FCPS HS Boundary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.

The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Changing MS structure is a logistical bridge too far for FCPS. Let's stay on topic for boundaries, since the SB is going to vote approval on the updated 8130 this Thursday the 18th.

I am adamently opposed to Reid making decisions after reading about FCPS submitting a grant application to turn a school into a Montesorri Magnet. Parents, PTA, and school board member were unaware...Dunne from Mount Vernon District. https://mvonthemove.com/fcps-pauses-plans-for-montessori-program-at-bucknell-es/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR26DY80H5kBPqRXDfCkYZ-vGb_VlbsPW5keH7GYf8oluV-itSVaTLPefOI_aem_MA35dP-Vmn386En3XXFVJA

Is that 15m grant for a magnet only for Bucknell? That's an outrageouss amount of FIT $ so it is likely for more than 1 FCPS magnet. Grrants aren't annual so ...FCPS did the magnets to avoid boundary changes and this dolt Reid is talking about AAP centers and movement? That ship sailed when FCPS did many local level iv- maybe Reid wants to remove that and go back to busing for larger centers? In that case why bother with all this 8130 crap?

For next year it’s just Bucknell.

So as usual there are separate rules /policies/ regulations for that area of the county? 2 elementary schools by Bucknell - Riverside [has AAP] and Groveton each have 10 room modulars. SY28-29 Groveton projected to be 95% cap with modular and 139% without. Then there is Bush Hill 115% Rosehill 133%.

Something is off here with that load a building with out of boundary students for Montesorri and/or AAP considering this [w]holistic boundary fresh start stuff.

I think the idea specifically is to attract back the high-SES families who live in that area and deliberately choose private to avoid the poor and diverse schools. Redistribution of Groveton and Rose Hill will do absolutely nothing because they are also majority FARMs. Filling Bucknell to 100% capacity with more FARMs is not going to solve or address anything.

And so you expect a ratmaze of busing and extra programs? Paid or with all our tax dollars? And I did not write about filling Bucknell to 100%. More schools than Groveton etc in hat section of the county. fyi Waynewood and Bellview! And if you ive over there I expect Whitman walkers to no longerr be bused to Sandburg.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:People keep asserting FCPS already has prepared new boundary maps that they'll unveil at some point, but that would be easy enough to FOIA if it were true. Seems like a conspiracy theory.

Oh yeah, they always produce documents under FOIA. They never ever try to bury the requester with costs.

Absurd post.

It would be a specific request so any claims by FCPS of exorbitant production costs could be readily challenged. But thanks for confirming you prefer to wallow in conspiracy theories.

I can’t tell if you are joking.

No. I just find it weird when people claim they’ve already decided what they are going to do and have already drawn up the new maps. If that were the case we’d have seen them already.

To your FOIA point claiming that is a simple low cost request, the county lawyers who will bill you several hundreds of dollars an hour to review any responsive documents would like a word. The staff time spent searching how many custodians’ in boxes would like a word too. These things are expensive by design.

To your broader point, you may want to participate in some conversations with the school board members and FPAC members.

In both instances you are just absolutely wrong, and just trying to carry the water for the school board. You call us conspiracy theorists as we fight against the school boards plans, but I’m guessing you are well aware of their plans too.

If these maps already exist, and you haven’t found a way to obtain and publicize and them yet, these advocacy groups like FairFACTS Matters must be all bluster and far less competent than they’d like people to believe.

But I don’t think they exist yet. Some School Board members may already have specific changes in mind, but I really doubt anything has been memorialized or agreed upon yet.

Prove me wrong.

I’m pretty sure in the governance meeting dr Reid said she had models already that included middle schools going 6-8.
Yiu can rewatch is you are so inclined and let us know if I’m right.

I don't think that anyone wants their 6th graders with the 8th graders.

8th graders are dating, drinking, and in many cases, sesxually active.

Half of the 6th graders are still playing with Legos and pying tag on the playground.

The 6th graders will lose recess if they are moved into middle school, and will be in a teen culture that is nt apprppriate for many of them.

What a terrible idea

Loundoun County as MS 6-8. I know plenty of school districts with 6-8 in California and across the Mid-West. Some schools have a separate wing for the 6th graders so that interaction with the 7-8th graders is limited. It is not a new concept and none of my friends in LCPS have complained.

California is probably the worst school model in the country.

Let’s hope FCPS does not try to mimic failing California. We are better than that.

It’s not just California, it’s majority of the country. Middle school is 6-8 and junior high is 7-9. FCPS is an outlier, but changing from the 7-8 model would be very difficult to accomplish because few middle schools have the capacity, building out more middle schools requires land that the county doesn’t have, and the secondary schools are tied to the 7-12 model.

Just because your friends where you grew up and your husbands friends where he grew up tell you one thing, doesn't mean it's true for the "majority of the country". Agree with all the PPs that I don't want my 6th grader in middle school. I'd rather make middle school 7-9 and high school 10-12.

