My parent has gotten sick very fast, other parent in denial, how to pay for nursing home in Virginia

[Anonymous]

Just as a statistical note: the typical stay in an actual nursing home - where skilled nursing is a necessity - is 2 yrs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: - First things first: I know it is tough, but you have to calm down, don't panic. Think things through. You feel pressured and rightly so, but you need to take the time to be the best informed advocate of your parent.

- Contact your local office of aging. Get an appointment. Talk to the social worker there. See what in-home services they can provide your dad IF he were to come home. DO NOT TELL THE HOSPITAL THAT THIS IS AN OPTION!!!

- The hospital should have assigned your dad a social worker, make that person do their job and help you figure out the options available to your dad. Keep in mind that they work for the hospital, so still do not tell them that going home is even a remote option. Let them TELL YOU what the options are.

- The hospital wants him out, they want his bed. They cannot kick him out if he is immobile and has no where to go and no assurance that he is going somehwere he will get care. You need to make it very clear that he cannot go to your house and cannot go home. 'Your mom is elderly and cannot care for him'
- Again: Make the hospital social worker do his/her job

- Apply for medicaid, it is not easy, and your dad needs to basically be flat broke.

- Some nursing homes will take you medicaid pending
- DO NOT SIGN OVER YOUR PARENTS' HOUSE! That is CRAZYYYY! You need to think of the long term future, your mom needs to have somewhere to live.

- Do not believe the nursing homes regarding your parents' house and assets. They want to get paid. Medicaid cannot take your parents' house, if your mom is living in it.

- I REPEAT: THE HOSPITAL CANNOT KICK OUT YOUR DAD IF HE HAS NO WHERE TO GO TO GET CARE!!
BTDT -- and I made them wait, they even wanted my parent out so bad they finally did a psych eval to test his competency, so they could legally release my parent.

- Good Luck!

Forgot to mention regarding medicaid, your dad cannot start signing over assests, giving money to you or your siblings. Medicaid sees that as fraud and it will disqualify him.

And rightfully so. I wouldn't want him being able to give away a bunch of cash and assets before using tax dollars to pay for his care.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: - First things first: I know it is tough, but you have to calm down, don't panic. Think things through. You feel pressured and rightly so, but you need to take the time to be the best informed advocate of your parent.

- Contact your local office of aging. Get an appointment. Talk to the social worker there. See what in-home services they can provide your dad IF he were to come home. DO NOT TELL THE HOSPITAL THAT THIS IS AN OPTION!!!

- The hospital should have assigned your dad a social worker, make that person do their job and help you figure out the options available to your dad. Keep in mind that they work for the hospital, so still do not tell them that going home is even a remote option. Let them TELL YOU what the options are.

- The hospital wants him out, they want his bed. They cannot kick him out if he is immobile and has no where to go and no assurance that he is going somehwere he will get care. You need to make it very clear that he cannot go to your house and cannot go home. 'Your mom is elderly and cannot care for him'
- Again: Make the hospital social worker do his/her job

- Apply for medicaid, it is not easy, and your dad needs to basically be flat broke.

- Some nursing homes will take you medicaid pending
- DO NOT SIGN OVER YOUR PARENTS' HOUSE! That is CRAZYYYY! You need to think of the long term future, your mom needs to have somewhere to live.

- Do not believe the nursing homes regarding your parents' house and assets. They want to get paid. Medicaid cannot take your parents' house, if your mom is living in it.

- I REPEAT: THE HOSPITAL CANNOT KICK OUT YOUR DAD IF HE HAS NO WHERE TO GO TO GET CARE!!
BTDT -- and I made them wait, they even wanted my parent out so bad they finally did a psych eval to test his competency, so they could legally release my parent.

- Good Luck!

Forgot to mention regarding medicaid, your dad cannot start signing over assests, giving money to you or your siblings. Medicaid sees that as fraud and it will disqualify him.

Yup. You have to be savvy to defraud Medicaid. I had a former coworker that started the process of hiding assets about 5 years before Mom moved to a skilled nursing facility

Wow.. Your coworker is an evil, freeloading twat.

