It seems SAHM & working mom live in different world

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why exactly does your work from home husband not do any of this?! He can’t take them to school or pick them up?

Also 7-6? How long are your work hours? In the US we work 8/8.5 hour day. You could easily work 7-3:30 or 8-4:30. It is your choice to work these long hours. And it seems you both are!

okay, okay - the poster who has been out of the DC area a while recently and is wondering if work culture has now shifted to 1) kids not being in daycare 8-6/7 (yes, a long time, but was at one point 100% normal for dual career families, and 2) do people really work these hours now? Don't most people work 9-10 hours a day who are in white collar professions, esp in DC?

Have you ever heard of the global pandemic? Also, the white collar professions who need to work 9-10 hours a day (aka not government) can afford a SAH/PT/WFH parent, or at least a FT nanny so the child can come home after school. Not as ideal as having a parent around more, but still better.

Obviously I have heard of the pandemic, I had several people quite close to me pass away/almost die, perhaps you can consider being more kind when speaking with people about it because some of us suffered grately.

But I am seeing you are generally about the mommy-wars, and seem to have the impression that women who don't stay with their kids all the time are evil (or maybe you allow a man to do so also) so we wouldn't be friends in real life anyway.

You are right, I wouldn’t be friends with someone who writes “grately”

And I never claimed women who don’t stay with their kids all the time are evil (but nice strawman argument, another reason we wouldn’t be friends). I am a FT working mom myself. If, as in OP’s situation, you have one spouse who WFH FT, and another who WFH 2-3x a week (hybrid) you can absolutely cut down on group care. Especially with ES kids unless they are SN

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

Honestly, you don't sound like a great mom if your kids are in care that many hours. It really doesn't make sense if one or both of you are working from home. That's a lot of hours working with no commute.

Why she is not a great mom? Just because she works and arranges for the kids to be engaged instead of making them home watch tv or play video games? I think mom's are trying to o their best we should not be judgmental to other women.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't lived in DC in a while. Have things changed SO much since the pandemic that people can't understand that a dual-career couple would have a kid in care from 8-630? This used to be 100% the norm so I am surprised at people shaming the parents for having kids in care "so long" unless it's a DCUM thing or one person?

Because those long hours used to incorporate a long commute. In situations where neither parent has a commute, why are such long hours necessary?
Both parents work a 10.5 hour work day every day?

Do you not remember how, during Covid, companies expected (and still expect) maximum flexibility from the people who WFH? My company is cool with WFH but you better believe you are expected to work harder to prove you’re not abusing it.

PP you quoted here.
No, I definitely don't remember that being what people said about their work expectations. Are you not familiar with J1 (job 1) J2 J3 guy that posts here? Each of his work from home "full time" jobs required so few hours that he was able to juggle all three AND still post here a lot.

Why would you take J1 guy as the norm? In my client facing role, the expectation is that I am available with a same day response, where as pre COVID, you had the courtesy of 24 business hour response. My leadership is cool enough with WFH and flexible work schedules but since everyone knows we WFH they want to hear from you immediately. And if the client isn’t happy, leadership isn’t happy, so…

"Same day" until what point? Surely if your client emails you at 11:58 pm, they aren't expecting you to respond within the next two minutes?

Oh, got me there! Expectation with a west coast client is by 11am East Coast time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why exactly does your work from home husband not do any of this?! He can’t take them to school or pick them up?

Also 7-6? How long are your work hours? In the US we work 8/8.5 hour day. You could easily work 7-3:30 or 8-4:30. It is your choice to work these long hours. And it seems you both are!

okay, okay - the poster who has been out of the DC area a while recently and is wondering if work culture has now shifted to 1) kids not being in daycare 8-6/7 (yes, a long time, but was at one point 100% normal for dual career families, and 2) do people really work these hours now? Don't most people work 9-10 hours a day who are in white collar professions, esp in DC?

Have you ever heard of the global pandemic? Also, the white collar professions who need to work 9-10 hours a day (aka not government) can afford a SAH/PT/WFH parent, or at least a FT nanny so the child can come home after school. Not as ideal as having a parent around more, but still better.

On paper I can afford a nanny but my kids go to FT daycare. We don’t have the house size to host a nanny with WFH, and don’t want to manage another employer / employee relationship outside of work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't lived in DC in a while. Have things changed SO much since the pandemic that people can't understand that a dual-career couple would have a kid in care from 8-630? This used to be 100% the norm so I am surprised at people shaming the parents for having kids in care "so long" unless it's a DCUM thing or one person?

Because those long hours used to incorporate a long commute. In situations where neither parent has a commute, why are such long hours necessary?
Both parents work a 10.5 hour work day every day?

