UHC CEO Gunned Down in Midtown Manhattan

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Luigi had no authority to be judge and executioner.

But the insurance companies do?

Health care isn’t a right. It’s cost money and is an expense. Insurance is a means to pay. But they don’t cover anything and everything on everyone. If there is treatment or med you think you need and they won’t pay, you are welcome to find another means to pay for it.

I mean, it can be a right if we as a nation decide it is. That's how rights work.

No, insurance policies don't cover everything.
And also many insurers renege on covering what they claim to cover.
Both of these things can be true at the same time. Do you actually not understand this?

But keep telling yourself how insurance companies are the good guys, and only demanding, unreasonable, stupid patients get their claims denied. Maybe that will work out for you.

You and many others really don’t get how complex the health system works. Someone told you no and you decided it was their fault.

This economist explains it better than I can.

https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/insurance-companies-arent-the-main

Thank you PP, that was an interesting read. As new drugs are developed for diseases that are not common yet cause significant disease burden or death (i.e. spinal muscular atrophy, sickle cell disease, etc.) that literally cost millions per DOSE, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Right but everyone is blaming the insurers instead of the biotech and pharma companies for the inflated prices. Apparently the insurers should just pay them whatever they ask.

Also don’t work in insurance, HR actually.

DP. It’s not either/or. My kid is a type 1 diabetic, so I have plenty of anger for the companies that are engaged in patent abuse and price gauging of a medicine that is inexpensive to produce, available without a prescription in many countries and affordable in nearly all, and yet in the US is so expensive that one in four type 1s — who would literally die without it within weeks — routinely go without, or with far less than they need

Here’s the thing: all of these issues (UHC, pharma, PE-owned health care facilities) are the same issue. They’re all caused by the same underlying rot. In every case, we have turned healthcare into a commodity whose shares can be bought and sold, and we have prioritized investor growth over patient care. Sometimes those investors are ordinary shareholders, sometimes they are the most ruthless ghouls of private equity. Regardless, enriching those individuals is now what our health system, above all, is for.

To some extent, system can co-exist with patient care — things like wellness visits and vaccinations are factored into the business model. But when push comes to shove (as it inevitably does in health care), we value the portfolio over the patient — over your kid, and over mine.

It’s the same problem almost everywhere. They’re not distinct problems with different causal agents — insurance vs. pharma vs. providers. It’s one big very broken system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Luigi had no authority to be judge and executioner.

But the insurance companies do?

Health care isn’t a right. It’s cost money and is an expense. Insurance is a means to pay. But they don’t cover anything and everything on everyone. If there is treatment or med you think you need and they won’t pay, you are welcome to find another means to pay for it.

I mean, it can be a right if we as a nation decide it is. That's how rights work.

No, insurance policies don't cover everything.
And also many insurers renege on covering what they claim to cover.
Both of these things can be true at the same time. Do you actually not understand this?

But keep telling yourself how insurance companies are the good guys, and only demanding, unreasonable, stupid patients get their claims denied. Maybe that will work out for you.

You and many others really don’t get how complex the health system works. Someone told you no and you decided it was their fault.

This economist explains it better than I can.

https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/insurance-companies-arent-the-main

Thank you PP, that was an interesting read. As new drugs are developed for diseases that are not common yet cause significant disease burden or death (i.e. spinal muscular atrophy, sickle cell disease, etc.) that literally cost millions per DOSE, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Right but everyone is blaming the insurers instead of the biotech and pharma companies for the inflated prices. Apparently the insurers should just pay them whatever they ask.

Also don’t work in insurance, HR actually.

Don't forget the overpaid specialists- namely, anesthesiologists and radiologists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Luigi had no authority to be judge and executioner.

But the insurance companies do?

Health care isn’t a right. It’s cost money and is an expense. Insurance is a means to pay. But they don’t cover anything and everything on everyone. If there is treatment or med you think you need and they won’t pay, you are welcome to find another means to pay for it.

I mean, it can be a right if we as a nation decide it is. That's how rights work.

No, insurance policies don't cover everything.
And also many insurers renege on covering what they claim to cover.
Both of these things can be true at the same time. Do you actually not understand this?

But keep telling yourself how insurance companies are the good guys, and only demanding, unreasonable, stupid patients get their claims denied. Maybe that will work out for you.

