FCPS HS Boundary

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.


The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.


^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.


When you move to any metropolitan area in the US, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of Korean and Indian ethnic students then chances are you have chosen the best pyramid in that locality. On the flip side, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of hispanic students then chances are you did not select a good school. This is not racist or xenophobic, this is backed by data. Fairfax has welcomed these disadvantaged hispanic immigrant populations at a high rate since the early 2000s, and FCPS owes solutions tailored to this population versus redrawing borders to dilute the failing #s on paper.


What if 80% of this went down after you purchased your house in one of these schools? I guess it is just tough luck.


We all buy our houses knowing that schools could be redistricted at any point. Anyone who isn't aware of that is dumb. Like you. You're dumb.


I certainly didn't choose to not control the border.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:2003
Lee - 2092 students
Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

WS - 2259 students
Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

2024
Lewis - 1675 students
Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

WS - 2761 students
Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    BS. This country was built on the backs of slaves. We'd be just fine.
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:You know exactly what they are trying to say. Chantilly has the 'good' kind of immigrant and Springfield and Burke do not.


    The barrier to immigration from Asia is very large. It takes a lot of money to come here, so the people that do are usually educated and value education for their children. They send them to tutoring or other enrichment and bring up test scores.
    The vast majority of people who choose to and are able to immigrate here illegally do not have those opportunities. They bring higher FARMS rates and higher ESOL burdens. You should be able to say this without being accused of being a racist.


    ^^ This. Those who go through all the hurdles to come here are almost all wealthy and educated, and will make sure their kids are educated as well.

    Those who walk here over a land border are economic migrants without any particularly marketable skills, and far more likely to be uneducated and not value education for your kids either.

    And this is backed up by school statistics. Look at Park View and Dominion over in Loudoun vs... well, vs. just about any other LCPS school.


    When you move to any metropolitan area in the US, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of Korean and Indian ethnic students then chances are you have chosen the best pyramid in that locality. On the flip side, if you place your kids in a school with the largest population of hispanic students then chances are you did not select a good school. This is not racist or xenophobic, this is backed by data. Fairfax has welcomed these disadvantaged hispanic immigrant populations at a high rate since the early 2000s, and FCPS owes solutions tailored to this population versus redrawing borders to dilute the failing #s on paper.


    What if 80% of this went down after you purchased your house in one of these schools? I guess it is just tough luck.


    We all buy our houses knowing that schools could be redistricted at any point. Anyone who isn't aware of that is dumb. Like you. You're dumb.


    DP. How many glasses of wine have you had on a Wednesday night, my dear?
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:2003
    Lee - 2092 students
    Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

    WS - 2259 students
    Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

    2024
    Lewis - 1675 students
    Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

    WS - 2761 students
    Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

    In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    Love the hyperbole, someone touched a nerve with this one. So back to immigration and how it impacts the current state of FCPS: how does FCPS fix Lewis and Herndon, two of the worst high schools in the county, also the two with extraordinarily large populations (50+%) of hispanic immigrants. How will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?

    More broadly, will living under the threat of readjusting boundaries every 5 years attract the types of parents who seek control for their children's environment, who seek stability for their children? These are the same types of families that prize academic achievement. The next 24 months of PR on the comprehensive boundary changes will be an inflection point for FCPS and it will never recover to its former status within the US public school system.
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:Changing MS structure is a logistical bridge too far for FCPS. Let's stay on topic for boundaries, since the SB is going to vote approval on the updated 8130 this Thursday the 18th.


    I am adamently opposed to Reid making decisions after reading about FCPS submitting a grant application to turn a school into a Montesorri Magnet. Parents, PTA, and school board member were unaware...Dunne from Mount Vernon District. https://mvonthemove.com/fcps-pauses-plans-for-montessori-program-at-bucknell-es/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR26DY80H5kBPqRXDfCkYZ-vGb_VlbsPW5keH7GYf8oluV-itSVaTLPefOI_aem_MA35dP-Vmn386En3XXFVJA

    Is that 15m grant for a magnet only for Bucknell? That's an outrageouss amount of FIT $ so it is likely for more than 1 FCPS magnet. Grrants aren't annual so ...FCPS did the magnets to avoid boundary changes and this dolt Reid is talking about AAP centers and movement? That ship sailed when FCPS did many local level iv- maybe Reid wants to remove that and go back to busing for larger centers? In that case why bother with all this 8130 crap?


    My post above. Note in the article Reid decided to meet with the Federal DOE to sneak change the magnet site. So what was he outcome of that? And she included busing for those who don't want Montessori.. Meanwhile Rosehill gets significant numbers transfer in for immersion. Seems like putting immersion at Bucknell works PLUS AAP - Bucknell could get more base school IF FCPS perates with integrity in this county wide analysis.

