Is this an American mom thing or specific to my kids school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some people aren't up for the casual "let's share our complaints!". I'm definitely the type to just commiserate with you and have plenty of mom friends who are similar. But I've also met people who take complaining as a sign of asking for advice or help. Which I think is fine too. This may be specific to the school or it may be how you phrase the complaints.

Or just people in general.

OP at least in the US there's an over-broad stereotype that women will commiserate while men always want to problem solve. It sticks in my brain because I'm a woman who isn't great at commiserating and immediately jumps to problem solving. I think you can find all types anywhere, unless you are maybe at a very small school, so just learn who you can vent to and who is going to offer a pointless solution (like I would).

[Anonymous]

I recently saw a friend who moved to the UK some years ago, and we discussed cultural differences. She said one thing that sticks out to her is Brits will complain about things or express dissatisfaction with something, but do nothing about it. Americans do see everything as a problem to be solved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I recently saw a friend who moved to the UK some years ago, and we discussed cultural differences. She said one thing that sticks out to her is Brits will complain about things or express dissatisfaction with something, but do nothing about it. Americans do see everything as a problem to be solved.

op - i dont know if i agree with that i think it's a bit more nuanced.
I am actually a huge problem solver and see everything as a problem to be solved. AND sometimes give people advice too. But typically when I give people advice it's because they've said a sentence like "I don't know what to do' or 'I'm completely stuck' or something like that.
Brits do like to complain that's true, as a nation. but what your friend might be missing is that a lot of what seems like brits complaining might be brits trying to bond with her over shared experience. rather than a 'real' problem they need to solve.
Like maybe here when a mom tells me something great about her kid she is trying to bond with me? That would never naturally occur to me unless I analyzed it.

[Anonymous]

OP I'm American and my kids attend public schools (in DC) and I feel this way all the time. I think it's a personality defect and something people should address in themselves. I agree with others that it's due to insecurity and competitiveness (related issues) and also that DC has an above-average number of parents like this because of the kinds of educational backgrounds and jobs people have here. Also DC is very status conscious and I think this drives people to hierarchical interactions where everyone is trying to assert their knowledge or credentials as being "top" instead of talking to each other like sane people.

I don't buy the explanation that some people are just more "problem solving" focused. The reason this is dumb is that often there is no problem to solve but they will still give you advice. Like this morning my kid woke up at 4:30am with a bad dream and as a result I'm exhausted. There isn't a problem here -- I got my kid back to sleep and also pinpointed what I think is the source of anxiety that brought on the bad dream. But I'm still super tired today because I didn't go back to sleep. I don't need advice I just need someone to say "ugh that sucks I've been there too" but a lot of DC parents are too stupid to understand this and will instead lecture at me like they are a child sleep expert even though -- I feel this is important to point out -- they aren't!

Anyway I have not figured out a way around this yet and am hoping that it dissipates as kids get older and humble their parents a bit more.

I made many of my friends in DC through a hobby that has nothing to do with being a parent. I highly recommend this! I still encounter weird know-it-alls but they are easier to avoid in non-parent settings I've found.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s a DC thing where many of us have wonky policy backgrounds and see parenting as a series of problems to be solved. I think you just have to keep trying and find your people. I have one mom friend who I enjoy because we have the same perspective on schools - we’re both kind if tiger-parenty, which is VERY frowned upon in our neighborhood (apparently you’re supposed to go straight from “play based” schools to your child being naturally “advanced,” with no effort). I have another mom friend who shares my take on the nature of tween boys. But a lot of mom friends in between where I would never broach any parenting subject at all, because I don’t know what’s a hot issue with them.

Another cultural aspect is that Americans don’t always understand “taking the piss” … especially about kids! That’s my form of humor personally (maybe thanks to Grandma from Dover?) but a lot of Americans don’t get it. If I heard you complain about your youtuber kids I would get it! But there are a lot of, erm, humor impaired people around here.

op - haha you get it!
yes i find if i ever do the british thing of being honest (eg saying that some of my kids art is terrible and deserves to go in the bin immediately) I get a lot of raised eyebrows.

dp.. that's definitely a personality thing, not an American thing.

