Sigh... DD and friends are excluding other kids via group chats

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So this is your main beef?
“Yesterday, I found something she said about how Larla (one of the excluded children) doesn't have instagram or tiktok because if she got it, she wouldn't have any followers.”

Honestly, that comment is just run of the mill girl chatter and certainly not something I’d intervene over.

I’ll also say it’s normal for all kids to have different group chats. It’s not exclusionary.

Do you think that girl would appreciate that if she saw it? OP is lucky this hasn’t blown up in her daughter’s face yet, but it will. And no, that kind of comment isn’t exactly normal in the first place.

The picture thing is snotty, but honestly the comments, or excluding other girls in a smaller chat is nothing new. This happened, minus the technology, when I was this age in the 80s. We wrote notes to each other, and we'd say not-very-nice things about other girls. Or in groups, we'd talk about other girls in catty and obnoxious ways. This is as old as time.

At the ripe old age of my mid-50s, looking back I wish I hadn't been so catty and obnoxious. I was also on the other end of it too as the target of unflattering comments and I know talked about behind my back, but I wish I had been more secure and didn't feel the need to do it myself.

That said, the difference today is this can all be screenshotted and shared very widely. OP should definitely talk to her DD about being kind to others, never knowing what someone else is going through, even the girls she may think are a worthy target are figuring out life too and deserve grace. But also point out that life comes as you fast, and the girl who you're gossiping about now could end up being her best friend down the line, and what if someone shares screen shots of what you've said? It's like when the notes we passed in class back in the olden days were intercepted and shared with the target. I was mortified when that happened one time and it did give me a wake-up call.

The sentiments might be the same but the technology is obviously not. If my friend tried to rat me out because of something I said over the phone I could just deny it back then. Now, there are receipts. So kids have to adapt. If you want to talk shit about your friends don’t do it in such a way that can easily be tracked back to you. Kids need to beat over the head with this over and over again. I don’t think my parents ever had to talk to me about being nice on the phone or passing notes. That stuff almost never came back to you or you could just deny it and call someone a liar then its she said, she said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Be blunt, I checked your phone and your behavior isn't ok and you are losing your phone for a week.

This. Losing it. More regular checks. AND remind her: if they are talking about other ppl they are talking about YOU.

[Anonymous]

The truest thing said here is this will turn around and bite her in the ass. Friends that do this to other people will do it to her and none of her friends actually trust her or like her because they see her doing it too. If that's the kind of "friends" you cultivate, you won't be a very happy person. You can explain that to her and if she doesn't believe you, she will live it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The sending pictures is particularly harmful and dangerous.

I'd have a blunt conversation about this. Have her imagine that these texts were printed out and plastered all over the school. How would she feel? How would her friends feel? Would she proud of this?

Teen girls might pick each other apart, but putting it in writing like this is absolutely a horrible idea. She might feel annoyed with one girl, say something mean in person, and everyone would forget the next day. On a text thread? That lives FOREVER. She needs to understand it.

I'm not sure what I'd do for "punishment" but I'd absolutely make sure she knows that if I am paying for her plan, I better not ever see trash talk from her on that phone again.

OP here. Thanks, this is helpful. I think she knows all of this, since DH and I have made a point to discuss bullying and its negative effects with her before. I feel like she's a little too old to "punish" in the traditional sense of the word- grounding her or taking away things is only going to make her feel angry at me. I don't want all of her focus to be on hating me- she needs to feel accountable. I have no problem being the bad cop, though.

Punishing and taking stuff away is a way of holding her accountable, even at 15.

I get it - I have a kid who tends to react to consequences by blaming me instead of herself. But the problem is my kid's reaction, not the existence of a consequence holding her accountable for her wrong - yeah, wrong - action.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So this is your main beef?
“Yesterday, I found something she said about how Larla (one of the excluded children) doesn't have instagram or tiktok because if she got it, she wouldn't have any followers.”

Honestly, that comment is just run of the mill girl chatter and certainly not something I’d intervene over.

I’ll also say it’s normal for all kids to have different group chats. It’s not exclusionary.

Do you think that girl would appreciate that if she saw it? OP is lucky this hasn’t blown up in her daughter’s face yet, but it will. And no, that kind of comment isn’t exactly normal in the first place.

The picture thing is snotty, but honestly the comments, or excluding other girls in a smaller chat is nothing new. This happened, minus the technology, when I was this age in the 80s. We wrote notes to each other, and we'd say not-very-nice things about other girls. Or in groups, we'd talk about other girls in catty and obnoxious ways. This is as old as time.

At the ripe old age of my mid-50s, looking back I wish I hadn't been so catty and obnoxious. I was also on the other end of it too as the target of unflattering comments and I know talked about behind my back, but I wish I had been more secure and didn't feel the need to do it myself.

That said, the difference today is this can all be screenshotted and shared very widely. OP should definitely talk to her DD about being kind to others, never knowing what someone else is going through, even the girls she may think are a worthy target are figuring out life too and deserve grace. But also point out that life comes as you fast, and the girl who you're gossiping about now could end up being her best friend down the line, and what if someone shares screen shots of what you've said? It's like when the notes we passed in class back in the olden days were intercepted and shared with the target. I was mortified when that happened one time and it did give me a wake-up call.

The sentiments might be the same but the technology is obviously not. If my friend tried to rat me out because of something I said over the phone I could just deny it back then. Now, there are receipts. So kids have to adapt. If you want to talk shit about your friends don’t do it in such a way that can easily be tracked back to you. Kids need to beat over the head with this over and over again. I don’t think my parents ever had to talk to me about being nice on the phone or passing notes. That stuff almost never came back to you or you could just deny it and call someone a liar then its she said, she said.

