Au Pair just asked for more money

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Or this example:
Right. Comes to about 25k/yr. I'm a host mom.

You still aren't getting FT household help for that. Anyone who has had to pay for a Nanny or even a babysitter knows that.

When my kids were little we had a nanny. This was over 5 years ago. I paid $21/hr, fed rate for mileage, and employer side of FICA, plus a payroll servihe, excluding bonuses and gifts our bare minimum nanny expenses were 49,221.52.

For most people with out an AuPair to hire In house help, assuming they skip paying taxes, skip payroll, and skip any sort of perk will be paying $800/wk. This is still almost double the all AuPair cost.

No idea why people are so sensitive to the facts. Paying $25k per year for live in in call childcare is cheap cheap cheap.

You’re right. For what you get (or can get as long as you get a good match) it’s super cheap. And IME the au pair is more reliable (fewer sick or personal days, almost always on time).

As I posted already, this is why I love au pairs. We have been paying $350/week. The au pair feels like she’s highly valued and doing well financially. Compare to a nanny making $350/week: she’s not gonna particularly valued at all. She won’t be making top of the market compared to other DC nannies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Domestic Workers are denied basic labor rights. The issue is not whether one can get away with following the minimum letter of the law, but whether their actions are justifiable knowing that the law should be (MA laws for nanny’s and au pairs) or ethically justifiable.

When most of our country’s labor laws, like the Fair Labor Standards Act, were drafted, domestic workers were not included. There are pending bills in DMV and in the Congress that will change that soon. Workplace standards like a minimum wage, overtime pay, or protections against sexual harassment in the workplace are rarely extended to domestic workers, if at all. Many domestic workers do not earn a living wage and work without access to health care, paid sick days or paid time off.

Live-out domestic workers are protected by every single one of those. Live-in domestic workers (other than APs) are entitled to minimum wage and pay for every minute worked (no, we don’t get overtime, but most of us are fine with it). Every nanny I know who is legally allowed to work in the US has a contract that spells out the rate, guaranteed hours, vacation, sick leave and any other benefits. Some of us have partially or fully funded healthcare through our employers, but some of us (myself included) do the math to realize it’s better for us to have a higher rate and pay for our own healthcare.

APs are glorified babysitters. They’re great for families who need a split shift with elementary kids. They’re great for families who have a hard time finding a target language. They’re great for families who luck out and find a gem who actually knows how to teach toddlers/preschoolers and doesn’t mind working 45 hours every week. But not only are APs not for every family, a lot of them exaggerate their experience, and they’re just here to party. There are some that want to send money home or save their money for a nest egg; those are the APs who are having the best time right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The bill sponsored by Sen Kamala Harris (VP Elect) is already on the slate.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/2112/text

There is a bill pending in DC too.

Simply stated, what is happening in today’s domestic worker market, including au pairs, is not fair or justifiable. That will hopefully change soon by law, like in MA. Until then, the only right thing to do is to voluntarily adopt the MA law standards or do better than that. Instead, many families have fought against these laws. That says something about us that we can hopefully change.

Requiring breaks would kill the nanny industry.

Requiring minimum wage is fine, but domestic workers legally allowed to work wherever they want are already entitled to it.

Anyone who babysits for 8 hours or more for a week must have a contract, per this bill. They’re also legally entitled to all of the legal protections. Really? If you have a teen babysit 6 pm to 2 am on New Year’s Eve, you think they’re entitled to the same legal protections as a nanny working 55 hours per week? You think that a preteen mother’s helper who plays with kids for 8 hours per week needs a contract and legal protections?

We (nannies, working legally in the US) didn’t ask for this, and we don’t want it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also this makes the person saying their au pair costs them
$30k per year insane. Unless they’re handing out gold bars.

This is only because you don't understand the program and ignore posts by anyone who tries to explain how it works. As I've said previously, posting nonsense prolifically (and then prolifically patting yourself on the back for your nonsense) doesn't make you correct.

Why don’t you explain it? If you’d like to advance an argument, provide some facts instead of repeating yourself and lashing out at other women. Not a good look. Also, maybe explain to the federal judge and a couple senators who reviewed the situation and came to the same conclusions about corrupting of the program.

