Three Officers and Two Paramedics Are Charged in Elijah McClain’s Death

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

I’ve placed data here on DCUM before, including local and national data, that shows police interactions overwhelmingly end without incident. For most jurisdictions, over 99.4% (on average) of these interactions contained no use of force. For those that do end in force, most (again over 90%) are deemed appropriate. These are the facts. Does bad policing happen? Absolutely. Should the majority of officers who are contributing positively take the blame? Nope.

You say my anecdote is garbage. If you’re comfortable with abusing people who don’t deserve abuse, then that’s unfortunate and there’s nothing I can say to change your mind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

I’ve placed data here on DCUM before, including local and national data, that shows police interactions overwhelmingly end without incident. For most jurisdictions, over 99.4% (on average) of these interactions contained no use of force. For those that do end in force, most (again over 90%) are deemed appropriate. These are the facts. Does bad policing happen? Absolutely. Should the majority of officers who are contributing positively take the blame? Nope.

You say my anecdote is garbage. If you’re comfortable with abusing people who don’t deserve abuse, then that’s unfortunate and there’s nothing I can say to change your mind.

Why do police wear a uniform? What is the symbolism behind a badge?

It’s to demonstrate unity and erase any sense of the individual. In the police academy a whole class can be punished for the actions of one cadet. Everything about the police as an institution is designed to reinforce this sense of collective duty and responsibility. It is completely hypocritical for police officers to ignore these aspects of their own institution just so that they can shirk responsibility and play martyr.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

I’ve placed data here on DCUM before, including local and national data, that shows police interactions overwhelmingly end without incident. For most jurisdictions, over 99.4% (on average) of these interactions contained no use of force. For those that do end in force, most (again over 90%) are deemed appropriate. These are the facts. Does bad policing happen? Absolutely. Should the majority of officers who are contributing positively take the blame? Nope.

You say my anecdote is garbage. If you’re comfortable with abusing people who don’t deserve abuse, then that’s unfortunate and there’s nothing I can say to change your mind.

Why do police wear a uniform? What is the symbolism behind a badge?

It’s to demonstrate unity and erase any sense of the individual. In the police academy a whole class can be punished for the actions of one cadet. Everything about the police as an institution is designed to reinforce this sense of collective duty and responsibility. It is completely hypocritical for police officers to ignore these aspects of their own institution just so that they can shirk responsibility and play martyr.

This is such a tremendous reach of an argument. You are aware that officers are tested as individuals during the academy, correct? That this occurs both with role-play scenarios and paper/pen tests? You’re also aware that they are judged individually as part of the FTO process? And that they receive regular, individual evaluations? They do not “erase any sense of the individual.” Your post suggests that your knowledge of academies comes from social media and/or movies.

Also, where is the shirking of responsibility and the playing martyrdom? I’ve looked over this thread and have seen none of that.

You’re welcome to hate police for no other reason than the fact they are police, of course. Just expect someone to call you on inaccurate or malicious statements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

I’ve placed data here on DCUM before, including local and national data, that shows police interactions overwhelmingly end without incident. For most jurisdictions, over 99.4% (on average) of these interactions contained no use of force. For those that do end in force, most (again over 90%) are deemed appropriate. These are the facts. Does bad policing happen? Absolutely. Should the majority of officers who are contributing positively take the blame? Nope.

You say my anecdote is garbage. If you’re comfortable with abusing people who don’t deserve abuse, then that’s unfortunate and there’s nothing I can say to change your mind.

“Deemed appropriate” as decided by the same people who commit the crimes. Police are always investigated by the police. It’s not remotely shocking that they decree their colleagues not guilty of excessive force. See the “a few bad apples spoil the bunch” analogy, because this is part of it.

I’ll say again. We need a police force, but that police force needs to work for everyone, not just certain members of a community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

I’ve placed data here on DCUM before, including local and national data, that shows police interactions overwhelmingly end without incident. For most jurisdictions, over 99.4% (on average) of these interactions contained no use of force. For those that do end in force, most (again over 90%) are deemed appropriate. These are the facts. Does bad policing happen? Absolutely. Should the majority of officers who are contributing positively take the blame? Nope.