You and many others really don’t get how complex the health system works. Someone told you no and you decided it was their fault.

This economist explains it better than I can.

https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/insurance-companies-arent-the-main

Thank you PP, that was an interesting read. As new drugs are developed for diseases that are not common yet cause significant disease burden or death (i.e. spinal muscular atrophy, sickle cell disease, etc.) that literally cost millions per DOSE, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Right but everyone is blaming the insurers instead of the biotech and pharma companies for the inflated prices. Apparently the insurers should just pay them whatever they ask.

Also don’t work in insurance, HR actually.

Don't forget the overpaid specialists- namely, anesthesiologists and radiologists.

Sorry insurance PR person. The radiologist, anesthesiologist or surgeon actually treats a patient and often saves their life. It takes years of medical school and training. The insurance leech just wants to take premiums and deny services to make money, The insurance companies are toxic leeches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Luigi had no authority to be judge and executioner.

But the insurance companies do?

Health care isn’t a right. It’s cost money and is an expense. Insurance is a means to pay. But they don’t cover anything and everything on everyone. If there is treatment or med you think you need and they won’t pay, you are welcome to find another means to pay for it.

I mean, it can be a right if we as a nation decide it is. That's how rights work.

No, insurance policies don't cover everything.
And also many insurers renege on covering what they claim to cover.
Both of these things can be true at the same time. Do you actually not understand this?

But keep telling yourself how insurance companies are the good guys, and only demanding, unreasonable, stupid patients get their claims denied. Maybe that will work out for you.

You and many others really don’t get how complex the health system works. Someone told you no and you decided it was their fault.

This economist explains it better than I can.

https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/insurance-companies-arent-the-main

Thank you PP, that was an interesting read. As new drugs are developed for diseases that are not common yet cause significant disease burden or death (i.e. spinal muscular atrophy, sickle cell disease, etc.) that literally cost millions per DOSE, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Right but everyone is blaming the insurers instead of the biotech and pharma companies for the inflated prices. Apparently the insurers should just pay them whatever they ask.

Also don’t work in insurance, HR actually.

Don't forget the overpaid specialists- namely, anesthesiologists and radiologists.

Sorry insurance PR person. The radiologist, anesthesiologist or surgeon actually treats a patient and often saves their life. It takes years of medical school and training. The insurance leech just wants to take premiums and deny services to make money, The insurance companies are toxic leeches.

I'm sure those radiologists and anesthesiologists aren't interesting in making money. Their $500k incomes are just a coincidence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hey y’all if you don’t like corporate health insurance, there’s always Kaiser.

And if insurance carriers think their customers are being overtreated, they can limit their offerings to catastrophe coverage .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Luigi had no authority to be judge and executioner.

But the insurance companies do?

Health care isn’t a right. It’s cost money and is an expense. Insurance is a means to pay. But they don’t cover anything and everything on everyone. If there is treatment or med you think you need and they won’t pay, you are welcome to find another means to pay for it.

I mean, it can be a right if we as a nation decide it is. That's how rights work.

No, insurance policies don't cover everything.
And also many insurers renege on covering what they claim to cover.
Both of these things can be true at the same time. Do you actually not understand this?

But keep telling yourself how insurance companies are the good guys, and only demanding, unreasonable, stupid patients get their claims denied. Maybe that will work out for you.

You and many others really don’t get how complex the health system works. Someone told you no and you decided it was their fault.

This economist explains it better than I can.

https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/insurance-companies-arent-the-main

Thank you PP, that was an interesting read. As new drugs are developed for diseases that are not common yet cause significant disease burden or death (i.e. spinal muscular atrophy, sickle cell disease, etc.) that literally cost millions per DOSE, it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

Right but everyone is blaming the insurers instead of the biotech and pharma companies for the inflated prices. Apparently the insurers should just pay them whatever they ask.

Also don’t work in insurance, HR actually.

Don't forget the overpaid specialists- namely, anesthesiologists and radiologists.

Sorry insurance PR person. The radiologist, anesthesiologist or surgeon actually treats a patient and often saves their life. It takes years of medical school and training. The insurance leech just wants to take premiums and deny services to make money, The insurance companies are toxic leeches.

I'm sure those radiologists and anesthesiologists aren't interesting in making money. Their $500k incomes are just a coincidence.

