Harsh comment on being a Sahm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

This is your opinion, but it’s really none of your business. This is the same as someone clucking their tongue at a mom of an infant that she “ought” to stay home and not let strangers raise her baby. That’s also none of your business (or mine).

As for finances, I don’t really get this argument. Presumably the couple has savings. Joint & individual bank accounts. Investments. The woman has degrees. In the event of a divorce, assets are split, there is alimony, and the woman goes to find a job with her degree. Not saying it’s easy, but it’s certainly not as though she’s likely to be out on the street.

LOL! Have you read threads on here? Women actively DONT get jobs because it lowers their alimony 🙄 seriously these are just lazy gold diggers, you’re being disingenuous here.

Are you joking? I’ve been on plenty of divorce threads. The majority opinion is that if a woman sees divorce on the horizon, it is time to get her ducks in a row career-wise.
Receiving alimony in a divorce is on the wane and obviously not a long term solution.

You’re probably right about women in the real world. Dcum is not the same. Full of umc women who refuse to work if they may lose their free ride (alimony). They SHOULD get their ducks in a row instead, but they don’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Part time physician 3 days/wk.
one morning per wk to organize schedules and everything for the week.
No, society would not fall apart without my work but that's not how a job works and not WHY i work. Wouldn't fall apart but many many patients are better off because I am their doctor. Being a SAHM woul bore me to tears and depression. I am intellectual and need the intellectual stimulation.

Kids stuff is well organized and I'm on top of it. Both my kids are excelling at school, sports, community service, and the arts. Each has a great group of friends. They are well behaved and kind. So, no it's not only SAHM who have well behaved kids. In fact, I see many SAHM kids who are NOT well behaved and have poor values.

I have nothing against SAHM and am friends with several. One way is not better absolutely so this thread is just weird. Each person does what is necessary for them - I need the intellectual stimulation and love what I do. I don't nedd it for the money.

I feel sorry for women who are so insecure in their SAHMness that they feel the need to put down working moms. Rarely do working moms even talk about the SAHM thing.

I want to thank you! My doctor just had a baby and came back, and I love having a female doctor. It’s been proven that women (and actually men too) get better healthcare with female doctors. I bet you are helping a lot of people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

I have the exact same opinion of Kids these days. They need a lot more involved parents to improve behavior. I did not vote for Trump.

But do you agree with the opinion that well educated mothers should be SAH even when their kids are teenagers? That's the scary part of PP's take on this. Her solution is to keep women in the home to raise the kids, even when they don't need a full-time SAH.

It isn’t a “should” issue. But I think it’s great if they are- there is value to that. Why are you acting like there is zero value to having a SAHM to older kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Part time physician 3 days/wk.
one morning per wk to organize schedules and everything for the week.
No, society would not fall apart without my work but that's not how a job works and not WHY i work. Wouldn't fall apart but many many patients are better off because I am their doctor. Being a SAHM woul bore me to tears and depression. I am intellectual and need the intellectual stimulation.

Kids stuff is well organized and I'm on top of it. Both my kids are excelling at school, sports, community service, and the arts. Each has a great group of friends. They are well behaved and kind. So, no it's not only SAHM who have well behaved kids. In fact, I see many SAHM kids who are NOT well behaved and have poor values.

I have nothing against SAHM and am friends with several. One way is not better absolutely so this thread is just weird. Each person does what is necessary for them - I need the intellectual stimulation and love what I do. I don't nedd it for the money.

I feel sorry for women who are so insecure in their SAHMness that they feel the need to put down working moms. Rarely do working moms even talk about the SAHM thing.

I’m a SAHM and I actually have had some PT jobs over the years. They were more for the diversion and to keep up to date with some of the newer technology that’s come out since I left the FT workforce 25 years ago. We didn’t need that income, that isn’t why I got the jobs. I’m in my late 50’s now and I have zero interest in working now. My husband will be retiring soon and we are figuring out where our retirement home will be. It’s funny to see this thread because there seem to be a lot of posters asking SAHMs “what do you do all day!?!” A SAHM will answer the question and a working mom will say “well I do the same thing and there’s no way that takes all day” or some such thing. As a person who has worked FT and PT and SAHM at various points I can say that it’s more of a detail thing. If you stay at home you are simply able to focus in on details that make life better for your family. When our kids were little even a PT job could throw in a level of chaos and time restraints that we didn’t need. When the kids were older my PT jobs were more fun but then our elderly parents started needing help. There’s always something. I’ve never had a problem staying busy that is for darned sure.

