Lottery is Off the Table

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Now they'll devise a plan designed to increase URM in a more targeted manner, while still maintaining high merit-based academic standards.

These things can't exist currently and are in direct competition with each other.

I hope they can exist in the future by reforming AAP to be truly for the gifted instead of overwhelmed with well off whites and asians who are above average but aren't gifted in many cases.

How do you identify "truly gifted"?

Good question. I don't know.

I'll leave that to professionals. I would scrap appeals thought because again that's just a backdoor for pushy parents to cheat the system

If the focus is really equity I would argue the fairest thing to do is take students who are more than 3 standard deviations above the average person in a school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

Really? What's wrong with the culture? And how is telling the URMs the only way they'll get into TJ is if there's a random lottery supposed to improve things?

Because the reason that there are so few URMs at TJ is because they don't want to go there, not because there are no qualified URMs. In its current form, it is unattractive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

You understand that language is code for anti Asian American racism, right? The culture of the school is fine or even better. You have no direct knowledge of the school’s culture yet freely speak about it.

More directly: The culture of the school is cheating. It needs to be fixed. By a lottery or another way. Fixing the culture benefits all students, Asian American and everyone.

The culture of the school is achieving.

Introducing a bunch of unprepared students into the school with a challenging curriculum is a recipe for far more cheating than exists today.

Take your anti-Asian BS elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

Really? What's wrong with the culture? And how is telling the URMs the only way they'll get into TJ is if there's a random lottery supposed to improve things?

Because the reason that there are so few URMs at TJ is because they don't want to go there, not because there are no qualified URMs. In its current form, it is unattractive.

That must be why at the schools that don't have the terrible culture of TJ the percentage of URMs enrolled in challenging courses is much lower than the percentage of Asian and white kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

You understand that language is code for anti Asian American racism, right? The culture of the school is fine or even better. You have no direct knowledge of the school’s culture yet freely speak about it.

More directly: The culture of the school is cheating. It needs to be fixed. By a lottery or another way. Fixing the culture benefits all students, Asian American and everyone.

Cheating is NOT the culture at TJ! And stop implying that all Asians cheat! There are hundreds of whites at TJ. Some of the whites cheat, but not all. Same with Asians. Just stop it with the lies, you racist SOB!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

You understand that language is code for anti Asian American racism, right? The culture of the school is fine or even better. You have no direct knowledge of the school’s culture yet freely speak about it.

More directly: The culture of the school is cheating. It needs to be fixed. By a lottery or another way. Fixing the culture benefits all students, Asian American and everyone.

There is far less cheating at TJ than a base schools.

[Anonymous]

Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

Really? What's wrong with the culture? And how is telling the URMs the only way they'll get into TJ is if there's a random lottery supposed to improve things?

Because the reason that there are so few URMs at TJ is because they don't want to go there, not because there are no qualified URMs. In its current form, it is unattractive.

That must be why at the schools that don't have the terrible culture of TJ the percentage of URMs enrolled in challenging courses is much lower than the percentage of Asian and white kids.

I'll just come out and say what we all know to be true. Currently, you won't get more URM there unless you lower standards because URM aren't in as many advanced classes and therefore aren't as prepared and by extension aren't as qualified.

The only way to "fix" this is to give more URM more opportunities earlier on. One way to do that is to tweak AAP so you build a more diverse pipeline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

because we all know the answer to this already and no one on this woke board wants to face facts.

See my other post above as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

We have a very good idea. They do not want to spend time and effort to get in, work like crazy and likely end up with average grades and damage their chanced at good colleges after all that effort even if the percentage of them goes up to ten percent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

The AP and IB schools with the highest percentage of Black students (Hayfield and Mount Vernon) have the lowest AP participation and IB diploma rates in FCPS. On the AP side, next lowest to Hayfield is Falls Church, which has a low Black enrollment but is heavily Hispanic.

Any admissions process in FCPS structured to admit the highest achieving students will lead to a school that is heavily Asian with a low Black and Hispanic enrollment.

That is painful, so the School Board members who don't like it want to turn TJ into a demonstration project that a more representative student body can still attend a STEM-focused school. They can do this, but it means they will end up making more subjective and SES-weighted assessments about "aptitude," and TJ will end up the HS version of the magnet arts and sciences programs at Bailey's and Hunter's Woods ES.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They should still allow 20% of the students from each region. They can do it using the application process but each region in FCPS should receive 20% of the slots.

It’s not good enough for the School Board members who know some pyramids within a region have stronger students than others.

Something has to give. This is a lot better than a lottery.

But it all starts in elementary school - that is where the resources should be spent.

There is a fight for the really talented URMs by the time you get to high school - regional privates, boarding schools, etc. If they are talented and financially constrained, they can go to these schools for free. They are much better represented in those schools.

You all are ignoring the other elephant.

The culture of the school needs to be fixed. A change in admissions to a lottery would accomplish this. If not a lottery, then a different change will be needed.

I have a STEM background. I do not have children at TJ, but I am lucky to have passed paths with many TJ graduates, who went to IVY league schools or MIT. Just like the student body, most are Asian, but some are White, and one was AA. I have worked day to day with them during and after college. They are a good bunch and work hard. Perhaps, only the good and only those who work hard make it to me, but that is the sample I have gotten to work with. So there is that.

I do find it troublesome to hear about anecdotes about the school. Perhaps it is bad apples, perhaps it is more systematic. Or perhaps things have gotten worse in the past couple of years. Whatever it is, it would be good to address these problems in a targeted fashion instead of a lottery. At least to me, I have found that many TJ students are solid contributors to society and the STEM profession. They are also of integrity and highly intelligent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

We have a very good idea. They do not want to spend time and effort to get in, work like crazy and likely end up with average grades and damage their chanced at good colleges after all that effort even if the percentage of them goes up to ten percent.

"You really don't want to buy in our neighborhood. I'm sure you'd be more comfortable in that other area where there are already more Black people."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

We have a very good idea. They do not want to spend time and effort to get in, work like crazy and likely end up with average grades and damage their chanced at good colleges after all that effort even if the percentage of them goes up to ten percent.

That's an oversimplified explanation. There's so much more involved but I doubt you'd care to dig deeper into the reasons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone ever done a study of the percentage of blacks and Hispanics who graduated with a full IB diploma in FCPS? This might shed light on whether open access to a challenging program makes a difference in black/Hispanic enrollment.
Also, is there any study on the percentage of black/Hispanic participation in the STEM academies at Marshall, Chantilly and Edison?

The reason I ask these questions is that no one knows why there is a racial disparity at TJ. There's this assumption that there must be something wrong with the admissions process or school culture, but what if it's another reason? Why is no one doing an objective study on this?

We have a very good idea. They do not want to spend time and effort to get in, work like crazy and likely end up with average grades and damage their chanced at good colleges after all that effort even if the percentage of them goes up to ten percent.

That's an oversimplified explanation. There's so much more involved but I doubt you'd care to dig deeper into the reasons.

Oh I am intimately familiar with TJ and have been for 17 years.