What do you think about Upper Schools telling parents to butt out?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s appropriate. 3 kids through high school, one remaining. Outside Parent Teacher conferences, I never communicated with any teacher. My kids did not have any accommodations, so could see communication of that was the case.

I’d like some lower school and intermediate /middle school student parent perspectives. They have the same policy there- parents out of the picture.

My kid got dragged into a Restorative Justice session when witnessing bullying. Parents were never told, or at least we weren’t.

A couple months later when my kid was the target of the same bully and not wanting to go to school, she disclosed this mtg that happened a couple months ago.

Apparently she only said some benign thing at the mtg, in front of the bully snd whole group since that’s how the guidance counselor rolls, about how everyone should be nice. And then the retaliation game began.

First I asked teacher wtf was going on. Silence; everyone is nice here. Then we had to go to guidance counselor, got total shock from her. Lastly I ran into some parents who all had issues with the same bully bullying their kid. Took months to figure that out with zero help, only zero communication, from the lower school.

And they had the gall to say, when we requested distance with next years homeroom, you should have told us right away!

Will you keep your child at the school for US?

[Anonymous]

What difference does it make to you whether PP stays or leaves for US?

[Anonymous]

I am interested because people say (like the PP above) that even though they *and their child* are unhappy at their school, they didn’t know how the school operates when they joined and they can’t leave because it’s too late. The child is in US and it would be disruptive, esp to their college ambitions, etc.

This parent is fully aware of how the school operates. Will they choose to stay?

[Anonymous]

You just laid out the quandary that PP faces and I agree that it’s a potentially tough situation. That said, I’m interested in knowing why does it matter to you which way things end for their family?

[Anonymous]

Because we are in the same spot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our kids attend two Big 3s and both have the philosophy that parents should not be involved in any conversations between students and teachers/coaches.

When teachers/coaches are snarky, inappropriate, or even verbally abusive, the students are supposed to handle it themselves. Students are even punished if parents get involved.

Supposedly this is all in the name of student empowerment but say what you will even a 18 yr old is not on the same footing as a teacher or coach. This seems a perfect way for teachers/coaches to avoid accountability.

On the flip side I get that some parents are privileged PITAs and whine over every little thing making teachers’ lives a misery and wasting their time.

How can schools find a better way than telling students and parents in a blanket way that parents should not be involved in conversations with teachers/coaches?

If you have teachers and coaches like this, why is your kid at this school? You be the adult and remove your kid from a crappy school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a teacher, and I have almost 20 years of experience.

The situation has radically changed over the past several years. While most parents are reasonable and perfectly pleasant, there is a small, crazed minority of parents who have ruined the system for the majority of teachers, students, and parents. These policies are in place because that is the only way to ensure that teachers are not harrassed, slandered, and attacked by a minority of (very, VERY) badly-behaved parents.

I have witnessed a bevy of moms make it their single purpose to humiliate and destroy the careers of colleagues. I have witnessed parents cursing and shouting at colleagues. I have directly experienced parents who send me abusive emails before they have bothered to learn the facts of a situation, and parents who cannot conceal their disgust and scorn for teachers in general, and who believe and act as if every teacher is an enemy and peasant who must be bullied. Again, this is not the majority of parents, but when the minority of badly-behaved parents is allowed to run rampant, it destroys the atmosphere for all teachers at the school, as well as the well-being and possibly the career of the teacher receiving the brunt of the abuse. I do not think any other working professional routinely endures the insults and abuse teachers receive. I really don't.

I agree that constructing a wall between parent and teacher is not the ideal way to support students. But I also don't see any alternative. I don't think it is possible to fully understand just how bad some parents behave toward teachers unless you have witnessed this.

For the record, I have a track record of strong AP scores and great relationships with students and parents. Most of the teachers I have seen abused by parents were perfectly competent as well (not all, but even with weaker teachers, abusing them doesn't improve the situation).

I don't know what the solution is here. But I suggest that rather than blaming the school for these unpleasant policies, you look toward the few badly-behaved parents who have ruined things for us all.

I hear you my complaints are not teacher based, we never felt the need to contact a teacher - although it's sad there are no teacher conferences.

