School residency cheaters investigated

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better. But it will NOT:

- Guarantee that you don't get "shut out" of your PK3 choice
- Make any of the schools that still have PK3 slots any more acceptable to you
- Make it any more likely that you will keep your child all the way through 5th grade in many of the neighborhoods where people complain about PK3 slots
- Solve the terrible achievement gap still present in DC
- Explain why UMC kids get CMI, but low SES kids get Rocketship
- Provide a good middle school on Capitol Hill
- Provide a good high school on Capitol Hill
- Solves overcrowding at Deal and makes Hardy a more viable option
- Modernize all the schools that desperately need it
- Create a gifted and talented program that serves everyone and strengthens neighborhood schools overall
- Ensures that disabled kids actually get their needs met at DCPS and charters
- Meets all the demand for bilingual education
- Gives all students the amount of recess and outdoor time necessary for their healthy development
- or any of the other zillion problems discussed here on a daily basis

It might not do those things. But I pay a shitload in DC taxes. I pay a premium to live in this city and I don't get premium services for this privilege. (though I do get a shorter commute and for the most part a city that has worked fairly well for me - I'm not one to complain too much about the city).

It does bother me that people in MD put their kids in DC schools. DCPS has made great strides, but there are still lots of problems. And charters operate with all sorts of problems, too. There are real issues of space allocations across sectors, of renovating underperforming and under enrolled schools, and poor education of vulnerable children. Maryland is a relatively wealthy state that does well on almost all societal markers.

I'd like DC to operate in a more efficient, effective manner. And that means kicking out what truly does seem to be a relatively high percentage of residency fraudsters. I'm not someone who believes in any way that people on public assistance should be forced to take drug tests or anything. I think that's a waste of resources. But here in DC, with schools with long waiting lists, with schools that are underperforming, with a tight city budget, with massive problems providing special education services, etc etc etc - I cannot stand the thought of a relatively wealthy neighboring state offloading hundreds of kids off their rolls and onto ours.

I think this is a big problem and I think it has to stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It would open up schools to DC residents that are not taken up by out-of-DC residents. Reduce costs for paying teachers for not DC residents - surely DC can find a better way to use those funds.

Save 50 DC families 20k per year in childcare so that they can go to work full time. Or give more needy children needed early intervention education.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would open up schools to DC residents that are not taken up by out-of-DC residents. Reduce costs for paying teachers for not DC residents - surely DC can find a better way to use those funds.

Not to mention prove that we are serious about tackling fraud and cronyism.

Unless one passively accepts that DC stands for the District of Cronyism (and Corruption).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better. But it will NOT:

- Guarantee that you don't get "shut out" of your PK3 choice
- Make any of the schools that still have PK3 slots any more acceptable to you
- Make it any more likely that you will keep your child all the way through 5th grade in many of the neighborhoods where people complain about PK3 slots
- Solve the terrible achievement gap still present in DC
- Explain why UMC kids get CMI, but low SES kids get Rocketship
- Provide a good middle school on Capitol Hill
- Provide a good high school on Capitol Hill
- Solves overcrowding at Deal and makes Hardy a more viable option
- Modernize all the schools that desperately need it
- Create a gifted and talented program that serves everyone and strengthens neighborhood schools overall
- Ensures that disabled kids actually get their needs met at DCPS and charters
- Meets all the demand for bilingual education
- Gives all students the amount of recess and outdoor time necessary for their healthy development
- or any of the other zillion problems discussed here on a daily basis

It might not do those things. But I pay a shitload in DC taxes. I pay a premium to live in this city and I don't get premium services for this privilege. (though I do get a shorter commute and for the most part a city that has worked fairly well for me - I'm not one to complain too much about the city).

It does bother me that people in MD put their kids in DC schools. DCPS has made great strides, but there are still lots of problems. And charters operate with all sorts of problems, too. There are real issues of space allocations across sectors, of renovating underperforming and under enrolled schools, and poor education of vulnerable children. Maryland is a relatively wealthy state that does well on almost all societal markers.

I'd like DC to operate in a more efficient, effective manner. And that means kicking out what truly does seem to be a relatively high percentage of residency fraudsters. I'm not someone who believes in any way that people on public assistance should be forced to take drug tests or anything. I think that's a waste of resources. But here in DC, with schools with long waiting lists, with schools that are underperforming, with a tight city budget, with massive problems providing special education services, etc etc etc - I cannot stand the thought of a relatively wealthy neighboring state offloading hundreds of kids off their rolls and onto ours.

