Feeling friendless and unlovable. I am always the initiator. I feel sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

This is exactly what I’ve experienced in my suburb. I don’t understand why people want to live like this.

I think that they believe that this is society’s expectation of them. And then you keep living this way and you become less interesting and intellectually curious, so it is a vicious cycle. It is so weird. I grew up in the 70s and 80s, and my parents and their friends had a lot less money and conveniences than people today, and they had a really tight knit community with one another. They would get together all the time and drink, eat, party, joke and laugh. And we kids would all play together in the rec room. They had a blast! I don’t know what has happened to American society, but we have become so isolated from one another and there is no sense of community. There is a hyperfocus on just the nuclear family and people have become so clipped and reserved with others. People only care about themselves and their own children now and they rarely care about anyone else or reach out to them. I strongly believe that this is at the root of most of the serious societal problems we are experiencing today. No one looks out for each other like they used to.

DP. My hot take is that it’s because there are too many divisive topics now, and the society is so not homogenous that it’s hard to stick together since everyone is so different.

Well the happiest countries in the world are the most homogeneous ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

This is exactly what I’ve experienced in my suburb. I don’t understand why people want to live like this.

I think that they believe that this is society’s expectation of them. And then you keep living this way and you become less interesting and intellectually curious, so it is a vicious cycle. It is so weird. I grew up in the 70s and 80s, and my parents and their friends had a lot less money and conveniences than people today, and they had a really tight knit community with one another. They would get together all the time and drink, eat, party, joke and laugh. And we kids would all play together in the rec room. They had a blast! I don’t know what has happened to American society, but we have become so isolated from one another and there is no sense of community. There is a hyperfocus on just the nuclear family and people have become so clipped and reserved with others. People only care about themselves and their own children now and they rarely care about anyone else or reach out to them. I strongly believe that this is at the root of most of the serious societal problems we are experiencing today. No one looks out for each other like they used to.

DP. My hot take is that it’s because there are too many divisive topics now, and the society is so not homogenous that it’s hard to stick together since everyone is so different.

+1

DP here. This is an excellent observation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

This is exactly what I’ve experienced in my suburb. I don’t understand why people want to live like this.

I think that they believe that this is society’s expectation of them. And then you keep living this way and you become less interesting and intellectually curious, so it is a vicious cycle. It is so weird. I grew up in the 70s and 80s, and my parents and their friends had a lot less money and conveniences than people today, and they had a really tight knit community with one another. They would get together all the time and drink, eat, party, joke and laugh. And we kids would all play together in the rec room. They had a blast! I don’t know what has happened to American society, but we have become so isolated from one another and there is no sense of community. There is a hyperfocus on just the nuclear family and people have become so clipped and reserved with others. People only care about themselves and their own children now and they rarely care about anyone else or reach out to them. I strongly believe that this is at the root of most of the serious societal problems we are experiencing today. No one looks out for each other like they used to.

DP. My hot take is that it’s because there are too many divisive topics now, and the society is so not homogenous that it’s hard to stick together since everyone is so different.

What I see is that people are stressed and have a need to control everything in their lives. Organizing a social event takes a lot of energy, and people don’t have time between kids and jobs and housework. I’m a huge introvert and I also feel like I’m the only one in my friend groups that initiates things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

This is exactly what I’ve experienced in my suburb. I don’t understand why people want to live like this.

I think that they believe that this is society’s expectation of them. And then you keep living this way and you become less interesting and intellectually curious, so it is a vicious cycle. It is so weird. I grew up in the 70s and 80s, and my parents and their friends had a lot less money and conveniences than people today, and they had a really tight knit community with one another. They would get together all the time and drink, eat, party, joke and laugh. And we kids would all play together in the rec room. They had a blast! I don’t know what has happened to American society, but we have become so isolated from one another and there is no sense of community. There is a hyperfocus on just the nuclear family and people have become so clipped and reserved with others. People only care about themselves and their own children now and they rarely care about anyone else or reach out to them. I strongly believe that this is at the root of most of the serious societal problems we are experiencing today. No one looks out for each other like they used to.