Live-in nanny here. Maybe you’ll listen to me, since you are ignoring the HP.

$10400 (roughly, rounded to $200 weekly): directly to the AP; $10179 if paying exactly the stipend
$6000-11000: agency fees
$1000: education credits, $500 per semester
$2400-7200: $200-600 food per month for the extra person (BPs are notorious for eating triple what HP expect), but the amount “deducted” is much less
$60-600: $5-50 increase in electricity per month, depending on what the AP does
$60-600: $5-50 increase in water per month, depending on how much water AP uses and what your rate is
$240-$1000 phone for a year
Car insurance rate increase can be several hundred to more than a thousand
Increased gas for the car
Increased maintenance on the car
Extra flight, food, and tickets for vacation
Extra tickets, food and other costs associated with including AP in dinner out, movie night, apple picking, etc.

Most families hit $24000 without trying. Many families go over $30k. I don’t want to count the number of families who switch from nanny to AP thinking they’ll save, then they find they don’t. OTOH, families who get tired of rematching don’t quibble about a nanny’s rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That’s helpful. Until MA laws are enacted here therefore, do we think $50 extra a week for OP’s aupair is not misplaced then?

OP’s AP isn’t doing the job. She’s not playing with kids, tidying up after them or doing their laundry (kid, not adult). No, she doesn’t need extra pay for not doing her job!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ruling
Posted byWill Brownsberger December 18, 2019 85 Comments on Au Pair Ruling
A federal appellate court ruling has created a difficult situation for some families who rely on “au pair” arrangements for their child care. The ruling upheld the application of the Massachusetts Domestic Workers Bill of Rights to au pair arrangements.

In an “au pair” arrangement, a young person comes from another country to live with a U.S. family. In return for room and board, they provide child care. In many cases, they are treated very well, often as a family members. They have the opportunity to perfect their English and may also be a full time student. They may have light responsibilities, perhaps only after-school pick up and afternoon childcare, but they may make a critical difference for working parents. All benefit from a cultural exchange.

For better or for worse, what historically has been a personal arrangement of trust has grown into a big business. Agencies recruit women from around the world and place them with families to provide child care. They charge the families hefty fees. In some cases, the “au pair” has not been treated as a family member, but as a domestic servant with full-time responsibilities often going beyond child care to include house work. Because the women are on temporary visas, they have limited ability to push back on unreasonable demands and cases of real abuse have occurred.

The legislature followed California and New York and passed a Massachusetts Domestic Workers Bill of Rights in 2014 to respond to a series of troubling reports. The Massachusetts “DWBOR” requires families to treat their au pairs as employees:

Keep records of hours worked
Pay Massachusetts minimum wage (now $12/hour) and overtime
Make only limited permitted deductions for room and board
Provide rest time and sick leave
Provide reasonable access to phone and internet
Of critical importance, the au pair must be provided notice of these rights and an employer family can be prosecuted if they retaliate against an au pair’s assertion of these rights.

The Domestic Workers Bill of Rights was enacted over 5 years ago, but some agencies who place au pairs have chosen to litigate the new rules, instead of adapting to them. They have argued that weaker federal rules preempt the state rules. The agencies have continued to place au pairs without regard to the rules and, with the litigation pending, the Massachusetts Attorney General has not brought enforcement actions against families.

The recent ruling settles the issue that the Massachusetts DWBOR does lawfully apply to au pair arrangments. Weaker federal rules do not necessarily preempt stronger state rules. For example, the federal minimum wage is only $7.25, but Massachusetts workers benefit from the higher Massachusetts rate of $12.00. The court confirmed that Massachusetts has the power to set standards for domestic workers, including au pairs.

For families who currently have arrangements that do not comply with Massachusetts rules, the change increases costs and paperwork and, in some cases, creates a genuine hardship. I have heard from many families who depend on au pair child care who are distraught and are seeking a legislative exemption from the new rules. While I am deeply troubled that some mutually beneficial arrangements are going to be disrupted by the new rules, I do not support exempting au pair arrangements.

The Massachusetts Domestic Workers bill of rights responded to very real abuses. At the time the bill was under discussion and debate, we considered exempting au pair arrangements but concluded that by so doing we would be creating a significant loop hole that would defeat the purposes of the bill. The bill was passed by a unanimous final roll call in the Senate and by a final roll call of 126 to 22 in the House.

