stop whining about voter ID requirements

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The people who think it is simple for everyone to have a valid ID are middle-income and up white people who own homes and stay in one place for 30/40 years or until black families move into their neighborhoods.

Low and moderate income people, especially in urban areas, are less likely to have a long-term fixed address. They tend to move around quite a bit, and occasionally live with other people who may or may not be related to them, their names might not be on the lease or utility bills or the other documents required for an ID, and they may not be planning to stay in that place long enough to bother updating an ID with an old address on it. Those are people that Republicans want to disenfranchise

We are not saying it is simple, we are saying the federal government should solve this problem for anyone has difficulty obtaining an official photo ID and desires to have one.
A new national ID does not need to be created, the US government can issue US passports. In turn, these passports can be used directly or as proof of ID to obtain other types of local state REAL ID (eg, the new drivers license). Soon people won't be able to travel by plane without a REAL ID. So, let's empower people lacking ID by having the federal government solve the problem. And it has to be the federal government since state governments may oppose the initiative.

The same people saying the Federal Government should solve this problem are the same people fighting against Federal overreach. Look, if the right wants to have a national ID and nationalID card requirements for voting, then they are going to have to step back on the whole federal overreach thing.

So..which will it be. Do we really want a national ID database?

Call their bluff and put an end to this issue/tactic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pretty much. The only people I know who haven't gotten their ReadlID are republicans, because they don't want to do all the paperwork. Ironic, no?

Find it interesting no one has commented on this...I currently have two republican friends who are driving around on expired licenses because they can't be bothered to order birth certificates.

And, birth certificates are not "free", if you don't already have a copy.

Just think republicans are making a strategic error assuming that all their voters who matter all have non expired ids. They may find out otherwise in the next election.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The people who think it is simple for everyone to have a valid ID are middle-income and up white people who own homes and stay in one place for 30/40 years or until black families move into their neighborhoods.

Low and moderate income people, especially in urban areas, are less likely to have a long-term fixed address. They tend to move around quite a bit, and occasionally live with other people who may or may not be related to them, their names might not be on the lease or utility bills or the other documents required for an ID, and they may not be planning to stay in that place long enough to bother updating an ID with an old address on it. Those are people that Republicans want to disenfranchise

We are not saying it is simple, we are saying the federal government should solve this problem for anyone has difficulty obtaining an official photo ID and desires to have one.
A new national ID does not need to be created, the US government can issue US passports. In turn, these passports can be used directly or as proof of ID to obtain other types of local state REAL ID (eg, the new drivers license). Soon people won't be able to travel by plane without a REAL ID. So, let's empower people lacking ID by having the federal government solve the problem. And it has to be the federal government since state governments may oppose the initiative.

The same people saying the Federal Government should solve this problem are the same people fighting against Federal overreach. Look, if the right wants to have a national ID and nationalID card requirements for voting, then they are going to have to step back on the whole federal overreach thing.

So..which will it be. Do we really want a national ID database?

Again, slowly, it isn't just "the right" that wants secure elections.


Four in Five Americans Support Voter ID Laws

https://news.gallup.com/poll/194741/four-five-americans-support-voter-laws-early-voting.aspx

Take off your political blinders for just a minute. In a country where it seems like nobody can agree on much of anything of substance, 80% of Americans support voter ID laws.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since most Americans, including Democrats and black Americans, are in favor of voter ID requirements, what is it that those who are pushing against voter ID requirements are angling for?

Great question.

It isn’t being done in good faith. It is intended to suppress black and Latino and young voters. It may look neutral to you but the people pushing it know that their state and local election officials will always apply rules more strictly to obstruct black voters. They will make it harder for some people to get the required IDs or to update IDs and they will continue to put up other obstacles to suppress black votes, e.g. rigging precinct size, location, capacity, staffing to ensure long lines and waits. These racists cannot be trusted to enforce election laws fairly and equally. They have no intention of doing so. This is not targeted at fraud. It is targeted at depressing turnout among certain types of eligible voters.

So this is about what you FEEL their goals are. There's a whole lot of hypothesizing and impugning motives in these discussions. There are many states that require voters to have ID that are not Republican led states.

