Will Manchin and Sinema crack?

[Anonymous]

Why does the GOP not care about military spending or tax cuts for the wealthy but object to infrastructure (including human infrastructure) ? Mind boggling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm mystified by Sinema. Manchin makes some sense. He's from a very red state and needs to show separation from the party to get enough votes to win. He's also historically been pretty conservative. But Sinema is from a state that is strongly trending blue. Her campaign specifically promoted a bunch of the items that are in the reconciliation bill. That's what she won on. She used to be a Green Party activist! And now her support among democrats in Arizona is in the tank. If she sinks the reconciliation bill, she is guaranteed a strong primary challenge that she will almost certainly lose. It's baffling.

Actually Manchin is the bigger enigma. The programs included in the $3.5T bill are wildly popular in WV, but Manchin ignores that.

Sinema is easy to figure out: she's a straight-up sellout.

Machin always shows his independence, then quietly votes. He just needs to make it clear to WVa he’s not a Dem Stooge. Ultimately, he’ll get the WVa pork.

Sinema is going to be a wealthy woman with a very soft landing place when she loses the 2024 primary.

Either that, or she’s a mentally ill meglomaniac who needs the spotlight. She’s super erratic. So, that’s also very possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm mystified by Sinema. Manchin makes some sense. He's from a very red state and needs to show separation from the party to get enough votes to win. He's also historically been pretty conservative. But Sinema is from a state that is strongly trending blue. Her campaign specifically promoted a bunch of the items that are in the reconciliation bill. That's what she won on. She used to be a Green Party activist! And now her support among democrats in Arizona is in the tank. If she sinks the reconciliation bill, she is guaranteed a strong primary challenge that she will almost certainly lose. It's baffling.

Actually Manchin is the bigger enigma. The programs included in the $3.5T bill are wildly popular in WV, but Manchin ignores that.

Sinema is easy to figure out: she's a straight-up sellout.

Machin always shows his independence, then quietly votes. He just needs to make it clear to WVa he’s not a Dem Stooge. Ultimately, he’ll get the WVa pork.

Sinema is going to be a wealthy woman with a very soft landing place when she loses the 2024 primary.

Either that, or she’s a mentally ill meglomaniac who needs the spotlight. She’s super erratic. So, that’s also very possible.

If Sinema loses the 2024 primary it means AZ will have a Republican senator.

Some of you are confusing "trending blue" with "becoming wildly progressive." The two are not the same. If the Democrats go sharply progressive, many of the "trending blue" places will now "trend red." Sinema knows this. One can't fault her position as a very moderate Democrat. You know, Democrats used to be moderate...

[Anonymous]

There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A rising tide lifts all boats. Including yours, OP.

Rising taxes do not lift the middle class. Increased taxes help the indigent and don't really impact the lifestyle of the wealthy. You must fall within one one of thosevtwp groups.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

They refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is authoritarian. How many times have you read a sentence like “the Democrats are the real authoritarians!”? Many times on this board. That tracks with their “understanding” of things like “communism,” “Marxism” and “socialism.” They don’t know what the hell those things are, either, but they’re certain Democrats are all of them simultaneously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

They refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is authoritarian. How many times have you read a sentence like “the Democrats are the real authoritarians!”? Many times on this board. That tracks with their “understanding” of things like “communism,” “Marxism” and “socialism.” They don’t know what the hell those things are, either, but they’re certain Democrats are all of them simultaneously.

Oh, they know what those terms mean, and no one needs to be a GOP sycophant to understand that too many Democrats think money should be taken from the hard working middle class to pay for freebies that get votes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

They refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is authoritarian. How many times have you read a sentence like “the Democrats are the real authoritarians!”? Many times on this board. That tracks with their “understanding” of things like “communism,” “Marxism” and “socialism.” They don’t know what the hell those things are, either, but they’re certain Democrats are all of them simultaneously.

Oh, they know what those terms mean, and no one needs to be a GOP sycophant to understand that too many Democrats think money should be taken from the hard working middle class to pay for freebies that get votes.