[Anonymous]

I’d have a difficult time saying :

Ok Larla. I’ll make sure to consider this comment when I decide on your inheritance. It sounds like you prefer working and won’t need the money. I’d hate for you to inherit enough that you don’t have to work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

Tradwives of the world actively making it worse for women everywhere. Sigh. It’s sad that people actually believe the world would be better off without women in professional positions.

I mean, women will never get ahead because of catty women like you always tearing other women down. Women who shit on SAHMs or housewives are the ultimate “pick me!” girls, but you have your heads so far up your own asses you’ll never even consider contemplating the internalized misogyny which drives your worldview.

Lean into that patriarchy, girlboss. Make the rich male overlords of the world richer and then act shocked and pretend it’s the housewives holding women down

Huh?? Like me? Did you read the post from the pp saying that the world would be better without women doctors, lawyers or business owners? What is wrong with you? THAT is patriarchy, you seem very confused as to the definition.[/quote
+1. There are some very misguided posters on this thread who don't seem to grasp the concepts of misogyny or patriarchy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

Tradwives of the world actively making it worse for women everywhere. Sigh. It’s sad that people actually believe the world would be better off without women in professional positions.

I mean, women will never get ahead because of catty women like you always tearing other women down. Women who shit on SAHMs or housewives are the ultimate “pick me!” girls, but you have your heads so far up your own asses you’ll never even consider contemplating the internalized misogyny which drives your worldview.

Lean into that patriarchy, girlboss. Make the rich male overlords of the world richer and then act shocked and pretend it’s the housewives holding women down

Huh?? Like me? Did you read the post from the pp saying that the world would be better without women doctors, lawyers or business owners? What is wrong with you? THAT is patriarchy, you seem very confused as to the definition.

+1. There are some very misguided posters on this thread who don't seem to grasp the concepts of misogyny or patriarchy.

1. The poster never said or implied that the “world would be better without women doctors, lawyers, or business owners”. (Although I think the world would be significantly better with fewer lawyers of any sex, but that’s neither here nor there.) You’re both putting words into her mouth to fit your narrative. I believe that’s called a straw man.

2. Capitalism IS patriarchy. There is no divorcing the two. Perhaps if you had some free time to read, think, and reflect on big ideas you would understand that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

Your work isn’t the huge contribution to society you think it is. I prefer my contribution to be focuses on raising great kids. But you do you; no one would miss you at work if you quit tomorrow, though.

FYI, the same kind of idiotic reasoning is why we have a measles outbreak. How individuals, you and those around you, make decisions does have an impact on the world we all inhabit.

What do you do?

I'm an editor.

That’s as informative as saying you’re a SAHM. What do you edit? How do “fill” your time?

Also, good luck when you’re replaced by AI. Not saying it’s better than you, but as this thread shows, our society only cares about maximizing “efficiency” and doesn’t give a rat’s ass about quality. Save your money.

??? I'm working, have a full-time, flexible job with benefits. I'm earning money, so your comment makes zero sense. And while AI is getting better, it's still shockingly unreliable. In my field, which is quite specialized, human editors like myself are correcting a lot of mistakes generated by poor editing programs (often developed in India).

Jesus Christ, you’re an editor but you lack basic reading comprehension? Maybe the unreliable AI would be an improvement after all.

“Save your money” means save (imperative) your money because you will most likely be out of a job within the next five years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

Tradwives of the world actively making it worse for women everywhere. Sigh. It’s sad that people actually believe the world would be better off without women in professional positions.

I mean, women will never get ahead because of catty women like you always tearing other women down. Women who shit on SAHMs or housewives are the ultimate “pick me!” girls, but you have your heads so far up your own asses you’ll never even consider contemplating the internalized misogyny which drives your worldview.

Lean into that patriarchy, girlboss. Make the rich male overlords of the world richer and then act shocked and pretend it’s the housewives holding women down

Huh?? Like me? Did you read the post from the pp saying that the world would be better without women doctors, lawyers or business owners? What is wrong with you? THAT is patriarchy, you seem very confused as to the definition.

+1. There are some very misguided posters on this thread who don't seem to grasp the concepts of misogyny or patriarchy.

1. The poster never said or implied that the “world would be better without women doctors, lawyers, or business owners”. (Although I think the world would be significantly better with fewer lawyers of any sex, but that’s neither here nor there.) You’re both putting words into her mouth to fit your narrative. I believe that’s called a straw man.

2. Capitalism IS patriarchy. There is no divorcing the two. Perhaps if you had some free time to read, think, and reflect on big ideas you would understand that.