You say my anecdote is garbage. If you’re comfortable with abusing people who don’t deserve abuse, then that’s unfortunate and there’s nothing I can say to change your mind.

“Deemed appropriate” as decided by the same people who commit the crimes. Police are always investigated by the police. It’s not remotely shocking that they decree their colleagues not guilty of excessive force. See the “a few bad apples spoil the bunch” analogy, because this is part of it.

I’ll say again. We need a police force, but that police force needs to work for everyone, not just certain members of a community.

What is your proof that isn’t occurring?

Plus, police are not “always” evaluated by other police. Cases are also sent to external jurisdictions and the State Attorney’s office. In Maryland, they are also evaluated by two different civilian boards.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Aurora police dept is an abomination. Weren't they the same who dragged the little girls out of a car because they assumed it couldn't belong to black people. They were forced to lie face down on asphalt with guns drawn on them. The car wasn't even the make and model that was reported stolen.

There was also video 2 black women took in their apt complex of a 2 cops trying to detain a white woman in a car. The white woman refused to stop and the cops were befuddled. An young black male walks by and the cops dropped dealing with the woman and began hassling him and tried to detain him. The women walked over and let the officers know they had recorded everything and they had no right to stop the young man. He was clearly terrified. One of the cops literally turned around and took off when he saw he was being recorded. The other followed.

There is so much more.

Citation please. There are over 700 officers working for Aurora PD if you didn't know.

Do you know the phrase “a few bad apples spoils the bunch”? Probably not, and if you do, you probably don’t understand what it means. You see, back in the olden times, apples were stored in barrels and if even one or two apples went bad, soon the whole barrel would be rotten. It’s the same thing in policing. How many covert or overt acts of racism by the police have occurred where McClain was murdered? How many “good” cops looked the other way? How many “good” supervisors quietly squashed stories or investigations to protect the bad cops? How many good cops were retaliated against? Now repeat that across the country. There’s no accountability. Black people are just left to dangle on their own, their stories pretty unbelieved or waved away.

We need the police. We need a police force that works for everyone, not just to the benefit of some.

My husband is a police officer. He has been criticized for not doing more to turn in bad cops, even though he has logically and clearly explained that he works on a shift of 5... all honest, hard-working officers who consciously try to make good decisions. He was once accused openly in front of many people for not stopping something that happened across his county among officers he doesn't even know. There are 1,800 officers in his department. He is apparently personally responsible for what all of them do, regardless of whether or not he has ever met them.

That's the problem with your "bad apples" analogy that you try so hard to insult a PP above. Those apples are stored in MANY different barrels. The apples in barrel #245 are not responsible for the applies in barrel #742, but yet that's exactly the mindset we are using when we judge police today. You are only assuming there are legions of "good" cops looking the other way and "good" supervisors squashing stories. Data actually suggests otherwise, especially when you look at use-of-force statistics. The overwhelming majority of police intereactions are actually of the helpful variety, not the type that unfortunately make the news.

This story on this thread is about bad apples. Condemn the bad ones, but let the other ones stand on their own merits.

You’re trying to hard to defend those who cover for bad cops.

Again: you have no proof that officers are inherently bad. That’s the only explanation that would work to explain how all your barrels would be spoiled. There is literally no proof, and you know it. I’m not defending “bad cops.” I’m defending people who went into this profession honorably who are now being held accountable for stuff that happens counties or states away.

If we go down this road, be prepared to talk about how all teachers are inherently bad, all doctors are inherently bad, etc. I can find bad in all groups of people, so if one bad apple spoils an entire profession…

You have no proof that they aren't inherently bad. For the sake of argument, maybe your husband is a "good" cop but if he was with other cops who stopped a black man for no reason other than the color of his skin and who put him in a choke hold, what would your husband do? Would he tell his fellow cops to stop? Would he report them? We all know that he would do absolutely nothing

I’m not taking your bait. No, “we all” don’t know that. I also know that regional statistics in the DMV area also don’t support your bias and hate. Your tone alone suggests that no data, nor documented anecdotes, will change your mind. I’ve been down this road on DCUM before and have noticed that people who want to hate will simply continue to hate, no matter how unwarranted their feelings may be.

