Your daily reminder that expecting parents to teach their kids at home is super inequitable

[Anonymous]

One of the frustrations I have is a parent is the lack of transparency about what's happening in the classroom. I get anecdotes from my kid, but they are only providing one perspective. If my kid says the teacher isn't calling on them, etc... are they really raising their hand or speaking loudly enough for the teacher to notice? Are there disruptions elsewhere in the classroom, and if so, how frequent/egregious are they? Are there other social dynamics at play? How can I support my child in solving their own problems, and when is there a problem to a point where I need to step in and do/say something as a parent?

Occasionally we've had a saint of a teacher where we can communicate openly about these things and I feel confident that I have a good understanding of what's happening in the classroom... but other years we're stuck with someone who fails to communicate, or clearly isn't telling us the whole story, or is otherwise standoffish. And since the school doesn't allow parents to observe the classroom we're left in the dark about all of those things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrations I have is a parent is the lack of transparency about what's happening in the classroom. I get anecdotes from my kid, but they are only providing one perspective. If my kid says the teacher isn't calling on them, etc... are they really raising their hand or speaking loudly enough for the teacher to notice? Are there disruptions elsewhere in the classroom, and if so, how frequent/egregious are they? Are there other social dynamics at play? How can I support my child in solving their own problems, and when is there a problem to a point where I need to step in and do/say something as a parent?

Occasionally we've had a saint of a teacher where we can communicate openly about these things and I feel confident that I have a good understanding of what's happening in the classroom... but other years we're stuck with someone who fails to communicate, or clearly isn't telling us the whole story, or is otherwise standoffish. And since the school doesn't allow parents to observe the classroom we're left in the dark about all of those things.

What do your interactions with the non-communicative teachers look like? I've had pretty good luck and haven't had any teachers that I felt weren't telling the whole story. But, I've got a couple of teachers who are friends and they've told stories about parents who initiate conversations in an accusatory manner or who feel like they need to be spoon fed. In my work, I interact with a lot of local government officials and they seem to have the same types of experiences with a limited (but vocal) number of citizens. And these types of people make them dig-in a little, and they probably aren't that responsive to those types of people. (I obviously have no idea what your interactions are like, so I'm not at all saying you're like one of these people. But they exist, and they influence how teachers interact with parents.)

I'm personally happy that our schools don't let parents observe classrooms directly. Some of my kids classmates have terrible parents, and I wouldn't want my kids being watched by those people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is it okay for parents to teach their own child/children to count, learn letters, or speak? What about eat their own food, follow the direction, and respect others? Don’t these behaviors provide privileges?

x1000000

Teach your child to be a civilized human. YES, this is on you, parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrations I have is a parent is the lack of transparency about what's happening in the classroom. I get anecdotes from my kid, but they are only providing one perspective. If my kid says the teacher isn't calling on them, etc... are they really raising their hand or speaking loudly enough for the teacher to notice? Are there disruptions elsewhere in the classroom, and if so, how frequent/egregious are they? Are there other social dynamics at play? How can I support my child in solving their own problems, and when is there a problem to a point where I need to step in and do/say something as a parent?

Occasionally we've had a saint of a teacher where we can communicate openly about these things and I feel confident that I have a good understanding of what's happening in the classroom... but other years we're stuck with someone who fails to communicate, or clearly isn't telling us the whole story, or is otherwise standoffish. And since the school doesn't allow parents to observe the classroom we're left in the dark about all of those things.

I'm not sure that classroom observation is the solution unless you can remain hidden, otherwise, the real dynamic will not reveal itself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is it okay for parents to teach their own child/children to count, learn letters, or speak? What about eat their own food, follow the direction, and respect others? Don’t these behaviors provide privileges?

x1000000

Teach your child to be a civilized human. YES, this is on you, parents.

