17 Year Old Custody Schedule

[Anonymous]

OP here: I also want to add that I have assured my ex that I would NOT seek any additional child support if the schedule changed and DS spent more time with me, so finances can't be playing any role in my ex's decision/thoughts. (It really wouldn't be that much extra time anyway, so any hypothetical impact on child support would be negligible, nor would I ever want to have that fight for just 9 more months of CS).

I'm only raising this because sometimes people say that parents want more time with the kid to get more money, or parents don't want to lose time because then they'll have to pay more money, etc.

[Anonymous]

Can you negotiate all summer next summer in return for no more every other weekend? Sign him up for football camp at his dad's city?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By this age, your 17 yr old's wishes would be taken into consideration by a judge. Suggest to DS that he invite his dad to come to HIM, and hang out for an afternoon through dinner. Maybe they could do that once a month and DS could go there one weekend a month.

OP here: that is what I proposed, but dad said absolutely not, no way. He wants his full two weekends a month at his house, end of story.

I just really can't afford to go to court to fight this out, even if a judge would listen. I'm really scared of being held in contempt of court.

Good luck to your ex in having a close and meaningful relationship with his son if this is how he treats him. Tell your son he is supposed to follow the visitation schedule. When he doesn't and your ex squawks at you tell him you can't force a 17 yr old to see someone he doesn't want to see. Let him take you to court. This should not be expensive - maybe 2-4 hours of attorney billing time. Your son will have to say he doesn't want to go. Judge will rule in his favor.

OP here - how do you know this?

I also don't see how this will only be 2-4 hours of attorney billing time. Last time we had to go to court over a dispute, it was at least 15 hours.

I know the judge will rule in his favor because I've done matrimonial and family law for over 20 years and courts listen to 17 yr olds about their wishes regarding visitation.

That's lovely, but in no universe does going to court involve only 2-4 billable hours for an attorney.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I also want to add that I have assured my ex that I would NOT seek any additional child support if the schedule changed and DS spent more time with me, so finances can't be playing any role in my ex's decision/thoughts. (It really wouldn't be that much extra time anyway, so any hypothetical impact on child support would be negligible, nor would I ever want to have that fight for just 9 more months of CS).

I'm only raising this because sometimes people say that parents want more time with the kid to get more money, or parents don't want to lose time because then they'll have to pay more money, etc.

How much extra child support do you think you'd get by him losing two days a month? You already have full custody. It does sound like there is more to this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can you negotiate all summer next summer in return for no more every other weekend? Sign him up for football camp at his dad's city?

OP: Next summer he will be 18 and a high school graduate and can do whatever he wants, so I don't see how that will be helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By this age, your 17 yr old's wishes would be taken into consideration by a judge. Suggest to DS that he invite his dad to come to HIM, and hang out for an afternoon through dinner. Maybe they could do that once a month and DS could go there one weekend a month.

OP here: that is what I proposed, but dad said absolutely not, no way. He wants his full two weekends a month at his house, end of story.

I just really can't afford to go to court to fight this out, even if a judge would listen. I'm really scared of being held in contempt of court.

Good luck to your ex in having a close and meaningful relationship with his son if this is how he treats him. Tell your son he is supposed to follow the visitation schedule. When he doesn't and your ex squawks at you tell him you can't force a 17 yr old to see someone he doesn't want to see. Let him take you to court. This should not be expensive - maybe 2-4 hours of attorney billing time. Your son will have to say he doesn't want to go. Judge will rule in his favor.

OP here - how do you know this?

I also don't see how this will only be 2-4 hours of attorney billing time. Last time we had to go to court over a dispute, it was at least 15 hours.

I know the judge will rule in his favor because I've done matrimonial and family law for over 20 years and courts listen to 17 yr olds about their wishes regarding visitation.

OP here: ok, but what if a 17 year old said they NEVER wanted to see the other parent? A court wouldn't grant that, no? Kids still have to spend time with both parents, unless parental rights are terminated. That's how it's always been explained to me.

It's fair to say a judge would require DS to be there at least one weekend a month, right? And I support that. Both because I want DS to have a relationship with his dad, but also, selfishly, as a single parent I do appreciate my occasional kid-free time.

No judgment OP, but this is the problem: you and your ex are on the same side against your kid. You’ve been pitching this as a difference between the kid and ex, but really it’s a convo between you and your kid about how you need some alone weekends too and if he stays home how can you still get that time. Once you and your son are on the same page I bet the ex piece will be easier to figure out.

OP here: This is why I have proposed (to both my ex and my DS) that my DS continue to spend one weekend a month with his dad. I'm fine if it drops from two weekends to one. But my ex is still insisting on both weekends.