To get this thread back on track: condemn the officers who should be condemned. Don’t blame 800,000 for the actions of a few.

Honest questions: do you think the cops that did this thought they could get away with it because they were cops? I cant imagine doing something like that- surrounded by other people and plentiful evidence- and think that I was 1) doing the right thing and 2) if I thought it was wrong, not thinking I wouldnt get caught and YET......this is where the birth and culture of policing in America is most of the problem and it has only gotten worse by the militarization of the policing in America.

I can’t presume to know what went through their minds. I’ve already stated above that I don’t condone their actions. What I also don’t condone is the blanket “all police are bad” nonsense in which certain posters on DCUM love to engage. It’s this type of misplaced anger that puts good officers in danger. Look at local police departments. They are severely understaffed, so officers are responding to calls without sufficient backup. They are working extra shifts, so they are regularly tired. My husband had been spit on for doing nothing more than getting out of his car. He has been pulled away from helping others, including administering first aid, by “well meaning” people. He has had threats put on his car. He is not the enemy.

Your questions above insinuate that he is, that somehow merely suggesting that officers are not a monolith somehow is equal to supporting the actions of officers that day.

I don’t operate that way. I don’t make assumptions about groups of people.

Cool story. Policing in america is dysfuctional, add in the well documented racism and there you have it . Your anecdote is garbage next to the data.

I’ve placed data here on DCUM before, including local and national data, that shows police interactions overwhelmingly end without incident. For most jurisdictions, over 99.4% (on average) of these interactions contained no use of force. For those that do end in force, most (again over 90%) are deemed appropriate. These are the facts. Does bad policing happen? Absolutely. Should the majority of officers who are contributing positively take the blame? Nope.

You say my anecdote is garbage. If you’re comfortable with abusing people who don’t deserve abuse, then that’s unfortunate and there’s nothing I can say to change your mind.

“Deemed appropriate” as decided by the same people who commit the crimes. Police are always investigated by the police. It’s not remotely shocking that they decree their colleagues not guilty of excessive force. See the “a few bad apples spoil the bunch” analogy, because this is part of it.

I’ll say again. We need a police force, but that police force needs to work for everyone, not just certain members of a community.

What is your proof that isn’t occurring?

Plus, police are not “always” evaluated by other police. Cases are also sent to external jurisdictions and the State Attorney’s office. In Maryland, they are also evaluated by two different civilian boards.

You mean prosecutors who charge the criminals cops arrest? Im not sure of the civilian boards after the 2021 police accountability act that requires each county to have its own review board with the only caveat being that active police cant be on the board. PG county civilian review board is no longer operational for anything past 6/30 of this year and it goes to the new police accountability review starting 7/1. There is no additional info on PG website about who is on it, etc. Baltimore City civilian board asked to be used to meet the new requirements and it was denied. Most boards are comprised of those elected by the County Exec. In Baltimore Co (https://www.baltimorecountymd.gov/county-news/2022/09/13/olszewski-nominates-police-accountability-board-members) 4 of the 9 have direct ties to law enforcement- either work with the department or as a firefighter/EMT.

[Anonymous]

I think there are generally hard situations where officers make a bad decision and then there are cases like this that are just so shocking that it would appear to me that all policing is fundamentally sick on some level. This is one of those cases.

This case has shades of Kelly Thomas but the dirt bag cops got a not guilty verdict there on worse facts for the cops.

I think that whatever presumption or benefit of the doubt police are legally getting needs to be walked back if this kind of situation keeps happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think there are generally hard situations where officers make a bad decision and then there are cases like this that are just so shocking that it would appear to me that all policing is fundamentally sick on some level. This is one of those cases.

This case has shades of Kelly Thomas but the dirt bag cops got a not guilty verdict there on worse facts for the cops.

I think that whatever presumption or benefit of the doubt police are legally getting needs to be walked back if this kind of situation keeps happening.