DP. I have not seen one reason for voter ID laws backed up with evidence for their necessity on this thread. It’s ironic that you are so dismissive of FEELINGS because that’s the only reason you want voter ID.

Countries all over the world require voter ID. Are they all paranoid? Services and purchases of all kinds require ID. Should the US stop with all the nonsense?

Countries all over the world make it EASIER for their citizens to vote — with national holidays, automatic registration, and expanding rather than reducing different voting options. “All kinds”? Wow! If you’re going to argue for the relevance of your point, generalizations such as “all kinds” and unspecified “nonsense “ really aren’t helping.

This is starting to feel like trying to get sense out of Tucker Carlson: unsupported opinionated generalizations that are trying to masquerade as genuine arguments when, really, they’re more like entertainment.

From two pages back. I suppose you can choose to hop on a 17 page thread without reading anything that came before, but it makes one look like an ass. Allow me to spoon feed you:

You need ID to cash a check.
You need ID to buy alcohol.
You need ID to buy tobacco.
You need ID to buy a gun.
You need ID to get into many govt buildings.
You need ID to get onto secure federal property.
You need ID to rent or buy an apartment or home.
You need ID to get on a plane.
You need ID to get a library card.
You need ID to buy a fishing license.
You need ID to open a bank account.
You need ID to receive govt benefits like WIC and EBT.
You need ID to apply for a job.
You need ID to buy or rent a car.
You need ID to go into any school building in the country.
You need ID to get medical treatment.
You need ID to apply to colleges.
You need ID to get into a many bars/clubs.
You need ID to get into many community centers / pools

I read it the first time. It’s still inaccurate. You clearly know quite a lot about what “makes one look like an ass”: ignorant and stubborn are an unfortunate combination.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Here’s what’s ironic... at least the first five examples on that page don’t strictly require photo is except for Brazil which is moving to biometric ID.

So your original premise that all other countries require ID is incorrect

YOU are incorrect and are too lazy to even read the details in the list

Argentina

In Argentina voting is compulsory for all citizens between 18 and 70 years old, non-compulsory for those older than 70 and between 16 and 18, and citizens with domiciles in foreign countries. To vote they must present a valid Documento Nacional de Identidad at the corresponding voting center.

My clarification: the Documento Nacional de Identidad is a national photo ID

Most countries in Latin America have similar policies.




Australia

In Australia voting is compulsory[1] for all adult citizens. Failure to cast a ballot may result in a small fine, currently AU$20. [2]

No form of ID is required to cast a ballot at an election; instead, voters are asked three questions before being issued a ballot, so that they can be checked off the electoral roll: (1) what is your full name; (2) where do you live; and (3) have you voted before in this election?[3] On election day, voters can vote at any polling place in their state of residence, and at selected polling places in other states.

However; In order to be registered, a form must be filled out and an ID must be proven.[



Brazil

In Brazil voting is compulsory to all citizens between 18 and 70 years old.[6] To vote, all citizens must:

Be registered to vote, getting a voter ID card, called "Título Eleitoral" aka "Títilo de Eleitor" in Brazil. Presenting the voter ID card when voting is optional
Present an official identity document with photo, usually the regular ID card (cédula de identidade)

Since 2006 the Brazilian Electoral Justice is re-registering voters with biometric identification.
Observation: that is even more fraudproof than any type of ID



Canada
Federal elections

In Canada, the Federal government mails an Elections Canada registration confirmation card, which the voter takes to the polling station. The card tells the individual where and when to vote. Voters must prove their identity and address with one of three options:[10]

Show one original government-issued piece of identification with photo, name and address, like a driver's license or a health card.
Show two original pieces of authorized identification. Both pieces must have a name and one must also have an address. Examples: student ID card, birth certificate, public transportation card, utility bill, bank/credit card statement, etc.
Take an oath and have an elector who knows the voter vouch for them (both of whom must make a sworn statement). This person must have authorized identification and their name must appear on the list of electors in the same polling division as the voter. This person can only vouch for one person and the person who is vouched for cannot vouch for another elector.