    But that integrity is the real problem since Bucknell is a serious red flag on Reid. Now of all times to give her more authority? Not to be trusted. This was not FCPS floating a pssible site for an AAP boundary change and we personnally have had those floated. It was a grant money grab with the DOE.
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:2003
    Lee - 2092 students
    Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

    WS - 2259 students
    Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

    2024
    Lewis - 1675 students
    Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

    WS - 2761 students
    Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

    In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    Love the hyperbole, someone touched a nerve with this one. So back to immigration and how it impacts the current state of FCPS: how does FCPS fix Lewis and Herndon, two of the worst high schools in the county, also the two with extraordinarily large populations (50+%) of hispanic immigrants. How will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?

    More broadly, will living under the threat of readjusting boundaries every 5 years attract the types of parents who seek control for their children's environment, who seek stability for their children? These are the same types of families that prize academic achievement. The next 24 months of PR on the comprehensive boundary changes will be an inflection point for FCPS and it will never recover to its former status within the US public school system.


    Over 50% Hispanic does not mean you are a Hispanic immigrant. Many of these kids are English-speaking kids born in America who identify as Hispanic.
    Anonymous
    I’m curious- will Bucknell be required to use the basal as part of the Montessori program?
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:2003
    Lee - 2092 students
    Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

    WS - 2259 students
    Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

    2024
    Lewis - 1675 students
    Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

    WS - 2761 students
    Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

    In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    Love the hyperbole, someone touched a nerve with this one. So back to immigration and how it impacts the current state of FCPS: how does FCPS fix Lewis and Herndon, two of the worst high schools in the county, also the two with extraordinarily large populations (50+%) of hispanic immigrants. How will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?

    More broadly, will living under the threat of readjusting boundaries every 5 years attract the types of parents who seek control for their children's environment, who seek stability for their children? These are the same types of families that prize academic achievement. The next 24 months of PR on the comprehensive boundary changes will be an inflection point for FCPS and it will never recover to its former status within the US public school system.


    Over 50% Hispanic does not mean you are a Hispanic immigrant. Many of these kids are English-speaking kids born in America who identify as Hispanic.


    Of course, but there's a direct relationship between where immigrants choose to live and the per capita population of their ethnicity. It's not unreasonable to believe that Springfield and Herndon have a larger % relative to the overall Fairfax hispanic immigrant population. And as you point out, maybe it's not the hispanic immigrant population dragging down the numbers at these two schools, maybe it's the hispanic population overall. In which case we still go back to the same question: how will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:Flint Hill is a great private school!
    how much extra capacity do they have?
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:Flint Hill is a great private school!
    how much extra capacity do they have?


    More like how much extra cash do you have? $40k a year, I hope.
    Anonymous
    Are there any parts of they are possibly throwing out and not including in the policy vote tonight? Or is this a done deal vote?
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:2003
    Lee - 2092 students
    Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

    WS - 2259 students
    Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

    2024
    Lewis - 1675 students
    Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

    WS - 2761 students
    Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

    In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    Love the hyperbole, someone touched a nerve with this one. So back to immigration and how it impacts the current state of FCPS: how does FCPS fix Lewis and Herndon, two of the worst high schools in the county, also the two with extraordinarily large populations (50+%) of hispanic immigrants. How will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?

    More broadly, will living under the threat of readjusting boundaries every 5 years attract the types of parents who seek control for their children's environment, who seek stability for their children? These are the same types of families that prize academic achievement. The next 24 months of PR on the comprehensive boundary changes will be an inflection point for FCPS and it will never recover to its former status within the US public school system.


    Over 50% Hispanic does not mean you are a Hispanic immigrant. Many of these kids are English-speaking kids born in America who identify as Hispanic.


    Of course, but there's a direct relationship between where immigrants choose to live and the per capita population of their ethnicity. It's not unreasonable to believe that Springfield and Herndon have a larger % relative to the overall Fairfax hispanic immigrant population. And as you point out, maybe it's not the hispanic immigrant population dragging down the numbers at these two schools, maybe it's the hispanic population overall. In which case we still go back to the same question: how will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?


    The issue can be framed differently. Let’s assume some of these schools with high Hispanic enrollments do an admirable job of supporting these kids, given where they started from, even if their test scores are lower. The schools still have a substantial population of students who aren’t Hispanic, and the opportunities available to those schools may not be the same at a Lewis or Herndon as at a Langley or West Springfield.