And it DOES keep happening. It does. Black innocent or black people guilty, at best, of misdemeanors keep getting murdered by police.

Not every person in the Washington Post database of gunshot victims of the police is Black and some are probably “justified,” but this paragraph should be instructive for the cop’s wife whose spouse and his colleagues can do no wrong (italics mine):

“After Michael Brown, an unarmed Black man, was killed in 2014 by police in Ferguson, Mo., a Post investigation found that the FBI undercounted fatal police shootings by more than half. This is because reporting by police departments is voluntary and many departments fail to do so.” https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/investigations/police-shootings-database/

There. is. a. problem. and police and their advocates pretending that there is not is entrenching the problem. “Although half of the people shot and killed by police are White, Black Americans are shot at a disproportionate rate. They account for less than 13 percent of the U.S. population, but are killed by police at more than twice the rate of White Americans. Hispanic Americans are also killed by police at a disproportionate rate.” And that database doesn’t even count the people who are killed by the police or their actions like George Floyd, Sandra Bland and Elijah McClain, nor does it cover other sorts of police abuse of their power like planting evidence and raping people. Daniel Holtzclaw is an extreme example, but he’s probably not the only one.

But sure. The police force is a pure as the driven snow and anyone with any evidence to the contrary is crazy or something.

[Anonymous]

18:18 again.

Just a few days ago a Colorado police officer parked his cruiser, with a suspect in it, on train tracks. The cruiser and the woman inside were hit by a train. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/video-train-hits-police-car-woman-handcuffed-back-seat-fort-lupton-colorado/

Parks her on train tracks. On train tracks. Presumably the place where everyone knows not to park and he left a suspect parked there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are generally hard situations where officers make a bad decision and then there are cases like this that are just so shocking that it would appear to me that all policing is fundamentally sick on some level. This is one of those cases.

This case has shades of Kelly Thomas but the dirt bag cops got a not guilty verdict there on worse facts for the cops.

I think that whatever presumption or benefit of the doubt police are legally getting needs to be walked back if this kind of situation keeps happening.

And it DOES keep happening. It does. Black innocent or black people guilty, at best, of misdemeanors keep getting murdered by police.

Not every person in the Washington Post database of gunshot victims of the police is Black and some are probably “justified,” but this paragraph should be instructive for the cop’s wife whose spouse and his colleagues can do no wrong (italics mine):

“After Michael Brown, an unarmed Black man, was killed in 2014 by police in Ferguson, Mo., a Post investigation found that the FBI undercounted fatal police shootings by more than half. This is because reporting by police departments is voluntary and many departments fail to do so.” https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/investigations/police-shootings-database/

There. is. a. problem. and police and their advocates pretending that there is not is entrenching the problem. “Although half of the people shot and killed by police are White, Black Americans are shot at a disproportionate rate. They account for less than 13 percent of the U.S. population, but are killed by police at more than twice the rate of White Americans. Hispanic Americans are also killed by police at a disproportionate rate.” And that database doesn’t even count the people who are killed by the police or their actions like George Floyd, Sandra Bland and Elijah McClain, nor does it cover other sorts of police abuse of their power like planting evidence and raping people. Daniel Holtzclaw is an extreme example, but he’s probably not the only one.

But sure. The police force is a pure as the driven snow and anyone with any evidence to the contrary is crazy or something.

Officer's wife here. Literally NOBODY, including me, is saying that a police force is as "pure as the driven snow." Let's stop the hyperbole, shall we? It doesn't help your argument at all. I have already... repeatedly.. said that there are officer-involved shootings in which the officer is CLEARLY in the wrong. What I take great offense to is the notion that 800,000 officers should be held as inherently bad because of the actions of the few.

There were 1,021 officer-involved shootings in 2021, of which 32 were of unarmed citizens. (This information came from the Washington Post database.) That's in a population of over 333,000,000. There are over 800,000 police officers in the United States, and the majority of them have not even touched a weapon in months except for mandatory training. Over 99% of police interactions have no use-of-force. Do horrific shootings occur? Of course. Nobody... again: nobody... is denying that. The issue I have is with blatantly ignoring the facts and assuming officers are evil. It's not true and it's actually dangerous rhetoric that leads to understaffed shifts.

