Affirmative Action should be income-based, not race-based

[Anonymous]

Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

[Anonymous]

For a number of reasons, I think some form of race-based affirmative action probably makes sense. At the same time, I get why some think it’s unfair.

That said, I struggle to understand why white people care so much. I mean, If you’re a white kid kept out of Harvard by affirmative action, where do you end up going? Brown? Cornell? Georgetown? Is that really so bad?

This just feels like another parable about the power of marketing—here, the universities’.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

+1.

The whole thing ia a diagrace.

For whites and for blacks and for Asian Americans and for Hispanics.

Time to move on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For a number of reasons, I think some form of race-based affirmative action probably makes sense. At the same time, I get why some think it’s unfair.

That said, I struggle to understand why white people care so much. I mean, If you’re a white kid kept out of Harvard by affirmative action, where do you end up going? Brown? Cornell? Georgetown? Is that really so bad?

This just feels like another parable about the power of marketing—here, the universities’.

You're assuming that the white kids rejected in favor of black kids with worse grades are getting into a comparable institution. If all institutions are favoring minorities, the white kid runs into the same problem - and, depending on the program, may not get accepted at all. That's why there are so many white kids with a 3.7 rejected from all med schools, while a minority with a 3.4 gets acceptances from multiple schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

+1.

The whole thing ia a diagrace.

For whites and for blacks and for Asian Americans and for Hispanics.

Time to move on.

Yes, and what's also disgraceful is when a black poster* says that high-achieving white kids rejected as a result need to STFU about it, or another poster refers to "white trash," or still another say that the smart, top-scoring white kid needs to suck it up at community college so that a mediocre minority can go the a 4-year University,

*I assume that poster was black. I can't see how a white person would say that white peoples need to STFU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a number of reasons, I think some form of race-based affirmative action probably makes sense. At the same time, I get why some think it’s unfair.

That said, I struggle to understand why white people care so much. I mean, If you’re a white kid kept out of Harvard by affirmative action, where do you end up going? Brown? Cornell? Georgetown? Is that really so bad?

This just feels like another parable about the power of marketing—here, the universities’.

You're assuming that the white kids rejected in favor of black kids with worse grades are getting into a comparable institution. If all institutions are favoring minorities, the white kid runs into the same problem - and, depending on the program, may not get accepted at all. That's why there are so many white kids with a 3.7 rejected from all med schools, while a minority with a 3.4 gets acceptances from multiple schools.

No I’m not. Harvard is better than those schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

+1.

The whole thing ia a diagrace.

For whites and for blacks and for Asian Americans and for Hispanics.

Time to move on.

Yes, and what's also disgraceful is when a black poster* says that high-achieving white kids rejected as a result need to STFU about it, or another poster refers to "white trash," or still another say that the smart, top-scoring white kid needs to suck it up at community college so that a mediocre minority can go the a 4-year University,

*I assume that poster was black. I can't see how a white person would say that white peoples need to STFU.

+ a million.

Enough of this skin color business.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a number of reasons, I think some form of race-based affirmative action probably makes sense. At the same time, I get why some think it’s unfair.

That said, I struggle to understand why white people care so much. I mean, If you’re a white kid kept out of Harvard by affirmative action, where do you end up going? Brown? Cornell? Georgetown? Is that really so bad?

This just feels like another parable about the power of marketing—here, the universities’.

You're assuming that the white kids rejected in favor of black kids with worse grades are getting into a comparable institution. If all institutions are favoring minorities, the white kid runs into the same problem - and, depending on the program, may not get accepted at all. That's why there are so many white kids with a 3.7 rejected from all med schools, while a minority with a 3.4 gets acceptances from multiple schools.

No I’m not. Harvard is better than those schools.

What are you talking about? You're acting as if a white kid with excellent grades and scores gets bumped out of a top school due to the lower standards for minorities, he'll get into SOME sort of decent school. I am telling you that it is so bad that WHITE students with a 3.6 applying to med school will be laughed out by virtually every med school in the country, whereas a black kid with a 3.3 still has a very good chance of getting accepted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

+1.

The whole thing ia a diagrace.