I think this is a big problem and I think it has to stop.

+1

Those are exactly my feelings as well. I pay a lot in taxes, don't use much in terms of city services, and it galls me to no end that people from outside jurisdictions are using up badly needed DC dollars. The pre-K waitlists are a very real cost for DC parents who get waitlisted. That's $25K+ per year they need to spend in childcare costs.

I can't believe all the people who are apologists for residency cheating. Perhaps this just indicates how deep and ingrained the problem truly is? It may be on a scale that we can't even imagine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better. But it will NOT:

- Guarantee that you don't get "shut out" of your PK3 choice
- Make any of the schools that still have PK3 slots any more acceptable to you
- Make it any more likely that you will keep your child all the way through 5th grade in many of the neighborhoods where people complain about PK3 slots
- Solve the terrible achievement gap still present in DC
- Explain why UMC kids get CMI, but low SES kids get Rocketship
- Provide a good middle school on Capitol Hill
- Provide a good high school on Capitol Hill
- Solves overcrowding at Deal and makes Hardy a more viable option
- Modernize all the schools that desperately need it
- Create a gifted and talented program that serves everyone and strengthens neighborhood schools overall
- Ensures that disabled kids actually get their needs met at DCPS and charters
- Meets all the demand for bilingual education
- Gives all students the amount of recess and outdoor time necessary for their healthy development
- or any of the other zillion problems discussed here on a daily basis

You sound like those Second Amendment gun nuts who claim that new gun safety laws are pointless because they won't solve 100% of the gun problems.

You do know we're allowed to address many different problems in different ways, don't you? Not every solution has to be the magic bullet that provides all the answers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would open up schools to DC residents that are not taken up by out-of-DC residents. Reduce costs for paying teachers for not DC residents - surely DC can find a better way to use those funds.

Save 50 DC families 20k per year in childcare so that they can go to work full time. Or give more needy children needed early intervention education.

When I got laid off from a job, I had to turn down job offers with lower salaries because although I was willing to work at a lower pay and wanted to keep my resume warm with experience, the lower job salary could not cover daycare and it was not low enough for some sort of daycare stipend. My husband was in his last year of school at the time. D.C. child care costs are no joke. The main reason we decided to pay extra and buy an overpriced townhome which needed a new roof off the bat was because of the preschool options.

[Anonymous]

Don't you think lots of the pro-cheater posters would be singing a different tune if the cheater profiled had been a wealthy two-lawyer family from Bethesda?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better. But it will NOT:

- Guarantee that you don't get "shut out" of your PK3 choice
- Make any of the schools that still have PK3 slots any more acceptable to you
- Make it any more likely that you will keep your child all the way through 5th grade in many of the neighborhoods where people complain about PK3 slots
- Solve the terrible achievement gap still present in DC
- Explain why UMC kids get CMI, but low SES kids get Rocketship
- Provide a good middle school on Capitol Hill
- Provide a good high school on Capitol Hill
- Solves overcrowding at Deal and makes Hardy a more viable option
- Modernize all the schools that desperately need it
- Create a gifted and talented program that serves everyone and strengthens neighborhood schools overall
- Ensures that disabled kids actually get their needs met at DCPS and charters
- Meets all the demand for bilingual education
- Gives all students the amount of recess and outdoor time necessary for their healthy development
- or any of the other zillion problems discussed here on a daily basis

It might not do those things. But I pay a shitload in DC taxes. I pay a premium to live in this city and I don't get premium services for this privilege. (though I do get a shorter commute and for the most part a city that has worked fairly well for me - I'm not one to complain too much about the city).

It does bother me that people in MD put their kids in DC schools. DCPS has made great strides, but there are still lots of problems. And charters operate with all sorts of problems, too. There are real issues of space allocations across sectors, of renovating underperforming and under enrolled schools, and poor education of vulnerable children. Maryland is a relatively wealthy state that does well on almost all societal markers.

I'd like DC to operate in a more efficient, effective manner. And that means kicking out what truly does seem to be a relatively high percentage of residency fraudsters. I'm not someone who believes in any way that people on public assistance should be forced to take drug tests or anything. I think that's a waste of resources. But here in DC, with schools with long waiting lists, with schools that are underperforming, with a tight city budget, with massive problems providing special education services, etc etc etc - I cannot stand the thought of a relatively wealthy neighboring state offloading hundreds of kids off their rolls and onto ours.

