POC and resenting mixed-race relationships

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is sick a sticky ball of wax to unravel and the answer depends on who are you talking to. I am a black woman, married to a black man. My BIL is engaged to a white woman. I am happy for my BIL because he found love, but I am completely honest about the fact that I wish he had found it with a black woman.

Educated black women have a really hard time finding males of any color to settle down with and when even our won don't choose us, it stings. Black women are often considered the least beautiful by men of all races. The standard of beauty in this country does not place us at the top of the heap. In particular black women with darker skin and kinky hair.

Do I resent the white women "taking" black men? It isn't a clear yes or no. It is less about resenting the white woman and more about my heart breaking for all the black women I know who are single and cannot find a partner of any race.

Is is important that BW teach our girls that any man can and will love you.

Black women already know that. What black women need to learn is that we can love any race of man. So many of us have had it drilled into our heads by wary black mothers and territorial black men that to love a non-black man makes a black woman the worst kind of race traitor, while black men can chase non-black women to “get back” at the world that emasculates black men. It is time for black women to move beyond racist indoctrination and stop acting as if non-black, esp white, men are less than human.

I posted that and i agree with you totally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not a POC (and thus will defer to POC on this if they disagree with me), but here's what I've gleaned from reading/listening/learning.

One issue is the legacy of racism and what it means to succeed, in that for a long time so much of success for a POC is the extent to which they are accepted by and integrated into white society. In the eyes of some POC, a POC (especially an affluent/successful POC) marrying a white person can be seen as perpetuating this notion that the goal of POC is to integrate into white society (via marriage) rather than succeed in their own skin.

Another issue is what it does to communities, which still tend to be highly segregated by race. When a POC marries a white person, if they are successful/affluent enough to do so, they tend to move to a whiter/more affluent community rather than staying in a less affluent community with a higher concentration of POC (this happens with POC couples as well, but at a lesser rate than white/POC couples). One effect of this is to remove from the community exactly the kind of people who would be in the best position to invest (not just financially but also with time/effort) in the community and help improve it. Another is that the kinds of people you'd like to have in your community as role models for kids tend not to stick around, and it's a lot harder for young kids trying to find their way out of a cycle of poverty to find an example they know personally of someone who looks like them who has been successful, who's broken the cycle, and who might be able to guide them a bit as they grow up.

Also, the rates of mixed-race marriages tends not to be balanced across the genders. Black men are more likely to marry white women than black women are to marry white men; it's the reverse for hispanic and asian communities. Whatever the reason for that (and there are plenty of factors we could discuss) the end result is that, for instance, black women tend to have a harder time finding a husband/long-term partner, especially one who will contribute positively to a family (both financially and emotionally), when a disproportionate number of black men (especially black men who are more likely to be financially stable and involved partners/parents) are marrying white women, and there's not a commensurate group of white men who would provide the same looking to marry black women.

Black woman here. This an excellent analysis of things from the POC side. I would add that an explanation a black male friend of mine gave me for why black men are hostile to white men dating black women: A lot of BM feel that the love and support of BW is one of the few things they can rely on and take for granted. BW are usually hostile to dating WM as a matter of strongly-held racial loyalty to BM and a lot of BM like it that way. A lot of BM also feel threatened by WM, whom BM perceive as already having “everything.” So, seeing a BW with a WM actives a lot of envy, resentment, and fear on the part of BM. If BM have to compete with WM for BM, they do not feel they will succeed in that struggle.

This is so true. BM would rather see another BW single and unmarried than with a WM.

For some reason, I'm black and don't mind black women married to white men, but hate when black men married to white women. My sister is married to a white guy. I feel like black women tend to be open to dating all kinds of guys, but some black men only seek out white women (my brother). I look at the women and think - you would NEVER date a black woman with those looks and credentials.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are a lot of really excellent, thoughtful comments on this thread.

Agreed! It's as if all the assholes somehow skipped this one!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are a lot of really excellent, thoughtful comments on this thread.

Not really.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I smile at every interracial couple I see. You can't force people to like it, but you can show the couple involved that you support it.

