Pay-to-Play Sport at Private HS employing club coach - what's normal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The “iron sharpens iron” comment is what’s laughable.

The Gibbs summer teams quit in the middle or tourneys and plays against third rate competition (in front of few scouts or college coaches).

Kids who want to face better competition and not pay the Gibbs extortion fee are harassed and tossed aside.

Kids who stick to the program get to play at D3 schools or, if they’re lucky, walk on at a D1 school.

The purpose for program isn’t for the kids who strive to play against the best. It’s designed so the Gibbs boys can maximize profits off the baseball dreams of kids.

So to this point if there were other local programs available for developing talent, why does SJC win literally every year? Because they are the best. Because they are a serious, machine of a program. Its not that a DM or PVI doesnt try as hard to be good - its just that they are not!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The “iron sharpens iron” comment is what’s laughable.

The Gibbs summer teams quit in the middle or tourneys and plays against third rate competition (in front of few scouts or college coaches).

Kids who want to face better competition and not pay the Gibbs extortion fee are harassed and tossed aside.

Kids who stick to the program get to play at D3 schools or, if they’re lucky, walk on at a D1 school.

The purpose for program isn’t for the kids who strive to play against the best. It’s designed so the Gibbs boys can maximize profits off the baseball dreams of kids.

So to this point if there were other local programs available for developing talent, why does SJC win literally every year? Because they are the best. Because they are a serious, machine of a program. Its not that a DM or PVI doesnt try as hard to be good - its just that they are not!

I think these posts make it clear. They win every year because they cheat the system to practice and play together year round. They also recruit heavily and are not completely honest during recruitment. In the process of winning all these championships, they significantly diminish their players' college prospects by waiting too long to start the college conversation, pigeon-holing players, having all players play together meaning that they aren't always at the appropriate event, and eliminating the possibility of another coach being able to talk to colleges about their players.

[Anonymous]

My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

This is what it’s all about. Somehow I’m to believe the system that has produced possibly the single most dominant and successful program in the area across all sports is some scheme to line the pockets of the coach at the expense of the well-being of the student-athlete? Jog on with that, Erin Brockovich.

Unfortunately, today’s coddled athlete who’s been told they’re special all their life finds it easier in the face of adversity to blame others for their “misfortune” than powering through to explore what’s possible. In my day, your reputation was earned, not given. Results were also earned. Sounds like somebody’s offers didn’t meet their expectation, but you don’t get six-pack abs simply by joining the gym.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

This is what it’s all about. Somehow I’m to believe the system that has produced possibly the single most dominant and successful program in the area across all sports is some scheme to line the pockets of the coach at the expense of the well-being of the student-athlete? Jog on with that, Erin Brockovich.

Unfortunately, today’s coddled athlete who’s been told they’re special all their life finds it easier in the face of adversity to blame others for their “misfortune” than powering through to explore what’s possible. In my day, your reputation was earned, not given. Results were also earned. Sounds like somebody’s offers didn’t meet their expectation, but you don’t get six-pack abs simply by joining the gym.

To the first post, that's great to hear that your son had such a positive experience. I truly mean that because it is not always to case. To the second post, this is about baseball and possibly soccer. None of the other sports at SJC do what those two sports do in terms of owning the kids year-round. Finally, blaming the athlete has been the MO of St. John's baseball for over a decade now. Not a single honest, objective person would say that the five guys leaving are anything but hard working. And from what I understand, their only "misfortune" was not paying to play. Obviously I don't know everything about the story but neither do you, do you? The fact that it is 5 players over two grades should say something. Particularly since 4 of them are committed to premiere programs, including the preseason 11 and 5 in the country. -Parent who's son is succeeding in college baseball despite St. John's not because of St. John's

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

This is what it’s all about. Somehow I’m to believe the system that has produced possibly the single most dominant and successful program in the area across all sports is some scheme to line the pockets of the coach at the expense of the well-being of the student-athlete? Jog on with that, Erin Brockovich.

Unfortunately, today’s coddled athlete who’s been told they’re special all their life finds it easier in the face of adversity to blame others for their “misfortune” than powering through to explore what’s possible. In my day, your reputation was earned, not given. Results were also earned. Sounds like somebody’s offers didn’t meet their expectation, but you don’t get six-pack abs simply by joining the gym.

