Why are so many convinced that authoritarianism is "freedom"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every Trumper/MAGA/Q person says they want to "restore freedom." Why are so many convinced that their authoritarian policies of firing scientists, targeting universities, banning critical race theory, deporting people without any due process, arresting judges etc. are about "freedom"?

Also when was the country actually free and when did cease to be free, in their view?

I remember being told we couldn’t be in public spaces unless we gave into authoritarian control and took a shot that didn’t stop infection or transmission of a disease.

You mean that type of “freedom”?

Nice manipulation of the facts.

But let's pretend that was a sign of authoritarian control. How does your once in a century, dealing with a pandemic, caution compare to sending people to human rights violating maximum security prisons in another country?

Why does everyone forget that Covid and the lock down began under Trump? March 2020 - Jan 2021 Trump was POTUS.

And they were extended for an unreasonable period thereafter by the Biden Administration - when other countries around the world took far less drastic measures or lifted restrictions far sooner. The evidence is overwhelming that the Biden Administration screwed up.

-1. I mean, FCPS was one of the last school districts to go back in person— in the country. And my DD was back in a HS classroom about 6 weeks after Biden was inaugurated. Wolftrap had a summer season in 2021, although they sold at reduced capacity for early shows as they phased back in. My son was HS class of 2020 and got to start college in person at a SLAC, but it wasn’t normal. Class of 2021 had actual graduations in May 2021 (but many used places like Jiffy Lube Live) and started college in a generally normal environment. I flew with my kids to see their aunt in April 2021 once we were all vaxxed. And we spent a week with their grandparents in June 2021.

Please explain the rationale for “unreasonably long” closures after 1/20/2020.

What restrictions were “unreasonably long”.

Should be unreasonably long closures after 1/20/2021.

And BTW— soldiers get so many vaccines, in addition to being required to have the standard schedule. A unit with a Covid, measles or even flu outbreak isn’t mission ready. In 2021 requiring soldier who are lining in very close quarters on subs and ships to vaxx isn’t loss of freedom. It’s mission readiness. In fall 2020, before we had vaccines, colleges stuffing kids in dorms were so overwhelmed some had to close and go online. Not an option for the military. They needed to get vaxxed.

[Anonymous]

We have to restore freedom in workplaces and in the military - huh? They're authoritarian structures by design. Before the Covid vaccine conservatives never objected to that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You want to highlight BLM as some kind of righteous movement? The organization itself was run by a couple of huge grifters. Yeah let's get rid of police and just have....riots? The movement didn't accomplish anything useful.

Which is why most Democrats hated BLM. When we heard “defund the police” we thought: something doesn’t sound right. We used logic.

When are Republicans going to do the same? Please, for our country’s future, stop being loyal to this new authoritarianism.

LOL, wut?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every Trumper/MAGA/Q person says they want to "restore freedom." Why are so many convinced that their authoritarian policies of firing scientists, targeting universities, banning critical race theory, deporting people without any due process, arresting judges etc. are about "freedom"?

Also when was the country actually free and when did cease to be free, in their view?

I remember being told we couldn’t be in public spaces unless we gave into authoritarian control and took a shot that didn’t stop infection or transmission of a disease.

You mean that type of “freedom”?

Nice manipulation of the facts.

But let's pretend that was a sign of authoritarian control. How does your once in a century, dealing with a pandemic, caution compare to sending people to human rights violating maximum security prisons in another country?

Why does everyone forget that Covid and the lock down began under Trump? March 2020 - Jan 2021 Trump was POTUS.

It wasn’t Trump or republicans that demanded that you had to get a shot to keep your job, carry the card with you to get into public spaces, attend schools, go to college etc.

The authoritarians said we will allow you have this freedom if you give up that freedom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every Trumper/MAGA/Q person says they want to "restore freedom." Why are so many convinced that their authoritarian policies of firing scientists, targeting universities, banning critical race theory, deporting people without any due process, arresting judges etc. are about "freedom"?

Also when was the country actually free and when did cease to be free, in their view?

I remember being told we couldn’t be in public spaces unless we gave into authoritarian control and took a shot that didn’t stop infection or transmission of a disease.

You mean that type of “freedom”?

Nice manipulation of the facts.

But let's pretend that was a sign of authoritarian control. How does your once in a century, dealing with a pandemic, caution compare to sending people to human rights violating maximum security prisons in another country?

Why does everyone forget that Covid and the lock down began under Trump? March 2020 - Jan 2021 Trump was POTUS.

And they were extended for an unreasonable period thereafter by the Biden Administration - when other countries around the world took far less drastic measures or lifted restrictions far sooner. The evidence is overwhelming that the Biden Administration screwed up.

You have memory loss. Most lockdowns were lifted within a few months of Biden’s administration. And it was also up to local governments. My kids were back at school in Spring 2021. Typical MAGA making up history.

[Anonymous]

When COVID started, I saw with my own eyes what was happening around the world. A *lot* of people got every sick, and a lot died. We closed down. We developed vaccines. We absolutely needed to establish herd immunity. Lives were saved, maybe even yours, but of course we'll never know if it would've been you for sure because so many of us got vaccinated that we were able to reopen ('you' being anyone reading this). None of that is opinion. Saving lives required the temporary inconveniences of a dangerous once-in-a-hundred-years worldwide pandemic.

Now to today...
Actions threatening freedom of the press are not required.
Actions threatening freedom of expression are not required.
Actions targeting people without due process are not required.
Ignoring court rulings is not required.