I think this is a big problem and I think it has to stop.

+1

Those are exactly my feelings as well. I pay a lot in taxes, don't use much in terms of city services, and it galls me to no end that people from outside jurisdictions are using up badly needed DC dollars. The pre-K waitlists are a very real cost for DC parents who get waitlisted. That's $25K+ per year they need to spend in childcare costs.

I can't believe all the people who are apologists for residency cheating. Perhaps this just indicates how deep and ingrained the problem truly is? It may be on a scale that we can't even imagine.

1 year of prek childcare costs is easily a down payment on a first home, something that people claim helps to stabilize communities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don't you think lots of the pro-cheater posters would be singing a different tune if the cheater profiled had been a wealthy two-lawyer family from Bethesda?

I think they'd be even more outraged, that even more well-to-do people from out of state might be scamming DC resources. For example, mention "Maryland driver" to the average person who lives in Upper NW and you're likely to get a not very favorable reaction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better.

What is likely a few million a year, is not "a few bucks"

And no one is saying it will solve any of those problems, but it is a problem, just not one of your priorities. Taking your attitude, nothing is worth solving because everything is independent of everything else so let's give up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better. But it will NOT:

- Guarantee that you don't get "shut out" of your PK3 choice
- Make any of the schools that still have PK3 slots any more acceptable to you
- Make it any more likely that you will keep your child all the way through 5th grade in many of the neighborhoods where people complain about PK3 slots
- Solve the terrible achievement gap still present in DC
- Explain why UMC kids get CMI, but low SES kids get Rocketship
- Provide a good middle school on Capitol Hill
- Provide a good high school on Capitol Hill
- Solves overcrowding at Deal and makes Hardy a more viable option
- Modernize all the schools that desperately need it
- Create a gifted and talented program that serves everyone and strengthens neighborhood schools overall
- Ensures that disabled kids actually get their needs met at DCPS and charters
- Meets all the demand for bilingual education
- Gives all students the amount of recess and outdoor time necessary for their healthy development
- or any of the other zillion problems discussed here on a daily basis

It might not do those things. But I pay a shitload in DC taxes. I pay a premium to live in this city and I don't get premium services for this privilege. (though I do get a shorter commute and for the most part a city that has worked fairly well for me - I'm not one to complain too much about the city).

It does bother me that people in MD put their kids in DC schools. DCPS has made great strides, but there are still lots of problems. And charters operate with all sorts of problems, too. There are real issues of space allocations across sectors, of renovating underperforming and under enrolled schools, and poor education of vulnerable children. Maryland is a relatively wealthy state that does well on almost all societal markers.

I'd like DC to operate in a more efficient, effective manner. And that means kicking out what truly does seem to be a relatively high percentage of residency fraudsters. I'm not someone who believes in any way that people on public assistance should be forced to take drug tests or anything. I think that's a waste of resources. But here in DC, with schools with long waiting lists, with schools that are underperforming, with a tight city budget, with massive problems providing special education services, etc etc etc - I cannot stand the thought of a relatively wealthy neighboring state offloading hundreds of kids off their rolls and onto ours.

I think this is a big problem and I think it has to stop.

+1

Those are exactly my feelings as well. I pay a lot in taxes, don't use much in terms of city services, and it galls me to no end that people from outside jurisdictions are using up badly needed DC dollars. The pre-K waitlists are a very real cost for DC parents who get waitlisted. That's $25K+ per year they need to spend in childcare costs.

I can't believe all the people who are apologists for residency cheating. Perhaps this just indicates how deep and ingrained the problem truly is? It may be on a scale that we can't even imagine.

1 year of prek childcare costs is easily a down payment on a first home, something that people claim helps to stabilize communities.