You must need glasses, that’s what she wrote. If it’s you trying to back track now, it’s not working out very well.

Your condescending comment about having time to read is duly noted, very apropos for this conversation. You make sahms not only look like lazy liars who fluff up tasks to fill their day, but also rude and lacking tact with speaking to women who actually work. Good luck with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

Tradwives of the world actively making it worse for women everywhere. Sigh. It’s sad that people actually believe the world would be better off without women in professional positions.

I mean, women will never get ahead because of catty women like you always tearing other women down. Women who shit on SAHMs or housewives are the ultimate “pick me!” girls, but you have your heads so far up your own asses you’ll never even consider contemplating the internalized misogyny which drives your worldview.

Lean into that patriarchy, girlboss. Make the rich male overlords of the world richer and then act shocked and pretend it’s the housewives holding women down

Huh?? Like me? Did you read the post from the pp saying that the world would be better without women doctors, lawyers or business owners? What is wrong with you? THAT is patriarchy, you seem very confused as to the definition.

+1. There are some very misguided posters on this thread who don't seem to grasp the concepts of misogyny or patriarchy.

1. The poster never said or implied that the “world would be better without women doctors, lawyers, or business owners”. (Although I think the world would be significantly better with fewer lawyers of any sex, but that’s neither here nor there.) You’re both putting words into her mouth to fit your narrative. I believe that’s called a straw man.

2. Capitalism IS patriarchy. There is no divorcing the two. Perhaps if you had some free time to read, think, and reflect on big ideas you would understand that.

You must need glasses, that’s what she wrote. If it’s you trying to back track now, it’s not working out very well.

Your condescending comment about having time to read is duly noted, very apropos for this conversation. You make sahms not only look like lazy liars who fluff up tasks to fill their day, but also rude and lacking tact with speaking to women who actually work. Good luck with that.

“To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP.”

This is what she wrote. You’re pretending that statement means she thinks that the world would be better off if women didn’t hold professional positions. (I realize that the person asking her a question posed a rather sensational scenario in which all doctors, lawyers, and businessfolk are men, but at no point did this woman, or any woman in this thread, agree that such a scenario would be best. Perhaps you’re unfamiliar with the natural flow of conversation?)

You are either being disingenuous or you are not very bright. Perhaps you need a remedial English class before you bother reading for pleasure or your own personal edification.

(Finally, it’s odd you assume I am a SAHM. It’s even more odd that you expect anyone to address you with tact or respect when you are participating in this random thread for the sole purpose of putting other women down.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Adding I dislike the perspective of the two parent working family as harried and exhausted and slaves to fast food. We are none of those things and both parents have worked busy jobs throughout, with the exception of a four month maternity leave for mom.

I don't working or staying at home is inherently better or worse. I do think a teen who is busting their ass to get good grades, get into college, etc might have some questions about what their parent at home is doing all day while everyone else has a clear role during the day.

Agree with this. I typically don’t post on these, but I get really defensive when people think just because we have a dual income household we are eating crap and not paying attention to our health. Nothing could be further than the truth and we really prioritize home-cooked nutritious foods and a healthy lifestyle.

I will say I do realize we are very fortunate and both earn good incomes and are not the typical Americans living paycheck. We have had some lucky circumstances like when the kids were in daycare, we both worked for the same company that had daycare in the office and was a 10 minute commute from our house. I realize that is very rare. We also had close by grandparents that very involved in our lives when the kids were little.

I have been lucky enough to work a hybrid schedule two or three days a week from home since the kids were two and five, and now since Covid I work almost full-time remotely only going to the office about once a month or so. DH is very helpful with cooking and food prep. And we are lucky enough we are able to outsource lawn care, house cleaning etc.

My schedule is such that I can usually do the carpool to pick up from sports after school and my one teen has an outside activity that requires me to sometimes to leave the house early evenings to drive but I can usually hop on my laptop once we are there if need be.

Finally my teens tend to respect my husband’s career more even though I earn a good salary and have an impressive title because I work from home. They always just assume I can run any errand during the day. And truthfully, I sometimes can, but I think the sometimes disrespect is there whether we work or not when they are teens!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

Tradwives of the world actively making it worse for women everywhere. Sigh. It’s sad that people actually believe the world would be better off without women in professional positions.

I mean, women will never get ahead because of catty women like you always tearing other women down. Women who shit on SAHMs or housewives are the ultimate “pick me!” girls, but you have your heads so far up your own asses you’ll never even consider contemplating the internalized misogyny which drives your worldview.