This is very weird.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that when a brown girl marries a white guy, other brown people get offended?

Why is it that when a black man marries a white girl, other black people are angry?

What is it about marrying white that offends other POC?

Speaking as a black woman married to a white man, our worst and most persistent detractors are white women.

I have to agree as a white man thathas dated a few Latinas I have to agree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that when a brown girl marries a white guy, other brown people get offended?

Why is it that when a black man marries a white girl, other black people are angry?

What is it about marrying white that offends other POC?

So I am black woman married to a white man and I was shocked by how nasty some black men were about that. I went to a predominately white high school and ALL of the few black boys that also attended my school openly said they only dated white girls. (Although to be fair one of them is married to a very beautiful, very accomplished black woman...not sure what she sees in him). I think black women frequently get upset because some black men will really openly say that they think that white women are superior for whatever stereotyped reason. I personally think that everyone should just marry whoever they want but you must have some self-hatred reasons if you dislike all women or men that are the same race that you are.

Also, although I am not South Asian, I think it is a little weird and problematic that every show or movie that is successful lately has an South Asian person in a relationship with a white person. Examples being both seasons of Master of None, the Big Sick, and every love interest on the Mindy Project.

Agree with the bolded. I'm white, married to a black man. I dated men of all races when I was single, and met two different black men who proudly announced they only dated white women because black women are all [stupid stereotypes here], ON OUR FIRST DATE. I think they meant it to be a compliment to me (or some kind of coded reassurance? unclear) but both were pretty surprised when I walked out on the date. No one should be constrained in who they can date based on race, but if you have a blanket ban on a certain race (I don't care which one, it doesn't have to be a self-hatred issue) then I assume you're not someone my values line up with very well.

As for the South Asian/white thing -- I felt bad for Kumail Nanjiani because his movie was autobiographical and he got so much flack for reinforcing the stereotype that was started with Mindy & Master of None. But I do understand why people are upset with the trend.

Really? Because I don't and it makes me so angry when people say that movies that look like my marriage are "problematic." Bite me. It's this bizarre #woke racism and it's BS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is sick a sticky ball of wax to unravel and the answer depends on who are you talking to. I am a black woman, married to a black man. My BIL is engaged to a white woman. I am happy for my BIL because he found love, but I am completely honest about the fact that I wish he had found it with a black woman.

Educated black women have a really hard time finding males of any color to settle down with and when even our won don't choose us, it stings. Black women are often considered the least beautiful by men of all races. The standard of beauty in this country does not place us at the top of the heap. In particular black women with darker skin and kinky hair.

Do I resent the white women "taking" black men? It isn't a clear yes or no. It is less about resenting the white woman and more about my heart breaking for all the black women I know who are single and cannot find a partner of any race.

Is is important that BW teach our girls that any man can and will love you.

Black women already know that. What black women need to learn is that we can love any race of man. So many of us have had it drilled into our heads by wary black mothers and territorial black men that to love a non-black man makes a black woman the worst kind of race traitor, while black men can chase non-black women to “get back” at the world that emasculates black men. It is time for black women to move beyond racist indoctrination and stop acting as if non-black, esp white, men are less than human.

Maybe just maybe some people don' t date interracially no because they see other races as sub human, but they simply aren't attracted to them and/or prefer to be with someone of the same cultural background.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not a POC (and thus will defer to POC on this if they disagree with me), but here's what I've gleaned from reading/listening/learning.

One issue is the legacy of racism and what it means to succeed, in that for a long time so much of success for a POC is the extent to which they are accepted by and integrated into white society. In the eyes of some POC, a POC (especially an affluent/successful POC) marrying a white person can be seen as perpetuating this notion that the goal of POC is to integrate into white society (via marriage) rather than succeed in their own skin.