For us, the bigger issue at our school (we are the "it's not-NCS" family) is the admin having zero reflection on what happens in the school on a variety of issues and how it has a very toxic overall impact on culture. When an admin assumes that no feedback is ever worthy and allows that view to permeates to every aspect of (and adult in) the school, it is a problem. And it has a huge impact. Especially when "no feedback is worth" is hand in hand with "we are rigorous and students need to handle it". There's some key sense of humanity and kindness lacking in that equation as it is currently playing out and it lacks understanding that even high achieving mature HS students are still kids and could use some positive mentoring to go along with the rigor and forays into self-advocation.

I will say that we know of others who did have issues with teachers. The same names came up from different circles over different years...so admin should reflect in those situations too - and not just assume it's a student in over their head (as school would say - from parent pushing student to take too hard of a course) or a parent just pushing for a higher grade. (Again - this was not our situation but even from the outside, it seemed like "there was something there" regarding some teachers.....and that in other cases it was likely the student in over their head)

I will also say there were situations where admin were touting policies towards being out sick (during COVID) that were then flatly NOT being played out by staff. The school found this hard to believe - but I heard so many stories from other parents about students returning from long breaks where the policy was not being put into practice. (some parents didn't know about the policy - just them conveying difficulty of return and me saying "but what about this policy..." ).

What do you mean there are no parent-teacher conferences?

Well...I mean this...

Our school had 1 teacher conference in Fall of 9th grade (with only 3 teachers - which may or not match your choice of preferred 3). Then, never again.

Which school?

Sidwell - don't know if this will change with new HS leadership.

Sidwell does not have parent-teacher conferences in HS? That’s ridiculous. My kids are in elementary school right now so I didn’t realize that HS is this - be independent and sink or swim mentality.

[Anonymous]

Oh give me a break. That’s not true at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Because we are in the same spot.

I empathize with your situation. What’s still not clear to me is if or how PP’s decision affects what choice you make. If PP left you would too? If PP stayed you would too? If there’s no connection, why does it matter?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Because we are in the same spot.

I empathize with your situation. What’s still not clear to me is if or how PP’s decision affects what choice you make. If PP left you would too? If PP stayed you would too? If there’s no connection, why does it matter?

Why does it matter to you why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s appropriate. 3 kids through high school, one remaining. Outside Parent Teacher conferences, I never communicated with any teacher. My kids did not have any accommodations, so could see communication of that was the case.

I’d like some lower school and intermediate /middle school student parent perspectives. They have the same policy there- parents out of the picture.

My kid got dragged into a Restorative Justice session when witnessing bullying. Parents were never told, or at least we weren’t.

A couple months later when my kid was the target of the same bully and not wanting to go to school, she disclosed this mtg that happened a couple months ago.

Apparently she only said some benign thing at the mtg, in front of the bully snd whole group since that’s how the guidance counselor rolls, about how everyone should be nice. And then the retaliation game began.

First I asked teacher wtf was going on. Silence; everyone is nice here. Then we had to go to guidance counselor, got total shock from her. Lastly I ran into some parents who all had issues with the same bully bullying their kid. Took months to figure that out with zero help, only zero communication, from the lower school.

And they had the gall to say, when we requested distance with next years homeroom, you should have told us right away!

As an elementary teacher this anecdote has been weighing on me. We have to teach children that there is efficacy to their self advocacy or they will stop trying to advocate for themselves. Telling a parent about their distress caused by a peer or teacher at school **is** age appropriate self advocacy and should be followed through on so they can see the connection between speaking up and getting results.

Quashing their voice because they weren't brave enough to tell the "correct" adult is detrimental to their future efforts and sets them up for future harm and possible abuse. They may internalize events as being their fault rather than a problem to be solved with support. Responding now can set them up for more success in the future.

[Anonymous]

For those considering a move in LS, I can tell you that it needn't be this way. When my child had a teasing concern and spoke up to me about it, I shared the concern with the administrator and teachers in a very objective "wanted to let you know that this this was reported to me but obviously I wasn't there" sort of way. By day's end I was clearly informed of the age appropriate follow ups that had happened that day and would be happening in the future. The issue quickly resolved. There is no reason for parents to be boxed out if they are reporting concerns appropriately.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Because we are in the same spot.