Aw, you’re so cute to think that 400K is “middle class.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm mystified by Sinema. Manchin makes some sense. He's from a very red state and needs to show separation from the party to get enough votes to win. He's also historically been pretty conservative. But Sinema is from a state that is strongly trending blue. Her campaign specifically promoted a bunch of the items that are in the reconciliation bill. That's what she won on. She used to be a Green Party activist! And now her support among democrats in Arizona is in the tank. If she sinks the reconciliation bill, she is guaranteed a strong primary challenge that she will almost certainly lose. It's baffling.

Actually Manchin is the bigger enigma. The programs included in the $3.5T bill are wildly popular in WV, but Manchin ignores that.

Sinema is easy to figure out: she's a straight-up sellout.

Machin always shows his independence, then quietly votes. He just needs to make it clear to WVa he’s not a Dem Stooge. Ultimately, he’ll get the WVa pork.

Sinema is going to be a wealthy woman with a very soft landing place when she loses the 2024 primary.

Either that, or she’s a mentally ill meglomaniac who needs the spotlight. She’s super erratic. So, that’s also very possible.

If Sinema loses the 2024 primary it means AZ will have a Republican senator.

Some of you are confusing "trending blue" with "becoming wildly progressive." The two are not the same. If the Democrats go sharply progressive, many of the "trending blue" places will now "trend red." Sinema knows this. One can't fault her position as a very moderate Democrat. You know, Democrats used to be moderate...

She isn’t moderate though she’s crazy. You could actually run to the right of where she was in 2018 in AZ, on good governance issues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm mystified by Sinema. Manchin makes some sense. He's from a very red state and needs to show separation from the party to get enough votes to win. He's also historically been pretty conservative. But Sinema is from a state that is strongly trending blue. Her campaign specifically promoted a bunch of the items that are in the reconciliation bill. That's what she won on. She used to be a Green Party activist! And now her support among democrats in Arizona is in the tank. If she sinks the reconciliation bill, she is guaranteed a strong primary challenge that she will almost certainly lose. It's baffling.

Actually Manchin is the bigger enigma. The programs included in the $3.5T bill are wildly popular in WV, but Manchin ignores that.

Sinema is easy to figure out: she's a straight-up sellout.

Machin always shows his independence, then quietly votes. He just needs to make it clear to WVa he’s not a Dem Stooge. Ultimately, he’ll get the WVa pork.

Sinema is going to be a wealthy woman with a very soft landing place when she loses the 2024 primary.

Either that, or she’s a mentally ill meglomaniac who needs the spotlight. She’s super erratic. So, that’s also very possible.

If Sinema loses the 2024 primary it means AZ will have a Republican senator.

Some of you are confusing "trending blue" with "becoming wildly progressive." The two are not the same. If the Democrats go sharply progressive, many of the "trending blue" places will now "trend red." Sinema knows this. One can't fault her position as a very moderate Democrat. You know, Democrats used to be moderate...

She isn’t moderate though she’s crazy. You could actually run to the right of where she was in 2018 in AZ, on good governance issues.

Yeah I feel like you don't need to run as a progressive to defeat Sinema in a primary. Run as someone who wants to get things done instead of someone who's going to get in the way, blah blah blah.

It's weird because I instinctively like her and I assumed that she had some insights that were telling her Arizonans wanted her to do what she's doing. But maybe there is no plan?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

They refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is authoritarian. How many times have you read a sentence like “the Democrats are the real authoritarians!”? Many times on this board. That tracks with their “understanding” of things like “communism,” “Marxism” and “socialism.” They don’t know what the hell those things are, either, but they’re certain Democrats are all of them simultaneously.

Oh, they know what those terms mean, and no one needs to be a GOP sycophant to understand that too many Democrats think money should be taken from the hard working middle class to pay for freebies that get votes.

Aw, you’re so cute to think that 400K is “middle class.”

You're mighty precious yourself if you think Democrats haven't raised taxes on folks making less than $400,000 over the years. Wealthy D3mocrats like Nancy Pelosi aren't worrying at all about the true middle class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

They refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is authoritarian. How many times have you read a sentence like “the Democrats are the real authoritarians!”? Many times on this board. That tracks with their “understanding” of things like “communism,” “Marxism” and “socialism.” They don’t know what the hell those things are, either, but they’re certain Democrats are all of them simultaneously.

