12 yo daughter groped at school...at least twice

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You have to tell the police. They can at the very least scare the sh!t out of the boy and his family. They will do an investigation and if nobody else saw it, they can't really do anything (he said/she said case) but it will at least show you won't put up with this crap.

Depending on the actual details, you are seriously over-estimating what the police will respond to. This will be referred back to the school unless it was an adult unless it was really clearly serious. I'm not saying that's fair or right, just saying that's reality in terms of what the police will come out for, especially since it happened days/weeks ago. Maybe if it happens again they'll come out.

However OP CAN and should file a police report, that they have to take at a station. But she'd need to know a lot more detail than what she's shared here. And really the school is the first line of contact in terms of finding out what they've done, if anything, already.

[Anonymous]

I would encourage her to smack his hand away if being diplomatic is useless. And also FYI, a very effective technique if a guy has a hold of you, it to jam your thumb up his hmmhmm. He will immediately jump off you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with the PP who said "Define grope" for us who you're asking advice of. Also was it the same kid who did it the 2nd time?

For starters, any info she hasn't shared yet she needs to share with you. So if you don't know details of the "groping", tell her you are worried it will continue if she doesn't tell you more. Maybe also explain to her that her trust in you is so important to you... AND you have a job as her parent to protect her. That you have to be able to do that or you're worried she'll feel worse and worse. See how that goes.

I also wonder if whoever groped her told her that if she tells on them, they'll do it more and tell the whole school or tell everyone lies about her. If she's anxious and quiet already, abusers (both child and adult abusers) are often good at sniffing out who will not fight back or stand up for themselves. So maybe also tell her that even if whoever did it threatened her, they are relying on her silence to keep doing it to her and others. That the only way to interrupt it is to address it, even though that also can be stressful.

I'm same PP, if she does tell you more or you are ready to reach out to school, if you can, go to the school to talk to the teacher and ask both what was said and also what the school's protocol is for such behaviors. The teacher likely can't or won't tell you which kid it was or what specific follow up happened because they're not supposed to talk about other kids (sometimes they do anyway though). But asking what the protocol is is important, because that's how you know what follow up is supposed to happen and also ask what would happen in their protocol if she's groped again. AND... also ask a Dean or Vice Principal or Behavior Dean (whoever handles kids breaking the rules overall) what the protocols are. Get a 2nd answer because sometimes if the teacher hasn't followed up, they don't tell you all the facts about what they were *supposed* to do because they didn't do it. So get the info from someone else as well.

If you can't go to the school in person, call the school, ask for the emails of her teacher and whoever handles behavior, and email them these questions. But I do understand you wanting to try to get your daughter to a point where you have her "consent" to reach out, but you really may have to anyway.

How is it going finding her a therapist? When is the last time she had one and what if anything was she diagnosed with? Just asking because it might also help us with ideas for you about how to get her to understand and accept you talking to the school.

The school’s “protocol” is obviously to do nothing, lest it be accused of mistreating the assailant. I’d be surprised if the teacher isn’t a mandated reporter. You need to be the one defining the “protocol” here. You need to be such a problem they’ll do anything to placate you.

You mean well, but as someone who's worked in schools in the DMV around discipline, you are giving horrible advice. If you really think it's functional for a school system to discipline each kid by what parents define as the protocol, you're nuts. OP must first find out what the school's protocol is, then find out if it's been followed, and then act from there. Running in and telling them what they should do... good luck with that without being informed by what the district or school's written rules and protocols are first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The “devious licks” thing is old, I remember getting the same thing a few years ago and some idiot kid actually vandalized a schoo bathroom and “blamed it on TikTok”.
I don’t let my kids go in tiktok.
Op, please speak with the school immediately and advocate for your child. Simply because she is shy and doesn’t want a fuss made doesn’t mean she needs to sit back and take abuse and assault. And this is assault. Please get her help!

Just FYI - don't be naive. If your kids have access to YouTube, then they're seeing every single thing posted on TikTok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wanted to give you some insight into what goes through a shy depressed girls brain when she is being sexually harassed like this. I was your daughter, and I was sexually harassed repeatedly in my teens and twenties. In my teens a swim teammate (boy, it was coed) pulled my swimsuit down around my waist every single day for weeks. I was too embarrassed to ask my mom for a new “swim team” type suit and wore my beach suit. He would swim up behind me. Everyone knew, no one did anything.

