US vs Thailand

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really don't think most people have seen the brackets. The US is in Group F with Chile, Sweden, and Thailand. The top TWO teams advance. If a team wins all three matches there are NO goal differential used. They would have 9 points (3 points for a win and 1 for a tie). If the US beats Sweden they will end up in first place. If the US loses to Sweden they will end up in second place and advance. The ONLY scenario where goal differential matters is if they tie Sweden. Then they would use goal differential. And because there are 24 teams to start and they have to go down to 16 teams then 4 third place teams will advance as well. This is different than World Cup where 32 teams start and only the top two teams advance.

However, if you look at the knock out stage, the US got a really easy draw! 24 teams start out
First place of Group F (US, Sweden, Thailand, Chile) plays 2nd place team of Group B (Germany, Spain, South Africa, China)

The SECOND place team in Group F will play the SECOND place team of E (New Zealand, Cameron, Canada, Netherlands). This is different than in the men's word cup because twop third place teams will advance.

So there was NO reason to score over 10 goals. And the celebrating that went along with it is ridiculous.

And to continue looking strategically at the brackets. It might be better for the US to finish second in group F. If they win they will play either Spain or Germany- two tough teams who are playing right now. Then if they win they will probably have to play France (they are hosting so have huge advantage). So running up the score strategically was an awful idea. It is like another poster said the US team plays checkers while others play chess. No way is Sweden going to score over 13 even if Thailand walks off the field. So people need to stop bringing up goal differential as a reason they ran up the score. Strategically it was the wrong thing to do.

On the other hand, some teams play better as underdogs, some teams play better when they're on a roll. That can play into whether one wants to finish 2nd or 3rd in Olympics badminton... (I think it's badminton that got all the bad press for countries basically throwing matches to try to get easier paths through the finals).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Male athletes usually do not act like this in situations like this

In discussions online in other places, I've seen lots of cases of superior teams running the score up but not celebrating at all

They don’t? So is this a female thing or just particular to a few specific people who happen to be women?

No, they don't. I do not watch enough blowouts in women's sports to know how many women on average celebrate with such little class, but my guess is this team is worse than average.

My post was in response to the PP who said this: "Never have I seen such outrage directed toward male athletes."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really don't think most people have seen the brackets. The US is in Group F with Chile, Sweden, and Thailand. The top TWO teams advance. If a team wins all three matches there are NO goal differential used. They would have 9 points (3 points for a win and 1 for a tie). If the US beats Sweden they will end up in first place. If the US loses to Sweden they will end up in second place and advance. The ONLY scenario where goal differential matters is if they tie Sweden. Then they would use goal differential. And because there are 24 teams to start and they have to go down to 16 teams then 4 third place teams will advance as well. This is different than World Cup where 32 teams start and only the top two teams advance.

However, if you look at the knock out stage, the US got a really easy draw! 24 teams start out
First place of Group F (US, Sweden, Thailand, Chile) plays 2nd place team of Group B (Germany, Spain, South Africa, China)

The SECOND place team in Group F will play the SECOND place team of E (New Zealand, Cameron, Canada, Netherlands). This is different than in the men's word cup because twop third place teams will advance.

So there was NO reason to score over 10 goals. And the celebrating that went along with it is ridiculous.

There is always a reason to score more goals if you are a professional player, regardless of whether goal differential will come into play for advancement. Every player in the World Cup is trying to build their resume to help with future contracts and endorsement deals. Many of them will get bonuses based on honors like Golden Boot or Golden Ball. Others will just be adding to their soccer resume, and a high number of total goals scored in a WC will be a very nice thing to list so you have to get them when you can. Others, like Morgan, will be shooting for US or world records in categories like most goals scored in a game, most goals scored in a WC, and most goals scored in a career. All of those things will not just help for future earnings and jobs after they retire, but also for posterity.

Soooo it wasn't about goal differential and advancing to them at all then. It was about personal achievements and incentives. Got it.

There’s truth to both, and both are legitimate reasons to drive up the score. The belief that team sports are only about the team and not the individuals that comprise the team is naive.

When one is celebrating a 9th or 10th goal it is no longer about celebrating advancing. It is celebrating PERSONAL achievement and that is why the celebrations were over the top and selfish.