I empathize with your situation. What’s still not clear to me is if or how PP’s decision affects what choice you make. If PP left you would too? If PP stayed you would too? If there’s no connection, why does it matter?

DP. Why are you harping on this person? Maybe it’s just human curiosity wanting to know the outcome of the story. Who cares? It was a simple question. The person they asked can share the answer or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a teacher, and I have almost 20 years of experience.

The situation has radically changed over the past several years. While most parents are reasonable and perfectly pleasant, there is a small, crazed minority of parents who have ruined the system for the majority of teachers, students, and parents. These policies are in place because that is the only way to ensure that teachers are not harrassed, slandered, and attacked by a minority of (very, VERY) badly-behaved parents.

I have witnessed a bevy of moms make it their single purpose to humiliate and destroy the careers of colleagues. I have witnessed parents cursing and shouting at colleagues. I have directly experienced parents who send me abusive emails before they have bothered to learn the facts of a situation, and parents who cannot conceal their disgust and scorn for teachers in general, and who believe and act as if every teacher is an enemy and peasant who must be bullied. Again, this is not the majority of parents, but when the minority of badly-behaved parents is allowed to run rampant, it destroys the atmosphere for all teachers at the school, as well as the well-being and possibly the career of the teacher receiving the brunt of the abuse. I do not think any other working professional routinely endures the insults and abuse teachers receive. I really don't.

I agree that constructing a wall between parent and teacher is not the ideal way to support students. But I also don't see any alternative. I don't think it is possible to fully understand just how bad some parents behave toward teachers unless you have witnessed this.

For the record, I have a track record of strong AP scores and great relationships with students and parents. Most of the teachers I have seen abused by parents were perfectly competent as well (not all, but even with weaker teachers, abusing them doesn't improve the situation).

I don't know what the solution is here. But I suggest that rather than blaming the school for these unpleasant policies, you look toward the few badly-behaved parents who have ruined things for us all.

I hear you my complaints are not teacher based, we never felt the need to contact a teacher - although it's sad there are no teacher conferences.

For us, the bigger issue at our school (we are the "it's not-NCS" family) is the admin having zero reflection on what happens in the school on a variety of issues and how it has a very toxic overall impact on culture. When an admin assumes that no feedback is ever worthy and allows that view to permeates to every aspect of (and adult in) the school, it is a problem. And it has a huge impact. Especially when "no feedback is worth" is hand in hand with "we are rigorous and students need to handle it". There's some key sense of humanity and kindness lacking in that equation as it is currently playing out and it lacks understanding that even high achieving mature HS students are still kids and could use some positive mentoring to go along with the rigor and forays into self-advocation.

I will say that we know of others who did have issues with teachers. The same names came up from different circles over different years...so admin should reflect in those situations too - and not just assume it's a student in over their head (as school would say - from parent pushing student to take too hard of a course) or a parent just pushing for a higher grade. (Again - this was not our situation but even from the outside, it seemed like "there was something there" regarding some teachers.....and that in other cases it was likely the student in over their head)

I will also say there were situations where admin were touting policies towards being out sick (during COVID) that were then flatly NOT being played out by staff. The school found this hard to believe - but I heard so many stories from other parents about students returning from long breaks where the policy was not being put into practice. (some parents didn't know about the policy - just them conveying difficulty of return and me saying "but what about this policy..." ).

What do you mean there are no parent-teacher conferences?

Well...I mean this...

Our school had 1 teacher conference in Fall of 9th grade (with only 3 teachers - which may or not match your choice of preferred 3). Then, never again.

Which school?

Sidwell - don't know if this will change with new HS leadership.

Sidwell does not have parent-teacher conferences in HS? That’s ridiculous. My kids are in elementary school right now so I didn’t realize that HS is this - be independent and sink or swim mentality.

St. Albans does not either.

NCS does have parent/teacher conferences with advisor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh give me a break. That’s not true at all.

What isn’t true?