Is dual-enrollment a scam?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very good for lower income families who cannot afford 4 years of college easily. It also allows you to go in as a transfer student vs. freshman. There are advantages and we consider it but heard too many negative things.

This is actually not always true - dual enrollment students are often still considered freshman. Umd, for example, only considers dual enrollment students transfers if they complete additional college credits post high school graduation.

It makes sense that serious universities would take DE students with a grain of salt, considering the academic level of DE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very good for lower income families who cannot afford 4 years of college easily. It also allows you to go in as a transfer student vs. freshman. There are advantages and we consider it but heard too many negative things.

This is actually not always true - dual enrollment students are often still considered freshman. Umd, for example, only considers dual enrollment students transfers if they complete additional college credits post high school graduation.

DE students aren't transfer students. If you take a CC course after graduation, you wouldn't be dually enrolled.

Yes, they are. If you transfer in an Associate’s degree from a community college and intend to graduate two years later, you’re a transfer student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very good for lower income families who cannot afford 4 years of college easily. It also allows you to go in as a transfer student vs. freshman. There are advantages and we consider it but heard too many negative things.

This is actually not always true - dual enrollment students are often still considered freshman. Umd, for example, only considers dual enrollment students transfers if they complete additional college credits post high school graduation.

It makes sense that serious universities would take DE students with a grain of salt, considering the academic level of DE.

Define “serious universities.” UMD, UVa, W&M, UNC and the UC schools all accept community college transfer students, and accept their credits as meeting specific graduation requirements, not just random electives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:None of my kid’s AP or IB classes were accepted for credit at her SLAC. They could be used to meet some prerequisites, but that’s it. College is a business and they want you there for eight semesters.

Dual enrollment works better for shortening time in college.

But .. some schools will require you to apply as a transfer student if you want to claim the DE credit. Read the policy at every school you are interested in attending.

[Anonymous]

NP here. I don't know why I am continually surprised at the narrow thinking of so many DCUM posters. Montgomery County is one of the most diverse counties in the nation. Just because something doesn't appeal to your family doesn't mean it isn't appropriate for other families. There are many lower income families, immigrant families, families who aren't about to send their girls off to 4 year colleges, families whose teenagers contribute to running the household, families with children with mental health issues, etc. who find Montgomery College to be an excellent opportunity to excellent careers. Not every kid is interested in a typical American high school experience and not every college bound student wants a typical American 4-yr college program. Fortunately, students have many pathways to find success in Montgomery County, and some of those pathways go through MC.

The relationship between MCPS and MC has been around for a while, and it changes and adapts as state laws/initiatives and business needs change. Prior to 2015, students could drop out of high school at age 16. Some did this so that they could work and support families. Students could get their GEDs and then enroll at MC to begin working towards an associate's degree while also working. For 2016-2017 compulsory HS attendance went until age 17, and then beginning in 2018 it changed to age 18. This corresponds with the decrease in enrollment at MC beginning after 2015. Since then, MCPS and MC have been experimenting with different programs beyond simple dual enrollment for some classes. Early College, Middle College, and Jump Start all allow high school students to simultaneously earn an associates degree along with their high school diploma. https://www.montgomerycollege.edu/high-school-students/dual-enrollment/degree-and-pathway-programs/index.html

And there seems to be complete blindness to the Universities of Shady Grove. USG’s mission is “To support and expand pathways to affordable, high-quality public higher education that meet the distinctive needs of the region and are designed to support workforce and economic development in the state; ..." They offer a series of degrees in the health services, education, biotechnology, computer science, and cybersecurity fields all of which are careers in high demand to feed our existing county businesses. There is even a program to support students through HS to a BS degree https://www.acesmontgomery.org/ . So, a motivated student can do Early College at MC and also work to save tuition money. Then at 18 they enroll at USG, can still work and live at home, and take only 2 more years to get their BS. They graduate at age 20 debt free and start their career locally at $50k-$80k. That is a great deal for economic mobility.

So no, dual-enrollment isn't a scam. It is an economic engine not targeted at the DCUM crowd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very good for lower income families who cannot afford 4 years of college easily. It also allows you to go in as a transfer student vs. freshman. There are advantages and we consider it but heard too many negative things.

This is actually not always true - dual enrollment students are often still considered freshman. Umd, for example, only considers dual enrollment students transfers if they complete additional college credits post high school graduation.

It makes sense that serious universities would take DE students with a grain of salt, considering the academic level of DE.

Define “serious universities.” UMD, UVa, W&M, UNC and the UC schools all accept community college transfer students, and accept their credits as meeting specific graduation requirements, not just random electives.