Provincial elections

Voter identification regulations vary from provinces to provinces. In Ontario, "ID is required to vote or to add or update your voter information on the voters list" and a substantial number of acceptable IDs, which do not need to be photo IDs, are accepted.[11]

In Quebec, the voter must show one of five government-issued photo IDs, and if lacking any of these, will be directed to the identity verification panel.


France

In France, voters must prove their identity to vote: at the registration (proof of address — A phone, water or electricity invoice... — and an identity document that proves your nationality — National Identity Card or Passport — and on the day of the vote, in towns larger than 1000 inhabitants, an identity document is required.

You’re not even reading the things you quote. It’s riddled with exceptions. Pathetic.

All of these countries take different tactics. You have the nerve to put Quebec in bold but ignore that Canada actually gives several options to verify your identification- JUST LIKE MOST JURISDICTIONS IN THE US! In France if you live in a small town they give you an exception for identity document! Australia doesn’t even require an ID!

Your little farce is falling apart. Voter ID is a “solution” looking for a problem. I guess the problem is brown people voting?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1. You don't actually need an ID for most of those. Businesses often ask for one as a means of limiting their liability but one isn't strictly required. Air travel is the big exception.

2. There are often a variety of different documents one can use in those circumstances. It is not strictly limited to one specific type.

3. The new voter rules being pushed tend to limit things to one specific form of ID. For example, one of the Dakotas limited it to a state issued drivers license with a street address. It just so happens that Native Americans that lived on the reservation tended to have a Tribal Authority ID and did not have a standard street address. Notice that a passport doesn't count under those rules.

At this point a national voter ID is probably a good idea just to make this issue go away. Ironically, there is a lot of overlap between people against a national ID but for ID requirements for voting.

Exactly. And not that OP will read this, but it affects older people a great deal.

For Older Voters, Getting The Right ID Can Be Especially Tough

https://www.npr.org/2018/09/07/644648955/for-older-voters-getting-the-right-id-can-be-especially-tough

Three dozen states require voters to show identification at the polls. And almost half of those states want photo IDs. But there are millions of eligible voters who don't have them. A 2012 survey estimated that 7 percent of American adults lack a government-issued photo ID.

While some organizations have sued to overturn these laws, a nonprofit organization called Spread The Vote has taken a different tack: It helps people without IDs get them. And people over 50 years of age have presented some of their biggest challenges.

On a recent Tuesday morning in Austell, Ga., 53-year-old Pamela Moon tried to get a replacement for an ID she had lost. She worked with a Spread The Vote volunteer at the Sweetwater Mission. The group sends volunteers to the mission every other Tuesday, so that people who come for food and clothes can get help obtaining a Georgia ID at the same time.

Georgia is one of seven states with particularly strict voter ID requirements, which demand that voters show a government-issued photo ID in order to cast a ballot in person. Advocates for voter ID laws argue that showing identification at the polls reduces the incidence of voter fraud, although studies have repeatedly shown that in-person voter fraud is extremely rare.

Moon never had a driver's license. "I can drive," she said, but she never got her license, "'cause I can't afford to buy no car."

Bill Cox, a volunteer for Spread The Vote, told Moon she needs a birth certificate to get a replacement ID. She lost that, too, she said.

"We will help you get that," Cox told her. "We will pay for it."

This is a relief for Moon. In Georgia, the cost of a birth certificate and a photo ID is $57 and she lives mostly off her disability benefits. In fact, studies show that most people who lack official state IDs are low income and they have more urgent concerns than just voting.

57 bucks is outrageous. It's a poll tax, and is should be unconstitutional.

I agree. And for many, there would also be transportation costs to and from the DMV. More areas really need to have DMV express locations accessible by public transportation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since most Americans, including Democrats and black Americans, are in favor of voter ID requirements, what is it that those who are pushing against voter ID requirements are angling for?

Great question.

It isn’t being done in good faith. It is intended to suppress black and Latino and young voters. It may look neutral to you but the people pushing it know that their state and local election officials will always apply rules more strictly to obstruct black voters. They will make it harder for some people to get the required IDs or to update IDs and they will continue to put up other obstacles to suppress black votes, e.g. rigging precinct size, location, capacity, staffing to ensure long lines and waits. These racists cannot be trusted to enforce election laws fairly and equally. They have no intention of doing so. This is not targeted at fraud. It is targeted at depressing turnout among certain types of eligible voters.