I've said this before: you are welcome to hate police, but if you post inaccurate information, I will be here to correct it.

[Anonymous]

This case is heart breaking. It should have never taken so long for them to be indicted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:18:18 again.

Just a few days ago a Colorado police officer parked his cruiser, with a suspect in it, on train tracks. The cruiser and the woman inside were hit by a train. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/video-train-hits-police-car-woman-handcuffed-back-seat-fort-lupton-colorado/

Parks her on train tracks. On train tracks. Presumably the place where everyone knows not to park and he left a suspect parked there.

While this is a great example of stupid and indefensible policing, it didn't occur as you posted above. The officer parked the car on the tracks after chasing a road-rage suspect. She stopped her car just beyond the tracks. He then placed her in his car as they continued the investigation. That's when the train hit.

Is it stupid, neglectful, and worthy of full prosecution? Of course. Was it nefarious, as you suggest? That's harder to prove.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are generally hard situations where officers make a bad decision and then there are cases like this that are just so shocking that it would appear to me that all policing is fundamentally sick on some level. This is one of those cases.

This case has shades of Kelly Thomas but the dirt bag cops got a not guilty verdict there on worse facts for the cops.

I think that whatever presumption or benefit of the doubt police are legally getting needs to be walked back if this kind of situation keeps happening.

And it DOES keep happening. It does. Black innocent or black people guilty, at best, of misdemeanors keep getting murdered by police.

Not every person in the Washington Post database of gunshot victims of the police is Black and some are probably “justified,” but this paragraph should be instructive for the cop’s wife whose spouse and his colleagues can do no wrong (italics mine):

“After Michael Brown, an unarmed Black man, was killed in 2014 by police in Ferguson, Mo., a Post investigation found that the FBI undercounted fatal police shootings by more than half. This is because reporting by police departments is voluntary and many departments fail to do so.” https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/investigations/police-shootings-database/

There. is. a. problem. and police and their advocates pretending that there is not is entrenching the problem. “Although half of the people shot and killed by police are White, Black Americans are shot at a disproportionate rate. They account for less than 13 percent of the U.S. population, but are killed by police at more than twice the rate of White Americans. Hispanic Americans are also killed by police at a disproportionate rate.” And that database doesn’t even count the people who are killed by the police or their actions like George Floyd, Sandra Bland and Elijah McClain, nor does it cover other sorts of police abuse of their power like planting evidence and raping people. Daniel Holtzclaw is an extreme example, but he’s probably not the only one.

But sure. The police force is a pure as the driven snow and anyone with any evidence to the contrary is crazy or something.

Officer's wife here. Literally NOBODY, including me, is saying that a police force is as "pure as the driven snow." Let's stop the hyperbole, shall we? It doesn't help your argument at all. I have already... repeatedly.. said that there are officer-involved shootings in which the officer is CLEARLY in the wrong. What I take great offense to is the notion that 800,000 officers should be held as inherently bad because of the actions of the few.

There were 1,021 officer-involved shootings in 2021, of which 32 were of unarmed citizens. (This information came from the Washington Post database.) That's in a population of over 333,000,000. There are over 800,000 police officers in the United States, and the majority of them have not even touched a weapon in months except for mandatory training. Over 99% of police interactions have no use-of-force. Do horrific shootings occur? Of course. Nobody... again: nobody... is denying that. The issue I have is with blatantly ignoring the facts and assuming officers are evil. It's not true and it's actually dangerous rhetoric that leads to understaffed shifts.

I've said this before: you are welcome to hate police, but if you post inaccurate information, I will be here to correct it.

Honestly, lady, lol. You have been on here trying to claim that the police forces in this country aren’t riddled with violent and racist people who abuse their power. You refuse to acknowledge that “good” cops looking the other way does, in fact, make them bad cops. You seem like a nice enough person but I don’t think you have any distance on this issue nor can you step back and examine how the experience of policing looks and feels for people in those communities who get brutalized in a way that you, a wife of a police officer, and I, a White upper middle class woman, are hugely unlikely to ever experience.