+1

60% of the transfers into UMD came from community colleges last year. https://irpa.umd.edu/CampusCounts/Admissions/apps_ug.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I don't know why I am continually surprised at the narrow thinking of so many DCUM posters. Montgomery County is one of the most diverse counties in the nation. Just because something doesn't appeal to your family doesn't mean it isn't appropriate for other families. There are many lower income families, immigrant families, families who aren't about to send their girls off to 4 year colleges, families whose teenagers contribute to running the household, families with children with mental health issues, etc. who find Montgomery College to be an excellent opportunity to excellent careers. Not every kid is interested in a typical American high school experience and not every college bound student wants a typical American 4-yr college program. Fortunately, students have many pathways to find success in Montgomery County, and some of those pathways go through MC.

The relationship between MCPS and MC has been around for a while, and it changes and adapts as state laws/initiatives and business needs change. Prior to 2015, students could drop out of high school at age 16. Some did this so that they could work and support families. Students could get their GEDs and then enroll at MC to begin working towards an associate's degree while also working. For 2016-2017 compulsory HS attendance went until age 17, and then beginning in 2018 it changed to age 18. This corresponds with the decrease in enrollment at MC beginning after 2015. Since then, MCPS and MC have been experimenting with different programs beyond simple dual enrollment for some classes. Early College, Middle College, and Jump Start all allow high school students to simultaneously earn an associates degree along with their high school diploma. https://www.montgomerycollege.edu/high-school-students/dual-enrollment/degree-and-pathway-programs/index.html

And there seems to be complete blindness to the Universities of Shady Grove. USG’s mission is “To support and expand pathways to affordable, high-quality public higher education that meet the distinctive needs of the region and are designed to support workforce and economic development in the state; ..." They offer a series of degrees in the health services, education, biotechnology, computer science, and cybersecurity fields all of which are careers in high demand to feed our existing county businesses. There is even a program to support students through HS to a BS degree https://www.acesmontgomery.org/ . So, a motivated student can do Early College at MC and also work to save tuition money. Then at 18 they enroll at USG, can still work and live at home, and take only 2 more years to get their BS. They graduate at age 20 debt free and start their career locally at $50k-$80k. That is a great deal for economic mobility.

So no, dual-enrollment isn't a scam. It is an economic engine not targeted at the DCUM crowd.

+1. This. The majority of MC courses are transferable to UMD and other Maryland higher edu institutions. I was a transfer student myself and I was able to save a ton of money taking two years of community college classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I don't know why I am continually surprised at the narrow thinking of so many DCUM posters. Montgomery County is one of the most diverse counties in the nation. Just because something doesn't appeal to your family doesn't mean it isn't appropriate for other families. There are many lower income families, immigrant families, families who aren't about to send their girls off to 4 year colleges, families whose teenagers contribute to running the household, families with children with mental health issues, etc. who find Montgomery College to be an excellent opportunity to excellent careers. Not every kid is interested in a typical American high school experience and not every college bound student wants a typical American 4-yr college program. Fortunately, students have many pathways to find success in Montgomery County, and some of those pathways go through MC.

The relationship between MCPS and MC has been around for a while, and it changes and adapts as state laws/initiatives and business needs change. Prior to 2015, students could drop out of high school at age 16. Some did this so that they could work and support families. Students could get their GEDs and then enroll at MC to begin working towards an associate's degree while also working. For 2016-2017 compulsory HS attendance went until age 17, and then beginning in 2018 it changed to age 18. This corresponds with the decrease in enrollment at MC beginning after 2015. Since then, MCPS and MC have been experimenting with different programs beyond simple dual enrollment for some classes. Early College, Middle College, and Jump Start all allow high school students to simultaneously earn an associates degree along with their high school diploma. https://www.montgomerycollege.edu/high-school-students/dual-enrollment/degree-and-pathway-programs/index.html

And there seems to be complete blindness to the Universities of Shady Grove. USG’s mission is “To support and expand pathways to affordable, high-quality public higher education that meet the distinctive needs of the region and are designed to support workforce and economic development in the state; ..." They offer a series of degrees in the health services, education, biotechnology, computer science, and cybersecurity fields all of which are careers in high demand to feed our existing county businesses. There is even a program to support students through HS to a BS degree https://www.acesmontgomery.org/ . So, a motivated student can do Early College at MC and also work to save tuition money. Then at 18 they enroll at USG, can still work and live at home, and take only 2 more years to get their BS. They graduate at age 20 debt free and start their career locally at $50k-$80k. That is a great deal for economic mobility.

So no, dual-enrollment isn't a scam. It is an economic engine not targeted at the DCUM crowd.