So this is about what you FEEL their goals are. There's a whole lot of hypothesizing and impugning motives in these discussions. There are many states that require voters to have ID that are not Republican led states.

DP. I have not seen one reason for voter ID laws backed up with evidence for their necessity on this thread. It’s ironic that you are so dismissive of FEELINGS because that’s the only reason you want voter ID.

Countries all over the world require voter ID. Are they all paranoid? Services and purchases of all kinds require ID. Should the US stop with all the nonsense?

Countries all over the world make it EASIER for their citizens to vote — with national holidays, automatic registration, and expanding rather than reducing different voting options. “All kinds”? Wow! If you’re going to argue for the relevance of your point, generalizations such as “all kinds” and unspecified “nonsense “ really aren’t helping.

This is starting to feel like trying to get sense out of Tucker Carlson: unsupported opinionated generalizations that are trying to masquerade as genuine arguments when, really, they’re more like entertainment.

From two pages back. I suppose you can choose to hop on a 17 page thread without reading anything that came before, but it makes one look like an ass. Allow me to spoon feed you:

You need ID to cash a check.
You need ID to buy alcohol.
You need ID to buy tobacco.
You need ID to buy a gun.
You need ID to get into many govt buildings.
You need ID to get onto secure federal property.
You need ID to rent or buy an apartment or home.
You need ID to get on a plane.
You need ID to get a library card.
You need ID to buy a fishing license.
You need ID to open a bank account.
You need ID to receive govt benefits like WIC and EBT.
You need ID to apply for a job.
You need ID to buy or rent a car.
You need ID to go into any school building in the country.
You need ID to get medical treatment.
You need ID to apply to colleges.
You need ID to get into a many bars/clubs.
You need ID to get into many community centers / pools

I read it the first time. It’s still inaccurate. You clearly know quite a lot about what “makes one look like an ass”: ignorant and stubborn are an unfortunate combination.

Don't ask for a list of what "all kinds" includes if you're not interested. You don't even make sense. What's "still inaccurate?" You may not think it means we should require voter ID but please use your words in a meaningful way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pretty much. The only people I know who haven't gotten their ReadlID are republicans, because they don't want to do all the paperwork. Ironic, no?

Find it interesting no one has commented on this...I currently have two republican friends who are driving around on expired licenses because they can't be bothered to order birth certificates.

And, birth certificates are not "free", if you don't already have a copy.

Just think republicans are making a strategic error assuming that all their voters who matter all have non expired ids. They may find out otherwise in the next election.

You mean how they told their voters not to vote by mail and then lost the election? That kind of strategic error? 😂

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pretty much. The only people I know who haven't gotten their ReadlID are republicans, because they don't want to do all the paperwork. Ironic, no?

Find it interesting no one has commented on this...I currently have two republican friends who are driving around on expired licenses because they can't be bothered to order birth certificates.

And, birth certificates are not "free", if you don't already have a copy.

Just think republicans are making a strategic error assuming that all their voters who matter all have non expired ids. They may find out otherwise in the next election.

You mean how they told their voters not to vote by mail and then lost the election? That kind of strategic error? 😂

Right, maybe I shouldn't point that out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since most Americans, including Democrats and black Americans, are in favor of voter ID requirements, what is it that those who are pushing against voter ID requirements are angling for?

Great question.

It isn’t being done in good faith. It is intended to suppress black and Latino and young voters. It may look neutral to you but the people pushing it know that their state and local election officials will always apply rules more strictly to obstruct black voters. They will make it harder for some people to get the required IDs or to update IDs and they will continue to put up other obstacles to suppress black votes, e.g. rigging precinct size, location, capacity, staffing to ensure long lines and waits. These racists cannot be trusted to enforce election laws fairly and equally. They have no intention of doing so. This is not targeted at fraud. It is targeted at depressing turnout among certain types of eligible voters.