Where I grew up, I was the last 6th grade class out of Elementary. Elementary was K-6, Junior High was 7-9, and High was 8-12. They switched it to K-5, 6-8 (now called Middle School) and 9-12. I think I prefer 6 being part of elementary, middle school sucks for everyone and the less of it there is the better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.

The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.

^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.

The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.

^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.

When you move to any metropolitan area in the US, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of Korean and Indian ethnic students then chances are you have chosen the best pyramid in that locality. On the flip side, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of hispanic students then chances are you did not select a good school. This is not racist or xenophobic, this is backed by data. Fairfax has welcomed these disadvantaged hispanic immigrant populations at a high rate since the early 2000s, and FCPS owes solutions tailored to this population versus redrawing borders to dilute the failing #s on paper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.

The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.

^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.

When you move to any metropolitan area in the US, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of Korean and Indian ethnic students then chances are you have chosen the best pyramid in that locality. On the flip side, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of hispanic students then chances are you did not select a good school. This is not racist or xenophobic, this is backed by data. Fairfax has welcomed these disadvantaged hispanic immigrant populations at a high rate since the early 2000s, and FCPS owes solutions tailored to this population versus redrawing borders to dilute the failing #s on paper.

Silly we can’t “place our kid anywhere” by buying a house. We are at the whims of the superintendent

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.

The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.

^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.

When you move to any metropolitan area in the US, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of Korean and Indian ethnic students then chances are you have chosen the best pyramid in that locality. On the flip side, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of hispanic students then chances are you did not select a good school. This is not racist or xenophobic, this is backed by data. Fairfax has welcomed these disadvantaged hispanic immigrant populations at a high rate since the early 2000s, and FCPS owes solutions tailored to this population versus redrawing borders to dilute the failing #s on paper.

What if 80% of this went down after you purchased your house in one of these schools? I guess it is just tough luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Changing MS structure is a logistical bridge too far for FCPS. Let's stay on topic for boundaries, since the SB is going to vote approval on the updated 8130 this Thursday the 18th.

I am adamently opposed to Reid making decisions after reading about FCPS submitting a grant application to turn a school into a Montesorri Magnet. Parents, PTA, and school board member were unaware...Dunne from Mount Vernon District. https://mvonthemove.com/fcps-pauses-plans-for-montessori-program-at-bucknell-es/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR26DY80H5kBPqRXDfCkYZ-vGb_VlbsPW5keH7GYf8oluV-itSVaTLPefOI_aem_MA35dP-Vmn386En3XXFVJA

Is that 15m grant for a magnet only for Bucknell? That's an outrageouss amount of FIT $ so it is likely for more than 1 FCPS magnet. Grrants aren't annual so ...FCPS did the magnets to avoid boundary changes and this dolt Reid is talking about AAP centers and movement? That ship sailed when FCPS did many local level iv- maybe Reid wants to remove that and go back to busing for larger centers? In that case why bother with all this 8130 crap?

For next year it’s just Bucknell.

So as usual there are separate rules /policies/ regulations for that area of the county? 2 elementary schools by Bucknell - Riverside [has AAP] and Groveton each have 10 room modulars. SY28-29 Groveton projected to be 95% cap with modular and 139% without. Then there is Bush Hill 115% Rosehill 133%.

Something is off here with that load a building with out of boundary students for Montesorri and/or AAP considering this [w]holistic boundary fresh start stuff.

I think the idea specifically is to attract back the high-SES families who live in that area and deliberately choose private to avoid the poor and diverse schools. Redistribution of Groveton and Rose Hill will do absolutely nothing because they are also majority FARMs. Filling Bucknell to 100% capacity with more FARMs is not going to solve or address anything.

Forget it, unless they do something that gets the FARMS rate below 20%. Too many people remember the tipping point study.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Changing MS structure is a logistical bridge too far for FCPS. Let's stay on topic for boundaries, since the SB is going to vote approval on the updated 8130 this Thursday the 18th.

I am adamently opposed to Reid making decisions after reading about FCPS submitting a grant application to turn a school into a Montesorri Magnet. Parents, PTA, and school board member were unaware...Dunne from Mount Vernon District. https://mvonthemove.com/fcps-pauses-plans-for-montessori-program-at-bucknell-es/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR26DY80H5kBPqRXDfCkYZ-vGb_VlbsPW5keH7GYf8oluV-itSVaTLPefOI_aem_MA35dP-Vmn386En3XXFVJA

Is that 15m grant for a magnet only for Bucknell? That's an outrageouss amount of FIT $ so it is likely for more than 1 FCPS magnet. Grrants aren't annual so ...FCPS did the magnets to avoid boundary changes and this dolt Reid is talking about AAP centers and movement? That ship sailed when FCPS did many local level iv- maybe Reid wants to remove that and go back to busing for larger centers? In that case why bother with all this 8130 crap?