The celebrations are a separate issue, and I happen to agree with you on that front. But my comments were in response to this comment "So there was NO reason to score over 10 goals." As stated above, there are many good reasons for players to try to score when they can.

And I have repeatedly stated over and over it isn’t about the goals. There is only one poster in here who has banged the pull back drum and they are not wrong in Spirit just pragmatism. The US will not need that level of differential to advance so the argument does ring a bit hollow even if it is true. But the defenders are conflating attacks on the celebrations as attacks on the aggressiveness and box score. They are not the same issues.

And so far, the only person willing to provide details has said Rapinoe's celebration was over the top, and then only because they were so far ahead when she celebrated.

So people are criticizing the entire team for one player's 2 seconds. They're criticizing one possible error out of an long, intense game. And tarring the team with it.

Sportsmanship? Respect? Class? None's on show here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I support the women’s team but I do worry that whether or not people agree with how this particular game was played/celebrated, the debate will ultimately detract from their victories moving forward, no matter how well they play. I’ll also be curious to see how individual players choose to celebrate in future games. Will they give in to the detractors or will they continue to express themselves freely? Should be interesting.

I think future games will be far more competitive and this will not be an issue. But they did bring some unnecessary scrutiny on themselves in an otherwise flawless opening game.

But it is about context. I think most felt the over/under on this game against Thailand would have been at 5. So they were heavy favorites going in so act like it when you do win and you were expected to win big. This was not 13-0 against Germany so pump the breaks.

People are the worst. They brought this on themselves?! No! Busybody snowflakes are the ones melting down over this. They are the only ones with a problem. Why is everyone obsessed with controlling women.

Right, because it seems like most people are concerned primarily with the goal celebration choices and not the high score. When you focus on that, and say that the players should have reacted differently than they did, you’re basically saying that the women should’ve conducted themselves with more restraint. Despite the fact that this is the pinnacle of their careers, adrenaline is flowing, their team is advancing, and the player is one of the best in the world, restrain yourself. It’s not dignified or ladylike to show such exuberance toward your achievement without considering how this might affect your opponents’ emotional state. Never have I seen such outrage directed toward male athletes.

Well if the USMNT ever beats anyone by that large a margin we’ll all find out together.

The emotions or heat of the moment are not really proper defenses for personal actions.

Except the culture of soccer is goal celebrations.

So why expect the US team to show restraint when that is not expected of anyone else?

When the NFL decided it was getting out of hand, they did something about it. Here, rather than criticize FIFA for allowing excessive celebration, you criticize these women for taking part in the culture of their sport.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Male athletes usually do not act like this in situations like this

In discussions online in other places, I've seen lots of cases of superior teams running the score up but not celebrating at all

Are you nuts?

You haven't watched soccer if you think the men don't celebrate. Even in unbalanced games.

[Anonymous]

US citizens complaining that THEIR national team were celebrating their historic record breaking win with every goal. That's all it takes to get you mad?

They didnt play dirty
They didnt taunt
They didnt disrespect the referees
They didnt disrespect the other team

They celebrated their accomplishments and your mad.

That tells me all I need to know about you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thought exercise: Did anyone ever criticize these Super Bowl winners for continuing to score?

https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/02/05/biggest-blowouts-super-bowl-history

That is the finals of that chosen sport. Do those players celebrate when they pummel say a bottom ranked Cleveland of hte past decade or a late 70's early 80's Saints or the 80's Buccaneers? No, because they know they are supposed to beat those teams.

Yesterday was not the World Cup finals and your comparing their celebrations to Super Bowl games demonstrates that you don't understand the difference.

So as a Marylander, can I call out all the teams that have crushed the Orioles this season for being unsportsmanlike? Everyone knows we're rebuilding. They could beat us by a couple of runs. Beating us by so many is trashy. Right?

It isn't about the score. It is celebrating single game, double digit goals as if you WON the World Cup.

Do you realize that winning the World Cup is a very rare thing? And that airplane arms, jump-hugging a teammate, dancing, running up to a teammate and congratulating her, all of those are perfectly normal, ordinary things in games that are much, much less important than a World Cup game? These are the final games before the World Cup. It's huge. It's a tremendously big deal. This is what these women have been working for their whole lives. Most World Cup players don't score goals. Most World Cup players don't make it into the final game. Scoring a goal in a game, even not in the final, is a huge accomplishment.