I would say the same thing, of course, not in front of the kids. But then, I'm from CA, and DH is a Brit, and I guess I get that kind of humor. Our kids go to public school.

[Anonymous]

We’re at a DCPS and haven’t had this problem. I’m sure these types exist but it’s not the norm. Sounds like a private school type of thing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP I'm American and my kids attend public schools (in DC) and I feel this way all the time. I think it's a personality defect and something people should address in themselves. I agree with others that it's due to insecurity and competitiveness (related issues) and also that DC has an above-average number of parents like this because of the kinds of educational backgrounds and jobs people have here. Also DC is very status conscious and I think this drives people to hierarchical interactions where everyone is trying to assert their knowledge or credentials as being "top" instead of talking to each other like sane people.

I don't buy the explanation that some people are just more "problem solving" focused. The reason this is dumb is that often there is no problem to solve but they will still give you advice. Like this morning my kid woke up at 4:30am with a bad dream and as a result I'm exhausted. There isn't a problem here -- I got my kid back to sleep and also pinpointed what I think is the source of anxiety that brought on the bad dream. But I'm still super tired today because I didn't go back to sleep. I don't need advice I just need someone to say "ugh that sucks I've been there too" but a lot of DC parents are too stupid to understand this and will instead lecture at me like they are a child sleep expert even though -- I feel this is important to point out -- they aren't!

Anyway I have not figured out a way around this yet and am hoping that it dissipates as kids get older and humble their parents a bit more.

I made many of my friends in DC through a hobby that has nothing to do with being a parent. I highly recommend this! I still encounter weird know-it-alls but they are easier to avoid in non-parent settings I've found.

op - i am sorry you are so tired! And yes when you are tired the LAST thing you need is someone telling you why you could have dealt with it better.
Just being a parent means you have a baby and then you are at least somewhat tired 95% of the time until they are all older than 15, longer if they play some kind of travel sport. Then by the time they go to college it is too late and the tiredness has wizened us.
See, it's this kind of encouraging commentary that people are missing out on when they give me advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s a DC thing where many of us have wonky policy backgrounds and see parenting as a series of problems to be solved. I think you just have to keep trying and find your people. I have one mom friend who I enjoy because we have the same perspective on schools - we’re both kind if tiger-parenty, which is VERY frowned upon in our neighborhood (apparently you’re supposed to go straight from “play based” schools to your child being naturally “advanced,” with no effort). I have another mom friend who shares my take on the nature of tween boys. But a lot of mom friends in between where I would never broach any parenting subject at all, because I don’t know what’s a hot issue with them.

Another cultural aspect is that Americans don’t always understand “taking the piss” … especially about kids! That’s my form of humor personally (maybe thanks to Grandma from Dover?) but a lot of Americans don’t get it. If I heard you complain about your youtuber kids I would get it! But there are a lot of, erm, humor impaired people around here.

op - haha you get it!
yes i find if i ever do the british thing of being honest (eg saying that some of my kids art is terrible and deserves to go in the bin immediately) I get a lot of raised eyebrows.

I would want to sit by you at the next parent event!

op - aww thank you. I really do need some more friends!
I think the moms like me I just think their impression is that I'm funny but hopeless/ hapless and constantly looking for their help whereas the truth is I'm just trying to find someone funny or empathic who I can laugh about this stuff with or commiserate.

In the sea of moms who put on that "isn't everything just wonderful?" persona, you will eventually find someone who takes things a little less seriously and will find the humor in terrible school musicals and discordant instrumental performances.

[Anonymous]

This isn’t some huge mystery. You see it here too. Someone claims to just be venting but reply after reply will be people offering advice. Nobody likes a complainer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I'm American and my kids attend public schools (in DC) and I feel this way all the time. I think it's a personality defect and something people should address in themselves. I agree with others that it's due to insecurity and competitiveness (related issues) and also that DC has an above-average number of parents like this because of the kinds of educational backgrounds and jobs people have here. Also DC is very status conscious and I think this drives people to hierarchical interactions where everyone is trying to assert their knowledge or credentials as being "top" instead of talking to each other like sane people.

