When marriage therapy brings out deep issues

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH and I are getting ready to begin couples therapy. We've been doing a better job of communicating with one another, talking about a lot of stuff over the last couple weeks that has built up over time. He says he wants to bring up some of this stuff before we start therapy so it doesn't just become one big unproductive, unloading session for us which I think makes sense.

I am trying to make sure I am open to hearing him and not criticizing or diminishing his feelings. However, some things he said recently about his feelings seemed way out in left field for me. For instance, he said he has to this day a deep distrust because years ago I remained friends with a guy I dated before DH, and DH thought that I was still having sex with that guy while we were dating, which I was not and assured him of without hesitation. I don't know how to explain it but hearing that made me so confused -- I keep thinking about it and wondering how he could be with me this whole time thinking I had cheated on him or been interested in other people...? Without bringing it up?

It's hard to hear that, sure, but more importantly for me, how can I even change to help him trust me when I didn't actually do what he imagines I did? It has been literally almost 10 years since I've seen the old friend, and completely cut him out like 2-3 years ago because he's a douche and I have told DH I should've done that years before but even then, all we ever did was talk maybe once a year if that.

Maybe I'm focusing too much on this one thing but also I am now a bit concerned about what other things will come up in therapy that were just not even close to my radar as far as our relationship is concerned. How can we work through very deep things like this?

OP, you may not like to hear this, but you bear some responsibility in this situation. You kept a former romantic partner around for years while in a relationship with your DH, which is likely going to create some amount of unease. Why was the former romantic partner so important to you that you didn't cut them loose when you became serious with DH?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:... I remained friends with a guy I dated before DH

It has been literally almost 10 years since I've seen the old friend, and completely cut him out like 2-3 years ago because he's a douche and I have told DH I should've done that years before but even then, all we ever did was talk maybe once a year if that.

OP, you may not like to hear this, but you bear some responsibility in this situation. You kept a former romantic partner around for years while in a relationship with your DH, which is likely going to create some amount of unease. Why was the former romantic partner so important to you that you didn't cut them loose when you became serious with DH?

I was young and stupid and inexperienced in relationships, and I was close friends with this guy and felt it would be unfair and mean and wrong to just stop being friends with him because a relationship didn’t work out. I still liked him as a friend, and he was part of a group of 4 or 5 of us who were close friends in college. It’s taken me time to realize who real friends are. I met DH and fell in love with him completely and have been dating, engaged, or married to him for almost 20 years. During that time though, it feels like he was living in a partial alternate reality where I would occasionally be with this person? It just kind of blows my mind, and I’m trying to accept that it’s his feelings and perceptions regardless of its basis in reality.

Now that I realize how much it impacted DH, it was completely not worth staying friends with the guy, who as I mentioned, I’ve barely seen or spoken to for many years, and completely cutoff a few years back. During this conversation I told DH this and acknowledged that his friendship wasn’t worth it, in hindsight.

But part of the issue is I had **no idea** it was bothering DH so deeply for nearly 2 decades. I knew DH never really liked him but if you had told me it’s because DH thought I was intermittently having sex with the guy outside our relationship and marriage I would have been absolutely floored. It was also in this conversation that he said part of him is upset that he apparently felt so strongly about it and I “never noticed.”

I’m not blameless but I’m definitely confused by this sharp left turn in our relationship work.

[Anonymous]

OP, I have been on the other side of your problem and I empathize with your DH.

My DH maintained contact, some of which crossed boundaries (flirting in emails/social media), with two old girlfriends long into our marriage. When I explained that this was disrespectful of our marriage, DH initial reaction was defensive, asserting that they were harmless friends and that I was overreacting. This reaction by DH caused me to question myself - whether I was overreacting - so I kept quiet about it for years. It took individual therapy for me to normalize my feelings and reactions and discuss again with DH. Older now and long married, we were in a better position to understand.

So, what you see as a "sharp turn" may have been a long covered up grievance by your DH that he kept hidden exactly because of your earlier reactions that what you were doing by maintaining this relationship was completely harmless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I have been on the other side of your problem and I empathize with your DH.

My DH maintained contact, some of which crossed boundaries (flirting in emails/social media), with two old girlfriends long into our marriage. When I explained that this was disrespectful of our marriage, DH initial reaction was defensive, asserting that they were harmless friends and that I was overreacting. This reaction by DH caused me to question myself - whether I was overreacting - so I kept quiet about it for years. It took individual therapy for me to normalize my feelings and reactions and discuss again with DH. Older now and long married, we were in a better position to understand.

So, what you see as a "sharp turn" may have been a long covered up grievance by your DH that he kept hidden exactly because of your earlier reactions that what you were doing by maintaining this relationship was completely harmless.