To the first post, that's great to hear that your son had such a positive experience. I truly mean that because it is not always to case. To the second post, this is about baseball and possibly soccer. None of the other sports at SJC do what those two sports do in terms of owning the kids year-round. Finally, blaming the athlete has been the MO of St. John's baseball for over a decade now. Not a single honest, objective person would say that the five guys leaving are anything but hard working. And from what I understand, their only "misfortune" was not paying to play. Obviously I don't know everything about the story but neither do you, do you? The fact that it is 5 players over two grades should say something. Particularly since 4 of them are committed to premiere programs, including the preseason 11 and 5 in the country. -Parent who's son is succeeding in college baseball despite St. John's not because of St. John's

This, x 1000. Players who are already commits prior to their senior year, are not benchwarmers. There obviously are systemic problems within the program if these players are leaving. Problems that winning doesn't cure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

This is what it’s all about. Somehow I’m to believe the system that has produced possibly the single most dominant and successful program in the area across all sports is some scheme to line the pockets of the coach at the expense of the well-being of the student-athlete? Jog on with that, Erin Brockovich.

Unfortunately, today’s coddled athlete who’s been told they’re special all their life finds it easier in the face of adversity to blame others for their “misfortune” than powering through to explore what’s possible. In my day, your reputation was earned, not given. Results were also earned. Sounds like somebody’s offers didn’t meet their expectation, but you don’t get six-pack abs simply by joining the gym.

To the first post, that's great to hear that your son had such a positive experience. I truly mean that because it is not always to case. To the second post, this is about baseball and possibly soccer. None of the other sports at SJC do what those two sports do in terms of owning the kids year-round. Finally, blaming the athlete has been the MO of St. John's baseball for over a decade now. Not a single honest, objective person would say that the five guys leaving are anything but hard working. And from what I understand, their only "misfortune" was not paying to play. Obviously I don't know everything about the story but neither do you, do you? The fact that it is 5 players over two grades should say something. Particularly since 4 of them are committed to premiere programs, including the preseason 11 and 5 in the country. -Parent who's son is succeeding in college baseball despite St. John's not because of St. John's

This, x 1000. Players who are already commits prior to their senior year, are not benchwarmers. There obviously are systemic problems within the program if these players are leaving. Problems that winning doesn't cure.

DeMatha perspective here. St Johns won last year because of the two freshmen they rolled out there who have now transferred. To suggest they didn’t have what it takes to succeed at St Johns is absolutely laughable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

This is what it’s all about. Somehow I’m to believe the system that has produced possibly the single most dominant and successful program in the area across all sports is some scheme to line the pockets of the coach at the expense of the well-being of the student-athlete? Jog on with that, Erin Brockovich.

Unfortunately, today’s coddled athlete who’s been told they’re special all their life finds it easier in the face of adversity to blame others for their “misfortune” than powering through to explore what’s possible. In my day, your reputation was earned, not given. Results were also earned. Sounds like somebody’s offers didn’t meet their expectation, but you don’t get six-pack abs simply by joining the gym.

“But it’s ok cuz we won.” - 2017 Houston Astros

“But it’s ok cuz we won.” - 2018 Boston Red Sox

“But it’s ok cuz we won.” - 2014-19 St Johns Baseball

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son played baseball at SJC and had a great experience. A couple of points. He would be considered a middle of the pack player by SJC standards. He knew this and we knew this. We never aspired to DI colleges or scholarships. My DH and I checked in with him often and told him if he ever wanted to quit, we supported that decision. As long as he finished out the season. My son ended up playing DIII and did get quite a bit of money (considered merit, but it was for baseball). He has no regrets. He worked incredibly hard and has used that work ethic both on and off of the field.

This is what it’s all about. Somehow I’m to believe the system that has produced possibly the single most dominant and successful program in the area across all sports is some scheme to line the pockets of the coach at the expense of the well-being of the student-athlete? Jog on with that, Erin Brockovich.

Unfortunately, today’s coddled athlete who’s been told they’re special all their life finds it easier in the face of adversity to blame others for their “misfortune” than powering through to explore what’s possible. In my day, your reputation was earned, not given. Results were also earned. Sounds like somebody’s offers didn’t meet their expectation, but you don’t get six-pack abs simply by joining the gym.