Gotta give people diagnosing cancer a salary haircut. The insurance executives’ $10M salaries don’t pay themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I suspect the apologist for the insurance industry who's been posting in this thread all day in fact is an employed wonk with the insurance industry. LOL.

Yeah, that poster seems to be worshipping soundbites.

workshopping

Well they aren’t working.

Honestly, healthcare IS a basic human right. As a society we’ve developed the science to treat disease and ease suffering. Why a big fat insurance CEO needs to get a big cash bonus before humans are treated is simply bizarre.

I get it money, makes the world go around it is what it is. But health insurance companies should not be publicly traded and should be as doctor/patient focused as possible. The responsibility to the shareholders cannot outweigh the responsibility to the customers who need the care.

What about a responsibility to their customers to keep premiums down?

It’s easier to keep premiums down when you’re not paying a bunch of execs multi million dollar salaries.

This whole thing has made really re-evaluate how we think of money in this country. So many people think rich people deserve it because they “worked hard” and think of money in terms of belonging to someone.

But the reality is that money is a form of currency created by our government for the benefit of its citizens. It is printed by our treasury, insured by our FDIC, and taxed through our IRS. To make money, corporations benefit from things like federally funded highways, government research grants, etc.

We need to start looking at money as something inherently belonging to our country and our policies are how we think the money should be transferred around to incentivize creation, but also provide societal stability. No one is inherently entitled to money and just because we *can* create the current system where most of the money is owned by a small percent of people (and often recirculated amongst the offspring of those people or tucked away in a bank) doesn’t mean we should do that.

I’m not saying we need to be a socialist country, but I do think we need to stop with the mentality of money being something that belongs to particular individuals.

Executive salaries and cash bonuses are a *tiny* fraction of health insurance corporate spending. And much of their compensation comes in the form of stock awards and stock options. These are often newly issues shares, meaning they're effectively coming from other shareholders rather than from customer premiums.

And the value of those shares is 100% unrelated to premiums paid and how much of that is retained through denials.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:On Reddit they published the number where one could send money to his jailhouse account and apparently donations are adding up.

OMG whatever you think of this guy the very last thing he needs is an effing GoFundMe. I weep for America.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is anyone the target?!

But what about the the unaffordable cost of health care and claims that get denied?

People except too much. Sorry, but they do. As a population we are over treated and over medicated. It’s not sustainable. I’m 40 and I honestly can’t think of a single female friend that isn’t on an SSRI, anti anxiety, or stimulant med. 75% of the population had eaten their way into diabetes, being overweight or obesity. Now we need an expensive drug to fix it because no one wants to eat less. Women want to wait to have kids into their mid 30s and 40s use IVF. People used to have kids in their 20s or just accept kids weren’t in the cards if it didn’t happen naturally. Not anymore. I don’t think our problem is healthcare, it’s our expectations. People want to live until 100 and have every single aliment and discomfort alleviated. Getting sick and dying is part of life. Curing and fixing everything on everyone, every time, at all ages (or using up tons of resources trying) is not sustainable

Sure, UHC is doing us all a favor by charging us ever increasing premiums and then refusing to pay out.

If this is the best talking point the insurance industry can ciome up with, no wonder their share prices are getting decimated.

See how much you’d be paying without insurance involved. All you people seem to think that $20K is a reasonable cost for a broken leg in the ER and insurance should just pay it are the problem. We are a nation of spoiled, poorly educated children.

What dummy is going to the ER room and not an orthopedist for a broken leg.

And no, it wouldn’t be $20k at an ER room to set a leg cast after X-rays. Stop wasting their time and our time with your nonsense

WTF. Every normal person goes to the ER for a broken leg because that’s an emergency. You can’t get in to see an orthopedist without two weeks minimum wait.

+1 I’m the PP whose DH broke his collarbone in a surfing accident similar to what people are speculating happened to the shooter. Damn straight he went to the ER because he was in so much pain he was going into shock. And there was a question that he might need emergency surgery (he didn’t). We got into an orthopedist two days later but only because I used to date the orthopedist’s brother and our parents are still best friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Luigi had no authority to be judge and executioner.

But the insurance companies do?