Facebook is the devil. Stop flirting with old high school boyfriends/friends.

[Anonymous]

"The source of your DH's problem rests not with you in ANY way, but deep within himself, with his deep-seated insecurities."

Listen to this, OP

It is so not okay to dredge up stuff from the past as a way of dealing with the current situation, and to hold resentments fo a decade because you didn't read his mind!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I have been on the other side of your problem and I empathize with your DH.

My DH maintained contact, some of which crossed boundaries (flirting in emails/social media), with two old girlfriends long into our marriage. When I explained that this was disrespectful of our marriage, DH initial reaction was defensive, asserting that they were harmless friends and that I was overreacting. This reaction by DH caused me to question myself - whether I was overreacting - so I kept quiet about it for years. It took individual therapy for me to normalize my feelings and reactions and discuss again with DH. Older now and long married, we were in a better position to understand.

So, what you see as a "sharp turn" may have been a long covered up grievance by your DH that he kept hidden exactly because of your earlier reactions that what you were doing by maintaining this relationship was completely harmless.

NP - but did this "normalization" involve you realizing that these feelings were due to your own insecurities and that you needed to get over it? Or did "normalizing" involve you finally getting him to acknowledge that he needed to cut off these old friends?

I ask because it seems to me that it is silly that people cannot remain friends with old flames, and it seems to me that the insecure person needs to get over it.

[Anonymous]

OP, you may also find out that you, too, are holding on to things without even realizing it. I went to therapy (alone) to deal with one thing and found myself sobbing over something hurtful my DH had done a couple of years previously that had never been resolved fully; we just moved past it. I thought I'd gotten over it and we certainly never talked about it, nor did I think about it much, consciously, but it was still there. If your DH is able to compartmentalize and tuck something away, I could see him holding onto this in a way that you wouldn't realize unless the subject came up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I have been on the other side of your problem and I empathize with your DH.

My DH maintained contact, some of which crossed boundaries (flirting in emails/social media), with two old girlfriends long into our marriage. When I explained that this was disrespectful of our marriage, DH initial reaction was defensive, asserting that they were harmless friends and that I was overreacting. This reaction by DH caused me to question myself - whether I was overreacting - so I kept quiet about it for years. It took individual therapy for me to normalize my feelings and reactions and discuss again with DH. Older now and long married, we were in a better position to understand.

So, what you see as a "sharp turn" may have been a long covered up grievance by your DH that he kept hidden exactly because of your earlier reactions that what you were doing by maintaining this relationship was completely harmless.

NP - but did this "normalization" involve you realizing that these feelings were due to your own insecurities and that you needed to get over it? Or did "normalizing" involve you finally getting him to acknowledge that he needed to cut off these old friends?

I ask because it seems to me that it is silly that people cannot remain friends with old flames, and it seems to me that the insecure person needs to get over it.

That's not insecurity, Hon. 'Old flames' are kept in the past. Did your father exchange frequent messages with his lover before your mother? I know neither of my parents did and I do not think it is normal or healthy for a marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I have been on the other side of your problem and I empathize with your DH.

My DH maintained contact, some of which crossed boundaries (flirting in emails/social media), with two old girlfriends long into our marriage. When I explained that this was disrespectful of our marriage, DH initial reaction was defensive, asserting that they were harmless friends and that I was overreacting. This reaction by DH caused me to question myself - whether I was overreacting - so I kept quiet about it for years. It took individual therapy for me to normalize my feelings and reactions and discuss again with DH. Older now and long married, we were in a better position to understand.

So, what you see as a "sharp turn" may have been a long covered up grievance by your DH that he kept hidden exactly because of your earlier reactions that what you were doing by maintaining this relationship was completely harmless.

NP - but did this "normalization" involve you realizing that these feelings were due to your own insecurities and that you needed to get over it? Or did "normalizing" involve you finally getting him to acknowledge that he needed to cut off these old friends?

I ask because it seems to me that it is silly that people cannot remain friends with old flames, and it seems to me that the insecure person needs to get over it.

PP here - my DH kept in touch with lots of old female friends, including ones he had dated, with no issues - I am not that insecure or controlling, but the "normalization" I had to come to was that the inappropriate boundary crossing with these two specific women was a different matter and DH acknowledged that this contact was unhealthy and needed to stop. Prior to that, I let DH's defensiveness that nothing was wrong - a little "harmless" flirting never hurt anyone kind of attitude - make me feel like I was over-reacting. As someone above said, Facebook is the devil!