We are not at war. We are not experiencing a pandemic. We are not in any immediate danger. Therefore, extreme measures are not required. Trump is choosing to remove civil discourse from our government and society and instead imposing the will of the few on the whole.
Never in my lifetime did I expect our system of checks and balances to collapse. We are close to a tipping point - either the administration is reigned in by Congress and the Supreme Court or it isn't. Either they are permitted to disregard laws and court rulings or they are forced back into balance.
I worry which way it will go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They think freedom means white men are at the top of society instead of freedom meaning everyone gets to try to be at the top of society.

This. Freedom for me, but not for thee. They think that as long as they are in the MAGA club they will get ahead while the people they don't like will be downtrodden. But they don't understand that Trump doesn't actually give a shit about the average supporter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They think freedom means white men are at the top of society instead of freedom meaning everyone gets to try to be at the top of society.

I think MAGA is civic nationalist more so than white supremacist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every Trumper/MAGA/Q person says they want to "restore freedom." Why are so many convinced that their authoritarian policies of firing scientists, targeting universities, banning critical race theory, deporting people without any due process, arresting judges etc. are about "freedom"?

Also when was the country actually free and when did cease to be free, in their view?

I remember being told we couldn’t be in public spaces unless we gave into authoritarian control and took a shot that didn’t stop infection or transmission of a disease. L

You mean that type of “freedom”?

You remember wrong.

+1 You remember wrong.
Just because you don’t care if you get Covid doesn’t mean everyone else has to be exposed to your choices.
Businesses can require masks during a pandemic. If you don’t like it? Go to another business. Businesses, especially those in healthcare, can require vaccinations. If you don’t want the vaccinations, don’t work in health care or for that business. Businesses can require a drug test for employment. Don’t like it? Don’t work there.
You have the freedom. You just want to “stick it to the libs” and for cis white men to be back on top without any fair and equal competition from women, other races, lgbtq+ people. It’s disgusts me how many people want to go back to the US in the 1820’s.

[Anonymous]

My +1 you remember wrong was to agree with the previous “you remember wrong” poster. It didn’t save the original statements like I wanted. Sorry.

[Anonymous]

"Conservatism [MAGA] consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You want to highlight BLM as some kind of righteous movement? The organization itself was run by a couple of huge grifters. Yeah let's get rid of police and just have....riots? The movement didn't accomplish anything useful.

Which is why most Democrats hated BLM. When we heard “defund the police” we thought: something doesn’t sound right. We used logic.

When are Republicans going to do the same? Please, for our country’s future, stop being loyal to this new authoritarianism.

+100 refreshing to hear simple logic applied looking backward and forward. Many people out there who still identify as Republicans or Democrats continuing to deny the obvious truth in front of them.

Don't agree with the hate BLM notion. There is much more good behind that movement than bad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every Trumper/MAGA/Q person says they want to "restore freedom." Why are so many convinced that their authoritarian policies of firing scientists, targeting universities, banning critical race theory, deporting people without any due process, arresting judges etc. are about "freedom"?

Also when was the country actually free and when did cease to be free, in their view?

I remember being told we couldn’t be in public spaces unless we gave into authoritarian control and took a shot that didn’t stop infection or transmission of a disease.

You mean that type of “freedom”?

Nice manipulation of the facts.

But let's pretend that was a sign of authoritarian control. How does your once in a century, dealing with a pandemic, caution compare to sending people to human rights violating maximum security prisons in another country?

Why does everyone forget that Covid and the lock down began under Trump? March 2020 - Jan 2021 Trump was POTUS.

And they were extended for an unreasonable period thereafter by the Biden Administration - when other countries around the world took far less drastic measures or lifted restrictions far sooner. The evidence is overwhelming that the Biden Administration screwed up.

-1. I mean, FCPS was one of the last school districts to go back in person— in the country. And my DD was back in a HS classroom about 6 weeks after Biden was inaugurated. Wolftrap had a summer season in 2021, although they sold at reduced capacity for early shows as they phased back in. My son was HS class of 2020 and got to start college in person at a SLAC, but it wasn’t normal. Class of 2021 had actual graduations in May 2021 (but many used places like Jiffy Lube Live) and started college in a generally normal environment. I flew with my kids to see their aunt in April 2021 once we were all vaxxed. And we spent a week with their grandparents in June 2021.

Please explain the rationale for “unreasonably long” closures after 1/20/2020.

What restrictions were “unreasonably long”.

Should be unreasonably long closures after 1/20/2021.

And BTW— soldiers get so many vaccines, in addition to being required to have the standard schedule. A unit with a Covid, measles or even flu outbreak isn’t mission ready. In 2021 requiring soldier who are lining in very close quarters on subs and ships to vaxx isn’t loss of freedom. It’s mission readiness. In fall 2020, before we had vaccines, colleges stuffing kids in dorms were so overwhelmed some had to close and go online. Not an option for the military. They needed to get vaxxed.

This. Agree 100%. When deploying to the Middle East we had to get anthrax vaccines, or when on other deployments often it was typhoid, yellow fever, japanese encephalitis and so on, depending on what was prevalent and a risk.

Unvaccinated soldiers pose a risk to the readiness of the unit. No vaccine: Not mission ready, not mission capable, not deployable. Period.

Get the damn vaccine.

Or, better yet, if you're so prone to weak-brained conspiracy theory BS and propaganda, you are also a risk to the mission. If you actually believe all the disinfo claiming things like "the vaccines are more dangerous than COVID" then god knows what other stupid shit you believe and you probably have no business serving because you are a weak link who could undermine the unit.

[Anonymous]

Gun rights is the litmus test

Anybody taking gun rights is a suspected authoritarian.

Zero authoritarians are pro gun rights

100 percent of authoritarians are pro gun rights for the population

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They think freedom means white men are at the top of society instead of freedom meaning everyone gets to try to be at the top of society.

I think MAGA is civic nationalist more so than white supremacist.

No they aren't. Civic nationalism would embrace diversity and inclusivity. MAGA does not.