Is it possible to learn to enjoy sex with someone after years of bad sex?

[Anonymous]

Do you have any studies to back up the "beta" behaviors equals bad sex? Cuz otherwise you guys sound like you're just trying to find excuses to act like a dick.

[Anonymous]

I don't do too badly with the physique thing -- weight's good; but I could definitely use more muscle. But my wife has a lot more time to work out. She's works part-time from home, and we have school age children. My workouts have to be before the work day starts or (generally) after the kids have gone to bed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you have any studies to back up the "beta" behaviors equals bad sex? Cuz otherwise you guys sound like you're just trying to find excuses to act like a dick.

It's not that the beta causes bad sex. It's the lack of alpha. You can have both -- in fact, you need both for a solid, long term relationship.

I'm not going to go looking for studies at the moment; but take a look at the characteristics of the hero in pretty much any of the romance novels so popular among women. These guys are not loading dishes or being overly respectful. The girls are pining over the guys on the football team, not the guys on the chess team. Common experience suggests that women's sexual engine gets revved up more by dominant, aggressive, physically strong men more than by considerate, accommodating, physically unremarkable men. I'd be willing to look for studies showing that women get more aroused by nurturing, non-dominant men; but I doubt that's the case. They might like sharing a household with such men, but sexual arousal is something else again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you have any studies to back up the "beta" behaviors equals bad sex? Cuz otherwise you guys sound like you're just trying to find excuses to act like a dick.

It's not that the beta causes bad sex. It's the lack of alpha. You can have both -- in fact, you need both for a solid, long term relationship.

I'm not going to go looking for studies at the moment; but take a look at the characteristics of the hero in pretty much any of the romance novels so popular among women. These guys are not loading dishes or being overly respectful. The girls are pining over the guys on the football team, not the guys on the chess team. Common experience suggests that women's sexual engine gets revved up more by dominant, aggressive, physically strong men more than by considerate, accommodating, physically unremarkable men. I'd be willing to look for studies showing that women get more aroused by nurturing, non-dominant men; but I doubt that's the case. They might like sharing a household with such men, but sexual arousal is something else again.

Personally, I pined for the (cute) guy on the chess team, if there was one, and never on the football players yuck. I always preferred the quieter, studious, more sensitive guys. Of course you don't want to deal with someone who is completely passive all the time, but this alpha-beta thing is just crap.

[Anonymous]

I assume the wives complaining about their out of shape husbands will give their husbands 90 minutes a day to work out, walk/run, etc.

I assume they won't complain one minute about their fat husbands and then go on about wanting desert, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Personally, I pined for the (cute) guy on the chess team, if there was one, and never on the football players yuck. I always preferred the quieter, studious, more sensitive guys. Of course you don't want to deal with someone who is completely passive all the time, but this alpha-beta thing is just crap.

Most of the alpha-beta posters are speaking in generalities. Most of them even acknowledge you need some beta to really make it in a relationship.

I posit it's possible to be alpha in different fields/mental stuff, or someone on the chess team appears to be more alpha simply by following regular social norms (and not being creepy awkward).

[Anonymous]

OP here- thank you all for the interesting thoughts and discussion. I can't blame my lack of attraction to my husband on his fitness level, since he's in shape and good-looking. I'm the one who is still carrying 10 lbs of baby weight, but I'm not obese or unattractive. The alpha thing may have some validity in that I've lost respect for him as he has run his career into the ground and earns a third of what he did when we married, all the while racking up loads of debt. But I certainly don't want him to push me around or pull my hair as one PP mentioned- that would be a turn off too!
I wish I could go back to being able to fantasize an orgasm with him. I guess that's probably the best I can hope to achieve. God, how depressing!

[Anonymous]

OP - You are a paying the price of living a lie and taking the easy way out for years.

Individual counseling for both. Be prepared for your husband to be devastated when the truth finally comes out.

[Anonymous]

DH here: I think my DW did precisely the same thing as you, and now it has caused major problems for me. I suspect she wanted to settle down and have children, which we have done. It has put me in a horrible position -- does one give up hope of having a good sex life, or disrupt the stable home we provide our children? I would say, though, that you owe him honesty. He is probably tormenting himself trying to find ways to make you desire him sexually, which sounds like it is not in the cards and never has been.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you have any studies to back up the "beta" behaviors equals bad sex? Cuz otherwise you guys sound like you're just trying to find excuses to act like a dick.

It's not that the beta causes bad sex. It's the lack of alpha. You can have both -- in fact, you need both for a solid, long term relationship.

I'm not going to go looking for studies at the moment; but take a look at the characteristics of the hero in pretty much any of the romance novels so popular among women. These guys are not loading dishes or being overly respectful. The girls are pining over the guys on the football team, not the guys on the chess team. Common experience suggests that women's sexual engine gets revved up more by dominant, aggressive, physically strong men more than by considerate, accommodating, physically unremarkable men. I'd be willing to look for studies showing that women get more aroused by nurturing, non-dominant men; but I doubt that's the case. They might like sharing a household with such men, but sexual arousal is something else again.

The problem I have with this argument is that you are describing mating behaviors. Yes, biologically women are drawn to the alphas, but after 15 years of sex, marriage and sharing a house, kids in the next room, those hormones and that rush of chemicals from infatuation are long gone. When you can't rely on that romantic love/mating behavior whatever you want to call it, you have to step it up in other ways. That's when the whole, love is patient, kind, blah blah blah comes in. You have to work on building an intimate relationship to keep the sex interesting.

[Anonymous]

I'm not interested in sex at all, but I find that with a couple glasses of wine to get me started, I can fake it in the beginning and actually usually enjoy myself. Wine is the key!

[Anonymous]

Stability is the antithesis of passion. So, my guess is that you have to destabilize the marriage a little bit.

What's sexier:
a) a husband who is completely available, not someone who anyone would ever find threatening, completely devoted, eager to please, and primarily focuses his life on doing everything his wife wants him to do?

or

b) a husband who is a little distant, who attracts the interest of other women just a little bit, who other people fear a little (but is nice to you), who helps in a pinch but is mostly focused on his own interests?

Sure, these are caricatures, but I think they help identify what women want in a sex partner (as opposed to just a friendly relationship).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not interested in sex at all, but I find that with a couple glasses of wine to get me started, I can fake it in the beginning and actually usually enjoy myself. Wine is the key!

In vino veritas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP again, you know, I married a guy I had great sexual chemistry with. And he was a horrible husband. Did not help support the family, did not help parent. We are divorced.

Sex is not a good basis for marriage. It's important, but there are other things that are more important.

Sex is indispensable to marriage. Otherwise you just have a legally complicated friendship.

[Anonymous]

OP's problem is: 1) she need to take more responsibility for having orgasms with her husband, to include masterbating her self, seeking a sex therapist, etc.; 2) it sounds like they are going through a really stressful time right now, and that will always impact a couple's sex life.

right -- my husband could care less if I am interested in sex. He's fine doing it for himself. He would like me to initiate more, but again, that's just for his ego.