[Anonymous]

That 8k/month sounds high. I recently had a family member in a Sunrise facility in northern Virginia and we paid 6k. Both are expensive, but she couldn't toilet or feed herself. Everything ups the cost - how many meds, what can he do for himself vs what does he need, are there cognition issues. Make sure you are precise about what you will need in order to get a real price. Having done this twice now, note also that some of this can be negotiated - eg, community entry fees can be subsidized if they have open rooms they want to fill, etc. good luck. I'm sorry about your dad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:He gets the care he needs until he runs out of money, and then medicaid pays. He needs to move to a facility which accepts medicaid. They probably now need to live separately. As a couple they only have to spend 50% of their assets on his care. You mother will not be destitute. They will spend thru their assets, that's what happens.

STOP SAYING THATTTTTTTTTTTTT!!!
People please get educated!
Medicaid is a program to which you have to apply!!!! It is not a given!
And people can be broker than a joke and get denied!!!!@
What the heck in life just freaking kicks in!!
I know folks mean well, but this advice is just bad and if people follow it they will be in a world of trouble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He gets the care he needs until he runs out of money, and then medicaid pays. He needs to move to a facility which accepts medicaid. They probably now need to live separately. As a couple they only have to spend 50% of their assets on his care. You mother will not be destitute. They will spend thru their assets, that's what happens.

STOP SAYING THATTTTTTTTTTTTT!!!
People please get educated!
Medicaid is a program to which you have to apply!!!! It is not a given!
And people can be broker than a joke and get denied!!!!@
What the heck in life just freaking kicks in!!
I know folks mean well, but this advice is just bad and if people follow it they will be in a world of trouble.

Yes it's hard to get medicaid to pay, but when the person is in the nursing home and runs out of money, medicaid is forced to step in. What is the alternative? Wheeling grandpa onto the street? They can't go after children's money. For our grandparents we have gotten medicaid to pay up when they run out of money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He gets the care he needs until he runs out of money, and then medicaid pays. He needs to move to a facility which accepts medicaid. They probably now need to live separately. As a couple they only have to spend 50% of their assets on his care. You mother will not be destitute. They will spend thru their assets, that's what happens.

STOP SAYING THATTTTTTTTTTTTT!!!
People please get educated!
Medicaid is a program to which you have to apply!!!! It is not a given!
And people can be broker than a joke and get denied!!!!@
What the heck in life just freaking kicks in!!
I know folks mean well, but this advice is just bad and if people follow it they will be in a world of trouble.

Yes it's hard to get medicaid to pay, but when the person is in the nursing home and runs out of money, medicaid is forced to step in. What is the alternative? Wheeling grandpa onto the street? They can't go after children's money. For our grandparents we have gotten medicaid to pay up when they run out of money.

I am not being a smart ass, I swear I am not, so please understand me when I tell you that you are dead wrong. Medicaid is not a program that just finds people and who have run out of money and just pays their bills. There is nothing no where in this country where some program just ups and pays your bill because you cannot. It is a program to which you need to apply. It is a tedious process, and you can get denied. Yes, you can not have funds and be broke and sick and your medicaid application be denied. And if you do not think a nursing home will not come after you for unpaid bills, you need to look up filial support laws.
And if you do not think they will not kick people out, then your also mistaken. Not only that, look up some stories of places where people have put their loved ones that are medicaid pending, or take all medicaid and how some of these people are treated at some of these facilities.

[Anonymous]

What is the housing situation for your mom. Can she move into a smaller place? I think you have to go with the idea your father will need skilled care. How much is savings? Your mom should have access to half of their joint funds. You need to see an eldercare lawyer/ financial planner who can give you options. I'm thinking mom moves into smaller place, sell that boat and their home. Start cashing out 401K to pay for care. I don't know why people are surprised that they have to spend a lot of money at the end of life. I'm sorry for this situation. Talk to your mom about what assets they have.