Right. But what does your kid say? Is he okay with one weekend?

DS says he doesn't want to "have" to ever go up there on any sort of fixed schedule, but that one weekend would be better than two.

Your kid wants to talk to the judge himself so he can say he doesn’t want anything.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I also want to add that I have assured my ex that I would NOT seek any additional child support if the schedule changed and DS spent more time with me, so finances can't be playing any role in my ex's decision/thoughts. (It really wouldn't be that much extra time anyway, so any hypothetical impact on child support would be negligible, nor would I ever want to have that fight for just 9 more months of CS).

I'm only raising this because sometimes people say that parents want more time with the kid to get more money, or parents don't want to lose time because then they'll have to pay more money, etc.

Maybe he wants a relationship with his child? He only gets 4 days a month. Have you stopped to consider what that must be like as a parent? Now, you are changing it to two days a month.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I also want to add that I have assured my ex that I would NOT seek any additional child support if the schedule changed and DS spent more time with me, so finances can't be playing any role in my ex's decision/thoughts. (It really wouldn't be that much extra time anyway, so any hypothetical impact on child support would be negligible, nor would I ever want to have that fight for just 9 more months of CS).

I'm only raising this because sometimes people say that parents want more time with the kid to get more money, or parents don't want to lose time because then they'll have to pay more money, etc.

How much extra child support do you think you'd get by him losing two days a month? You already have full custody. It does sound like there is more to this.

I already said any impact would be negligible, which is why I explained I would never seek more child support.

I was trying to preempt anyone accusing me of wanting to get more money, or accusing my ex of not wanting to pay more money. I'm saying this isn't a factor, at all. CS hasn't changed in over 4 years, even when I was laid off, and I don't care at this point. It isn't worth the fight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can you negotiate all summer next summer in return for no more every other weekend? Sign him up for football camp at his dad's city?

OP: Next summer he will be 18 and a high school graduate and can do whatever he wants, so I don't see how that will be helpful.

How about supporting dad with an alternative schedule so Dad can still have a real relationship with his child? You can offer more holidays, long weekends, and other times as a compromise. It sounds like its all or nothing and with you, its nothing for Dad.

You will be the first to complain Dad isn't helping with college and other things after you cut off the relationship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here: our court order requires that I drive him to see his dad at the beginning of the weekend, and his dad drops him off at the end of the weekend. The driving is required to be split 50/50.

My understanding is that in my state, the child does not get to decide until 18. Their desires can be taken into account, but they don't get to make the ultimate decision.

Can 50/50 driving be turned into dad does the pickup?

Can your son be bribed by dad into getting his own car and driving himself? Does he have a license?

What does your ex say about the prospect of you having to manhandle an almost grown man into the car? Has he talked directly to dad about this? Do a speaker phone conversation and record yourself telling your son you don't have the resources to fight this and your preference is that he does his visitations, you do not support him staying with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I also want to add that I have assured my ex that I would NOT seek any additional child support if the schedule changed and DS spent more time with me, so finances can't be playing any role in my ex's decision/thoughts. (It really wouldn't be that much extra time anyway, so any hypothetical impact on child support would be negligible, nor would I ever want to have that fight for just 9 more months of CS).

I'm only raising this because sometimes people say that parents want more time with the kid to get more money, or parents don't want to lose time because then they'll have to pay more money, etc.

How much extra child support do you think you'd get by him losing two days a month? You already have full custody. It does sound like there is more to this.

I already said any impact would be negligible, which is why I explained I would never seek more child support.

I was trying to preempt anyone accusing me of wanting to get more money, or accusing my ex of not wanting to pay more money. I'm saying this isn't a factor, at all. CS hasn't changed in over 4 years, even when I was laid off, and I don't care at this point. It isn't worth the fight.

It sounds like this really is about more, possibly money. You aren't going to get a huge amount of child support extra for those two days a month. It does sound like a big factor as you are the one raising child support.

The issue is Dad has 4 days a month with his child. You are now at best reducing it to two days, possibly none. He wants to be a father and you're not supporting it. Come up with an alternative schedule so he keeps his 4 days a month.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here: our court order requires that I drive him to see his dad at the beginning of the weekend, and his dad drops him off at the end of the weekend. The driving is required to be split 50/50.

My understanding is that in my state, the child does not get to decide until 18. Their desires can be taken into account, but they don't get to make the ultimate decision.

Can 50/50 driving be turned into dad does the pickup?

Can your son be bribed by dad into getting his own car and driving himself? Does he have a license?