Health care isn’t a right. It’s cost money and is an expense. Insurance is a means to pay. But they don’t cover anything and everything on everyone. If there is treatment or med you think you need and they won’t pay, you are welcome to find another means to pay for it.

I mean, it can be a right if we as a nation decide it is. That's how rights work.

No, insurance policies don't cover everything.
And also many insurers renege on covering what they claim to cover.
Both of these things can be true at the same time. Do you actually not understand this?

But keep telling yourself how insurance companies are the good guys, and only demanding, unreasonable, stupid patients get their claims denied. Maybe that will work out for you.

You and many others really don’t get how complex the health system works. Someone told you no and you decided it was their fault.

This economist explains it better than I can.

https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/insurance-companies-arent-the-main

People here don’t know how 20% down payments on a $900,000 property work either.

His parents have a real estate empire. They gave him this property, likely one they owned, as a gift. They didn't give it as "here's a property with 200k equity, the mortgage payments start June 1st. You're welcome." It's safe to assume he owned the place outright to do what he wanted to with it. It sold for 900k so he pocketed whatever 900 minus transaction fees were. Let's be totally outrageous and say those were 200k, he left with 700k and that was his funding. He's from a wealthy family in real estate, this is not an unusual gift for a 20 something kid from their parents.

Some local multi family homes in Baltimore = a real estate empire?!?

Gawd.

Glad you never met any intl students at college who really did own family empires.

Owing 2 golf course resorts, a radio station, and a dozen nursing homes is a bit more than "local multi family homes"

That was all underpriced stuff decades ago. BFD
Nothing is costly in dangerous Balto except the gated communities where the ravens players live .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is anyone the target?!

But what about the the unaffordable cost of health care and claims that get denied?

People except too much. Sorry, but they do. As a population we are over treated and over medicated. It’s not sustainable. I’m 40 and I honestly can’t think of a single female friend that isn’t on an SSRI, anti anxiety, or stimulant med. 75% of the population had eaten their way into diabetes, being overweight or obesity. Now we need an expensive drug to fix it because no one wants to eat less. Women want to wait to have kids into their mid 30s and 40s use IVF. People used to have kids in their 20s or just accept kids weren’t in the cards if it didn’t happen naturally. Not anymore. I don’t think our problem is healthcare, it’s our expectations. People want to live until 100 and have every single aliment and discomfort alleviated. Getting sick and dying is part of life. Curing and fixing everything on everyone, every time, at all ages (or using up tons of resources trying) is not sustainable

Sure, UHC is doing us all a favor by charging us ever increasing premiums and then refusing to pay out.

If this is the best talking point the insurance industry can ciome up with, no wonder their share prices are getting decimated.

See how much you’d be paying without insurance involved. All you people seem to think that $20K is a reasonable cost for a broken leg in the ER and insurance should just pay it are the problem. We are a nation of spoiled, poorly educated children.

What dummy is going to the ER room and not an orthopedist for a broken leg.

And no, it wouldn’t be $20k at an ER room to set a leg cast after X-rays. Stop wasting their time and our time with your nonsense

I've had 3 broken bones in the last 18 years. One was actually 4 breaks (wrist). I went to the ER each time. You get ortho referral and see ortho later. The last one was my leg (fell off ladder, same as what did my wrist but this time on a wood floor instead of a cast iron/porcelain clawfoot bathtub--those suckers are dangerous!). I don't even remember if I saw ortho after (may have just been a very routine check)--it as a very simple fracture, top of tibia, they gave me a big ol wrap brace at the ER and I was gtg.

I found out there is a ortho urgent care, never heard of that.

What an uninformed rip off you are.

ER docs make fun of people like you (and the opioid regulars), but are happy to take your $500 copayment and up charge you for their triage time.

Even urgimeds take X-rays and give boots or splints.

Glad you don’t have kids and take them to the $$$&& ER room at every sniffle or fracture. What a hoot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You always go to an ER with a broken bone. They set it and refer you to an ortho. My kids seem to always break things on weekends, so that’s been my experience.

Oh brother.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If he was upset about his mother’s treatment, why did he cut off contact leaving her to file a missing person report?

People are asking all these questions like he’s a sane rational actor. He is not. It is very sad. Everyone is talking about it because it happened to be UHC that his paranoia focused on. It could have been someone at his surf coop, or the head of his former employer, or a piliitican. But it obviously says something about where Americans are with healthcare that they are building this Robin Hood narrative around him.