I was big and strong. I could have decked the kid, held him underwater, kicked him in the nuts. I did all those things to my big brother! But all I wanted to do was disappear. Having attention called to me was more painful than the harassment. There is also a voice in your head that says “maybe this is okay - maybe he’s allowed to do this - maybe if I say something everyone will laugh at me for making a fuss.” That voice in my head allowed me to be groped on buses, trains, streets and airplanes for the next 10 years.

That voice prevented me from saying a decisive clear NO in my 20s when I didn’t want to sleep with an ex boyfriend who invited me over for a movie.

You don’t need to get her self defense class, though I’m sure that is great. You need to figure out how to change the voice in her head that says other people have rights to her body, and that people paying attention to her will humiliate her. That’s what is preventing her from standing up for herself.

Good luck to you and your daughter, OP.

This is an extraordinarily important post from a very brave poster who has obviously made great strides in her own development. Women have a right to bodily integrity. They are not playthings or amusements for psychopaths. They don’t need to apologize. They need to get mad, really mad, and act on that anger in precise and targeted ways. This poster is right that a change of heart and self image will help. Martial arts can be a tool toward that, but there are other avenues as well. Anything that involves accomplishment can build self-esteem. This poster also makes the critical point that the victim is not at fault and bears no responsibility for their trauma. Saying that the victim “should have” done this or that ignores this. But there is an opportunity now to make an example of the attacker in this case, demonstrating to the victim how much power she really has, and it would be a shame to waste that.

💯

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would consider switching schools, but overall, she's doing well. I'd like to give the school a chance to address. School is ok, but no middle schools are amazing in this area.

What have you done to give the school a chance to address the situation? So far all we know is that your daughter told the teacher. You don't know what your daughter actually said because you weren't there, and an embarrassed and anxious child may not have communicated the gravity of the offense very well. The teacher may not understand what actually happened or how much this affected your daughter. That is why you must step in as the parent and speak to the principal and counselor and make an official report and follow up repeatedly.

Great advice, but OP needs way more specific detail from DD before she does that. Going in with only what she's said here will not get her far at all. The school can't identify the offender, but OP can report who her daughter says it was and find out in general what the protocol is, and ask whether there's been follow up with the student or not. She has a right to the answer to that question, even if they can't/won't tell her exactly what the follow up was.

OP should also ask for clarity, and follow up with emails to the counselor/teacher/principal documenting all these conversations, OP should find out what the school commits to doing if it happens again or that student or others further harass/assault/bully DD.

If there's no written record of these conversations, "They didn't happen." Meaning, if more happens and the school fails to act, OP you need to have a record of what you'd already brought to their attention that they didn't act on if you need to raise it to higher levels to get action.

Good luck OP, it's an awful situation but it's so important you act and model for your DD action.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with the PP who said "Define grope" for us who you're asking advice of. Also was it the same kid who did it the 2nd time?

For starters, any info she hasn't shared yet she needs to share with you. So if you don't know details of the "groping", tell her you are worried it will continue if she doesn't tell you more. Maybe also explain to her that her trust in you is so important to you... AND you have a job as her parent to protect her. That you have to be able to do that or you're worried she'll feel worse and worse. See how that goes.

I also wonder if whoever groped her told her that if she tells on them, they'll do it more and tell the whole school or tell everyone lies about her. If she's anxious and quiet already, abusers (both child and adult abusers) are often good at sniffing out who will not fight back or stand up for themselves. So maybe also tell her that even if whoever did it threatened her, they are relying on her silence to keep doing it to her and others. That the only way to interrupt it is to address it, even though that also can be stressful.

I'm same PP, if she does tell you more or you are ready to reach out to school, if you can, go to the school to talk to the teacher and ask both what was said and also what the school's protocol is for such behaviors. The teacher likely can't or won't tell you which kid it was or what specific follow up happened because they're not supposed to talk about other kids (sometimes they do anyway though). But asking what the protocol is is important, because that's how you know what follow up is supposed to happen and also ask what would happen in their protocol if she's groped again. AND... also ask a Dean or Vice Principal or Behavior Dean (whoever handles kids breaking the rules overall) what the protocols are. Get a 2nd answer because sometimes if the teacher hasn't followed up, they don't tell you all the facts about what they were *supposed* to do because they didn't do it. So get the info from someone else as well.

