I'm so tired of the adult female friendship dance

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else?
My high school friends are scattered and a few have splintered off with time, which is normal, I suppose. Ditto college. We mainly communicate via memes or some text threads.
The adult friends I made in my 20s all are now busy with families, me included; seems there's never a great time to meet up, and some have moved.
I love my neighborhood and have cultivated some solid friendships there, originally through my kids, but the guesswork sucks. I don't want to come off as too aggressive or needy, so I limit invites or texts. I thought I clicked with one person -- but several hangouts later, they basically ghosted and stopped reciprocating, our text thread went dormant, and...poof.
Anyone else in this boat? I just feel low-level stressed and somewhat lonely as a middle-aged mom.

It gets worse once your kids leave school.

+100

Why does it get worse when your kids leave? I'd think then I'd have more time to spend with my friends!

You meet a lot of parents at school functions, band concerts, soccer games etc and their kids might be coming and going to your house. Once the kids scatter in all directions for college, you have fewer chances to interact with those parents. Your main connection was the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel you, OP. I have a small handful of women I feel true friendship with, but I can only handle one-on-one togethers and it’s usually something active like a long walk or a run.

I don’t do group meetups anymore. The dynamics are too complex in multiple ways. For me, social media plus Covid years plus late 40s general malaise has killed my desire to go out in public with a group of women. Even ones I actually like.

I agree with you. I had a close friend and we would always do park meet uups, coffee and so on. Now every time she texts me it's for some large group gathering with her new friends and I can't stand at least half of them. I feel like I'm not important enough for her to mark out time for just me anymore!

That seems like a negative take. With kids’ activities etc, I have limited free time. I want to maintain connections with my friends but do not have time to see each individually all the time. I guess that’s a choice, but I’m not going to give up my job or kids activities to do that right now. Thankfully, my friends see that I do prioritize them and I look forward to more one on one gatherings once the kids are older. Most of them are in a similar space.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel you, OP. I have a small handful of women I feel true friendship with, but I can only handle one-on-one togethers and it’s usually something active like a long walk or a run.

I don’t do group meetups anymore. The dynamics are too complex in multiple ways. For me, social media plus Covid years plus late 40s general malaise has killed my desire to go out in public with a group of women. Even ones I actually like.

I agree with you. I had a close friend and we would always do park meet uups, coffee and so on. Now every time she texts me it's for some large group gathering with her new friends and I can't stand at least half of them. I feel like I'm not important enough for her to mark out time for just me anymore!

That seems like a negative take. With kids’ activities etc, I have limited free time. I want to maintain connections with my friends but do not have time to see each individually all the time. I guess that’s a choice, but I’m not going to give up my job or kids activities to do that right now. Thankfully, my friends see that I do prioritize them and I look forward to more one on one gatherings once the kids are older. Most of them are in a similar space.

Once the kids are older, you may find your friends have moved on.

[Anonymous]

Once I left school (grad school) I realized if I wanted friends, I had to be super proactive about it. I put more effort into making friends than dating. And I’m an introvert, but I like being social.

In some ways if got harder as I got older (and more adult - job, married, house, kids) - but each time I had one of those life changes I went out to try to make friends - and connect people together.

It helped that I had a few special interests - joined knitting meet ups, tennis lessons, book clubs, social networking, alumni groups, the new mom groups, daycare friends etc.

I’ve realized a few things:
1) someone has to ask first
2) you aren’t going to connect with everyone
2a) it’s a valuable skill to be able to have a conversation with and find something interesting about most people you meet
3) you aren’t going to have identical interests as everyone
3a) which means you have friends you go to concerts with and friends you go on hikes with etc.
4) friends will drift away, it’s usually not personal
5) if it’s a larger group based on an interest or kid activity or neighborhood, there are people you will have to put up with
5a) there are probably people who feel that way about you - it’s okay - you don’t need to be everyone’s cup of tea
6) if your kids and spouses get along - great - but once your kids are out of early elementary- eh not a big deal.
7) sometimes you have to be good with just texting memes back and forth
8) you have to initiate/plan - and sometimes you’re doing it more than 50% of the time


My mom - also an introvert - is very good at doing this. I’ve realized she’s good at talking about a lot of subjects, she has a lot of interests, and she doesn’t expect more of people than they are offering. She has good friends, but she also has casual friends she plays bridge with, and other friends she sees at her exercise classes. It’s made her retirement/widowhood so much easier.