Breonna Taylor and Amir Locke say hello.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are generally hard situations where officers make a bad decision and then there are cases like this that are just so shocking that it would appear to me that all policing is fundamentally sick on some level. This is one of those cases.

This case has shades of Kelly Thomas but the dirt bag cops got a not guilty verdict there on worse facts for the cops.

I think that whatever presumption or benefit of the doubt police are legally getting needs to be walked back if this kind of situation keeps happening.

And it DOES keep happening. It does. Black innocent or black people guilty, at best, of misdemeanors keep getting murdered by police.

Not every person in the Washington Post database of gunshot victims of the police is Black and some are probably “justified,” but this paragraph should be instructive for the cop’s wife whose spouse and his colleagues can do no wrong (italics mine):

“After Michael Brown, an unarmed Black man, was killed in 2014 by police in Ferguson, Mo., a Post investigation found that the FBI undercounted fatal police shootings by more than half. This is because reporting by police departments is voluntary and many departments fail to do so.” https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/investigations/police-shootings-database/

There. is. a. problem. and police and their advocates pretending that there is not is entrenching the problem. “Although half of the people shot and killed by police are White, Black Americans are shot at a disproportionate rate. They account for less than 13 percent of the U.S. population, but are killed by police at more than twice the rate of White Americans. Hispanic Americans are also killed by police at a disproportionate rate.” And that database doesn’t even count the people who are killed by the police or their actions like George Floyd, Sandra Bland and Elijah McClain, nor does it cover other sorts of police abuse of their power like planting evidence and raping people. Daniel Holtzclaw is an extreme example, but he’s probably not the only one.

But sure. The police force is a pure as the driven snow and anyone with any evidence to the contrary is crazy or something.

Officer's wife here. Literally NOBODY, including me, is saying that a police force is as "pure as the driven snow." Let's stop the hyperbole, shall we? It doesn't help your argument at all. I have already... repeatedly.. said that there are officer-involved shootings in which the officer is CLEARLY in the wrong. What I take great offense to is the notion that 800,000 officers should be held as inherently bad because of the actions of the few.

There were 1,021 officer-involved shootings in 2021, of which 32 were of unarmed citizens. (This information came from the Washington Post database.) That's in a population of over 333,000,000. There are over 800,000 police officers in the United States, and the majority of them have not even touched a weapon in months except for mandatory training. Over 99% of police interactions have no use-of-force. Do horrific shootings occur? Of course. Nobody... again: nobody... is denying that. The issue I have is with blatantly ignoring the facts and assuming officers are evil. It's not true and it's actually dangerous rhetoric that leads to understaffed shifts.

I've said this before: you are welcome to hate police, but if you post inaccurate information, I will be here to correct it.

Honestly, lady, lol. You have been on here trying to claim that the police forces in this country aren’t riddled with violent and racist people who abuse their power. You refuse to acknowledge that “good” cops looking the other way does, in fact, make them bad cops. You seem like a nice enough person but I don’t think you have any distance on this issue nor can you step back and examine how the experience of policing looks and feels for people in those communities who get brutalized in a way that you, a wife of a police officer, and I, a White upper middle class woman, are hugely unlikely to ever experience.

Breonna Taylor and Amir Locke say hello.

Nope, I’m sorry. I will not hate people because somebody on DCUM told me to. You’re argument rests on a fallacy: that officers routinely look the other way. Where’s your proof, other than a strong desire to make somebody (anybody?) responsible for society’s ills?

If you want to view the world through an “inherently evil” lens, that is your choice. The world may be better served if you do something to make it better, however. Volunteer through a citizen’s academy. Attend community policing activities. Do ride-alongs. Participate in their service opportunities and help communities. Get to know your local police department. I am 100% confident you won’t be so quick to condemn them all once you meet them.

You are condemning some good people who are working toward change. Seems counterproductive to me.