DP. My hot take is that it’s because there are too many divisive topics now, and the society is so not homogenous that it’s hard to stick together since everyone is so different.

Well the happiest countries in the world are the most homogeneous ones.

Yep. It’s hard when people are coming from such diverse backgrounds and you lose that common ‘culture’.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

I’m not White, but this is me! I partied a ton in my 20s and I’m happy to hang out at my kids’ soccer games and vacation with my family. Makes me happy now.

I’m not embarrassed by my lameness! Sorry you find it unappealing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a good friend that used to be fun to hang out with, but now she doesn't have anything interesting to talk about. It's just about her kids and her worries. I will still see her if she initiates, but it's harder to be motivated to reach out, because it's just not that compelling.

This may not be what's happening to you at all, but just wanted to share a different perspective.

A couple years back I had a bit of a blow-up with my sister because pretty much all communication was initiated by me, and I'm the introvert! And she essentially responded similarly to how you feel about your friend- that our conversations are boring and I have nothing interesting to say. I've always been a bit socially awkward but man if that wasn't a kick in the gut, that I wasn't even worthwhile to my own sister and she would just talk to me out of obligation. Needless to say I stopped initiating, we mostly text and then see eachother a couple times a year when I visit (she and my parents live in the same town. But it definitely made me wonder whether everyone else found me boring too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

I am surprised they reciprocate you

what are you babbling about grandma?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

I mean....why do you want to hang out with people like this? Instead of complaining about them, find some new friends with similar energy levels and interests.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

Genuine question: what do you do or say that makes you so interesting?

[Anonymous]

OP, it's not a rejection if it wasn't an invitation. You DID NOT issue an invitation. An invitation is: a specific date and a time. Or a choice of 2 or 3.

Or it's on them to initiate. Fine tune some boundaries. What you need to do is feel empowered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I often feel similar OP, and I think you have to look at the people who show up for your invites but don’t reciprocate. If they are people who don’t seem to initiate anything, ever, with anyone - then decide if you enjoy their company enough to accept that they need someone to initiate in order to plan things.
If it’s clear from Facebook, Instagram, and sideline chit chat that they are all initiating and coordinating with other people, but not including you, then ask yourself if you like them enough to be on the B-list. I don’t automatically fade people who put me on their B list - sometimes those people are useful to me as connections or for car pool and I am happy to keep up the pretense of “friendship”.

As for the people who keep me on the B-list because I am just not popular enough, I have found 2 things that seem to help get more invites -
1. Be interesting. Get a hobby. Make friends other ways. Make a point to keep in touch with old coworkers and college friends - and then post about it or talk about it. Going and doing social things will help you be more interesting because it hones your social skills and gives you things to talk about. but posting a pic of happy hour or mentioning you’ll miss soccer next week for your girls trip is key. It makes you seem like a coveted and limited commodity. The more I publicly hang out with others, the more I see that B-list crowd remember to include me.
2. Put yourself in the right place at the right time for impromptu invites. Go to the PTA meetings in person, even if there is a virtual option. Volunteer when you can for school events - especially the set-up. Chat at practices and games, don’t sit by yourself and only talk to your spouse. Linger for a few minutes at the end of school events - don’t always be in a hurry to leave. That’s how you get the “hey, we’re going to ice cream after the game and you should join us” invite.

This seems tiring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean.

Do you have kids? I don't, and I think many women with kids a) are super busy and/or b) don't want to hang out with women without kids. They'd rather hang out with other moms.

I have kids and the only women I find interesting are those who don't. So maybe I am an anomaly but I'm sure there's more than one like me out there in the world.

This. Married thirty and forty something American women with kids are the most boring people on the planet.

Not OP. I hope this is the problem. I love traveling, going out, concerts etc. I get the impression no one around my age with kids wants to have any fun. They are interested in kids birthday parties on the weekend but that’s really it. I don’t know why it has to be like this. Doesn’t anyone want to have fun?

