ADHD Clusters in a classroom

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that the kids have adhd, but that they have an inexperienced teacher and most likely parents who do not have consequences and are checked out of parenting.

That’s what they get when they wear out their experienced teachers and they resign. They get warm bodies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Whose horrible idea was it to cluster all the ADHD kids together in one classroom? My child has had a HORRIBLE year because of these kids - lots of teachers (not just the homeroom teacher) yelling at the entire class for the behavior of a small group of boys. One or two per room would be fine, but clustering 6-8 ADHD kids together one classroom with a new, young teacher who doesn't know how to manage them is truly cruel to the other students.

INCLUSION: it is the “I” in DEIA.

Now you know whose idea this was.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a disaster. My kid's 504 plan stipulates that he'll get preferential seating next to high-achieving kids. Seating him next to other ADHD kids would be a nightmare.

Wait, what??? Come back to that accommodation: preferential seating next to high achieving kids.

I do not believe this. How could you enforce this without revealing protected information about another student? Let’s say you go to the school to say the 504 is not being followed because your little Pierpont has been seated next to Larlo who you think is not very bright. Are you expecting the school to prove that Larlo really is high achieving to defend themselves against your accusation of not following the 504???

Preferential seating near the teacher is an accommodation. But preferential seating near a particular student? Yeah, no.

Well, this really is not enforceable. It’s a 504 for one, which have been abused so much (case in point) that they’re functionally useless. But also, there is no legal standing for ANOTHER student to be the source of the accommodation to support a student. None. As a teacher, I would not absolutely have pushed back on this in the team meeting. As it is, I doubt many of the teachers are actually following it as it’s not ethical.

[Anonymous]

My kid has adhd. There is so much more to it than “ being disruptive and loud” in a classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SO many kids are either diagnosed with true adhd or present with adhd symptoms due to poor sleep, poor nutrition, and lack of parental boundaries. The schools can’t do much about it; each class has at least 4-5 disruptive kids. Teach your child how to let some stuff roll off her back and how to advocate for herself when it’s important.

—a teacher and parent

Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU, for being a public school teacher in this environment, and also sharing your insights. I’ll highlight the key-three mistakes ruining so many kids potential:

- poor sleep,

- poor nutrition, and

- lack of parental boundaries.” IE TAKE AWAY THE DAMN PHONES AT NIGHT!!

[Anonymous]

^ this is really true. These kids roll in (late) after telling you they were up til 4 am and then they have a nice nutritious meal of chips and maybe a caramel iced frap from McDonald’s. Then they have to detox from their phone because we make them put it in the pouch. They are physically not thriving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whose horrible idea was it to cluster all the ADHD kids together in one classroom? My child has had a HORRIBLE year because of these kids - lots of teachers (not just the homeroom teacher) yelling at the entire class for the behavior of a small group of boys. One or two per room would be fine, but clustering 6-8 ADHD kids together one classroom with a new, young teacher who doesn't know how to manage them is truly cruel to the other students.

INCLUSION: it is the “I” in DEIA.

Now you know whose idea this was.

I am pretty sure that inclusion came from SPED law, which predates todays DEI discussion by 50 years. Go back to the 1970's if you want to better understand IEPs and 504 plans. They come from a time where kids where warehoused if they had learning differences and we figured out that was a bad idea. Kids with LDs were far more likely to end up in prison because they had not received an education and were placed in classes where the message was "You are not able to learn" and "you are lesser."

I would argue that the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction now, it is far to hard to discipline kids who are disruptive. We don't do enough to fund programs to support kids with serious emotional and mental issues who still need an education. Inclusion is not the answer for some kids but there are plenty of kids with ADHD and other issues who would be better served if Teachers were allowed to discipline kids and Admin supported them in their efforts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whose horrible idea was it to cluster all the ADHD kids together in one classroom? My child has had a HORRIBLE year because of these kids - lots of teachers (not just the homeroom teacher) yelling at the entire class for the behavior of a small group of boys. One or two per room would be fine, but clustering 6-8 ADHD kids together one classroom with a new, young teacher who doesn't know how to manage them is truly cruel to the other students.

INCLUSION: it is the “I” in DEIA.

Now you know whose idea this was.

I am pretty sure that inclusion came from SPED law, which predates todays DEI discussion by 50 years. Go back to the 1970's if you want to better understand IEPs and 504 plans. They come from a time where kids where warehoused if they had learning differences and we figured out that was a bad idea. Kids with LDs were far more likely to end up in prison because they had not received an education and were placed in classes where the message was "You are not able to learn" and "you are lesser."

I would argue that the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction now, it is far to hard to discipline kids who are disruptive. We don't do enough to fund programs to support kids with serious emotional and mental issues who still need an education. Inclusion is not the answer for some kids but there are plenty of kids with ADHD and other issues who would be better served if Teachers were allowed to discipline kids and Admin supported them in their efforts.