So this is about what you FEEL their goals are. There's a whole lot of hypothesizing and impugning motives in these discussions. There are many states that require voters to have ID that are not Republican led states.

DP. I have not seen one reason for voter ID laws backed up with evidence for their necessity on this thread. It’s ironic that you are so dismissive of FEELINGS because that’s the only reason you want voter ID.

Countries all over the world require voter ID. Are they all paranoid? Services and purchases of all kinds require ID. Should the US stop with all the nonsense?

Countries all over the world make it EASIER for their citizens to vote — with national holidays, automatic registration, and expanding rather than reducing different voting options. “All kinds”? Wow! If you’re going to argue for the relevance of your point, generalizations such as “all kinds” and unspecified “nonsense “ really aren’t helping.

This is starting to feel like trying to get sense out of Tucker Carlson: unsupported opinionated generalizations that are trying to masquerade as genuine arguments when, really, they’re more like entertainment.

From two pages back. I suppose you can choose to hop on a 17 page thread without reading anything that came before, but it makes one look like an ass. Allow me to spoon feed you:

You need ID to cash a check.
You need ID to buy alcohol.
You need ID to buy tobacco.
You need ID to buy a gun.
You need ID to get into many govt buildings.
You need ID to get onto secure federal property.
You need ID to rent or buy an apartment or home.
You need ID to get on a plane.
You need ID to get a library card.
You need ID to buy a fishing license.
You need ID to open a bank account.
You need ID to receive govt benefits like WIC and EBT.
You need ID to apply for a job.
You need ID to buy or rent a car.
You need ID to go into any school building in the country.
You need ID to get medical treatment.
You need ID to apply to colleges.
You need ID to get into a many bars/clubs.
You need ID to get into many community centers / pools

I read it the first time. It’s still inaccurate. You clearly know quite a lot about what “makes one look like

an ass”: ignorant and stubborn are an unfortunate combination.

DP here. Actually, I do have to show an ID to do each of the above listed, although I don't purchase tobacco or guns. In those places where an ID is not required for the above, I can see how individuals who are in this country illegally or those who've committed crimes would find it easier to seek refuge there.

[Anonymous]

When people register to vote in most states, they have some kind of proof of who they are. Some states, like Florida, take a lot more types of ID than others.

Once you are registered, it's your signature that is matched.

That has worked for decades -- and still works with few exceptions. When they did forensics on the votes in Michigan, they found almost no discrepancies. In Georgia, when then OTHER SIDE flagged all these "suspect" absentee ballots, when they tracked down the people, they found it was indeed their ballots.

Of course AMericans want secure elections. But the GOP just wants to throw up roadblocks; they are not remotely interested in a "secure" election: Only one that lets them cherry pick the voters and ensures their win.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The people who think it is simple for everyone to have a valid ID are middle-income and up white people who own homes and stay in one place for 30/40 years or until black families move into their neighborhoods.

Low and moderate income people, especially in urban areas, are less likely to have a long-term fixed address. They tend to move around quite a bit, and occasionally live with other people who may or may not be related to them, their names might not be on the lease or utility bills or the other documents required for an ID, and they may not be planning to stay in that place long enough to bother updating an ID with an old address on it. Those are people that Republicans want to disenfranchise

We are not saying it is simple, we are saying the federal government should solve this problem for anyone has difficulty obtaining an official photo ID and desires to have one.
A new national ID does not need to be created, the US government can issue US passports. In turn, these passports can be used directly or as proof of ID to obtain other types of local state REAL ID (eg, the new drivers license). Soon people won't be able to travel by plane without a REAL ID. So, let's empower people lacking ID by having the federal government solve the problem. And it has to be the federal government since state governments may oppose the initiative.

The same people saying the Federal Government should solve this problem are the same people fighting against Federal overreach. Look, if the right wants to have a national ID and nationalID card requirements for voting, then they are going to have to step back on the whole federal overreach thing.

So..which will it be. Do we really want a national ID database?

Again, slowly, it isn't just "the right" that wants secure elections.


Four in Five Americans Support Voter ID Laws

https://news.gallup.com/poll/194741/four-five-americans-support-voter-laws-early-voting.aspx

Take off your political blinders for just a minute. In a country where it seems like nobody can agree on much of anything of substance, 80% of Americans support voter ID laws.