Finally somebody with a sound mind!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I don't know why I am continually surprised at the narrow thinking of so many DCUM posters. Montgomery County is one of the most diverse counties in the nation. Just because something doesn't appeal to your family doesn't mean it isn't appropriate for other families. There are many lower income families, immigrant families, families who aren't about to send their girls off to 4 year colleges, families whose teenagers contribute to running the household, families with children with mental health issues, etc. who find Montgomery College to be an excellent opportunity to excellent careers. Not every kid is interested in a typical American high school experience and not every college bound student wants a typical American 4-yr college program. Fortunately, students have many pathways to find success in Montgomery County, and some of those pathways go through MC.

The relationship between MCPS and MC has been around for a while, and it changes and adapts as state laws/initiatives and business needs change. Prior to 2015, students could drop out of high school at age 16. Some did this so that they could work and support families. Students could get their GEDs and then enroll at MC to begin working towards an associate's degree while also working. For 2016-2017 compulsory HS attendance went until age 17, and then beginning in 2018 it changed to age 18. This corresponds with the decrease in enrollment at MC beginning after 2015. Since then, MCPS and MC have been experimenting with different programs beyond simple dual enrollment for some classes. Early College, Middle College, and Jump Start all allow high school students to simultaneously earn an associates degree along with their high school diploma. https://www.montgomerycollege.edu/high-school-students/dual-enrollment/degree-and-pathway-programs/index.html

And there seems to be complete blindness to the Universities of Shady Grove. USG’s mission is “To support and expand pathways to affordable, high-quality public higher education that meet the distinctive needs of the region and are designed to support workforce and economic development in the state; ..." They offer a series of degrees in the health services, education, biotechnology, computer science, and cybersecurity fields all of which are careers in high demand to feed our existing county businesses. There is even a program to support students through HS to a BS degree https://www.acesmontgomery.org/ . So, a motivated student can do Early College at MC and also work to save tuition money. Then at 18 they enroll at USG, can still work and live at home, and take only 2 more years to get their BS. They graduate at age 20 debt free and start their career locally at $50k-$80k. That is a great deal for economic mobility.

So no, dual-enrollment isn't a scam. It is an economic engine not targeted at the DCUM crowd.

+1. This. The majority of MC courses are transferable to UMD and other Maryland higher edu institutions. I was a transfer student myself and I was able to save a ton of money taking two years of community college classes.

+2 Thank you for posting. OP seems really narrow minded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean it basically mean kids get two years less of education. On the other hand, it helps kids be able to better afford a college degree.

Maybe - it depends on the grades. And after receiving an AA, those kids must apply as transfer students, thus missing out on most merit scholarships, etc. If kids want to apply as freshmen, then the classes count as high school classes only, not as an AA.

[Anonymous]

DE is nothing new. I left my MCPS HS for part of the day in the late 80s to attend MC. My credits were accepted when I went off to college.

DD wanted to do DE as a senior. She really didn’t enjoy HS classes and saw some DE course offerings that would help her explore her intended major. Classes took place at USG. She said they prepared her well for her later college courses as it was a lot of scholarly research papers, group projects and presentations. She was too shy to participate in the HS classroom but DE required her to push past the discomfort. She also learned that college professors won’t buy a lot of excuses and if you miss something you are out or luck. We credit it with her very smooth adjustment to the college classroom at UMD.

DS chose to stay at his HS and not take DE but focus on APs. He is also at UMD.

Choose the path that is best for your child but it’s not a scam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of my kid’s AP or IB classes were accepted for credit at her SLAC. They could be used to meet some prerequisites, but that’s it. College is a business and they want you there for eight semesters.

Dual enrollment works better for shortening time in college.

None? What did they take and score?
My kid's 5 on AP Calc, for instance, was certainly accepted.

It depends on the college to accept ap scires

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of my kid’s AP or IB classes were accepted for credit at her SLAC. They could be used to meet some prerequisites, but that’s it. College is a business and they want you there for eight semesters.

Dual enrollment works better for shortening time in college.

None? What did they take and score?
My kid's 5 on AP Calc, for instance, was certainly accepted.

It depends on the college to accept ap scires

The vast, vast majority of colleges & universities in the US do. 99% of kids aren’t going to get into the ones that don’t, such as some of the Ivies; hate to burst your bubble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean it basically mean kids get two years less of education. On the other hand, it helps kids be able to better afford a college degree.

Maybe - it depends on the grades. And after receiving an AA, those kids must apply as transfer students, thus missing out on most merit scholarships, etc. If kids want to apply as freshmen, then the classes count as high school classes only, not as an AA.

If you only have two years left of college to pay for after the AA, you have much less need for a merit scholarship. There’s no point in doing Early College/DE if you want to apply as a freshman.

[Anonymous]

I have friends who did this back in the day in Virginia. Very smart kids who got into top schools but had little money. They did two years at a community college with some of it done while they were still in high school and then transferred to UVA.