Oh, they know what those terms mean, and no one needs to be a GOP sycophant to understand that too many Democrats think money should be taken from the hard working middle class to pay for freebies that get votes.

Aw, you’re so cute to think that 400K is “middle class.”

You're mighty precious yourself if you think Democrats haven't raised taxes on folks making less than $400,000 over the years. Wealthy D3mocrats like Nancy Pelosi aren't worrying at all about the true middle class.

Why are Democrats trying to get the Salt Tax deduction put in place again? This is definitely a benefit to wealthy Americans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm mystified by Sinema. Manchin makes some sense. He's from a very red state and needs to show separation from the party to get enough votes to win. He's also historically been pretty conservative. But Sinema is from a state that is strongly trending blue. Her campaign specifically promoted a bunch of the items that are in the reconciliation bill. That's what she won on. She used to be a Green Party activist! And now her support among democrats in Arizona is in the tank. If she sinks the reconciliation bill, she is guaranteed a strong primary challenge that she will almost certainly lose. It's baffling.

Actually Manchin is the bigger enigma. The programs included in the $3.5T bill are wildly popular in WV, but Manchin ignores that.

Sinema is easy to figure out: she's a straight-up sellout.

Machin always shows his independence, then quietly votes. He just needs to make it clear to WVa he’s not a Dem Stooge. Ultimately, he’ll get the WVa pork.

Sinema is going to be a wealthy woman with a very soft landing place when she loses the 2024 primary.

Either that, or she’s a mentally ill meglomaniac who needs the spotlight. She’s super erratic. So, that’s also very possible.

If Sinema loses the 2024 primary it means AZ will have a Republican senator.

Some of you are confusing "trending blue" with "becoming wildly progressive." The two are not the same. If the Democrats go sharply progressive, many of the "trending blue" places will now "trend red." Sinema knows this. One can't fault her position as a very moderate Democrat. You know, Democrats used to be moderate...

She isn’t moderate though she’s crazy. You could actually run to the right of where she was in 2018 in AZ, on good governance issues.

Yeah I feel like you don't need to run as a progressive to defeat Sinema in a primary. Run as someone who wants to get things done instead of someone who's going to get in the way, blah blah blah.

It's weird because I instinctively like her and I assumed that she had some insights that were telling her Arizonans wanted her to do what she's doing. But maybe there is no plan?

Mark Kelly is fully on board and his approval ratings in AZ are way higher than Sinemas. I don’t see any evidence that support g reconciliation would be bad for her electorally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is also voting blue to protect the republic from authoritarian rule and the end of our country as we know it. GOP sycophants seem to forget that.

They refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is authoritarian. How many times have you read a sentence like “the Democrats are the real authoritarians!”? Many times on this board. That tracks with their “understanding” of things like “communism,” “Marxism” and “socialism.” They don’t know what the hell those things are, either, but they’re certain Democrats are all of them simultaneously.

Oh, they know what those terms mean, and no one needs to be a GOP sycophant to understand that too many Democrats think money should be taken from the hard working middle class to pay for freebies that get votes.

Except what is actually happening is that the upper class is vacuuming money from across the board and leaving the middle class and poor to fend for the crumbs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A rising tide lifts all boats. Including yours, OP.

I mean, does it, tho?

How are higher taxes lifting my boat? I’m all for reallocating funding toward public schools, programs to teach financial literacy, climate change, but at what point is just giving out a child tax credit in perpetuity helpful? Shouldn’t we just institute UBI, a flat tax and a VAT…the democrats want to shoe horn in coded language for perks that won’t go away and to get them re-elected.

Agree. It is not at all clear that what the Democrats are proposing will lift any boats. In fact, it seems more likely that this bill is a torpedo that is going to sink a lot of boats, with the question being how many. It's basically $3.5T worth of the Democratic Party's pet projects. I also find their constant argument that they are going to make the "rich" pay their "fair share" grating. Although I consider myself fortunate to have a HHI over $400K, I would not consider myself rich, but I do already pay a substantial amount in taxes every year (much more than lower income people do).

Same. The only boat this is lifting is people with 7 kids and a RV. I'm sure they're ecstatic to be paid $25,000 a year off the government teat for absolutely nothing.