I don't buy the explanation that some people are just more "problem solving" focused. The reason this is dumb is that often there is no problem to solve but they will still give you advice. Like this morning my kid woke up at 4:30am with a bad dream and as a result I'm exhausted. There isn't a problem here -- I got my kid back to sleep and also pinpointed what I think is the source of anxiety that brought on the bad dream. But I'm still super tired today because I didn't go back to sleep. I don't need advice I just need someone to say "ugh that sucks I've been there too" but a lot of DC parents are too stupid to understand this and will instead lecture at me like they are a child sleep expert even though -- I feel this is important to point out -- they aren't!

Anyway I have not figured out a way around this yet and am hoping that it dissipates as kids get older and humble their parents a bit more.

I made many of my friends in DC through a hobby that has nothing to do with being a parent. I highly recommend this! I still encounter weird know-it-alls but they are easier to avoid in non-parent settings I've found.

op - i am sorry you are so tired! And yes when you are tired the LAST thing you need is someone telling you why you could have dealt with it better.
Just being a parent means you have a baby and then you are at least somewhat tired 95% of the time until they are all older than 15, longer if they play some kind of travel sport. Then by the time they go to college it is too late and the tiredness has wizened us.
See, it's this kind of encouraging commentary that people are missing out on when they give me advice.

OP, I don't see the PP's commentary as encouraging. She seems like a complainer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I recently saw a friend who moved to the UK some years ago, and we discussed cultural differences. She said one thing that sticks out to her is Brits will complain about things or express dissatisfaction with something, but do nothing about it. Americans do see everything as a problem to be solved.

I think this is a cultural difference but disagree with your description because I think British people also solve problems all the time. It's not like British people are just falling apart unable to function -- they are as functional as Americans are on average. And there are plenty of Americans who struggle to solve problems in their own lives.

The distinction is about how people approach social interactions. I just think Americans will sometimes bring an almost professional problem-solving approach to social interactions whereas Brits (and people in many cultures) consider this rude and impersonal. Like I have no problem being a problem solver at work or at home but if I'm just chatting with someone outside the school or bump into a mom friend at the grocery store I don't have that mindset and we can complain or commiserate and it doesn't have to be results-oriented. Especially because a lot of the stuff we might commiserate on is not really a problem to be solved. A lot of parenting is just necessary drudgery and you can't fix that -- it's part of the deal.

I think many Americans refuse to accept this though -- the idea that some aspects of life just kind of suck and you have to put up with them or muddle through and there are no "hacks" or short cuts.

Also it seems like many American parents actually make parenting *harder* with all their "problem-solving." Often they invent problems that weren't there or impose impossible parameters on aspects of parenting that were a little hard but manageable. Like I actually think it's more productive to just complain a bit about how kids can sometimes be picky eaters and that's annoying and then move on. Like I'll say "ugh my kid asked for mac and cheese for dinner and then I made it and they wouldn't eat it so irritating" and the response will be "oh what you really need to do is be serving her more lentils -- did you know the nutritional content of mac and cheese is basically nil why don't you make all your bread products from scratch." Like that's not actually helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm from the UK and I've found that one real barrier to making friends here (or rather to having deeper friendships) has been this one - what seems to be cultural - difference around sharing parenting challenges. In the UK it's tacitly understood for the most part that if you share something that's hard about parenting, unless you specifically ask, you're not looking for advice but more so solidarity or to laugh about it or just to share and feel less alone or incompetent. Among the moms at my kids school I find almost universally that if i share something that's hard, they give me advice. For me personally it's a real barrier to friendships bc a. I often don't need or want advice per se and b. it sort of stops any kind of bonding or even really conversation in its tracks.
Is this an american cultural thing where if someone shares something hard it's assumed they want input or is my school different in some way? would love to find a tribe that I can laugh about my kids imitating youtubers rather than hear a 15 minute diatribe on how someone else is crushing it with not letting this happen.