My father - the extrovert - was not so good at this - he had very high standards/expectations, if someone upset him, they were dead to him, and he focused so much on “productive” and “valuable” interests that he eschewed any hobbies or activities that were just for the fun of it. When he retired, he quickly went downhill - it was really sad and frustrating.

I don’t think it’s any worse here than any other areas - there are snobs and status seekers everywhere. But it’s not effortless.

[Anonymous]

PP here - I really would like to hang out with people 1:1 as well - but limited time makes that hard. It also feels odd in some of my friend groups because most of my friends are in groups of 3-6, so 1:1 meetups do feel like we are leaving someone out deliberately.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else?
My high school friends are scattered and a few have splintered off with time, which is normal, I suppose. Ditto college. We mainly communicate via memes or some text threads.
The adult friends I made in my 20s all are now busy with families, me included; seems there's never a great time to meet up, and some have moved.
I love my neighborhood and have cultivated some solid friendships there, originally through my kids, but the guesswork sucks. I don't want to come off as too aggressive or needy, so I limit invites or texts. I thought I clicked with one person -- but several hangouts later, they basically ghosted and stopped reciprocating, our text thread went dormant, and...poof.
Anyone else in this boat? I just feel low-level stressed and somewhat lonely as a middle-aged mom.

I am someone that enjoys my friendships and have multiple friends from various stages in my life that I see fairly often. I think one of the most important things in adult frienships is flexibility and giving people some grace. Bad things can happen in people's lives that cause them to have limited bandwidth. Reach out again if you really connected with someone, even if it has been a few months. You may find that they had some sort of crisis and are now in a better place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else?
My high school friends are scattered and a few have splintered off with time, which is normal, I suppose. Ditto college. We mainly communicate via memes or some text threads.
The adult friends I made in my 20s all are now busy with families, me included; seems there's never a great time to meet up, and some have moved.
I love my neighborhood and have cultivated some solid friendships there, originally through my kids, but the guesswork sucks. I don't want to come off as too aggressive or needy, so I limit invites or texts. I thought I clicked with one person -- but several hangouts later, they basically ghosted and stopped reciprocating, our text thread went dormant, and...poof.
Anyone else in this boat? I just feel low-level stressed and somewhat lonely as a middle-aged mom.

It gets worse once your kids leave school.

+100

Why does it get worse when your kids leave? I'd think then I'd have more time to spend with my friends!

You meet a lot of parents at school functions, band concerts, soccer games etc and their kids might be coming and going to your house. Once the kids scatter in all directions for college, you have fewer chances to interact with those parents. Your main connection was the school.

Hmm. A few of my friends are the moms of my kids' friends but my closest friends I have known way before I even had kids. I could see becoming less close to certain people if our kids weren't interacting anymore but we also do things without the kids, so while the children are the reason we know each other, they're not the glue that hold us together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else?
My high school friends are scattered and a few have splintered off with time, which is normal, I suppose. Ditto college. We mainly communicate via memes or some text threads.
The adult friends I made in my 20s all are now busy with families, me included; seems there's never a great time to meet up, and some have moved.
I love my neighborhood and have cultivated some solid friendships there, originally through my kids, but the guesswork sucks. I don't want to come off as too aggressive or needy, so I limit invites or texts. I thought I clicked with one person -- but several hangouts later, they basically ghosted and stopped reciprocating, our text thread went dormant, and...poof.
Anyone else in this boat? I just feel low-level stressed and somewhat lonely as a middle-aged mom.

I am someone that enjoys my friendships and have multiple friends from various stages in my life that I see fairly often. I think one of the most important things in adult frienships is flexibility and giving people some grace. Bad things can happen in people's lives that cause them to have limited bandwidth. Reach out again if you really connected with someone, even if it has been a few months. You may find that they had some sort of crisis and are now in a better place.