If the question is "do we want secure elections" - of course the answer is "yes"

the 2020 election was secure.
So I agree.

I don't agree that mandating ID to vote is addressing any issues, since there is no proof of widespread voter fraud.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The people who think it is simple for everyone to have a valid ID are middle-income and up white people who own homes and stay in one place for 30/40 years or until black families move into their neighborhoods.

Low and moderate income people, especially in urban areas, are less likely to have a long-term fixed address. They tend to move around quite a bit, and occasionally live with other people who may or may not be related to them, their names might not be on the lease or utility bills or the other documents required for an ID, and they may not be planning to stay in that place long enough to bother updating an ID with an old address on it. Those are people that Republicans want to disenfranchise

We are not saying it is simple, we are saying the federal government should solve this problem for anyone has difficulty obtaining an official photo ID and desires to have one.
A new national ID does not need to be created, the US government can issue US passports. In turn, these passports can be used directly or as proof of ID to obtain other types of local state REAL ID (eg, the new drivers license). Soon people won't be able to travel by plane without a REAL ID. So, let's empower people lacking ID by having the federal government solve the problem. And it has to be the federal government since state governments may oppose the initiative.

The same people saying the Federal Government should solve this problem are the same people fighting against Federal overreach. Look, if the right wants to have a national ID and nationalID card requirements for voting, then they are going to have to step back on the whole federal overreach thing.

So..which will it be. Do we really want a national ID database?

Again, slowly, it isn't just "the right" that wants secure elections.


Four in Five Americans Support Voter ID Laws

https://news.gallup.com/poll/194741/four-five-americans-support-voter-laws-early-voting.aspx

Take off your political blinders for just a minute. In a country where it seems like nobody can agree on much of anything of substance, 80% of Americans support voter ID laws.

If the question is "do we want secure elections" - of course the answer is "yes"

the 2020 election was secure.
So I agree.

I don't agree that mandating ID to vote is addressing any issues, since there is no proof of widespread voter fraud.

Of course there isn't an actual problem. But why fall into their trap? A national voter ID not only solves the non-existent problem it also expand registration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since most Americans, including Democrats and black Americans, are in favor of voter ID requirements, what is it that those who are pushing against voter ID requirements are angling for?

Great question.

It isn’t being done in good faith. It is intended to suppress black and Latino and young voters. It may look neutral to you but the people pushing it know that their state and local election officials will always apply rules more strictly to obstruct black voters. They will make it harder for some people to get the required IDs or to update IDs and they will continue to put up other obstacles to suppress black votes, e.g. rigging precinct size, location, capacity, staffing to ensure long lines and waits. These racists cannot be trusted to enforce election laws fairly and equally. They have no intention of doing so. This is not targeted at fraud. It is targeted at depressing turnout among certain types of eligible voters.

So this is about what you FEEL their goals are. There's a whole lot of hypothesizing and impugning motives in these discussions. There are many states that require voters to have ID that are not Republican led states.

DP. I have not seen one reason for voter ID laws backed up with evidence for their necessity on this thread. It’s ironic that you are so dismissive of FEELINGS because that’s the only reason you want voter ID.

Countries all over the world require voter ID. Are they all paranoid? Services and purchases of all kinds require ID. Should the US stop with all the nonsense?

Countries all over the world make it EASIER for their citizens to vote — with national holidays, automatic registration, and expanding rather than reducing different voting options. “All kinds”? Wow! If you’re going to argue for the relevance of your point, generalizations such as “all kinds” and unspecified “nonsense “ really aren’t helping.

This is starting to feel like trying to get sense out of Tucker Carlson: unsupported opinionated generalizations that are trying to masquerade as genuine arguments when, really, they’re more like entertainment.