If you can't go to the school in person, call the school, ask for the emails of her teacher and whoever handles behavior, and email them these questions. But I do understand you wanting to try to get your daughter to a point where you have her "consent" to reach out, but you really may have to anyway.

How is it going finding her a therapist? When is the last time she had one and what if anything was she diagnosed with? Just asking because it might also help us with ideas for you about how to get her to understand and accept you talking to the school.

The school’s “protocol” is obviously to do nothing, lest it be accused of mistreating the assailant. I’d be surprised if the teacher isn’t a mandated reporter. You need to be the one defining the “protocol” here. You need to be such a problem they’ll do anything to placate you.

You mean well, but as someone who's worked in schools in the DMV around discipline, you are giving horrible advice. If you really think it's functional for a school system to discipline each kid by what parents define as the protocol, you're nuts. OP must first find out what the school's protocol is, then find out if it's been followed, and then act from there. Running in and telling them what they should do... good luck with that without being informed by what the district or school's written rules and protocols are first.

This.

I’ll add that I was groped repeatedly in high school. In the dark room, by one kid in my photography class. And after school by a wrestler. I don’t know why they targeted me, but they did. I told no one. It still haunts me.

OP, I am so sorry your kid is dealing with this and that you are all (including your spouse) are suffering the consequences of what’s happened. Telling you and her dad is amazing. Those open lines of communication are a gift. You can counsel her and gather info. Be sure to take care of yourself, too.

[Anonymous]

You are lucky your daughter told you. I was groped on the school bus by a psychopath (grabbed me in a chokehold with one arm and put his other hand down my shirt). I quit riding the bus and walked home from school every day (two miles) and my mother never asked what was wrong and I wouldn't have told her. That guy was a known groper and groped dozens of girls i knew and absolutely nothing happened to him. He is now a "high earner" and probably married to some clueless lady who thinks she found a catch. Make sure this boy is punished.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wanted to give you some insight into what goes through a shy depressed girls brain when she is being sexually harassed like this. I was your daughter, and I was sexually harassed repeatedly in my teens and twenties. In my teens a swim teammate (boy, it was coed) pulled my swimsuit down around my waist every single day for weeks. I was too embarrassed to ask my mom for a new “swim team” type suit and wore my beach suit. He would swim up behind me. Everyone knew, no one did anything.

I was big and strong. I could have decked the kid, held him underwater, kicked him in the nuts. I did all those things to my big brother! But all I wanted to do was disappear. Having attention called to me was more painful than the harassment. There is also a voice in your head that says “maybe this is okay - maybe he’s allowed to do this - maybe if I say something everyone will laugh at me for making a fuss.” That voice in my head allowed me to be groped on buses, trains, streets and airplanes for the next 10 years.

That voice prevented me from saying a decisive clear NO in my 20s when I didn’t want to sleep with an ex boyfriend who invited me over for a movie.

You don’t need to get her self defense class, though I’m sure that is great. You need to figure out how to change the voice in her head that says other people have rights to her body, and that people paying attention to her will humiliate her. That’s what is preventing her from standing up for herself.

Good luck to you and your daughter, OP.

Really sorry for your experience. And thank you, everyone suggesting OP's DD react and yell and deck the abuser really don't understand the internal struggle and voices and twisted oppressive voices that are baked into society even today for girls that make it especially hard for a "private, anxious" girl to establish clear boundaries and say "No!" Thanks for sharing your perspective, hope you're ok & able to stop abusers in their tracks with you now. Or that you're further along than before.

[Anonymous]

CALL....THE......POLICE
NOW

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:WTF. This is sexual assault. Not only do you tell the school, you tell the police.

TikTok encourages this; it is no big deal to kids.

Parents don't have to play by TikTok rules.

You are the “mean parent” and your kid is the weird oddball if you don’t let them have a phone with TikTok.