What does your ex say about the prospect of you having to manhandle an almost grown man into the car? Has he talked directly to dad about this? Do a speaker phone conversation and record yourself telling your son you don't have the resources to fight this and your preference is that he does his visitations, you do not support him staying with you.

Dad should not be forced to bribe his son with a car to see him. Mom can buy the car out of child support. A good parent will encourage the 4 day a month visits as its not a lot of time and its important for child to have a relationship with both parents.

OP clearly has the resources if she's willing to terminate visitation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I also want to add that I have assured my ex that I would NOT seek any additional child support if the schedule changed and DS spent more time with me, so finances can't be playing any role in my ex's decision/thoughts. (It really wouldn't be that much extra time anyway, so any hypothetical impact on child support would be negligible, nor would I ever want to have that fight for just 9 more months of CS).

I'm only raising this because sometimes people say that parents want more time with the kid to get more money, or parents don't want to lose time because then they'll have to pay more money, etc.

Maybe he wants a relationship with his child? He only gets 4 days a month. Have you stopped to consider what that must be like as a parent? Now, you are changing it to two days a month.

OP here: I am not the one trying to change it to one weekend a month. I have no problem with continuing to follow the schedule, as it currently stands, until DS turns 18. I have said multiple times I think it's important for my DS to have a relationship with his dad and spend time with his dad. I would happily follow that schedule until high school graduation.

This didn't become an issue until DS said "I'm a high school senior now and I won't do this schedule anymore." I'm sympathetic to DS's desires given his age and everything he's busy with. Which is why I've been trying to find a compromise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have you sat down and explained the repercussions to your son? Here’s what the court order says, here’s what contempt of court means, etc. Bring him into the brainstorm. Perhaps suggest one more weekend with his dad so kid and dad can do the same solution brainstorming.

Don't lie to the kid - he won't be held in contempt of court.

He won’t but mom can be. A friend went through this with her 16 year old DD. Very similar situation with the visitation order and distance, but there were also 4 much younger half-siblings at Dad’s house. Very chaotic environment. She didn’t want to go and mom could not physically force her into a car. However, the court held mom responsible.

That's very rare that a parent is held in contempt for visitation. Reality is most likely nothing will happen. Good for that judge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By this age, your 17 yr old's wishes would be taken into consideration by a judge. Suggest to DS that he invite his dad to come to HIM, and hang out for an afternoon through dinner. Maybe they could do that once a month and DS could go there one weekend a month.

OP here: that is what I proposed, but dad said absolutely not, no way. He wants his full two weekends a month at his house, end of story.

I just really can't afford to go to court to fight this out, even if a judge would listen. I'm really scared of being held in contempt of court.

Good luck to your ex in having a close and meaningful relationship with his son if this is how he treats him. Tell your son he is supposed to follow the visitation schedule. When he doesn't and your ex squawks at you tell him you can't force a 17 yr old to see someone he doesn't want to see. Let him take you to court. This should not be expensive - maybe 2-4 hours of attorney billing time. Your son will have to say he doesn't want to go. Judge will rule in his favor.

OP here - how do you know this?

I also don't see how this will only be 2-4 hours of attorney billing time. Last time we had to go to court over a dispute, it was at least 15 hours.

I know the judge will rule in his favor because I've done matrimonial and family law for over 20 years and courts listen to 17 yr olds about their wishes regarding visitation.

OP here: ok, but what if a 17 year old said they NEVER wanted to see the other parent? A court wouldn't grant that, no? Kids still have to spend time with both parents, unless parental rights are terminated. That's how it's always been explained to me.

It's fair to say a judge would require DS to be there at least one weekend a month, right? And I support that. Both because I want DS to have a relationship with his dad, but also, selfishly, as a single parent I do appreciate my occasional kid-free time.

No judgment OP, but this is the problem: you and your ex are on the same side against your kid. You’ve been pitching this as a difference between the kid and ex, but really it’s a convo between you and your kid about how you need some alone weekends too and if he stays home how can you still get that time. Once you and your son are on the same page I bet the ex piece will be easier to figure out.

OP here: This is why I have proposed (to both my ex and my DS) that my DS continue to spend one weekend a month with his dad. I'm fine if it drops from two weekends to one. But my ex is still insisting on both weekends.

Right. But what does your kid say? Is he okay with one weekend?

DS says he doesn't want to "have" to ever go up there on any sort of fixed schedule, but that one weekend would be better than two.

I must be really challenging to be nearing the age of independence and yet be forced to comply with court orders as if you have committed a crime, when you are just an innocent bystander of adults' disputes,