Pay-to-Play Sport at Private HS employing club coach - what's normal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP here. To follow up on this, how good are the club/travel teams that these coaches run? Do they stand on their own merits?

Others spoke to soccer. I'll speak to baseball. Diamond Skills is a low quality program. They do well in mediocre tournaments against mediocre competition but cannot compete with the elite travel programs. And the only way they stay in business is because the SJC coach forces SJC players to play for Diamond Skills (chaching$$$). As I think someone else mentioned the Georgetown Prep coach is a co-opwner of Diamond Skills. He does not force his GP players to play for Diamond Skills. And except for one or two they do not. Given the choice they play for other travel programs. That speaks volumes. As others have said it is natural for a coach to show some favoritism to kids on the school team who also play for the coach's travel program. But GP kids almost always choose not to play for their coach's travel program. If that's not an indictment of Diamond Skills I don't know what is.

[Anonymous]

One minor clarification to PP's comment about getting enough boys to show up for games. The problem is that Sal doesn't bother to roster enough kids on the teams he doesn't care about even though there are more than enough of boys in the age group. Teams may be under-rostered or have just enough players but no one to sub (but also but will be short if someone can't make the game). That devolves as the year goes on, and then kids stop showing up for games where they know they won't have a full team and will get killed (or because they're tired of being treated horribly by the club). This has been going on for a couple of years. There was a period a few years ago where Sal got positive buzz on this board but, as he tried to raise his profile in my view at the expense of kids, it seems like the general view of him and his club on this board shifted to pretty negative.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One minor clarification to PP's comment about getting enough boys to show up for games. The problem is that Sal doesn't bother to roster enough kids on the teams he doesn't care about even though there are more than enough of boys in the age group. Teams may be under-rostered or have just enough players but no one to sub (but also but will be short if someone can't make the game). That devolves as the year goes on, and then kids stop showing up for games where they know they won't have a full team and will get killed (or because they're tired of being treated horribly by the club). This has been going on for a couple of years. There was a period a few years ago where Sal got positive buzz on this board but, as he tried to raise his profile in my view at the expense of kids, it seems like the general view of him and his club on this board shifted to pretty negative.

What are the problem years?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One minor clarification to PP's comment about getting enough boys to show up for games. The problem is that Sal doesn't bother to roster enough kids on the teams he doesn't care about even though there are more than enough of boys in the age group. Teams may be under-rostered or have just enough players but no one to sub (but also but will be short if someone can't make the game). That devolves as the year goes on, and then kids stop showing up for games where they know they won't have a full team and will get killed (or because they're tired of being treated horribly by the club). This has been going on for a couple of years. There was a period a few years ago where Sal got positive buzz on this board but, as he tried to raise his profile in my view at the expense of kids, it seems like the general view of him and his club on this board shifted to pretty negative.

We've definitely had unpleasant experiences playing against his teams, which are the classic type of "foul your opponent if you can get away with it, and then flop and complain to the ref if you receive any glancing contact." His histrionics on the sideline are something to see as well. I will say that the teams of his we've seen tend to be pretty skillful, and I can see how you'd put up with him for a few years anyway if your kid was one of his favorites or on a favored team.

I wouldn't want my kid playing for him, but I've never seen or heard of him doing anything nearly as awful as what has been reported (and linked to) on this thread about the baseball program.

[Anonymous]

We are not fans of Sal as a coach and feel his on-field behavior is way over the top, but I would agree we have not heard of any behavior at the level that is going on at baseball. We have heard he favors his players for SJC soccer, but nothing like cutting them if they don't go to his private camp.

[Anonymous]

SJC soccer parent here and i agree with those who say they are not big fans of Sal, but that he appears to be a saint compared to the baseball coach. We know some kids on the baseball team and it is clear they don’t respect him. They make fun of him, roll there eyes at him, and we always wonder why they would want to play for him. But before I let Sal off the hook, I think the biggest disappointment is that SJC has hired two low character individuals to coach their teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SJC soccer parent here and i agree with those who say they are not big fans of Sal, but that he appears to be a saint compared to the baseball coach. We know some kids on the baseball team and it is clear they don’t respect him. They make fun of him, roll there eyes at him, and we always wonder why they would want to play for him. But before I let Sal off the hook, I think the biggest disappointment is that SJC has hired two low character individuals to coach their teams.

+100. I can't imagine anyone spending 15 minutes either 1) interviewing or 2) checking any parent references or 3) watching a game/practice and coming away saying this is a person who character aligns with SJC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SJC soccer parent here and i agree with those who say they are not big fans of Sal, but that he appears to be a saint compared to the baseball coach. We know some kids on the baseball team and it is clear they don’t respect him. They make fun of him, roll there eyes at him, and we always wonder why they would want to play for him. But before I let Sal off the hook, I think the biggest disappointment is that SJC has hired two low character individuals to coach their teams.