    The goal might be to try to make those opportunities more comparable, so that we don’t end up with high schools that are entirely Hispanic. Clearly the current opportunities for the non-Hispanic kids at these schools are not similar, or you wouldn’t have groups composed primarily of Langley parents regularly engaged in activities designed to preserve their boundaries and keep kids who aren’t at least UMC out of their school.
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:Are there any parts of they are possibly throwing out and not including in the policy vote tonight? Or is this a done deal vote?


    Might be a few who abstain or oppose but hard to see it not getting a majority of votes.
    Anonymous
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:
    Anonymous wrote:2003
    Lee - 2092 students
    Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

    WS - 2259 students
    Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

    2024
    Lewis - 1675 students
    Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

    WS - 2761 students
    Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

    In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    Love the hyperbole, someone touched a nerve with this one. So back to immigration and how it impacts the current state of FCPS: how does FCPS fix Lewis and Herndon, two of the worst high schools in the county, also the two with extraordinarily large populations (50+%) of hispanic immigrants. How will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?

    More broadly, will living under the threat of readjusting boundaries every 5 years attract the types of parents who seek control for their children's environment, who seek stability for their children? These are the same types of families that prize academic achievement. The next 24 months of PR on the comprehensive boundary changes will be an inflection point for FCPS and it will never recover to its former status within the US public school system.


    Over 50% Hispanic does not mean you are a Hispanic immigrant. Many of these kids are English-speaking kids born in America who identify as Hispanic.


    Of course, but there's a direct relationship between where immigrants choose to live and the per capita population of their ethnicity. It's not unreasonable to believe that Springfield and Herndon have a larger % relative to the overall Fairfax hispanic immigrant population. And as you point out, maybe it's not the hispanic immigrant population dragging down the numbers at these two schools, maybe it's the hispanic population overall. In which case we still go back to the same question: how will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?


    The issue can be framed differently. Let’s assume some of these schools with high Hispanic enrollments do an admirable job of supporting these kids, given where they started from, even if their test scores are lower. The schools still have a substantial population of students who aren’t Hispanic, and the opportunities available to those schools may not be the same at a Lewis or Herndon as at a Langley or West Springfield.

    The goal might be to try to make those opportunities more comparable, so that we don’t end up with high schools that are entirely Hispanic. Clearly the current opportunities for the non-Hispanic kids at these schools are not similar, or you wouldn’t have groups composed primarily of Langley parents regularly engaged in activities designed to preserve their boundaries and keep kids who aren’t at least UMC out of their school.


    I hear the argument that moving more higher SES/higher performing students to Lewis and Herndon will increase the demand for AP courses and electives and allow those schools to offer more of these classes and thus benefit the existing student population. My concern as a parent who lives in an area likely being considered for a move to Lewis (though SCHS makes a lot more sense geographically and is under enrolled by a similar amount) is will there be a lag in offering these courses? If these changes happen beginning the 26/27 school year, my child will be moved between their sophomore and junior year. Will there be a lag were they have to analyze demand, which will result in the students who are moved losing access to courses they would have otherwise had at WSHS and having their academic trajectory altered? I worry that the initial cohort of student relocated could suffer the "growing pains" of the school. Basically, if these moves take place, when will these improvements in course offerings take place? Will it be immediate? My family has the means and motivation to seek pupil placement, move further inbounds, or go private. For FCPS to not lose families like mine, they are going to have to show that our kids will not lose opportunities in a move like this. I'm supportive of more opportunities for all students, but ultimately, as a parent, I'm also going to look out for the best interest of my own children as well.
    Anonymous
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    Anonymous wrote:2003
    Lee - 2092 students
    Roughly 23% F/R lunch, 42% white, medium ESL rate (17.3%)

    WS - 2259 students
    Roughly 7% F/R lunch, 64% white, low ESL rate (7.5%)

    2024
    Lewis - 1675 students
    Roughly 63% F/R lunch, 12% white, high ESL rate (30%)

    WS - 2761 students
    Roughly 17% F/R lunch, 48% white, low ESL rate (5%)

    In 2003 Lee was middle of the road in FCPS. What happened?
  • IB put into Lee and several other schools

  • IB actually enabled easier transfer out with the liberal pupil placement policy

  • Immigrants concentrated in certain schools

  • 2005 boundary change - removed hundreds of students from Lee just as it was getting expanded - some to South County, some to West Springfield; students that departed were on the wealthier end of the spectrum. FCPS knew this was the case

  • Pupil placement accelerated - FCPS refuses to budge on dropping IB and Lee

  • 2015 boundary change - removed Daventry students - a relatively wealthy neighborhood

  • In the middle of all of this Great Schools came along and created winners and losers - English speaking Americans, particularly white, just stopped choosing houses in the Lee/Lewis boundary


  • That is how we got here. Notice the total number of students in 2003 at the two schools. Only different by 167 students. Now in 2024 - different by 1086 students.