Shouldn't good friends be reaching out when a person is in a bad place?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've sometimes thought about sending out a blast email (or maybe even an Evite where you can't see respondents) and setting up a happy hour, a brunch, a dinner, and letting whoever wants to join just join. But then I worry I'd be the only person there.

Absolutely try it! You may get a huge response, you may get a small response. Either way, you’re going to spend some time connecting with people.

And if no one shows up … know it’s only because their kids are needy and demanding and exhausting (as kids tend to be) and they likely feel worse about missing it than you do about them not being there. (Seriously, I’m so disappointed when I’m looking forward to something like that and then bail because things when sideways at home or I’m spiraling in an awful mood because of same …. )

Truly, I think it’s a wonderful idea! Try it once and see what happens!

Whenever I do this I always get a great response. I also started a monthly game night years ago that gets a great response. Moms want an excuse to get a break from their kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel you, OP. I have a small handful of women I feel true friendship with, but I can only handle one-on-one togethers and it’s usually something active like a long walk or a run.

I don’t do group meetups anymore. The dynamics are too complex in multiple ways. For me, social media plus Covid years plus late 40s general malaise has killed my desire to go out in public with a group of women. Even ones I actually like.

I agree with you. I had a close friend and we would always do park meet uups, coffee and so on. Now every time she texts me it's for some large group gathering with her new friends and I can't stand at least half of them. I feel like I'm not important enough for her to mark out time for just me anymore!

That seems like a negative take. With kids’ activities etc, I have limited free time. I want to maintain connections with my friends but do not have time to see each individually all the time. I guess that’s a choice, but I’m not going to give up my job or kids activities to do that right now. Thankfully, my friends see that I do prioritize them and I look forward to more one on one gatherings once the kids are older. Most of them are in a similar space.

Once the kids are older, you may find your friends have moved on.

Maybe a couple. But we see each other now. We just don’t have the time to get together individually on a regular basis. So I imagine they won’t just disappear when we both have that time. Our friendship isn’t based around our kids now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Once I left school (grad school) I realized if I wanted friends, I had to be super proactive about it. I put more effort into making friends than dating. And I’m an introvert, but I like being social.

In some ways if got harder as I got older (and more adult - job, married, house, kids) - but each time I had one of those life changes I went out to try to make friends - and connect people together.

It helped that I had a few special interests - joined knitting meet ups, tennis lessons, book clubs, social networking, alumni groups, the new mom groups, daycare friends etc.

I’ve realized a few things:
1) someone has to ask first
2) you aren’t going to connect with everyone
2a) it’s a valuable skill to be able to have a conversation with and find something interesting about most people you meet
3) you aren’t going to have identical interests as everyone
3a) which means you have friends you go to concerts with and friends you go on hikes with etc.
4) friends will drift away, it’s usually not personal
5) if it’s a larger group based on an interest or kid activity or neighborhood, there are people you will have to put up with
5a) there are probably people who feel that way about you - it’s okay - you don’t need to be everyone’s cup of tea
6) if your kids and spouses get along - great - but once your kids are out of early elementary- eh not a big deal.
7) sometimes you have to be good with just texting memes back and forth
8) you have to initiate/plan - and sometimes you’re doing it more than 50% of the time


My mom - also an introvert - is very good at doing this. I’ve realized she’s good at talking about a lot of subjects, she has a lot of interests, and she doesn’t expect more of people than they are offering. She has good friends, but she also has casual friends she plays bridge with, and other friends she sees at her exercise classes. It’s made her retirement/widowhood so much easier.

My father - the extrovert - was not so good at this - he had very high standards/expectations, if someone upset him, they were dead to him, and he focused so much on “productive” and “valuable” interests that he eschewed any hobbies or activities that were just for the fun of it. When he retired, he quickly went downhill - it was really sad and frustrating.

I don’t think it’s any worse here than any other areas - there are snobs and status seekers everywhere. But it’s not effortless.

This is good advice. There's certainly an ebb and flow to it.