Lean into that patriarchy, girlboss. Make the rich male overlords of the world richer and then act shocked and pretend it’s the housewives holding women down

Huh?? Like me? Did you read the post from the pp saying that the world would be better without women doctors, lawyers or business owners? What is wrong with you? THAT is patriarchy, you seem very confused as to the definition.

+1. There are some very misguided posters on this thread who don't seem to grasp the concepts of misogyny or patriarchy.

1. The poster never said or implied that the “world would be better without women doctors, lawyers, or business owners”. (Although I think the world would be significantly better with fewer lawyers of any sex, but that’s neither here nor there.) You’re both putting words into her mouth to fit your narrative. I believe that’s called a straw man.

2. Capitalism IS patriarchy. There is no divorcing the two. Perhaps if you had some free time to read, think, and reflect on big ideas you would understand that.

You must need glasses, that’s what she wrote. If it’s you trying to back track now, it’s not working out very well.

Your condescending comment about having time to read is duly noted, very apropos for this conversation. You make sahms not only look like lazy liars who fluff up tasks to fill their day, but also rude and lacking tact with speaking to women who actually work. Good luck with that.

“To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP.”

This is what she wrote. You’re pretending that statement means she thinks that the world would be better off if women didn’t hold professional positions. (I realize that the person asking her a question posed a rather sensational scenario in which all doctors, lawyers, and businessfolk are men, but at no point did this woman, or any woman in this thread, agree that such a scenario would be best. Perhaps you’re unfamiliar with the natural flow of conversation?)

You are either being disingenuous or you are not very bright. Perhaps you need a remedial English class before you bother reading for pleasure or your own personal edification.

(Finally, it’s odd you assume I am a SAHM. It’s even more odd that you expect anyone to address you with tact or respect when you are participating in this random thread for the sole purpose of putting other women down.)

I think that you are in the minority here. Everyone else understood that the PP was implicitly supporting the idea of women staying at home so that kids would be less of a mess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

Your work isn’t the huge contribution to society you think it is. I prefer my contribution to be focuses on raising great kids. But you do you; no one would miss you at work if you quit tomorrow, though.

FYI, the same kind of idiotic reasoning is why we have a measles outbreak. How individuals, you and those around you, make decisions does have an impact on the world we all inhabit.

What do you do?

I'm an editor.

That’s as informative as saying you’re a SAHM. What do you edit? How do “fill” your time?

Also, good luck when you’re replaced by AI. Not saying it’s better than you, but as this thread shows, our society only cares about maximizing “efficiency” and doesn’t give a rat’s ass about quality. Save your money.

??? I'm working, have a full-time, flexible job with benefits. I'm earning money, so your comment makes zero sense. And while AI is getting better, it's still shockingly unreliable. In my field, which is quite specialized, human editors like myself are correcting a lot of mistakes generated by poor editing programs (often developed in India).

Jesus Christ, you’re an editor but you lack basic reading comprehension? Maybe the unreliable AI would be an improvement after all.

“Save your money” means save (imperative) your money because you will most likely be out of a job within the next five years.

Maybe you just don't write well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

It's not "a debate" about who does more. That's obvious. Not up for debate. It isn't the SAHMommies.

Only in the US do people want a medal for bragging about how busy they are.
Leisure time is valued in most of the world

This is not about being busy. This is about how a capable, well educated woman can and ought to contribute to society beyond her nuclear family once the children are teenagers and there are no extenuating circumstances. Frankly, none of the excuses is particularly compelling. And the attempts to justify SAHMs under these circumstances are laughable. Just admit that you care more about the lifestyle than you care about contributing to society, that your higher ed degree was a bit of a waste on you, that you don't care that much about setting an example to your own kids about women holding professional status in the workforce, and that you are ultimately not that troubled by the economic risks of SAH. It's the utter intellectual dishonesty of SAHMs that amuse me.

DP here and correct, I only care about myself and my family. Don’t you? My working or not working has zero impact on society. That’s true for most careers, unless you’re a world-renowned physician or researcher or something at that level. Which I certainly am not, and I’m assuming you aren’t either just by virtue of the fact that there are very few people in those fields.

How would you feel if we went back to the 1950s and all your doctors were men, all your professors were men, all the lawyers were men, all the bankers were men, all the business owners were men, etc., etc. 99% of these professions are not "world-renowned," but I'd like to think that you are glad that you live in a world where millions women have rejected your attitude that their working has zero impact on society.