[Anonymous]

I would call the local senior services agency where your parents reside and they can point you in the right direction. My Mom spent $30,000 of her own money in a nursing home after insurance quit paying (hip surgery that left her paralyzed in one leg). We got her home with 24-hour care through an agency called Griswold Home Care that cost half the price of the nursing home. She had a live-in helper and we were waiting to deplete all her cash and then apply for Medicaid, but she passed in February. It was incredibly stressful and I feel your pain OP - it is a nightmare!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He gets the care he needs until he runs out of money, and then medicaid pays. He needs to move to a facility which accepts medicaid. They probably now need to live separately. As a couple they only have to spend 50% of their assets on his care. You mother will not be destitute. They will spend thru their assets, that's what happens.

STOP SAYING THATTTTTTTTTTTTT!!!
People please get educated!
Medicaid is a program to which you have to apply!!!! It is not a given!
And people can be broker than a joke and get denied!!!!@
What the heck in life just freaking kicks in!!
I know folks mean well, but this advice is just bad and if people follow it they will be in a world of trouble.

Yes it's hard to get medicaid to pay, but when the person is in the nursing home and runs out of money, medicaid is forced to step in. What is the alternative? Wheeling grandpa onto the street? They can't go after children's money. For our grandparents we have gotten medicaid to pay up when they run out of money.

I am not being a smart ass, I swear I am not, so please understand me when I tell you that you are dead wrong. Medicaid is not a program that just finds people and who have run out of money and just pays their bills. There is nothing no where in this country where some program just ups and pays your bill because you cannot. It is a program to which you need to apply. It is a tedious process, and you can get denied. Yes, you can not have funds and be broke and sick and your medicaid application be denied. And if you do not think a nursing home will not come after you for unpaid bills, you need to look up filial support laws.
And if you do not think they will not kick people out, then your also mistaken. Not only that, look up some stories of places where people have put their loved ones that are medicaid pending, or take all medicaid and how some of these people are treated at some of these facilities.

No one is assuming that Medicaid just miraculously shows up and starts handing out money. You are a little over the top. And trust me, I think we all know that Medicaid is not the best thing that can happen to you -- it's not the lottery nor does it mean you are entitled to cadillac care.

[Anonymous]

Every state has a SHIP--an agency that helps people on Medicare (if your dad is 71 that very likely includes him) navigate the health care system. They have a lot of familiarity with the rules for dual-eligibles, people who get Medicare and Medicaid. They may be able to advise you.

There is also a group called the National Association of Elder Law Attorneys. They can recommend someone near your parents. Even if they cost you a few thousand dollars, if they save you just a little bit each month (and give you peace of mind) they would be worth it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He gets the care he needs until he runs out of money, and then medicaid pays. He needs to move to a facility which accepts medicaid. They probably now need to live separately. As a couple they only have to spend 50% of their assets on his care. You mother will not be destitute. They will spend thru their assets, that's what happens.

STOP SAYING THATTTTTTTTTTTTT!!!
People please get educated!
Medicaid is a program to which you have to apply!!!! It is not a given!
And people can be broker than a joke and get denied!!!!@
What the heck in life just freaking kicks in!!
I know folks mean well, but this advice is just bad and if people follow it they will be in a world of trouble.

Yes it's hard to get medicaid to pay, but when the person is in the nursing home and runs out of money, medicaid is forced to step in. What is the alternative? Wheeling grandpa onto the street? They can't go after children's money. For our grandparents we have gotten medicaid to pay up when they run out of money.

I am not being a smart ass, I swear I am not, so please understand me when I tell you that you are dead wrong. Medicaid is not a program that just finds people and who have run out of money and just pays their bills. There is nothing no where in this country where some program just ups and pays your bill because you cannot. It is a program to which you need to apply. It is a tedious process, and you can get denied. Yes, you can not have funds and be broke and sick and your medicaid application be denied. And if you do not think a nursing home will not come after you for unpaid bills, you need to look up filial support laws.
And if you do not think they will not kick people out, then your also mistaken. Not only that, look up some stories of places where people have put their loved ones that are medicaid pending, or take all medicaid and how some of these people are treated at some of these facilities.