Absolutely zero chance it's a good idea to teach your kid to be sneakier (only say something in person in private, for ex) about their cattiness rather than just teaching them not to be catty.

I'd rather my kid get called out and stop doing it rather than learn how to do it in a way that won't bite them in the rear quite so badly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Who pays for the phone? Your daughter shouldn’t have some expectation of privacy that her shit stirring messages wouldn’t be read. You better read them first before some parent screen shots it and sends to the school for bullying.

From a parent who has been there, 100% this. Your daughter may be mad but trust me that you are protecting her by addressing it and stopping it. Take the phone away for a few days and remove her from the chat. I wish I had been checking my child's phone regularly but I do now--stupid on my part.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would come down on this like a ton of bricks. I can tell you care and want to nip this. Go hard core to prove the importance of your values. This is a great teaching opportunity for you. My kid would lose the phone for 2 weeks and I would be monitoring closely any future use. She would NOT be allowed to be part of that chain in the future. New friends might also be a requirement depending on the situation.

I’m curious if you’ve successfully mandated a change in friend group of a 14-15 year old. I have a hard time imagining how that would work.

[Anonymous]

Sort of off topic but at what age does one stop checking their kid's phones/messages?

[Anonymous]

Other parents know your kid is like this and think little of her because of her behavior. They also think less of you the longer it continues because you are either uninvolved or don’t care.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The sending pictures is particularly harmful and dangerous.

I'd have a blunt conversation about this. Have her imagine that these texts were printed out and plastered all over the school. How would she feel? How would her friends feel? Would she proud of this?

Teen girls might pick each other apart, but putting it in writing like this is absolutely a horrible idea. She might feel annoyed with one girl, say something mean in person, and everyone would forget the next day. On a text thread? That lives FOREVER. She needs to understand it.

I'm not sure what I'd do for "punishment" but I'd absolutely make sure she knows that if I am paying for her plan, I better not ever see trash talk from her on that phone again.

OP here. Thanks, this is helpful. I think she knows all of this, since DH and I have made a point to discuss bullying and its negative effects with her before. I feel like she's a little too old to "punish" in the traditional sense of the word- grounding her or taking away things is only going to make her feel angry at me. I don't want all of her focus to be on hating me- she needs to feel accountable. I have no problem being the bad cop, though.

I'd get more specific. Taking bad pictures of people without them and sending them to a group chat to be mocked is HORRIBLE. Teens make mistakes, but it needs to be pointed out how mean this is. She can be in the smaller group chat to talk about...things. But not people. If she and her friends need to complain about another friend, do it on a Starbucks run.

Teens need to realize that their phone conversations are not private. It's not YOU seeing this stuff that is the worst case scenario here, it's her other friends. Being cautious about it is a good idea. Videos, pictures, etc live a long time. Some inappropriate things can carry felony charges and there is a LONG electronic history. Your phone is not really private. It's good to know that at a young age.

[Anonymous]

Ask her why she doesn’t want to lift up other girls instead of tearing them down? Ask her why it makes her feel good in participating in this kind of mean behavior. Ask what exactly she gets out of it. Ask what kind of human being does she want to be. Ask her how she thinks she can be the best version of herself.

Don’t react with anger. Your anger will give her something to react to and a way to hide. Have a real, honest, thoughtful conversation or series of conversations with her.

[Anonymous]

She should not have an expectation of privacy. You should discuss it with her. I would consider whether this is a warning or a punishment related action. Seems like maybe you need to be having more routine discussions about what is appropriate to say/send over text. We beat my kids over the head with the idea that anything they say or picture they take could be shared with anyone and everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Be blunt, I checked your phone and your behavior isn't ok and you are losing your phone for a week.

I would be blunt but I wouldn't put my foot down this hard. I would talk to her and ask her how she sees the behavior. DD has a friend like this, also 15. She loves to exclude others. It's literally her MO. She will try to invite a few kids to get together and then leaves out close friends and tells people not to tell others. It's really gross. I always wondered if her parents taught her this but if they didn't it just makes her seem really insecure.
DD is the type of kid who's like the more the merrier so it bothers her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The sending pictures is particularly harmful and dangerous.

I'd have a blunt conversation about this. Have her imagine that these texts were printed out and plastered all over the school. How would she feel? How would her friends feel? Would she proud of this?

Teen girls might pick each other apart, but putting it in writing like this is absolutely a horrible idea. She might feel annoyed with one girl, say something mean in person, and everyone would forget the next day. On a text thread? That lives FOREVER. She needs to understand it.

I'm not sure what I'd do for "punishment" but I'd absolutely make sure she knows that if I am paying for her plan, I better not ever see trash talk from her on that phone again.

OP here. Thanks, this is helpful. I think she knows all of this, since DH and I have made a point to discuss bullying and its negative effects with her before. I feel like she's a little too old to "punish" in the traditional sense of the word- grounding her or taking away things is only going to make her feel angry at me. I don't want all of her focus to be on hating me- she needs to feel accountable. I have no problem being the bad cop, though.

And here we have it. OP is one of those parents whose only goal is to make sure that she gets through her kids' teen years without them "hating her." Heaven forbid that Precious has to go without her phone for a week.

OP, your kid is a bully. You darn well better step up and be the bad cop now, before you have a more serious problem on your hands.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Be blunt, I checked your phone and your behavior isn't ok and you are losing your phone for a week.

+1
My kids understand there is no expectation of privacy on their devices.