OP, I'd drop your concern about seeming needy. You are needy! You need friends. It's ok to ask people to hang out and have them be busy. Make it low stress stuff like "walk over for s'mores if you're around!" and aim for shorter gatherings. This helps take pressure off people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Once I left school (grad school) I realized if I wanted friends, I had to be super proactive about it. I put more effort into making friends than dating. And I’m an introvert, but I like being social.

In some ways if got harder as I got older (and more adult - job, married, house, kids) - but each time I had one of those life changes I went out to try to make friends - and connect people together.

It helped that I had a few special interests - joined knitting meet ups, tennis lessons, book clubs, social networking, alumni groups, the new mom groups, daycare friends etc.

I’ve realized a few things:
1) someone has to ask first
2) you aren’t going to connect with everyone
2a) it’s a valuable skill to be able to have a conversation with and find something interesting about most people you meet
3) you aren’t going to have identical interests as everyone
3a) which means you have friends you go to concerts with and friends you go on hikes with etc.
4) friends will drift away, it’s usually not personal
5) if it’s a larger group based on an interest or kid activity or neighborhood, there are people you will have to put up with
5a) there are probably people who feel that way about you - it’s okay - you don’t need to be everyone’s cup of tea
6) if your kids and spouses get along - great - but once your kids are out of early elementary- eh not a big deal.
7) sometimes you have to be good with just texting memes back and forth
8) you have to initiate/plan - and sometimes you’re doing it more than 50% of the time


My mom - also an introvert - is very good at doing this. I’ve realized she’s good at talking about a lot of subjects, she has a lot of interests, and she doesn’t expect more of people than they are offering. She has good friends, but she also has casual friends she plays bridge with, and other friends she sees at her exercise classes. It’s made her retirement/widowhood so much easier.

My father - the extrovert - was not so good at this - he had very high standards/expectations, if someone upset him, they were dead to him, and he focused so much on “productive” and “valuable” interests that he eschewed any hobbies or activities that were just for the fun of it. When he retired, he quickly went downhill - it was really sad and frustrating.

I don’t think it’s any worse here than any other areas - there are snobs and status seekers everywhere. But it’s not effortless.

Your list sounds pretty spot on to me. It’s interesting about your mom. As an introvert I don’t really ever crave people to socialize with or discuss subjects with. What I do miss is people I could do nothing with and it felt good and comfortable. Like a friend I could call spontaneously and say hey, want to watch Survivor and eat some cheese? I don’t like the calculations of proper dinner dates and get togethers. I think that’s why I’ve really floundered as a middle aged person in terms of friendship: the work involved and the nature of adult friendships aren’t my thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've sometimes thought about sending out a blast email (or maybe even an Evite where you can't see respondents) and setting up a happy hour, a brunch, a dinner, and letting whoever wants to join just join. But then I worry I'd be the only person there.

Absolutely try it! You may get a huge response, you may get a small response. Either way, you’re going to spend some time connecting with people.

And if no one shows up … know it’s only because their kids are needy and demanding and exhausting (as kids tend to be) and they likely feel worse about missing it than you do about them not being there. (Seriously, I’m so disappointed when I’m looking forward to something like that and then bail because things when sideways at home or I’m spiraling in an awful mood because of same …. )

Truly, I think it’s a wonderful idea! Try it once and see what happens!

Whenever I do this I always get a great response. I also started a monthly game night years ago that gets a great response. Moms want an excuse to get a break from their kids.

Same here. And I have found long term friends this way. Coordinate with one person beforehand to ensure you won’t be all alone, if you can. That made me less stressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think there are many of us in this same boat, especially in this area. Either you are a social climber or you are not and if you are not, you will struggle here. There's too many rules here and one simple "mistake" will oust you.

What rules are those. Exactly?

I cannot relate to what you’re describing. Is this just a female insecurity thing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Try not to take it personally. We are all busy, but that doesn’t mean we don’t value our friendships — we just don’t have time. I have local friends I haven’t seen in a year or more; however, if our scheduled meshed and we had a chance to connect, we would pick up right where we left off.

You don’t MAKE time, you mean. You have it. You just make other choices.