No one is assuming that Medicaid just miraculously shows up and starts handing out money. You are a little over the top. And trust me, I think we all know that Medicaid is not the best thing that can happen to you -- it's not the lottery nor does it mean you are entitled to cadillac care.

yes they are assuming that did you not read the post to which I was responding????

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will try to keep this as concise as possible. My father had surgery a month ago and has been on a downward spiral fast in decreasing health, he's been in and out of the hospital and rehab facitilities, and now is back in the hospital and they cannot figure what is wrong with him. He is in such intense pain he is completely immobile, cannot dress or feed himself, cannot sit up, walk, etc. Basically he needs 24 hour care which my mother cannot provide (she isn't strong enough to even lift him, etc.). This has all happened so quickly, and my parents both seem to be in denial as to how to care for him. Rehab hospital won't take him, they say he's too sick. The hospital says they can't do anything for him, so he eventually needs to leave (soon) so the options seem to be 24/7 nursing care at home or nursing home. They've been quote $8,000 PER MONTH for both. They cannot afford that. I cannot afford to give them that either. I don't think they would qualify for Medicaid. They are located in Virginia. My father is NOT a vet. They don't live near DC so I am not sure if them moving in with us is a real option.

Has anyone been in similar situation? How did you approach the financial issues for elder care? This literally keeps me up at night, and stresses me all day long. I don't know what to do. Any advice is very much appreciated

The way this works is they go into nursing care and spend every last dollar they have, depleting all assets, until they are bankrupt. Then they qualify for Medicaid, but may be moved to a facility that accepts it.

it sucks, but it's the way it works.

The above is what my grandmotehr had to do when my grandfather had Alzheimers and needed nursing home care many years ago, except that she didn't have to file for bankruptcy. I hope not to end up in the same situation with my parents, as their financial advisor told them that long term care insurance was not worth the money when I raised the issue many years ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: - First things first: I know it is tough, but you have to calm down, don't panic. Think things through. You feel pressured and rightly so, but you need to take the time to be the best informed advocate of your parent.

- Contact your local office of aging. Get an appointment. Talk to the social worker there. See what in-home services they can provide your dad IF he were to come home. DO NOT TELL THE HOSPITAL THAT THIS IS AN OPTION!!!

- The hospital should have assigned your dad a social worker, make that person do their job and help you figure out the options available to your dad. Keep in mind that they work for the hospital, so still do not tell them that going home is even a remote option. Let them TELL YOU what the options are.

- The hospital wants him out, they want his bed. They cannot kick him out if he is immobile and has no where to go and no assurance that he is going somehwere he will get care. You need to make it very clear that he cannot go to your house and cannot go home. 'Your mom is elderly and cannot care for him'
- Again: Make the hospital social worker do his/her job

- Apply for medicaid, it is not easy, and your dad needs to basically be flat broke.

- Some nursing homes will take you medicaid pending
- DO NOT SIGN OVER YOUR PARENTS' HOUSE! That is CRAZYYYY! You need to think of the long term future, your mom needs to have somewhere to live.

- Do not believe the nursing homes regarding your parents' house and assets. They want to get paid. Medicaid cannot take your parents' house, if your mom is living in it.

- I REPEAT: THE HOSPITAL CANNOT KICK OUT YOUR DAD IF HE HAS NO WHERE TO GO TO GET CARE!!
BTDT -- and I made them wait, they even wanted my parent out so bad they finally did a psych eval to test his competency, so they could legally release my parent.

- Good Luck!

Forgot to mention regarding medicaid, your dad cannot start signing over assests, giving money to you or your siblings. Medicaid sees that as fraud and it will disqualify him.

TBH I am sort of in this biz and I agree with this poster. Do not sign over the house, and it's probably worth the few hundred bucks to speak to an elder care lawyer / advisor. I believe a few people on here recommend names... Do a search.

[Anonymous]

can they move abroad to a country with much cheaper care?