As a DC taxpayer, I am not especially interested in scarce DC funds being used to stabilize Upper Marlboro and other PG communities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better. But it will NOT:

- Guarantee that you don't get "shut out" of your PK3 choice
- Make any of the schools that still have PK3 slots any more acceptable to you
- Make it any more likely that you will keep your child all the way through 5th grade in many of the neighborhoods where people complain about PK3 slots
- Solve the terrible achievement gap still present in DC
- Explain why UMC kids get CMI, but low SES kids get Rocketship
- Provide a good middle school on Capitol Hill
- Provide a good high school on Capitol Hill
- Solves overcrowding at Deal and makes Hardy a more viable option
- Modernize all the schools that desperately need it
- Create a gifted and talented program that serves everyone and strengthens neighborhood schools overall
- Ensures that disabled kids actually get their needs met at DCPS and charters
- Meets all the demand for bilingual education
- Gives all students the amount of recess and outdoor time necessary for their healthy development
- or any of the other zillion problems discussed here on a daily basis

You sound like those Second Amendment gun nuts who claim that new gun safety laws are pointless because they won't solve 100% of the gun problems.

You do know we're allowed to address many different problems in different ways, don't you? Not every solution has to be the magic bullet that provides all the answers.

The point is that this is a *minor* (if that) problem that has no bearing on 99.9% of DCUM reader's actual experiences with DC public & charter schools, yet draws an extreme over-focus because of the presence of any of several tantilizing tropes ... And PS DC actually has relatively lower taxes overall compared to other states. You do pay more to live here, but that's in housing costs, not taxes.

[Anonymous]

I've mentioned it before here -- there's a real problem with the process/residency requirements. If my kid's school was considered 100 percent compliant for DC residency verification based on required documentation, yet I know of a few MD residents who attend, there is a serious problem with people falsifying documents.

The administration says everything is A ok according to OSSE, nothing to see here. So then the burden of proof is on random parents who have the balls and or care enough to report license plates, names, etc. Or reporters who follow people home. Why can't there be a better system in place for identifying false documents? I'd like to know how exactly OSSE completes an audit.

I don't think my kids' school has a ton of residency cheaters but there are a few that I know of just in his class so I imagine there are more in other classes. For a school that has a waiting list in the hundreds and offers also second language instruction, it is unacceptable that any non-tuition paying MD students are taking spots and opportunities away from DC kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People's obsession with residency fraud is a great example of the availability bias at work ...

Listen up. Eradicating residency fraud will save a few bucks and may make some people feel better.

What is likely a few million a year, is not "a few bucks"

And no one is saying it will solve any of those problems, but it is a problem, just not one of your priorities. Taking your attitude, nothing is worth solving because everything is independent of everything else so let's give up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Agreed. And the scope of the issue is also completely blown up. This is "Cadillac Welfare Mom" redux (except with an Escalade!) While cheating isn't good, there's no evidence that it is some kind of systematic fraud making any sort of meaningful impact on DCPS. This just seems to be a perfect storm of white parents obsessed with being "shut out" from their PK3, and a "news" organization pushing an ideological agenda that is very happy to bash DC and black people in general.

Scope blown up? Really? You may not like the Daily Caller, but you are being disingenuous if you pretend this isn't a substantial problem.

There's no evidence that this is a "substantial problem"!! That's the whole point ...

If you read other articles in Washington Post and elsewhere, consider the City Council hearing in 2012, read this and other forums (with the topic coming up again and again over time), and if you open your eyes, the problem is clear.

We're not in a court of law where evidence is needed for a conviction. Rather, plenty of information and examples indicate that this is a substantial problem deserving proper investigation and legal evidence collection.

You can choose to require unassailable evidence before you acknowledge a problem, but that's just dumb. Can I offer you a cigarette?

there's been absolutely no credible evidence, circumstantial or otherwise, that this is some kind of severe issue within the scope of issues facing DC and DC schools. just anonymous DCUM posters and busy bodies counting MD license plates. on the other hand, we have plenty of reason to believe that the Daily Caller "investigation" is a hack job or worse to further their own anti-federal/anti-"liberal" agenda.

Of course there are some parents committing fraud out there. That does not demonstrate this is THE PROBLEM ZoMG!!! with DC schools. If you are super exercised about residency fraud, please take a moment to think why.

1. Really bothered by out-of-District students taking spots in DCPS and charters where DC students are shut out of the lottery.

2. Also bothered by DC incurring direct out of pocket costs for non-resident students for whom DC pays for special needs private schools.

3. Even where schools have spots availalble, bothered that scarce school resources are being used by non-residents and being diverted/distorted from other needs like science, enrichment, remedial help which would benefit DC students.

4. Bothered that DC taxpayers are being ripped off, particularly by out of state fraudsters.

5. I want DC to move beyond governance the resembles Barry era ineptitude and corruption