To the extent that some families have been surprised by the ruling, the fault lies with agencies who may have placed au pairs under the old rules and failed to inform families that the new rules were likely to come into force when litigation ended. The legislation was enacted on June 26, 2014 and a full transition period was allowed. We made it effective April 1, 2015.

Recognizing that families are not at fault, the Attorney General is still deferring enforcement as agencies and families sort out the consequences, but all who are affected should plan to move as quickly as possible into compliance. Agencies should be offering to unwind agreements or absorb the costs. I would like to know about agencies who are not taking appropriate responsibility for the transition.

I am also eager to continue to hear from affected families in my district — while I do not foresee any wholesale changes and our degrees of freedom on the details are limited, I remain willing to look for fair and feasible adjustments.

APs aren’t happy with this either. Yes, they’re paid more per hour. But they’re now employees. That means no more perks: private phone (shared is fine), car use, going on vacation with the family, dinners and outings with the family, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The existing limits on pay deductions for housing and food strike many families as unreasonable. The maximum deduction for housing is $35/week and the maximum deduction for food is $6.00/day. For more detail see the minimum wage regulations.

I agree that in the context of the homes where au pairs are most likely to be retained, these numbers look low. Yet, I do not think that adjusting these numbers is a promising idea. First, from a practical legislative standpoint, raising these numbers basically means cutting the minimum wage; we cannot carve out au pairs for different allowances. Cutting the minimum wage is not what we are trying to do right now. Second, the truth is that from a marginal cost standpoint, the numbers are not so far off. It does not actually cost a family anything to let an au pair use empty space in the house. Similarly, one more plate at a family table does not necessarily generate the same cost as it would to prepare a single meal from scratch.

Addendum: This note has generated push back. I fully appreciate that the marginal costs of having an au pair in a house are not zero. I fully appreciate that families are likely to spend much more than the housing and meals allowances. I’m just responding to some who seemed to suggest that the allowances should be compared to market rents.

Are you aware of how many APs eat separately, by choice? Are you aware of how many families have separate apartments or suites in a basement, and have (or could) rent them out?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If paying minimum wage is too expensive for some families, why not reduce the hours? The au pairs also want to take classes while they are here, which must be difficult with their work schedules. And it seems very harsh to only have one full weekend off per month.

It’s a maximum of 45 hours per week. 1.5 consecutive days off per week, at least one full weekend per month. In practice, most families keep a basic schedule that doesn’t vary much. The families using any weekend hours are usually doing so to cover a short kids’ sport practice or game, not even half a day, and they’re also more likely to be using less than 25 hours during the workweek.

Families using the full 45 hours are typically 9 hour days m-f or 10 hour days m-thurs and 5 hours on Friday. For those families, the AP has every weekend free.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also this makes the person saying their au pair costs them
$30k per year insane. Unless they’re handing out gold bars.

This is only because you don't understand the program and ignore posts by anyone who tries to explain how it works. As I've said previously, posting nonsense prolifically (and then prolifically patting yourself on the back for your nonsense) doesn't make you correct.

Why don’t you explain it? If you’d like to advance an argument, provide some facts instead of repeating yourself and lashing out at other women. Not a good look. Also, maybe explain to the federal judge and a couple senators who reviewed the situation and came to the same conclusions about corrupting of the program.

Live-in nanny here. Maybe you’ll listen to me, since you are ignoring the HP.

$10400 (roughly, rounded to $200 weekly): directly to the AP; $10179 if paying exactly the stipend
$6000-11000: agency fees
$1000: education credits, $500 per semester
$2400-7200: $200-600 food per month for the extra person (BPs are notorious for eating triple what HP expect), but the amount “deducted” is much less
$60-600: $5-50 increase in electricity per month, depending on what the AP does
$60-600: $5-50 increase in water per month, depending on how much water AP uses and what your rate is
$240-$1000 phone for a year
Car insurance rate increase can be several hundred to more than a thousand
Increased gas for the car
Increased maintenance on the car
Extra flight, food, and tickets for vacation
Extra tickets, food and other costs associated with including AP in dinner out, movie night, apple picking, etc.