But some parents aren't human....oh wait...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, parents on 100% responsible for their Children’s education. They may choose to outsource some of it by sending their kids to public or private school, religious school, etc. But I would never rely on any school to provide all of the education. Part of being a parent is educating one’s children.

And what about all the parents who can’t? The ones who work multiple jobs or don’t speak English or aren’t educatefthemselves? They’re sh*t out of luck, according to you? What a crappy outlook you have. ALL kids must be educated…and educated so well that kids shouldn’t need to supplement outside of school.

There is always going to be some disparity I what different families can provide. Always. And schools should absolutely teach the basics of reading, writing, math, etc. But even lower SES uneducated parents can do things like take their kid to the library, teach them manners, their native language, share stories of their family, culture, native country, etc (if immigrants), talk to them, & maybe occasionally take them to free museums or on hikes (if they have time). And many such parents do these things. All of this is education, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, parents on 100% responsible for their Children’s education. They may choose to outsource some of it by sending their kids to public or private school, religious school, etc. But I would never rely on any school to provide all of the education. Part of being a parent is educating one’s children.

And what about all the parents who can’t? The ones who work multiple jobs or don’t speak English or aren’t educatefthemselves? They’re sh*t out of luck, according to you? What a crappy outlook you have. ALL kids must be educated…and educated so well that kids shouldn’t need to supplement outside of school.

There is always going to be some disparity I what different families can provide. Always. And schools should absolutely teach the basics of reading, writing, math, etc. But even lower SES uneducated parents can do things like take their kid to the library, teach them manners, their native language, share stories of their family, culture, native country, etc (if immigrants), talk to them, & maybe occasionally take them to free museums or on hikes (if they have time). And many such parents do these things. All of this is education, too.

I’m sorry, but…you’re living under a rock. Many can do these things, absolutely. But it’s not like everyone has access to a library. It’s not like everyone has weekends free to hang out with their kids. It’s not like everyone is literate, even in their native language. Museums are rarely free and plenty of areas don’t have the green space for hikes.

But to me the bigger issue is the fairness to the child. It’s almost cruel to be aware that some kids have parents who won’t or can’t read or do times tables with their kids and then shrug your shoulders and say “well, public school can’t do everything!” No it can’t but it can do the basics and it’s so unfair to the kids to suggest otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a black parent, I don't have the luxury of expecting the school to do the heavy lifting in terms of core math and ELA. Maybe little white kids can survive entering K with zero literacy or numeracy skills, but my little black boys wouldn't be taken seriously, nor would I as a responsible parent. Don't talk to be about "equity" when some of you want the "privilege" of sending your kids to school unprepared, notwithstanding the fact that you have the resources to do so.

No, the school shouldn't expect much from parents, but you should expect more from yourselves.

White parents don't have the luxury either. We were told by a black principal how because we supplemented at home/private therapies our child would not get the help at school they needed as they had other families who needed it more. Racism goes both ways. She'd boost up the black kids and ignore the white/hispanic/asian kids. There is no equity. We didn't have the privilege of getting school help and went into heavy debt to get our child the help they needed.

I’m the PP. I didn’t blame “racism” and I don’t thing white teachers have it out for my kids. But the reality is that very few black boys are on the level academically and so it’s not surprising that institutions expect little of them, even if they don’t harbor racial animus towards them. It’s that reality, not racism per se, that I have accommodate for — and it’s something we’d have to accommodate for at ANY school, save for a few select privates with a history of educating high performing black boys. Your unfortunate matter might very well be due to the racism of administration in your particular school, but that’s not what I was speaking of. And I hardly doubt that the black principal is doing much to “boost” the black kids, who I bet still perform abysmally. And trust me, it sounds like another school where I wouldn’t send my black sons because the same principal would probably be even more dismissive of our high-SES black family and expect us to accept it out of sense of racial solidarity. This is all way more complex and nuanced that you can appreciate.