But giving advice, to us is bonding! If you share something and I have experienced it too and 'solved' that shared problem than why are you against hearing solutions. It seems if you really want a tribe you have to lower your barriers or move back to England.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I recently saw a friend who moved to the UK some years ago, and we discussed cultural differences. She said one thing that sticks out to her is Brits will complain about things or express dissatisfaction with something, but do nothing about it. Americans do see everything as a problem to be solved.

I think this is a cultural difference but disagree with your description because I think British people also solve problems all the time. It's not like British people are just falling apart unable to function -- they are as functional as Americans are on average. And there are plenty of Americans who struggle to solve problems in their own lives.

The distinction is about how people approach social interactions. I just think Americans will sometimes bring an almost professional problem-solving approach to social interactions whereas Brits (and people in many cultures) consider this rude and impersonal. Like I have no problem being a problem solver at work or at home but if I'm just chatting with someone outside the school or bump into a mom friend at the grocery store I don't have that mindset and we can complain or commiserate and it doesn't have to be results-oriented. Especially because a lot of the stuff we might commiserate on is not really a problem to be solved. A lot of parenting is just necessary drudgery and you can't fix that -- it's part of the deal.

I think many Americans refuse to accept this though -- the idea that some aspects of life just kind of suck and you have to put up with them or muddle through and there are no "hacks" or short cuts.

Also it seems like many American parents actually make parenting *harder* with all their "problem-solving." Often they invent problems that weren't there or impose impossible parameters on aspects of parenting that were a little hard but manageable. Like I actually think it's more productive to just complain a bit about how kids can sometimes be picky eaters and that's annoying and then move on. Like I'll say "ugh my kid asked for mac and cheese for dinner and then I made it and they wouldn't eat it so irritating" and the response will be "oh what you really need to do is be serving her more lentils -- did you know the nutritional content of mac and cheese is basically nil why don't you make all your bread products from scratch." Like that's not actually helpful.

That has not been my experience. If you said the thing about mac and cheese I would have not said anything about making lentils. I would have said yes that's frustrating.

I find your anaysis of American parents rather simplistic and wrong.

I only give 'advice' to other people I am close too. If you are an acquaintaince there is no reason to delve deeper on mac and cheese. That isn't even a problem!

So the op seeks closeness but Americans seek sharing information with close friends. By shutting us down you won't get the tribe you seek.

[Anonymous]

Given the kind of school your kids are in, you’ll need to look for an outside hobby for this sort of commiserating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm from the UK and I've found that one real barrier to making friends here (or rather to having deeper friendships) has been this one - what seems to be cultural - difference around sharing parenting challenges. In the UK it's tacitly understood for the most part that if you share something that's hard about parenting, unless you specifically ask, you're not looking for advice but more so solidarity or to laugh about it or just to share and feel less alone or incompetent. Among the moms at my kids school I find almost universally that if i share something that's hard, they give me advice. For me personally it's a real barrier to friendships bc a. I often don't need or want advice per se and b. it sort of stops any kind of bonding or even really conversation in its tracks.
Is this an american cultural thing where if someone shares something hard it's assumed they want input or is my school different in some way? would love to find a tribe that I can laugh about my kids imitating youtubers rather than hear a 15 minute diatribe on how someone else is crushing it with not letting this happen.

But giving advice, to us is bonding! If you share something and I have experienced it too and 'solved' that shared problem than why are you against hearing solutions. It seems if you really want a tribe you have to lower your barriers or move back to England.

I am American and I find getting advice in response to just trying to commiserate about some difficult aspect of parenting extremely off-putting. I also think people who give a lot of advice often over-estimate their knowledge or assume that because they "solved" an issue like kids fighting bedtime or picky eating or potty training or whatever for their own kid that they are experts and should be telling others what to do. But what works for one kid often doesn't work for another and also solutions to problems like this are often very family specific -- it depends on your schedule and your marriage and the layout of your house and a bunch of factors that vary a lot. Often advice-givers ignore all these factors (because they think the problem got solved due to their expert parenting only) and will even argue with you if you say "no I can't do that" and then get mad at you because you won't take their advice when they are "just trying to help."

I guarantee there are people in your orbit you absolutely hate your advice-giving and just tolerate it out of politeness.