For whites and for blacks and for Asian Americans and for Hispanics.

Time to move on.

Yes, and what's also disgraceful is when a black poster* says that high-achieving white kids rejected as a result need to STFU about it, or another poster refers to "white trash," or still another say that the smart, top-scoring white kid needs to suck it up at community college so that a mediocre minority can go the a 4-year University,

*I assume that poster was black. I can't see how a white person would say that white peoples need to STFU.

+ a million.

Enough of this skin color business.

Absolutely. There is all this ridiculous talk about how whites are trying to keep blacks from getting a piece of the pie, etc., etc., ignoring two things:

1) They are welcome to getting a piece of the pie. They just have to compete for it, rather than having special lower standards applied to them based solely on their skin color.

2) In the OP proposal, blacks who are from poor families with uneducated parents would STILL gain from SES-based AA. The only difference is that whites from similarly disadvantaged homes would also be beneficiaries of the proposal. We have either black parents or crazy liberals essentially saying that the only disadvantaged kids they want to help are blacks, and the "white trash" get just STFU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

Just stop with all your racist stereotypes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

+1.

The whole thing ia a diagrace.

For whites and for blacks and for Asian Americans and for Hispanics.

Time to move on.

Yes, and what's also disgraceful is when a black poster* says that high-achieving white kids rejected as a result need to STFU about it, or another poster refers to "white trash," or still another say that the smart, top-scoring white kid needs to suck it up at community college so that a mediocre minority can go the a 4-year University,

*I assume that poster was black. I can't see how a white person would say that white peoples need to STFU.

“Disgraceful”?

It’s disgraceful that racist POSs like you walk on earth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whites need to STFU and listen. Stop the whitesplaining.

I’m listening. Do your whatever-splaining.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

Just stop with all your racist stereotypes.

What in the world is racist? Blacks DO drop out at rates much higher than whites. And then they are stuck with loans, without a degree to show for it. So instead of artificially lowering admission standards so URMs can get into schools for which they would not qualify, they get into the schools that are more in line with their academic record and projected success.

There wasn't a single thing in there that was racist. You liberals just resort to that when you can't argue the facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

Just stop with all your racist stereotypes.

What in the world is racist? Blacks DO drop out at rates much higher than whites. And then they are stuck with loans, without a degree to show for it. So instead of artificially lowering admission standards so URMs can get into schools for which they would not qualify, they get into the schools that are more in line with their academic record and projected success.

There wasn't a single thing in there that was racist. You liberals just resort to that when you can't argue the facts.

Wait. Do you think higher-ranked schools are harder?

Did you even go to college?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the drop-out rate for blacks is disappointing. Less than half who enter graduate within six years, whereas the majority of whites do.

Which brings up another consideration....besides being unfair to whites with better grades, is it to the benefit of the taxpayers to fund black stidents admitted under the lower AA standards with Pell grants, subsidized federal loans, and so forth? Or, for that matter, is it doing a disservice to let black kids into a competitive program to which they not qualify without the AA "boost" - only for them to take in loans, drop out, and have no degree to show for it?

Wouldn't it be better for these students for them to be admitted under their own merits to whatever achool they would normally qualify for? That way, they are with their peer group - in terms of academic achievement - and more likely to complete the program and earn a college-level salary?

+1.

The whole thing ia a diagrace.

For whites and for blacks and for Asian Americans and for Hispanics.

Time to move on.

Yes, and what's also disgraceful is when a black poster* says that high-achieving white kids rejected as a result need to STFU about it, or another poster refers to "white trash," or still another say that the smart, top-scoring white kid needs to suck it up at community college so that a mediocre minority can go the a 4-year University,

*I assume that poster was black. I can't see how a white person would say that white peoples need to STFU.

“Disgraceful”?

It’s disgraceful that racist POSs like you walk on earth.

ME???? I don't hear you calling the liberal calling low-income Caucasians "white trash". Or that white people need to STFU. Or that white people can just go to community college so blacks can go to university.

Now what would be racist would be if someone were to call low-income blacks "black scum". Or the black people need to STFU. Or that black people can just go to community college and let the whites go to university.

See how that works, you racist POS.