No, I swear all they do is go to kids’ soccer game and take a few curated trips with just their nuclear family each year. Other than that, they just stay home. And, of course, if you live like this, then you never have anything interesting to talk about, so it is just a whole lot of dull. The men tend to be a little better, but most are so cowed by their wives that they end up the same way. We thought it was DC, but then we moved to a new city and even sent our kids to a private school known to have a great social scene, and it is exactly the same! Geez, like you said, doesn’t anyone want to party anymore? And given that these are some of the most privileged people in the country, I am just not buying the “crazy busy” or tired excuse. Come on people!

This is exactly what I’ve experienced in my suburb. I don’t understand why people want to live like this.

I think that they believe that this is society’s expectation of them. And then you keep living this way and you become less interesting and intellectually curious, so it is a vicious cycle. It is so weird. I grew up in the 70s and 80s, and my parents and their friends had a lot less money and conveniences than people today, and they had a really tight knit community with one another. They would get together all the time and drink, eat, party, joke and laugh. And we kids would all play together in the rec room. They had a blast! I don’t know what has happened to American society, but we have become so isolated from one another and there is no sense of community. There is a hyperfocus on just the nuclear family and people have become so clipped and reserved with others. People only care about themselves and their own children now and they rarely care about anyone else or reach out to them. I strongly believe that this is at the root of most of the serious societal problems we are experiencing today. No one looks out for each other like they used to.

DP. My hot take is that it’s because there are too many divisive topics now, and the society is so not homogenous that it’s hard to stick together since everyone is so different.

What I see is that people are stressed and have a need to control everything in their lives. Organizing a social event takes a lot of energy, and people don’t have time between kids and jobs and housework. I’m a huge introvert and I also feel like I’m the only one in my friend groups that initiates things.

I sometimes think about the differences between when I was growing up, my parents had much busier social lives than DH and I do. My mom is a pretty social, extroverted person, but we also had extended family nearby, and so did their friends. We'd often go to my grandparents or an aunt's for a few hours over the weekend, or occasionally for sleepovers. They definitely hired sitters as well, but they were cheap/underpaid back then (I remember being paid $2 an hour when I first started babysitting in the early 90s). No one was arranging "play dates", you just went down the street and found someone to play with. It all just feels like more effort these days. And then you do make the effort of arranging times, childcare, etc. and people bail and it feels like a waste.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I often feel similar OP, and I think you have to look at the people who show up for your invites but don’t reciprocate. If they are people who don’t seem to initiate anything, ever, with anyone - then decide if you enjoy their company enough to accept that they need someone to initiate in order to plan things.
If it’s clear from Facebook, Instagram, and sideline chit chat that they are all initiating and coordinating with other people, but not including you, then ask yourself if you like them enough to be on the B-list. I don’t automatically fade people who put me on their B list - sometimes those people are useful to me as connections or for car pool and I am happy to keep up the pretense of “friendship”.

As for the people who keep me on the B-list because I am just not popular enough, I have found 2 things that seem to help get more invites -
1. Be interesting. Get a hobby. Make friends other ways. Make a point to keep in touch with old coworkers and college friends - and then post about it or talk about it. Going and doing social things will help you be more interesting because it hones your social skills and gives you things to talk about. but posting a pic of happy hour or mentioning you’ll miss soccer next week for your girls trip is key. It makes you seem like a coveted and limited commodity. The more I publicly hang out with others, the more I see that B-list crowd remember to include me.
2. Put yourself in the right place at the right time for impromptu invites. Go to the PTA meetings in person, even if there is a virtual option. Volunteer when you can for school events - especially the set-up. Chat at practices and games, don’t sit by yourself and only talk to your spouse. Linger for a few minutes at the end of school events - don’t always be in a hurry to leave. That’s how you get the “hey, we’re going to ice cream after the game and you should join us” invite.

This seems tiring.

Man, you people get “tired” easily.

[Anonymous]

I’m the friend who rarely reciprocates. I’m suffering. And I know it’s not fair to dump my emotional stuff on others, at least beyond some minor sharing. So I isolate while I try to get it together.

[Anonymous]

i think friends have different love languages. I have an acquaintance I occasionally do things with (we work together) and I host a lot of gatherings. Hospitality is important to me.
Her friendship love language is talking about weekend plans, etc. She doesn't care to host anything.
We manage a friendship but nothing close because of this. I think friends want to be appreciated for certain things and others just can't measure up.