Do you not remember how, during Covid, companies expected (and still expect) maximum flexibility from the people who WFH? My company is cool with WFH but you better believe you are expected to work harder to prove you’re not abusing it.

PP you quoted here.
No, I definitely don't remember that being what people said about their work expectations. Are you not familiar with J1 (job 1) J2 J3 guy that posts here? Each of his work from home "full time" jobs required so few hours that he was able to juggle all three AND still post here a lot.

Why would you take J1 guy as the norm? In my client facing role, the expectation is that I am available with a same day response, where as pre COVID, you had the courtesy of 24 business hour response. My leadership is cool enough with WFH and flexible work schedules but since everyone knows we WFH they want to hear from you immediately. And if the client isn’t happy, leadership isn’t happy, so…

"Same day" until what point? Surely if your client emails you at 11:58 pm, they aren't expecting you to respond within the next two minutes?

Oh, got me there! Expectation with a west coast client is by 11am East Coast time.

I'm still not clear what you are saying. You said they expect a same day response. So that's only until 11 am EST? At 11:01 EST you are free to have a "next day response?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't lived in DC in a while. Have things changed SO much since the pandemic that people can't understand that a dual-career couple would have a kid in care from 8-630? This used to be 100% the norm so I am surprised at people shaming the parents for having kids in care "so long" unless it's a DCUM thing or one person?

Because those long hours used to incorporate a long commute. In situations where neither parent has a commute, why are such long hours necessary?
Both parents work a 10.5 hour work day every day?

Do you not remember how, during Covid, companies expected (and still expect) maximum flexibility from the people who WFH? My company is cool with WFH but you better believe you are expected to work harder to prove you’re not abusing it.

PP you quoted here.
No, I definitely don't remember that being what people said about their work expectations. Are you not familiar with J1 (job 1) J2 J3 guy that posts here? Each of his work from home "full time" jobs required so few hours that he was able to juggle all three AND still post here a lot.

Why would you take J1 guy as the norm? In my client facing role, the expectation is that I am available with a same day response, where as pre COVID, you had the courtesy of 24 business hour response. My leadership is cool enough with WFH and flexible work schedules but since everyone knows we WFH they want to hear from you immediately. And if the client isn’t happy, leadership isn’t happy, so…

"Same day" until what point? Surely if your client emails you at 11:58 pm, they aren't expecting you to respond within the next two minutes?

Oh, got me there! Expectation with a west coast client is by 11am East Coast time.

I'm still not clear what you are saying. You said they expect a same day response. So that's only until 11 am EST? At 11:01 EST you are free to have a "next day response?"

If a client emails me after I log off for the night, I need to get back to them the next morning. My team knows I log off by 10:30pm but will respond starting 5:30am. So in your 11:58pm example, that is generally a west coat client of mine, they expect a response by the time they log in (~11 EST).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't lived in DC in a while. Have things changed SO much since the pandemic that people can't understand that a dual-career couple would have a kid in care from 8-630? This used to be 100% the norm so I am surprised at people shaming the parents for having kids in care "so long" unless it's a DCUM thing or one person?

Because those long hours used to incorporate a long commute. In situations where neither parent has a commute, why are such long hours necessary?
Both parents work a 10.5 hour work day every day?

Do you not remember how, during Covid, companies expected (and still expect) maximum flexibility from the people who WFH? My company is cool with WFH but you better believe you are expected to work harder to prove you’re not abusing it.

PP you quoted here.
No, I definitely don't remember that being what people said about their work expectations. Are you not familiar with J1 (job 1) J2 J3 guy that posts here? Each of his work from home "full time" jobs required so few hours that he was able to juggle all three AND still post here a lot.

Why would you take J1 guy as the norm? In my client facing role, the expectation is that I am available with a same day response, where as pre COVID, you had the courtesy of 24 business hour response. My leadership is cool enough with WFH and flexible work schedules but since everyone knows we WFH they want to hear from you immediately. And if the client isn’t happy, leadership isn’t happy, so…

"Same day" until what point? Surely if your client emails you at 11:58 pm, they aren't expecting you to respond within the next two minutes?

Oh, got me there! Expectation with a west coast client is by 11am East Coast time.

I'm still not clear what you are saying. You said they expect a same day response. So that's only until 11 am EST? At 11:01 EST you are free to have a "next day response?"

If a client emails me after I log off for the night, I need to get back to them the next morning. My team knows I log off by 10:30pm but will respond starting 5:30am. So in your 11:58pm example, that is generally a west coat client of mine, they expect a response by the time they log in (~11 EST).