    Lewis is much smaller, much poorer, and has many more ESL students. The ESL rate at WS actually went down over the years.

    The quality of the school (teachers, admin) is not necessarily different or subpar, but the demographics of the students is much different.

    How should this be resolved? Long time homeowner wants to know.


    This is an unpopular reality to bring up: there is a relationship between the foreign born population and academic performance of an area. And fairfax county has grown its immigrant population over the past 25 years at a per capita rate that exceeds NYC. Lewis #s over 20 years are an example of this. FCPS has failed this population over time and now wants to shuffle kids around to see if it treats the symptoms of high immigrant areas. Living here means accepting that the county will continue to import a (mostly) disadvantaged immigrant population and concentrate it in pockets that need extra resources to be successful. FCPS’ position is that your children are the those resources that will fix that population.



    Um what??? Do you live in Springfield or Burke or something? We live in the part of western Fairfax County where our immigrant population is what you racists and xenophobes would call "high performing". I mean, look at Chantilly - are you telling me the Asian and South Asian populations are BRINGING IT DOWN???? Puh-LEASE.


    What are you trying to say? Springfield and Burke are part of Fairfax County.


    I am trying to say that only the whitest of white people living in the whitest of white school pyramids would say what you said, sweetheart. Also, shush with your "bad immigrants" commentary. This country is built on the back of immigrants. You would have NOTHING if the "bad immigrant" community disappeared. NOTHING.


    Love the hyperbole, someone touched a nerve with this one. So back to immigration and how it impacts the current state of FCPS: how does FCPS fix Lewis and Herndon, two of the worst high schools in the county, also the two with extraordinarily large populations (50+%) of hispanic immigrants. How will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?

    More broadly, will living under the threat of readjusting boundaries every 5 years attract the types of parents who seek control for their children's environment, who seek stability for their children? These are the same types of families that prize academic achievement. The next 24 months of PR on the comprehensive boundary changes will be an inflection point for FCPS and it will never recover to its former status within the US public school system.


    Over 50% Hispanic does not mean you are a Hispanic immigrant. Many of these kids are English-speaking kids born in America who identify as Hispanic.


    Of course, but there's a direct relationship between where immigrants choose to live and the per capita population of their ethnicity. It's not unreasonable to believe that Springfield and Herndon have a larger % relative to the overall Fairfax hispanic immigrant population. And as you point out, maybe it's not the hispanic immigrant population dragging down the numbers at these two schools, maybe it's the hispanic population overall. In which case we still go back to the same question: how will adding black/white/asian kids to these schools actually provide uplift to the hispanic student population?


    The issue can be framed differently. Let’s assume some of these schools with high Hispanic enrollments do an admirable job of supporting these kids, given where they started from, even if their test scores are lower. The schools still have a substantial population of students who aren’t Hispanic, and the opportunities available to those schools may not be the same at a Lewis or Herndon as at a Langley or West Springfield.

    The goal might be to try to make those opportunities more comparable, so that we don’t end up with high schools that are entirely Hispanic. Clearly the current opportunities for the non-Hispanic kids at these schools are not similar, or you wouldn’t have groups composed primarily of Langley parents regularly engaged in activities designed to preserve their boundaries and keep kids who aren’t at least UMC out of their school.


    I hear the argument that moving more higher SES/higher performing students to Lewis and Herndon will increase the demand for AP courses and electives and allow those schools to offer more of these classes and thus benefit the existing student population. My concern as a parent who lives in an area likely being considered for a move to Lewis (though SCHS makes a lot more sense geographically and is under enrolled by a similar amount) is will there be a lag in offering these courses? If these changes happen beginning the 26/27 school year, my child will be moved between their sophomore and junior year. Will there be a lag were they have to analyze demand, which will result in the students who are moved losing access to courses they would have otherwise had at WSHS and having their academic trajectory altered? I worry that the initial cohort of student relocated could suffer the "growing pains" of the school. Basically, if these moves take place, when will these improvements in course offerings take place? Will it be immediate? My family has the means and motivation to seek pupil placement, move further inbounds, or go private. For FCPS to not lose families like mine, they are going to have to show that our kids will not lose opportunities in a move like this. I'm supportive of more opportunities for all students, but ultimately, as a parent, I'm also going to look out for the best interest of my own children as well.


    Makes perfect sense. That’s why people have been saying they need to get rid of IB. No one at an AP school wants to be dumped into an IB school and told it’s “just as good.” It’s not, at least for most kids, and if they want to move WS kids to Lewis they need to accelerate the replacement of IB with AP.
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