Another issue is what it does to communities, which still tend to be highly segregated by race. When a POC marries a white person, if they are successful/affluent enough to do so, they tend to move to a whiter/more affluent community rather than staying in a less affluent community with a higher concentration of POC (this happens with POC couples as well, but at a lesser rate than white/POC couples). One effect of this is to remove from the community exactly the kind of people who would be in the best position to invest (not just financially but also with time/effort) in the community and help improve it. Another is that the kinds of people you'd like to have in your community as role models for kids tend not to stick around, and it's a lot harder for young kids trying to find their way out of a cycle of poverty to find an example they know personally of someone who looks like them who has been successful, who's broken the cycle, and who might be able to guide them a bit as they grow up.

Also, the rates of mixed-race marriages tends not to be balanced across the genders. Black men are more likely to marry white women than black women are to marry white men; it's the reverse for hispanic and asian communities. Whatever the reason for that (and there are plenty of factors we could discuss) the end result is that, for instance, black women tend to have a harder time finding a husband/long-term partner, especially one who will contribute positively to a family (both financially and emotionally), when a disproportionate number of black men (especially black men who are more likely to be financially stable and involved partners/parents) are marrying white women, and there's not a commensurate group of white men who would provide the same looking to marry black women.

Black woman here. This an excellent analysis of things from the POC side. I would add that an explanation a black male friend of mine gave me for why black men are hostile to white men dating black women: A lot of BM feel that the love and support of BW is one of the few things they can rely on and take for granted. BW are usually hostile to dating WM as a matter of strongly-held racial loyalty to BM and a lot of BM like it that way. A lot of BM also feel threatened by WM, whom BM perceive as already having “everything.” So, seeing a BW with a WM actives a lot of envy, resentment, and fear on the part of BM. If BM have to compete with WM for BM, they do not feel they will succeed in that struggle.

This is so true. BM would rather see another BW single and unmarried than with a WM.

For some reason, I'm black and don't mind black women married to white men, but hate when black men married to white women. My sister is married to a white guy. I feel like black women tend to be open to dating all kinds of guys, but some black men only seek out white women (my brother). I look at the women and think - you would NEVER date a black woman with those looks and credentials.

Some people argue the same thing for black women that date white men. The truth is everyone should be free o date who they want without judgement, but when it comes down to it we all know those couples who are together no because of genuine love but because of stupid stereotypes and thinking having a white partner is a prize and they let thing slide that they wouldn't for someone of their own race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that when a brown girl marries a white guy, other brown people get offended?

Why is it that when a black man marries a white girl, other black people are angry?

What is it about marrying white that offends other POC?

I don't think most people are annoyed by mixed raced relationships. I think what people get annoyed at is people putting down one race to "justify" dating interracially ie Or when people praise mixed relationships and kids as if they are better than not mixed relationships and kids. I think that's what most people get annoyed at.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that when a brown girl marries a white guy, other brown people get offended?

Why is it that when a black man marries a white girl, other black people are angry?

What is it about marrying white that offends other POC?

Speaking as a black woman married to a white man, our worst and most persistent detractors are white women.

I have to agree as a white man thathas dated a few Latinas I have to agree.

I think the biggest detractors are usually the people who are the same gender as you, but the same race as your SO. You're taking one of "their" potential SOs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that when a brown girl marries a white guy, other brown people get offended?

Why is it that when a black man marries a white girl, other black people are angry?

What is it about marrying white that offends other POC?

So I am black woman married to a white man and I was shocked by how nasty some black men were about that. I went to a predominately white high school and ALL of the few black boys that also attended my school openly said they only dated white girls. (Although to be fair one of them is married to a very beautiful, very accomplished black woman...not sure what she sees in him). I think black women frequently get upset because some black men will really openly say that they think that white women are superior for whatever stereotyped reason. I personally think that everyone should just marry whoever they want but you must have some self-hatred reasons if you dislike all women or men that are the same race that you are.

Also, although I am not South Asian, I think it is a little weird and problematic that every show or movie that is successful lately has an South Asian person in a relationship with a white person. Examples being both seasons of Master of None, the Big Sick, and every love interest on the Mindy Project.