And my point is this - pre COVID, the client expectation was that they would hear back from me at some point today with a response. But because the client knows we work from home, they expect us to be at their beck and call now. The culture of my industry has changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why exactly does your work from home husband not do any of this?! He can’t take them to school or pick them up?

Also 7-6? How long are your work hours? In the US we work 8/8.5 hour day. You could easily work 7-3:30 or 8-4:30. It is your choice to work these long hours. And it seems you both are!

okay, okay - the poster who has been out of the DC area a while recently and is wondering if work culture has now shifted to 1) kids not being in daycare 8-6/7 (yes, a long time, but was at one point 100% normal for dual career families, and 2) do people really work these hours now? Don't most people work 9-10 hours a day who are in white collar professions, esp in DC?

Have you ever heard of the global pandemic? Also, the white collar professions who need to work 9-10 hours a day (aka not government) can afford a SAH/PT/WFH parent, or at least a FT nanny so the child can come home after school. Not as ideal as having a parent around more, but still better.

Obviously I have heard of the pandemic, I had several people quite close to me pass away/almost die, perhaps you can consider being more kind when speaking with people about it because some of us suffered grately.

But I am seeing you are generally about the mommy-wars, and seem to have the impression that women who don't stay with their kids all the time are evil (or maybe you allow a man to do so also) so we wouldn't be friends in real life anyway.

You are right, I wouldn’t be friends with someone who writes “grately”

And I never claimed women who don’t stay with their kids all the time are evil (but nice strawman argument, another reason we wouldn’t be friends). I am a FT working mom myself. If, as in OP’s situation, you have one spouse who WFH FT, and another who WFH 2-3x a week (hybrid) you can absolutely cut down on group care. Especially with ES kids unless they are SN

I don't care how I spell on a message board, but you are correct, I spelled incorrectly in my haste.
I have a hard time with women blaming other women (and men , but it seems to typically be women) with their kids not being taken care of by a blood relative. I also think that sometimes, for some kids, group settings are better than nannies, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

Please don't feel bad for us. It sounds like a better solution for you is not to work outside the home, and great that your husband earns enough for the family as a whole. Some of us, like me, however, would chose to work regardless of how much our spouses make and it's the best choice for us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

Honestly, you don't sound like a great mom if your kids are in care that many hours. It really doesn't make sense if one or both of you are working from home. That's a lot of hours working with no commute.

What about the dad? Why judging only the mom? Is he a bad dad?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why exactly does your work from home husband not do any of this?! He can’t take them to school or pick them up?

Also 7-6? How long are your work hours? In the US we work 8/8.5 hour day. You could easily work 7-3:30 or 8-4:30. It is your choice to work these long hours. And it seems you both are!

Lots of jobs require you to work more than 8.5 hours per day. As an attorney, my day is 10 hours minimum. Most are somewhere in the ballpark of 12-15. Not my “choice” per se, just what I need to do to stay employed.

LOL. It is absolutely your choice to work 10 hours a day. There are government or in-house positions that do not require that. And there is tons more WFH flexibility after the pandemic.

I really do not understand people who prioritize $$ and are willing to put their young child in group care for that long. Both DH and I work FT but we have never needed more than 30 hours of care. Even 40 is fine. But 50??

I guess we aspire to be more than middle class slackers.

Ew. You think middle class parents are slackers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why exactly does your work from home husband not do any of this?! He can’t take them to school or pick them up?

Also 7-6? How long are your work hours? In the US we work 8/8.5 hour day. You could easily work 7-3:30 or 8-4:30. It is your choice to work these long hours. And it seems you both are!

Lots of jobs require you to work more than 8.5 hours per day. As an attorney, my day is 10 hours minimum. Most are somewhere in the ballpark of 12-15. Not my “choice” per se, just what I need to do to stay employed.

LOL. It is absolutely your choice to work 10 hours a day. There are government or in-house positions that do not require that. And there is tons more WFH flexibility after the pandemic.

I really do not understand people who prioritize $$ and are willing to put their young child in group care for that long. Both DH and I work FT but we have never needed more than 30 hours of care. Even 40 is fine. But 50??

If I am working then I am going to make bank and not slog thru life doing 9-5.
Able to retire early because of this. Life is good!

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry, being a SAHM doesn't mean she has an IQ or EQ of 80 or being a worker bee doesn't mean you have an IQ and EQ of 180.

She can see that you are dedicated to your work and your needs are different.

You can see that your children's childhood years are passing by and you don't have time to be a part of it.

She sounds judgmental and you sound stressed and insecure.

Its not that difficult fir people with different lifestyles to be friends and have respect and empathy for each other even if they don't agree with each other's life choices.

I think its not what she said, its how your inner self with guilt and frustration, interprets it. That's what's upsetting you. Modify your lifestyle.