+100. I can't imagine anyone spending 15 minutes either 1) interviewing or 2) checking any parent references or 3) watching a game/practice and coming away saying this is a person who character aligns with SJC.

We met with Coach Gibbs when our son was an 8th grader. When we walked out of his "clubhouse" I'm not sure who said "hell no" first -- me, my husband or my son. I can't imagine a scenario where I would have agreed to put my son in his care for 4 years, especially now that I know he pretty much owns his players year round. PP said something about not being able to imagine coming away saying the coach's character aligns with SJC. If the school is hiring people like the baseball and soccer coach regularly, then maybe that speaks to the character of the school. Sports factory > catholic values.

[Anonymous]

One thing I can assure you, many of the parents in this thread -- and they are identifiable to those in the relevant community based on their comments -- are the worst sort of little-league-parents-on-steroids. I certainly don't agree with all of the policies of certain of the coaches mentioned in this thread, but they tell you of those policies before you sign up. If you don't like the policy, then don't attend that school. But the sanctimony of some of you, the fundamental lack of self-awareness, is awe-inspiring. When you stop living your life through your child, then I might start listening to you on the topic of morality in sports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One thing I can assure you, many of the parents in this thread -- and they are identifiable to those in the relevant community based on their comments -- are the worst sort of little-league-parents-on-steroids. I certainly don't agree with all of the policies of certain of the coaches mentioned in this thread, but they tell you of those policies before you sign up. If you don't like the policy, then don't attend that school. But the sanctimony of some of you, the fundamental lack of self-awareness, is awe-inspiring. When you stop living your life through your child, then I might start listening to you on the topic of morality in sports.

Well, I sent my kid to SJC for a Catholic education, not to become a division 1 athlete. I didn't want or expect that. I also didn't expect to run into a shake down operation set up as a HS sports team when my son wanted to play a sport.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One thing I can assure you, many of the parents in this thread -- and they are identifiable to those in the relevant community based on their comments -- are the worst sort of little-league-parents-on-steroids. I certainly don't agree with all of the policies of certain of the coaches mentioned in this thread, but they tell you of those policies before you sign up. If you don't like the policy, then don't attend that school. But the sanctimony of some of you, the fundamental lack of self-awareness, is awe-inspiring. When you stop living your life through your child, then I might start listening to you on the topic of morality in sports.

What an idiotic attitude to have going into a school. "If you don't like borderline corrupt behavior head to another school?" What sort of person supports this crap and thinks this is just "how it is".

Talk about race to the bottom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One thing I can assure you, many of the parents in this thread -- and they are identifiable to those in the relevant community based on their comments -- are the worst sort of little-league-parents-on-steroids. I certainly don't agree with all of the policies of certain of the coaches mentioned in this thread, but they tell you of those policies before you sign up. If you don't like the policy, then don't attend that school. But the sanctimony of some of you, the fundamental lack of self-awareness, is awe-inspiring. When you stop living your life through your child, then I might start listening to you on the topic of morality in sports.

There is no logic in this post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hello SSSAS and girls lacrosse too.

Yup. A big offender.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SJC soccer parent here and i agree with those who say they are not big fans of Sal, but that he appears to be a saint compared to the baseball coach. We know some kids on the baseball team and it is clear they don’t respect him. They make fun of him, roll there eyes at him, and we always wonder why they would want to play for him. But before I let Sal off the hook, I think the biggest disappointment is that SJC has hired two low character individuals to coach their teams.

+100. I can't imagine anyone spending 15 minutes either 1) interviewing or 2) checking any parent references or 3) watching a game/practice and coming away saying this is a person who character aligns with SJC.

We met with Coach Gibbs when our son was an 8th grader. When we walked out of his "clubhouse" I'm not sure who said "hell no" first -- me, my husband or my son. I can't imagine a scenario where I would have agreed to put my son in his care for 4 years, especially now that I know he pretty much owns his players year round. PP said something about not being able to imagine coming away saying the coach's character aligns with SJC. If the school is hiring people like the baseball and soccer coach regularly, then maybe that speaks to the character of the school. Sports factory > catholic values.

All this said, SJC continues to get the largest pool of applicants. If it's so horrible, why are 1200 plus applying for 1/5 the # of slots?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One thing I can assure you, many of the parents in this thread -- and they are identifiable to those in the relevant community based on their comments -- are the worst sort of little-league-parents-on-steroids. I certainly don't agree with all of the policies of certain of the coaches mentioned in this thread, but they tell you of those policies before you sign up. If you don't like the policy, then don't attend that school. But the sanctimony of some of you, the fundamental lack of self-awareness, is awe-inspiring. When you stop living your life through your child, then I might start listening to you on the topic of morality in sports.

I'm thinking that it would be very difficult to identify the parents who are outraged by the baseball shenanigans at St. Johns, since that would likely be about 99% of the people who know or learn about the extreme conflict of interest. But identifying people who actually support the baseball coaches and their enablers should be quite easy.