much higher rate of poverty, so badda bing, Occam’s Razor and there’s your reason for more cameras needed and more tickets being issued. Poor people make worse decisions and yes speed more. Boom. Nobel prize for insight. Thank you to the committee.