Most families hit $24000 without trying. Many families go over $30k. I don’t want to count the number of families who switch from nanny to AP thinking they’ll save, then they find they don’t. OTOH, families who get tired of rematching don’t quibble about a nanny’s rate.

Host mom, and all of these expenses apply to us, and also an extra hotel room on vacations and an extra $500-1,000 on birthday and Christmas bonuses/gifts. And it's still cheaper than a nanny, and we still love the program. It's just not as cheap as people think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Also learned that if an au pair is sent home during the program by a complaint from her host family, she forfeits her fees. And if she chooses to leave her host family during the program, she has only 2 weeks to find a new host family or she is sent home, again forfeiting her fees.

You seem very misinformed.

Either AP or the family can initiate rematch, for any reason. Unless the AP did something egregious, the AP remains in the house while looking for another family. The agencies ALWAYS gloss over whatever the issues were. APs who slept through pick up, had three accidents or poured hot sauce in a child’s mouth as a punishment all managed to find rematch families.

The fees are so that APs don’t flake and quit, either after matching but prior to coming to the US or after arriving here. They’re young people who otherwise might flake the moment they’re expected to work.

[Anonymous]

For those decrying the agency fees assessed to the AP and HP:

AP health insurance
Room and training during orientation
Visa
2 one way tickets (they can’t book round trip, because they don’t know when the return will be)
Pay for local agency reps where APs will live (no rep within 50-100 miles, you can’t get an AP)
Pay for agency rep in home country
Maintenance and overhead for the computers
Pay for national staff

I’m sure I’m missing something.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also learned that if an au pair is sent home during the program by a complaint from her host family, she forfeits her fees. And if she chooses to leave her host family during the program, she has only 2 weeks to find a new host family or she is sent home, again forfeiting her fees.

You seem very misinformed.

Either AP or the family can initiate rematch, for any reason. Unless the AP did something egregious, the AP remains in the house while looking for another family. The agencies ALWAYS gloss over whatever the issues were. APs who slept through pick up, had three accidents or poured hot sauce in a child’s mouth as a punishment all managed to find rematch families.

The fees are so that APs don’t flake and quit, either after matching but prior to coming to the US or after arriving here. They’re young people who otherwise might flake the moment they’re expected to work.

Wouldn't this be child endangerment and why wasn't AP arrested and sent back home?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also this makes the person saying their au pair costs them
$30k per year insane. Unless they’re handing out gold bars.

This is only because you don't understand the program and ignore posts by anyone who tries to explain how it works. As I've said previously, posting nonsense prolifically (and then prolifically patting yourself on the back for your nonsense) doesn't make you correct.

Why don’t you explain it? If you’d like to advance an argument, provide some facts instead of repeating yourself and lashing out at other women. Not a good look. Also, maybe explain to the federal judge and a couple senators who reviewed the situation and came to the same conclusions about corrupting of the program.

Live-in nanny here. Maybe you’ll listen to me, since you are ignoring the HP.

$10400 (roughly, rounded to $200 weekly): directly to the AP; $10179 if paying exactly the stipend
$6000-11000: agency fees
$1000: education credits, $500 per semester
$2400-7200: $200-600 food per month for the extra person (BPs are notorious for eating triple what HP expect), but the amount “deducted” is much less
$60-600: $5-50 increase in electricity per month, depending on what the AP does
$60-600: $5-50 increase in water per month, depending on how much water AP uses and what your rate is
$240-$1000 phone for a year
Car insurance rate increase can be several hundred to more than a thousand
Increased gas for the car
Increased maintenance on the car
Extra flight, food, and tickets for vacation
Extra tickets, food and other costs associated with including AP in dinner out, movie night, apple picking, etc.

Most families hit $24000 without trying. Many families go over $30k. I don’t want to count the number of families who switch from nanny to AP thinking they’ll save, then they find they don’t. OTOH, families who get tired of rematching don’t quibble about a nanny’s rate.