If you don't understand that, your criticism of these women is based on an ignorance that renders your opinion entirely meaningless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Male athletes usually do not act like this in situations like this

In discussions online in other places, I've seen lots of cases of superior teams running the score up but not celebrating at all

They don’t? So is this a female thing or just particular to a few specific people who happen to be women?

No, they don't. I do not watch enough blowouts in women's sports to know how many women on average celebrate with such little class, but my guess is this team is worse than average.

My post was in response to the PP who said this: "Never have I seen such outrage directed toward male athletes."

Go spend some time on youtube watching men's soccer. You'll realize that male soccer players do indeed celebrate goals. And that within the range of "celebrating goals" even Rapinoe - the celebration that is being criticized here and being used to insult and demean the entire team - isn't out of bounds.

[Anonymous]

Mercy will be shown to those that ask for it. Thialand didn't ask for it so they didn't receive it. Next time they can quit if they want

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:US citizens complaining that THEIR national team were celebrating their historic record breaking win with every goal. That's all it takes to get you mad?

They didnt play dirty
They didnt taunt
They didnt disrespect the referees
They didnt disrespect the other team

They celebrated their accomplishments and your mad.

That tells me all I need to know about you.

Not many here are "mad." We support our national team. I know I do. But I don't support the level of celebration after going up over eight goals as though each goal had just won the world cup.

No class. Not angry. Maybe a little disappointed. But a fact, nonetheless.

Hopefully doesn't come back to haunt us.

[Anonymous]

Same goof balls complaining about excessive celebrations are the same ones with the "my kid is great" bumper sticker plastered on their hybrid and relentlessly posting on social media about their kids academic and athletic prowess.

"karen got 6 goals during their u9 debut this weekend" #thatsmygirl #futureUSWNT #cantstopwontstop #killshot #littleballer #hatersgoingtohate #ballersgoingtoball #whosyourdaddy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I support the women’s team but I do worry that whether or not people agree with how this particular game was played/celebrated, the debate will ultimately detract from their victories moving forward, no matter how well they play. I’ll also be curious to see how individual players choose to celebrate in future games. Will they give in to the detractors or will they continue to express themselves freely? Should be interesting.

I think future games will be far more competitive and this will not be an issue. But they did bring some unnecessary scrutiny on themselves in an otherwise flawless opening game.

But it is about context. I think most felt the over/under on this game against Thailand would have been at 5. So they were heavy favorites going in so act like it when you do win and you were expected to win big. This was not 13-0 against Germany so pump the breaks.

People are the worst. They brought this on themselves?! No! Busybody snowflakes are the ones melting down over this. They are the only ones with a problem. Why is everyone obsessed with controlling women.

Right, because it seems like most people are concerned primarily with the goal celebration choices and not the high score. When you focus on that, and say that the players should have reacted differently than they did, you’re basically saying that the women should’ve conducted themselves with more restraint. Despite the fact that this is the pinnacle of their careers, adrenaline is flowing, their team is advancing, and the player is one of the best in the world, restrain yourself. It’s not dignified or ladylike to show such exuberance toward your achievement without considering how this might affect your opponents’ emotional state. Never have I seen such outrage directed toward male athletes.

Well if the USMNT ever beats anyone by that large a margin we’ll all find out together.

The emotions or heat of the moment are not really proper defenses for personal actions.

These are grown women. They don't have sh*t to defend to anyone. They are not children to be scolded about their behavior. Do you guys even listen to yourselves?! WTAF.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Male athletes usually do not act like this in situations like this

Hahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

In fact, the men have never beaten anyone by that kind of margin before, so it's tough to say, ain't it?

In fact, NO team has ever beaten any other team by that margin in a world cup before.

It's unprecedented. Records broken:

- Most goals scored by a team in a World Cup match — men's or women's
- Largest margin of victory in a World Cup match
- Tie: Most goals scored by a player in a World Cup match

And also -- as it turns out! -- most celebrations

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Male athletes usually do not act like this in situations like this

In discussions online in other places, I've seen lots of cases of superior teams running the score up but not celebrating at all

Are you nuts?

You haven't watched soccer if you think the men don't celebrate. Even in unbalanced games.

Men don't celebrate like this in games as unbalanced as this

[Anonymous]

the person said people wouldn't react this strongly if men celebrated like this. Well, yes they would. But you can't really find examples of it