To be honest, I think kids would be less of mess, if more families had a SAHP. Have you been in a public school lately? Behavior is bananas. Largely because of poor parenting at home.

And here we have it, the white SAHM who voted for Trump because we need to make America great again...

I have the exact same opinion of Kids these days. They need a lot more involved parents to improve behavior. I did not vote for Trump.

But do you agree with the opinion that well educated mothers should be SAH even when their kids are teenagers? That's the scary part of PP's take on this. Her solution is to keep women in the home to raise the kids, even when they don't need a full-time SAH.

It isn’t a “should” issue. But I think it’s great if they are- there is value to that. Why are you acting like there is zero value to having a SAHM to older kids?

The point is that there is very little, if any, value to *society* beyond one's own family when a well educated woman spends her time, energy, and talents to benefit only children and spouse. Corollary - there is value to well educated women spending her time, energy, and talents to benefit not just her children and spouse, but to her larger community.
Perhaps there is a sense of noblesse oblige to highly educated WOTH moms, too. They realize that society has invested a lot into her academic and professional training, and that there is a moral obligation to return the favor.
I certainly feel that way, as a woman in a field that is dominated by men. There were so many people and institutions that supported me as I moved up the ranks from college to grad school and then to my chosen profession. If I dropped out to SAH - and I actually LOVE SAH and domestic chores - I know that the young women whom I directly supervise would be disappointed.
I also think that WOTH has been good for my husband and my sons. They are extremely sensitive to the work that goes on inside the house because mom isn't there to take care of it all. Dad and kids have to pitch in.
Finally I hope that my daughter will learn from our marriage that investing in her education is undeniably worth the expense. And that she will learn to choose a spouse who will support her as a mom and as someone who has value beyond household chores.

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Anonymous wrote:Well... what do you do all day when they are in school? They are teens - go back to work.

This is very insulting. Let me enlighten you:
My kids (one elementary and one middle school) have different school start and end times so it ends up they are both gone 6 hours on school days. Here is what I “do all day” as you so condescendingly put it:
Hour 1: clean up kitchen, do dishes, start first of many loads of laundry, tidy house (I clean my own house so every day I do a deep clean in one room/bathroom)
Hour 2: walk dog, switch out laundry, continue any unfinished cleaning
Hour 3: grocery store (one of 4 places I shop)
Hoot 4: put groceries away, start prepping dinner, switch out laundry
Hour 5: make appointments for family, respond to all kid-related emails (sports, bday invites, doc appointments)
Hour 6: prep sports bags/clothes/car snacks/ water bottles for kids afternoon activities

Then I go pick up my kids and my SECOND SHIFT of parenting begins. This lasts about 6-7 hours, driving them to activities, walking dog again at those locations, then at home making dinner, feeding everyone, cleaning up kitchen, helping with homework, overseeing bedtime routine, doing the social-emotional bonding they both want every night, until actual bedtime.

So this is how I look at it, and it’s how my husband describes my life: I basically have 2 part time jobs, totaling 14 hours of total work. The first is running the household and the second is the hands-on parenting.

Hope this helps everyone reading this thread to understand that SAHPs deserve respect. This is one of the hardest jobs in the world. What other job can you think of that comes with no training, very little resources or support, no sick days, no days off, no pay, and very little appreciation?

So you cook, clean, do laundry and grocery shop. Most working people do this too. Like, I don’t get why you think this is such an accomplishment?

DP. I don't understand why this is such a debate or a competition about who's better or does more. Nobody is saying all the things a SAHP does can't get done by parents working outside the home. Someone asked what the SAHM does all day and she (and others) answered the question. Why? Because working parents don't seem to believe that SAHPs are busy at all and just sit around half the day.

Goody for you for doing it all. And good for the SAHPs who do all that they do. What many SAHPs here aren't including is all their volunteer activities around their kids' schools and activities, which can be as much as part-time to full-time-work-equivalent.

…but you aren’t busy all day. There is no world where someone spends five hours a week, every week, booking appointments or answering rsvps for birthday parties. The fact that someone wrote that with a straight face is incredulous.

Parents who have never stayed at home full time with little kids do find it unfathomable.

You are being disingenuous at best, straight up lying at worst, if you believe this list of duties is accurate. Not everyone is as dumb and gullible as you seem to think.

+100. That PP with the hourly list is delusional or, possibly, super low processing speed so it does take her that long, every single day, to do those things.

5h a week making appointments and rsvping to birthday parties. 5h a week organizing sports equipment and water bottles. This person would not make it in a real job situation 😂 no wonder they need to stay home!

Good points