Agree.
The biases are rampant.

#1 thing when dealing with a mentally ill person is not to assume normal, rationale motives. Or sometimes any motive.

Wait for the “voices told me to do it” defense.

Since when did murder = mental illness? Humans have been killing each other without being mentally-ill since Cain killed Able. If you're Christian, then you believe that in God's eye, there is no valid reason for murder. But that doesn't mean that people can't have internally rational motives for murder. Luigi's reasons are internally consistent: mental illness is not needed to explain them.

Murder without rational motive is typically due to mental illness. This CEO didn’t even know him or affect him personally

Or cults and indoctrination. Luigi thinks what he did was warranted and necessary, and will save the world.

I don’t think he is mentally ill unless doing a few too many shrooms is mental illness. He probably is getting an astronomical amount of prison fan mail so he probably won’t feel like he did a bad thing. His manifesto and writings are extremely clear. He probably thinks of himself as some special revolutionary who stuck it to the man.

His note is not clear. It’s mumbo jumbo cliches tied to each other.

C- material at Gilman or Penn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is anyone the target?!

But what about the the unaffordable cost of health care and claims that get denied?

People except too much. Sorry, but they do. As a population we are over treated and over medicated. It’s not sustainable. I’m 40 and I honestly can’t think of a single female friend that isn’t on an SSRI, anti anxiety, or stimulant med. 75% of the population had eaten their way into diabetes, being overweight or obesity. Now we need an expensive drug to fix it because no one wants to eat less. Women want to wait to have kids into their mid 30s and 40s use IVF. People used to have kids in their 20s or just accept kids weren’t in the cards if it didn’t happen naturally. Not anymore. I don’t think our problem is healthcare, it’s our expectations. People want to live until 100 and have every single aliment and discomfort alleviated. Getting sick and dying is part of life. Curing and fixing everything on everyone, every time, at all ages (or using up tons of resources trying) is not sustainable

Well the fact so much of the population is obese, can’t afford to have kids until their fertility is declining, and need psych meds to function, evidences some societal failures that we aren’t going to “personal responsibility” our way out of. And unsurprisingly the hormone disrupters in the products we use, unhealthy changes to our food supply, and lack of family supports (e.g. paid parental leave) are brought to us courtesy of companies trying to increase their shareholder value.

Also, your post complete ignores the fact that anyone can become disabled or have an expensive accident that causes significant medical bills. Someone is going to have a baby in the NICU. Someone is going to have a bad fall. Someone is going to get cancer despite a healthy diet and working out. Someone is going to need medication to manage their health conditions. Insurance companies are supposed to be there for this when this happens after paying all our premiums.

We could absolutely have better coverage if we spent money on patients instead of allowing year over year record profits.

My take, too. The system isn't working for most people.

I agree with most of what PP is saying but the profits aren’t really the issue. UHC’s profits have been in the 5-6% range. So it could eliminate all its profits and still only provide 6% more care.
A non profit model doesn’t seem to be the solution — UPMC is a non profit and its CEO got an 8M bonus last year.

I think a big part of the problem is that we’ve had totally miraculous medical advances in the last 20 years. I know people with plain old ordinary health insurance getting gene therapy, biological treatments for autoimmune conditions, nerve blocking injections for pain, and bioengineered artificial skin transplants. All of which would have been sci fi just a decade or so ago. Insurance companies used to limit their cost by excluding the high priced participants, but they aren’t allowed to do that anymore so instead they try to come up with creative cost controls built around bureaucratic gate keeping. Which drives up costs even more as providers hire staff to deal with the bureaucracy. We need some sort of better national consensus on whether we are willing to pay for for health care or limit care more. I don’t think even a government health care system would solve the problem at this point, even if Americans were willing to move to that system, which it doesn’t seem like they want to.

Correct

But the average American and voter can’t read so won’t understand most economics or business models

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I am surprised no one has focused on his family owning nursing homes, which also are notoriously awful places designed for the owners to strike it rich at the expense of low quality care. Almost if not worse than the insurance company outrage.

Of course, I have no idea what his family's nursing homes are like. Can someone enlighten us?

Which one is it?
His families nursing homes have sucked the last 80 years or you have no idea?