[Anonymous]

Sometimes people who have themselves cheated will project onto their spouse as a way of rationalizing or justifying their own conduct. I hope this is not the case for you but please be aware of this dynamic as you head into therapy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I have been on the other side of your problem and I empathize with your DH.

My DH maintained contact, some of which crossed boundaries (flirting in emails/social media), with two old girlfriends long into our marriage. When I explained that this was disrespectful of our marriage, DH initial reaction was defensive, asserting that they were harmless friends and that I was overreacting. This reaction by DH caused me to question myself - whether I was overreacting - so I kept quiet about it for years. It took individual therapy for me to normalize my feelings and reactions and discuss again with DH. Older now and long married, we were in a better position to understand.

So, what you see as a "sharp turn" may have been a long covered up grievance by your DH that he kept hidden exactly because of your earlier reactions that what you were doing by maintaining this relationship was completely harmless.

This is oP, thank you for your perspective. I can see what you mean, definitely. I mentioned to DH during our conversation that I could see how it would be a tough position because, especially when we were young and dating, I doubt trying to make some ultimatum about my relationship or friendship would not have gone well. So I imagine he felt he had to keep it inside to a point. I tried to make a special point of not feeling like he was accusing me and not getting defensive and jumping to things that you describe, like "you're crazy" or "how could you think I would do that." I do not want to get into that trap -- we are already in some cycles and dysfunctional patterns we are trying to break.

[Anonymous]

OP - PP above who empathized with your DH.

Don't beat yourself up - marriages are imperfect and so are the people in them. The best you can hope for is to continue growing together - and that means changing some behaviors, apologizing for past behaviors and attitudes. You should be glad DH feels secure enough to tell you about this feeling he has held in for so long - that is hard to do.

[Anonymous]

I agree 100 percent with the poster who says that you need to question why you held onto an old boyfriend, when you and your husband got serious. She’s got some real good insights.

Even if you didn’t cheat, and I’ll accept that you didn’t, how did you treat your husband? It can be infuriating to have your spouse act as if your oppinions don’t matter or are less important then an oppisite sex friend. Things like scrolling on social media and a topic comes up and your spouse says “Well, Bill thinks…” and you say “I think he’s wrong” and the spouse says “But how would you know…” like you don’t have the right to have your oppinion unless it aligns perfectly with this friend.

It’s also upsetting to see your spouse like or comment on posts involving things you can’t or don’t want to do like “Bill took such an amazing trip” and you say “Well, I’d like too, but you always say we don’t have the money” or “I’d get involved with a similar activity, but our kids come home from school when that activity is available so I can’t”

In other words, you can have behaved appropriately in every conventional sense and still managed to make your spouse feel terrible.

Think too about when you and this friend interacted, would it have been difficult for an outside observer to know which guy was your romantic partner?

Also, it’s very possible this friend may have outright told your husband or implied that the two of you were sleeping together. It doesn’t mean you were, it just means that that is what your husband thinks happened.

If he is otherwise a nice person, and isn’t accusing you of sleeping with a random Starbucks barista or the hanyman who helps your grandma, or that you really aren’t at work because you didn’t answer when he called you, assume (since you chose to marry and stay married) that something is giving him his data. It’s either something you are doing, maybe not even something you are aware you are doing, something this friend is doing, or a combination of the two. Your husband gave a specific name and a specific time period, keep that in mind. It doesn’t matter so much what you did or didn’t do with the other guy, it’s all about how it made him feel.

Know too that while you say you would never cheat, you were willing to hang onto this friendship. Do some self-relection. You may not cheat now because of what you learned from this experience, but you didn’t know all this when it was going on, meaning that you would have been capable of cheating.

Finally, you don’t have to go to marriage therapy unless you want to. Your husband doesn’t either. Think about if it would be better for the two of you to hold hands, go on dates, be nice to each other, put each other first. He needs time to get to know and trust you again.

Know too that if he’s crazy or nasty as some posters have suggested, you are free to divorce him. It isn’t fair to remain married and treat him like he’s a nutcase. From where I sit, you made some poor choices that ended up mistreating him.You can always reevaluate later, but this is what you’ve got if your narative is accurate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes people who have themselves cheated will project onto their spouse as a way of rationalizing or justifying their own conduct. I hope this is not the case for you but please be aware of this dynamic as you head into therapy.

I had a boyfriend do this when we were in college. He kept talking about being afraid I’d be interested in someone else, when in reality he was the one who was contemplating and then starting a relationship with another girl. It was a long time though before I figured out what had happened.

[Anonymous]

You are thinking too much about this one thing.

I think perhaps you nervous about what else is in his head.

Hopefully, once you start therapy, you will be less anxious.