From two pages back. I suppose you can choose to hop on a 17 page thread without reading anything that came before, but it makes one look like an ass. Allow me to spoon feed you:

You need ID to cash a check.
You need ID to buy alcohol.
You need ID to buy tobacco.
You need ID to buy a gun.
You need ID to get into many govt buildings.
You need ID to get onto secure federal property.
You need ID to rent or buy an apartment or home.
You need ID to get on a plane.
You need ID to get a library card.
You need ID to buy a fishing license.
You need ID to open a bank account.
You need ID to receive govt benefits like WIC and EBT.
You need ID to apply for a job.
You need ID to buy or rent a car.
You need ID to go into any school building in the country.
You need ID to get medical treatment.
You need ID to apply to colleges.
You need ID to get into a many bars/clubs.
You need ID to get into many community centers / pools

I read it the first time. It’s still inaccurate. You clearly know quite a lot about what “makes one look like an ass”: ignorant and stubborn are an unfortunate combination.

Don't ask for a list of what "all kinds" includes if you're not interested. You don't even make sense. What's "still inaccurate?" You may not think it means we should require voter ID but please use your words in a meaningful way.

I didn’t ask for a list. I did point out that 1) People don’t necessarily need ID to do all of the things on that list and 2) it’s irrelevant since many of the people with ID issues may not do any of the things on that list. A long list of irrelevant BS is still just BS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since most Americans, including Democrats and black Americans, are in favor of voter ID requirements, what is it that those who are pushing against voter ID requirements are angling for?

Great question.

It isn’t being done in good faith. It is intended to suppress black and Latino and young voters. It may look neutral to you but the people pushing it know that their state and local election officials will always apply rules more strictly to obstruct black voters. They will make it harder for some people to get the required IDs or to update IDs and they will continue to put up other obstacles to suppress black votes, e.g. rigging precinct size, location, capacity, staffing to ensure long lines and waits. These racists cannot be trusted to enforce election laws fairly and equally. They have no intention of doing so. This is not targeted at fraud. It is targeted at depressing turnout among certain types of eligible voters.

So this is about what you FEEL their goals are. There's a whole lot of hypothesizing and impugning motives in these discussions. There are many states that require voters to have ID that are not Republican led states.

DP. I have not seen one reason for voter ID laws backed up with evidence for their necessity on this thread. It’s ironic that you are so dismissive of FEELINGS because that’s the only reason you want voter ID.

Countries all over the world require voter ID. Are they all paranoid? Services and purchases of all kinds require ID. Should the US stop with all the nonsense?

Countries all over the world make it EASIER for their citizens to vote — with national holidays, automatic registration, and expanding rather than reducing different voting options. “All kinds”? Wow! If you’re going to argue for the relevance of your point, generalizations such as “all kinds” and unspecified “nonsense “ really aren’t helping.

This is starting to feel like trying to get sense out of Tucker Carlson: unsupported opinionated generalizations that are trying to masquerade as genuine arguments when, really, they’re more like entertainment.

From two pages back. I suppose you can choose to hop on a 17 page thread without reading anything that came before, but it makes one look like an ass. Allow me to spoon feed you:

You need ID to cash a check.
You need ID to buy alcohol.
You need ID to buy tobacco.
You need ID to buy a gun.
You need ID to get into many govt buildings.
You need ID to get onto secure federal property.
You need ID to rent or buy an apartment or home.
You need ID to get on a plane.
You need ID to get a library card.
You need ID to buy a fishing license.
You need ID to open a bank account.
You need ID to receive govt benefits like WIC and EBT.
You need ID to apply for a job.
You need ID to buy or rent a car.
You need ID to go into any school building in the country.
You need ID to get medical treatment.
You need ID to apply to colleges.
You need ID to get into a many bars/clubs.
You need ID to get into many community centers / pools

I read it the first time. It’s still inaccurate. You clearly know quite a lot about what “makes one look like an ass”: ignorant and stubborn are an unfortunate combination.

Don't ask for a list of what "all kinds" includes if you're not interested. You don't even make sense. What's "still inaccurate?" You may not think it means we should require voter ID but please use your words in a meaningful way.

I didn’t ask for a list. I did point out that 1) People don’t necessarily need ID to do all of the things on that list and 2) it’s irrelevant since many of the people with ID issues may not do any of the things on that list. A long list of irrelevant BS is still just BS.

Other than a small town community rec center or ER and some schools, which of those items does not require an ID?