Agree with the bolded. I'm white, married to a black man. I dated men of all races when I was single, and met two different black men who proudly announced they only dated white women because black women are all [stupid stereotypes here], ON OUR FIRST DATE. I think they meant it to be a compliment to me (or some kind of coded reassurance? unclear) but both were pretty surprised when I walked out on the date. No one should be constrained in who they can date based on race, but if you have a blanket ban on a certain race (I don't care which one, it doesn't have to be a self-hatred issue) then I assume you're not someone my values line up with very well.

As for the South Asian/white thing -- I felt bad for Kumail Nanjiani because his movie was autobiographical and he got so much flack for reinforcing the stereotype that was started with Mindy & Master of None. But I do understand why people are upset with the trend.

Really? Because I don't and it makes me so angry when people say that movies that look like my marriage are "problematic." Bite me. It's this bizarre #woke racism and it's BS.

Ok, Jan. You realize that the majority of South Asians are married to other South Asians? But I’m glad you can be in the lucky group that gets to see themselves represented in the media.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Ok, Jan. You realize that the majority of South Asians are married to other South Asians? But I’m glad you can be in the lucky group that gets to see themselves represented in the media.

Oh right because otherwise there would be no media churning out thousands of quality movies about South Asian/South Asian couples

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that when a brown girl marries a white guy, other brown people get offended?

Why is it that when a black man marries a white girl, other black people are angry?

What is it about marrying white that offends other POC?

Go away troll

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not a POC (and thus will defer to POC on this if they disagree with me), but here's what I've gleaned from reading/listening/learning.

One issue is the legacy of racism and what it means to succeed, in that for a long time so much of success for a POC is the extent to which they are accepted by and integrated into white society. In the eyes of some POC, a POC (especially an affluent/successful POC) marrying a white person can be seen as perpetuating this notion that the goal of POC is to integrate into white society (via marriage) rather than succeed in their own skin.

Another issue is what it does to communities, which still tend to be highly segregated by race. When a POC marries a white person, if they are successful/affluent enough to do so, they tend to move to a whiter/more affluent community rather than staying in a less affluent community with a higher concentration of POC (this happens with POC couples as well, but at a lesser rate than white/POC couples). One effect of this is to remove from the community exactly the kind of people who would be in the best position to invest (not just financially but also with time/effort) in the community and help improve it. Another is that the kinds of people you'd like to have in your community as role models for kids tend not to stick around, and it's a lot harder for young kids trying to find their way out of a cycle of poverty to find an example they know personally of someone who looks like them who has been successful, who's broken the cycle, and who might be able to guide them a bit as they grow up.

Also, the rates of mixed-race marriages tends not to be balanced across the genders. Black men are more likely to marry white women than black women are to marry white men; it's the reverse for hispanic and asian communities. Whatever the reason for that (and there are plenty of factors we could discuss) the end result is that, for instance, black women tend to have a harder time finding a husband/long-term partner, especially one who will contribute positively to a family (both financially and emotionally), when a disproportionate number of black men (especially black men who are more likely to be financially stable and involved partners/parents) are marrying white women, and there's not a commensurate group of white men who would provide the same looking to marry black women.

Black woman here. This an excellent analysis of things from the POC side. I would add that an explanation a black male friend of mine gave me for why black men are hostile to white men dating black women: A lot of BM feel that the love and support of BW is one of the few things they can rely on and take for granted. BW are usually hostile to dating WM as a matter of strongly-held racial loyalty to BM and a lot of BM like it that way. A lot of BM also feel threatened by WM, whom BM perceive as already having “everything.” So, seeing a BW with a WM actives a lot of envy, resentment, and fear on the part of BM. If BM have to compete with WM for BM, they do not feel they will succeed in that struggle.

This is so true. BM would rather see another BW single and unmarried than with a WM.

Black man, here. In my nearly 50 years I've never encountered a black man who appeared hostile toward, resentful, or envious of black women with white men. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but these theories strike me as way off the mark and out of touch. Fact is, interracial relationships are a pretty popular discussion topic among black people, and harboring disdain toward black women for dating a white man, or black men feeling threatened by white men is not a part of that dialogue. I can say with a hefty degree of confidence that black men, in general, have zero fear of white men - in any capacity.