NP. I think this complexity and nuanced reference encapsulates where we are in society today. A great deal of broad-stroke arguments are dividing us even further, be it regarding education, race, abortion... I applaud your pragmatic approach to your sons' education, PP. You are getting it done despite the environment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I fully agree that supplementing at home should not be necessary (and I don't do it).

However, OP's list of parental responsibilities is woefully deficient. How about our responsibility to make sure our kids are respectful, to teachers and their peers? To instill a love of learning that makes them receptive to what they hear in school? To teach them to take responsibility for themselves and their schoolwork? To encourage them to be invested in their education and success? To teach them to listen? And on and on.

There's a lot more to education than multiplication tables and those are the critical skills that start at home.

All of this. Amen.

[Anonymous]

Pfft, parents don't make their kids do homework. It's why so many kids are behind and to be frank, ignorant.

I have more kids who "opt out" of homework than who will do any.

But what's it matter if they don't do the homework and fail a test anyway? We now allow corrections to be made and turned back in for credit. And how do they get to make those corrections? With books open.

Simply put, from the point of view from a kid in my class: This is dumb and useless, Mrs. J. Everything I need to know I can Google in 5 seconds!

That's literally how most kids feel, too.

Until parents go back to making kids do their homework and the Administration goes back to one and done tests, kids today will continue to be unprepared and behind academically.

This is anonymous so I will say it: redistricting & bussing of elementary school students was one of the worst things we did in education. It was far better to have an entire school from a low income area because then that school was provided with adequate resources to get the kids the help they needed. When everyone began K at a level 0-1, it was easier to teach the kids as a group.

Now that kids are bussed in to make a school a melting pot of diversity and socioeconomic statuses, and the kids, the schools, and the teachers struggle more. Instead of getting everyone coming in at the same level, you get a handful of kids who don't even know how to hold a pencil or identify letters, a handful who know their ABCs & 123s perfectly and other basics, and a handful who have sometimes completed PK2, PK3, PK4 and are ready to read and get bored quickly.

Do you know what happens when you have Kid 1 coming in at a level 0 and Kid 2 coming in at a level 7 in the same class? Kid 1 gets frustrated that they are behind and not "as smart as" other kids. Kid 2 gets frustrated because they are learning things they already know & gets bored.

Elementary schools shouldn't be redistricted or busses. You learn the fundamentals in those grades and it's better to learn those fundamentals with kids who are similar in skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I fully agree that supplementing at home should not be necessary (and I don't do it).

However, OP's list of parental responsibilities is woefully deficient. How about our responsibility to make sure our kids are respectful, to teachers and their peers? To instill a love of learning that makes them receptive to what they hear in school? To teach them to take responsibility for themselves and their schoolwork? To encourage them to be invested in their education and success? To teach them to listen? And on and on.

There's a lot more to education than multiplication tables and those are the critical skills that start at home.

So you really expected me to list all of those things? Even you couldn’t do it - you wrote “on and on”. So really you just wanted to argue for the sake of arguing.

My basic point was that parents should not be responsible for finding and filling in gaps in curriculum. They should absolutely be responsible for sending their kids to school ready to learn, and support it at home through homework that the school assigns (which can include nightly reading, or suggested trips to the library). Why should parents have to take on the mental load of identifying their school’s deficiencies?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pfft, parents don't make their kids do homework. It's why so many kids are behind and to be frank, ignorant.

I have more kids who "opt out" of homework than who will do any.

But what's it matter if they don't do the homework and fail a test anyway? We now allow corrections to be made and turned back in for credit. And how do they get to make those corrections? With books open.

Simply put, from the point of view from a kid in my class: This is dumb and useless, Mrs. J. Everything I need to know I can Google in 5 seconds!

That's literally how most kids feel, too.

Until parents go back to making kids do their homework and the Administration goes back to one and done tests, kids today will continue to be unprepared and behind academically.