Ignore trolls like this poster. They are just being bullies themselves and are wastes of everyone's time. Ignore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:WTF. This is sexual assault. Not only do you tell the school, you tell the police.

TikTok encourages this; it is no big deal to kids.

Parents don't have to play by TikTok rules.

You are the “mean parent” and your kid is the weird oddball if you don’t let them have a phone with TikTok.

Ignore trolls like this poster. They are just being bullies themselves and are wastes of everyone's time. Ignore.

Actually I APOLOGIZE, I misunderstood PP's point. THey are not a troll. Apologies, I understand it now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The “devious licks” thing is old, I remember getting the same thing a few years ago and some idiot kid actually vandalized a schoo bathroom and “blamed it on TikTok”.
I don’t let my kids go in tiktok.
Op, please speak with the school immediately and advocate for your child. Simply because she is shy and doesn’t want a fuss made doesn’t mean she needs to sit back and take abuse and assault. And this is assault. Please get her help!

Just FYI - don't be naive. If your kids have access to YouTube, then they're seeing every single thing posted on TikTok.

This is true. We found that out the hard way during pandemic with our middle schooler. Access to everything on TikTok, and so much of it was so toxic. We didn't take her phone away, we just had many conversations about what she was seeing, reminders that there are people posting to do harm to others, and asking her about things she enjoyed on tik tok and things that made her feel bad, and asking what about them made her feel bad. Eventually she seemed to see it more objectively and we even overheard a few convos with her BFFs where DD tried to help them put it in perspective and not follow whatever was going on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wanted to give you some insight into what goes through a shy depressed girls brain when she is being sexually harassed like this. I was your daughter, and I was sexually harassed repeatedly in my teens and twenties. In my teens a swim teammate (boy, it was coed) pulled my swimsuit down around my waist every single day for weeks. I was too embarrassed to ask my mom for a new “swim team” type suit and wore my beach suit. He would swim up behind me. Everyone knew, no one did anything.

I was big and strong. I could have decked the kid, held him underwater, kicked him in the nuts. I did all those things to my big brother! But all I wanted to do was disappear. Having attention called to me was more painful than the harassment. There is also a voice in your head that says “maybe this is okay - maybe he’s allowed to do this - maybe if I say something everyone will laugh at me for making a fuss.” That voice in my head allowed me to be groped on buses, trains, streets and airplanes for the next 10 years.

That voice prevented me from saying a decisive clear NO in my 20s when I didn’t want to sleep with an ex boyfriend who invited me over for a movie.

You don’t need to get her self defense class, though I’m sure that is great. You need to figure out how to change the voice in her head that says other people have rights to her body, and that people paying attention to her will humiliate her. That’s what is preventing her from standing up for herself.

Good luck to you and your daughter, OP.

Really sorry for your experience. And thank you, everyone suggesting OP's DD react and yell and deck the abuser really don't understand the internal struggle and voices and twisted oppressive voices that are baked into society even today for girls that make it especially hard for a "private, anxious" girl to establish clear boundaries and say "No!" Thanks for sharing your perspective, hope you're ok & able to stop abusers in their tracks with you now. Or that you're further along than before.

Thanks, PP. I am well. I’m 50 now, and it’s a long time ago. The memories are old and don’t normally occur to me, but when they do I still feel a burning anger. I’m one of those women who others thing “that could never have happened to her, she’s so strong and confident.” I wasn’t when I was young, but I got there. I’m sure OP’s daughter will too, with time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The “devious licks” thing is old, I remember getting the same thing a few years ago and some idiot kid actually vandalized a schoo bathroom and “blamed it on TikTok”.
I don’t let my kids go in tiktok.
Op, please speak with the school immediately and advocate for your child. Simply because she is shy and doesn’t want a fuss made doesn’t mean she needs to sit back and take abuse and assault. And this is assault. Please get her help!

Just FYI - don't be naive. If your kids have access to YouTube, then they're seeing every single thing posted on TikTok.

I’m not naive. They don’t have access to YouTube either unless it’s with a parent’s direct approval and for a school or extracurricular assignment.
There are ways to keep your kids off TikTok and my kids are fine with it. They are not interested in being fed misinformation.