For next year it’s just Bucknell.

So as usual there are separate rules /policies/ regulations for that area of the county? 2 elementary schools by Bucknell - Riverside [has AAP] and Groveton each have 10 room modulars. SY28-29 Groveton projected to be 95% cap with modular and 139% without. Then there is Bush Hill 115% Rosehill 133%.

Something is off here with that load a building with out of boundary students for Montesorri and/or AAP considering this [w]holistic boundary fresh start stuff.

I think the idea specifically is to attract back the high-SES families who live in that area and deliberately choose private to avoid the poor and diverse schools. Redistribution of Groveton and Rose Hill will do absolutely nothing because they are also majority FARMs. Filling Bucknell to 100% capacity with more FARMs is not going to solve or address anything.

Forget it, unless they do something that gets the FARMS rate below 20%. Too many people remember the tipping point study.

+1. These bureaucrats are driving high-SES families away from Fairfax, not bringing them in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Changing MS structure is a logistical bridge too far for FCPS. Let's stay on topic for boundaries, since the SB is going to vote approval on the updated 8130 this Thursday the 18th.

I am adamently opposed to Reid making decisions after reading about FCPS submitting a grant application to turn a school into a Montesorri Magnet. Parents, PTA, and school board member were unaware...Dunne from Mount Vernon District. https://mvonthemove.com/fcps-pauses-plans-for-montessori-program-at-bucknell-es/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR26DY80H5kBPqRXDfCkYZ-vGb_VlbsPW5keH7GYf8oluV-itSVaTLPefOI_aem_MA35dP-Vmn386En3XXFVJA

Is that 15m grant for a magnet only for Bucknell? That's an outrageouss amount of FIT $ so it is likely for more than 1 FCPS magnet. Grrants aren't annual so ...FCPS did the magnets to avoid boundary changes and this dolt Reid is talking about AAP centers and movement? That ship sailed when FCPS did many local level iv- maybe Reid wants to remove that and go back to busing for larger centers? In that case why bother with all this 8130 crap?

For next year it’s just Bucknell.

So as usual there are separate rules /policies/ regulations for that area of the county? 2 elementary schools by Bucknell - Riverside [has AAP] and Groveton each have 10 room modulars. SY28-29 Groveton projected to be 95% cap with modular and 139% without. Then there is Bush Hill 115% Rosehill 133%.

Something is off here with that load a building with out of boundary students for Montesorri and/or AAP considering this [w]holistic boundary fresh start stuff.

I think the idea specifically is to attract back the high-SES families who live in that area and deliberately choose private to avoid the poor and diverse schools. Redistribution of Groveton and Rose Hill will do absolutely nothing because they are also majority FARMs. Filling Bucknell to 100% capacity with more FARMs is not going to solve or address anything.

Forget it, unless they do something that gets the FARMS rate below 20%. Too many people remember the tipping point study.

They probably want to do something like they do in Arlington with all the magnet elementary schools. Get higher SES families to “choose” Montessori or STEM or whatever. I will be honest I don’t 100% disagree with this as a way to drive up enrollment and test scores. I mean, we’re all over here talking about turning Lewis into the trades HS. Now it does seem a little nakedly opportunistic and hypocritical to do this at a time when people seem to be on the brink of being shuttled all around the county for “equity” even though they say they aren’t doing that - but in a vacuum it’s not a bad move.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.

The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.

^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.

When you move to any metropolitan area in the US, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of Korean and Indian ethnic students then chances are you have chosen the best pyramid in that locality. On the flip side, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of hispanic students then chances are you did not select a good school. This is not racist or xenophobic, this is backed by data. Fairfax has welcomed these disadvantaged hispanic immigrant populations at a high rate since the early 2000s, and FCPS owes solutions tailored to this population versus redrawing borders to dilute the failing #s on paper.

Well we've gotten what we voted for.

[Anonymous]

I think 30% FARMs for schools like WSHS, Chantilly, Oakton, and McLean is a reasonable goal. This should keep other schools closer to 50%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2003
Lee - 2092 students
Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

WS - 2259 students
Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

2024
Lewis - 1675 students
Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

WS - 2761 students
Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?

IB put into Lee and several other schools

IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary

That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.

This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.

Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.

What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.

I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2003
Lee - 2092 students
Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

WS - 2259 students
Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

2024
Lewis - 1675 students
Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

WS - 2761 students
Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?

IB put into Lee and several other schools

IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary

That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.

This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.

Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.

You must be on some level aware that the East and South Asian/Indian populations of certain schools are not representative of Fairfax County or the entire US as a whole and don’t have anything to do with the illegal immigration situation.

I'll quote the PP: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area

REALLy?

[Anonymous]

Flint Hill is a great private school!