Agree with all of this. We don't need "DEI" to have "inclusion." It is the law. I agree that they have swung the pendulum too far. I think it is partly due to fear of lawsuits.

For example: RECESS I taught for years. I agree that kids need and deserve recess. However, there are few tools that teachers have to create order and discipline in the class. A short time watching other kids play can do wonders for a disruptive child.

As for no EXCLUSION, it has been taken way too far. I'm pretty sure it was to address kids who were mistreated and that was terrible. However, having to remove a whole class rather than excluding the child that is out of control is just ridiculous. It is upsetting to the whole class and the teachers. And, it prevents educating the students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whose horrible idea was it to cluster all the ADHD kids together in one classroom? My child has had a HORRIBLE year because of these kids - lots of teachers (not just the homeroom teacher) yelling at the entire class for the behavior of a small group of boys. One or two per room would be fine, but clustering 6-8 ADHD kids together one classroom with a new, young teacher who doesn't know how to manage them is truly cruel to the other students.

INCLUSION: it is the “I” in DEIA.

Now you know whose idea this was.

I am pretty sure that inclusion came from SPED law, which predates todays DEI discussion by 50 years. Go back to the 1970's if you want to better understand IEPs and 504 plans. They come from a time where kids where warehoused if they had learning differences and we figured out that was a bad idea. Kids with LDs were far more likely to end up in prison because they had not received an education and were placed in classes where the message was "You are not able to learn" and "you are lesser."

I would argue that the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction now, it is far to hard to discipline kids who are disruptive. We don't do enough to fund programs to support kids with serious emotional and mental issues who still need an education. Inclusion is not the answer for some kids but there are plenty of kids with ADHD and other issues who would be better served if Teachers were allowed to discipline kids and Admin supported them in their efforts.

No, that is incorrect. While an individualized educational plan (IEP) or 504 plan requires public educational institutions to provide a tailored (individualized) education to SPED students, it does not specifically prohibit separate classes or even separate, specialized schools to provide SPED services to identified students.

Rather, fully inclusive education models were brought into force by educational administrators with the intention of moving away from prior seclusion models of special education to the fullest extent practical; the idea being:

- it is to the social benefit of general education students and special education students alike, with the more able students serving as peer models and those less able serving as motivation for general education students to be more fully indoctrinated in empathy and tolerance.

DEI is not the law. It is an increasingly politically-driven ideology.

[Anonymous]

Meant to add: IEPs and 504 plans largely came about after 1990, with the passage of the ADA, 42 U.S.C. § 12101.

Inclusion is a separate, but related topic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They tend to group IEP/504 kids in one class so the special Ed teacher can stay in there most of the day. It sucks.

I hope someone discriminates against your kids, too.

You are sick. What are you talking about, discrimination? I’m the one who wrote this comment. My child has a 504 and is grouped in this class. It is awful to put all kids with IEPs/504s in one class. I don’t agree with it.

Well, bless your delusionally healthy heart. I hope you're just as thrilled when someone whines about their kid having a horrible year because their perfectly typical child had to share a classroom with your 504-kid.

[Anonymous]

I just wish that teachers were taught other methods of getting kids to behave than pairing the misbehaving kids with a kid who behaves. Both of my kids had one teacher who explicitly told us our child was the one pulled away from their friends to sit with the misbehaving kids in hopes that they would help to rein them in. I get it's meant as a compliment but it's really frustrating to have your kids used as a tool to get others to listen.

There's something to be said for having kids helping each other with class material because teaching it to others helps with mastery but my kids should not be responsible for the behavior of others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Secondary teacher: I have 6-8 in every class period with ADHD 504s. It's become so widespread since I started teaching 20 years ago. I wouldn't be surprised if every class looks like this.

So true

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They tend to group IEP/504 kids in one class so the special Ed teacher can stay in there most of the day. It sucks.

I hope someone discriminates against your kids, too.

You are sick. What are you talking about, discrimination? I’m the one who wrote this comment. My child has a 504 and is grouped in this class. It is awful to put all kids with IEPs/504s in one class. I don’t agree with it.

It’s a staffing issue. Get used to it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a disaster. My kid's 504 plan stipulates that he'll get preferential seating next to high-achieving kids. Seating him next to other ADHD kids would be a nightmare.

Wait, what??? Come back to that accommodation: preferential seating next to high achieving kids.

I do not believe this. How could you enforce this without revealing protected information about another student? Let’s say you go to the school to say the 504 is not being followed because your little Pierpont has been seated next to Larlo who you think is not very bright. Are you expecting the school to prove that Larlo really is high achieving to defend themselves against your accusation of not following the 504???

Preferential seating near the teacher is an accommodation. But preferential seating near a particular student? Yeah, no.

I think PP is lying about the accommodation.