“But it’s ok cuz we won.” - 2017 Houston Astros

“But it’s ok cuz we won.” - 2018 Boston Red Sox

“But it’s ok cuz we won.” - 2014-19 St Johns Baseball

That’s completely unfair to the boys who worked so hard for those championships. To equate cheating to them is BS.

[Anonymous]

Ummm, what about all those kids and coaches from the other WCAC teams that actually follow the league rules? It’s not unfair to them that Gibby runs a program that completely disregards the rules?

If your goal at a Catholic institution is to run a program that violates league rules while extorting money from families in order to win a few trophies, that speaks volumes about you.

[Anonymous]

Kevin Gibbs is one of the best multi sport athletes in SJC history. Yesbaseball, but also bball and QB of the football team. LJ Hoes played basketball. Again, lots of misinformation here.

Sad that winning 6 titles in a row creates crazy rumors and nonsense. If 5 players chose to transfer, then good luck to them. The SJC baseball machine will roll on- as it always does.

[Anonymous]

I love the religious school people justify the obvious cheating taking place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kevin Gibbs is one of the best multi sport athletes in SJC history. Yesbaseball, but also bball and QB of the football team. LJ Hoes played basketball. Again, lots of misinformation here.

Sad that winning 6 titles in a row creates crazy rumors and nonsense. If 5 players chose to transfer, then good luck to them. The SJC baseball machine will roll on- as it always does.

LJ Hoes graduated 12 years ago and doesn’t even list St. John’s as his high school on Perfect Game. He changed it to St. John’s Literary Institute that’s how much he loves his alma mater. And Kevin Gibbs was a three sport athlete when? The 90s? You will need more recent examples because this one just highlights the current hypocrisy of countless baseball players being encouraged/bullied into giving up another sport (usually basketball) to feed the machine. Maybe the Gibbs don’t want anyone else to excel in multiple sports so that Kevin stays as one of the best multi sport athletes in SJC history.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ummm, what about all those kids and coaches from the other WCAC teams that actually follow the league rules? It’s not unfair to them that Gibby runs a program that completely disregards the rules?

If your goal at a Catholic institution is to run a program that violates league rules while extorting money from families in order to win a few trophies, that speaks volumes about you.

Further to this point, violating rules re: practice time is a serious violation. It results in a significant competitive advantage for teams that violate the rules. That is why the rules are put in place and why leagues/conferences/associations that care about fair competition enforce them.

For example, when Harbaugh got to Michigan, the NCAA found that under his predecessor, Michigan football had exceeded practice time limits by 65 hours (off-season and season combined) over an 18 month period. Harbaugh’s Wolverines we’re docked 130 practice hours (double the amount of hours they violated by) over the next two years and put on probation for three years - a period in which the program had to take extra compliance measures with the NCAA (I.e., it made violating the practice rules nearly impossible. Oh, and let’s not forget that Michigan fired Rich Rodriguez, the coach who violated the rules and put the program in that mess.

65 hours over 18 months is nothing compared to the amount by which SJC baseball violates the WCAC’s rules, which state that in the off-season teams can’t work together more than 4 days a week or 12 hours a week. Over the summer alone, SJC baseball goes 6 or 7 days a week and regularly more than 30 hours a week. Excessive time continues throughout the entire offseason until the baseball season legitimately starts toward the end of February.

If the WCAC levied a penalty similar to what Michigan got (2x the number of hours by which the broke the rules), SJC baseball would never be allowed to practice! They’d have to just show up for games unprepared. Oh, and if SJC had an ethical land to stand on like Michigan, they’d fire Gibbs.

But carry on with your “nothing to see here” mentality. Maybe SJC’s players aren’t the ones making the decision to break the rules, but they are breaking the rules at the direction of their coach, and the school has an environment of total noncompliance. Sad if you’re too dense to see how other league teams/players are disadvantaged.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kevin Gibbs is one of the best multi sport athletes in SJC history. Yesbaseball, but also bball and QB of the football team. LJ Hoes played basketball. Again, lots of misinformation here.

Sad that winning 6 titles in a row creates crazy rumors and nonsense. If 5 players chose to transfer, then good luck to them. The SJC baseball machine will roll on- as it always does.

LJ Hoes is believed to be the last SJC baseball player to be allowed to play another varsity sport at SJC. 12 years ago. That’s what you would call history, not the present.