This is anonymous so I will say it: redistricting & bussing of elementary school students was one of the worst things we did in education. It was far better to have an entire school from a low income area because then that school was provided with adequate resources to get the kids the help they needed. When everyone began K at a level 0-1, it was easier to teach the kids as a group.

Now that kids are bussed in to make a school a melting pot of diversity and socioeconomic statuses, and the kids, the schools, and the teachers struggle more. Instead of getting everyone coming in at the same level, you get a handful of kids who don't even know how to hold a pencil or identify letters, a handful who know their ABCs & 123s perfectly and other basics, and a handful who have sometimes completed PK2, PK3, PK4 and are ready to read and get bored quickly.

Do you know what happens when you have Kid 1 coming in at a level 0 and Kid 2 coming in at a level 7 in the same class? Kid 1 gets frustrated that they are behind and not "as smart as" other kids. Kid 2 gets frustrated because they are learning things they already know & gets bored.

Elementary schools shouldn't be redistricted or busses. You learn the fundamentals in those grades and it's better to learn those fundamentals with kids who are similar in skills.

What a mess. God bless you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I fully agree that supplementing at home should not be necessary (and I don't do it).

However, OP's list of parental responsibilities is woefully deficient. How about our responsibility to make sure our kids are respectful, to teachers and their peers? To instill a love of learning that makes them receptive to what they hear in school? To teach them to take responsibility for themselves and their schoolwork? To encourage them to be invested in their education and success? To teach them to listen? And on and on.

There's a lot more to education than multiplication tables and those are the critical skills that start at home.

So you really expected me to list all of those things? Even you couldn’t do it - you wrote “on and on”. So really you just wanted to argue for the sake of arguing.

My basic point was that parents should not be responsible for finding and filling in gaps in curriculum. They should absolutely be responsible for sending their kids to school ready to learn, and support it at home through homework that the school assigns (which can include nightly reading, or suggested trips to the library). Why should parents have to take on the mental load of identifying their school’s deficiencies?

Depending on what bodies of knowledge you want your child to acquire, almost all schools are deficient in some way, if still adequate for the most part.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, parents on 100% responsible for their Children’s education. They may choose to outsource some of it by sending their kids to public or private school, religious school, etc. But I would never rely on any school to provide all of the education. Part of being a parent is educating one’s children.

And what about all the parents who can’t? The ones who work multiple jobs or don’t speak English or aren’t educatefthemselves? They’re sh*t out of luck, according to you? What a crappy outlook you have. ALL kids must be educated…and educated so well that kids shouldn’t need to supplement outside of school.

There is always going to be some disparity I what different families can provide. Always. And schools should absolutely teach the basics of reading, writing, math, etc. But even lower SES uneducated parents can do things like take their kid to the library, teach them manners, their native language, share stories of their family, culture, native country, etc (if immigrants), talk to them, & maybe occasionally take them to free museums or on hikes (if they have time). And many such parents do these things. All of this is education, too.

I’m a child of poor immigrants. My parents did zero outside enrichment for me. In fact, I did everything for them. I always had to translate for them, make phone calls, fill out forms, etc. They didn’t enrich or supplement.

I hated being poor and worked hard.

I’m afraid my UMC kids who have everything handed to them won’t be able to stand on their own. I was so used to doing everything for myself and had independence from a young age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a black parent, I don't have the luxury of expecting the school to do the heavy lifting in terms of core math and ELA. Maybe little white kids can survive entering K with zero literacy or numeracy skills, but my little black boys wouldn't be taken seriously, nor would I as a responsible parent. Don't talk to be about "equity" when some of you want the "privilege" of sending your kids to school unprepared, notwithstanding the fact that you have the resources to do so.

No, the school shouldn't expect much from parents, but you should expect more from yourselves.

Fascinating take given that while the U.S. does have systemic racism, it is almost entirely aimed at whites.

Your children will have government and private corporate handouts and quotas available regardless of their talent. My white kids won't. You don't want equality, you want even more special privileges than you already have.