None of that is relevant as they decided that they were willing to pay. They don't have to offer a car and insurance but most do to drive the kids around. Same with cell phone. And, you take the AP on vacation for your child care needs, not a vacation for them. I don't think its unreasonable to ask for more with multiple kids for 45 hours a week. They aren't even paying minimum wage. AP is living in their home for their needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also this makes the person saying their au pair costs them
$30k per year insane. Unless they’re handing out gold bars.

This is only because you don't understand the program and ignore posts by anyone who tries to explain how it works. As I've said previously, posting nonsense prolifically (and then prolifically patting yourself on the back for your nonsense) doesn't make you correct.

Why don’t you explain it? If you’d like to advance an argument, provide some facts instead of repeating yourself and lashing out at other women. Not a good look. Also, maybe explain to the federal judge and a couple senators who reviewed the situation and came to the same conclusions about corrupting of the program.

Live-in nanny here. Maybe you’ll listen to me, since you are ignoring the HP.

$10400 (roughly, rounded to $200 weekly): directly to the AP; $10179 if paying exactly the stipend
$6000-11000: agency fees
$1000: education credits, $500 per semester
$2400-7200: $200-600 food per month for the extra person (BPs are notorious for eating triple what HP expect), but the amount “deducted” is much less
$60-600: $5-50 increase in electricity per month, depending on what the AP does
$60-600: $5-50 increase in water per month, depending on how much water AP uses and what your rate is
$240-$1000 phone for a year
Car insurance rate increase can be several hundred to more than a thousand
Increased gas for the car
Increased maintenance on the car
Extra flight, food, and tickets for vacation
Extra tickets, food and other costs associated with including AP in dinner out, movie night, apple picking, etc.

Most families hit $24000 without trying. Many families go over $30k. I don’t want to count the number of families who switch from nanny to AP thinking they’ll save, then they find they don’t. OTOH, families who get tired of rematching don’t quibble about a nanny’s rate.

One cost not mentioned here is the cost of extra rent. I‘m an expectant parent and one of the big part of my cost calculations is how much extra rent I would have to pay to have a room for an au-pair and because I’m in a high cost area it is substantial.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also this makes the person saying their au pair costs them
$30k per year insane. Unless they’re handing out gold bars.

This is only because you don't understand the program and ignore posts by anyone who tries to explain how it works. As I've said previously, posting nonsense prolifically (and then prolifically patting yourself on the back for your nonsense) doesn't make you correct.

Why don’t you explain it? If you’d like to advance an argument, provide some facts instead of repeating yourself and lashing out at other women. Not a good look. Also, maybe explain to the federal judge and a couple senators who reviewed the situation and came to the same conclusions about corrupting of the program.

Live-in nanny here. Maybe you’ll listen to me, since you are ignoring the HP.

$10400 (roughly, rounded to $200 weekly): directly to the AP; $10179 if paying exactly the stipend
$6000-11000: agency fees
$1000: education credits, $500 per semester
$2400-7200: $200-600 food per month for the extra person (BPs are notorious for eating triple what HP expect), but the amount “deducted” is much less
$60-600: $5-50 increase in electricity per month, depending on what the AP does
$60-600: $5-50 increase in water per month, depending on how much water AP uses and what your rate is
$240-$1000 phone for a year
Car insurance rate increase can be several hundred to more than a thousand
Increased gas for the car
Increased maintenance on the car
Extra flight, food, and tickets for vacation
Extra tickets, food and other costs associated with including AP in dinner out, movie night, apple picking, etc.

Most families hit $24000 without trying. Many families go over $30k. I don’t want to count the number of families who switch from nanny to AP thinking they’ll save, then they find they don’t. OTOH, families who get tired of rematching don’t quibble about a nanny’s rate.

None of that is relevant as they decided that they were willing to pay. They don't have to offer a car and insurance but most do to drive the kids around. Same with cell phone. And, you take the AP on vacation for your child care needs, not a vacation for them. I don't think its unreasonable to ask for more with multiple kids for 45 hours a week. They aren't even paying minimum wage. AP is living in their home for their needs.

Many families invite au pairs on vacation because they’re a member of the family, not for them to work on vacation. When we do it, it’s max one night of babysitting. And we’ve also had au pairs bring a friend so she can have a proper trip for herself and make better use of the room we are paying for.

Not all families invite au pairs on vacation but for me it always seemed a little cruel.