Anyone following the viral Harvard University *Extension School* controversy?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard is the absolute grift - they monetize the name to shake down all comers in the Extension school, while they keep the size of the "regular" student body far below what their endowment could afford, ensuring that demand will always far outstrip supply and that crazy parents will sell their kidney to get Larla into "real" Harvard. And they get tax breaks as an educational institution even though Harvard's primary raison d'etre is building its endowment.

Meh, every school has their version of the "extension" school. Sometimes it's called continuing ed, at Columbia it's called general studies. All schools are looking to monetize but are also sensitive about diluting their brand.

If they slap their name on a certificate, they can't be surprised when someone claims the certificate is from their school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

Because you do not receive a master's/graduate degree from **Harvard** University. You receive it from a school at Harvard, so it's X degree, the school, Harvard. Rufo never identifies the school. He's not being honest.

Interesting on how you are drilling down on that it needs to be a lie. Is that how you want to split hairs over integrity?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

Because you do not receive a master's/graduate degree from **Harvard** University. You receive it from a school at Harvard, so it's X degree, the school, Harvard. Rufo never identifies the school. He's not being honest.

Interesting on how you are drilling down on that it needs to be a lie. Is that how you want to split hairs over integrity?

Interesting, but he wasn't wrong. I guess I got a degree from a specific college at my university but if people ask where I went, I tell them the university name, not the specific college. Nobody cares that much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

I realize you are completely blind to the bad faith behavior of all right wing provocateurs like Rufo. But really? Are you this dumb?

Have you ever mocked Jill Biden for using “Dr.” as her title? Asking for a friend.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds as though Harvard University is the one running the grift here, if one buys your assumption (which is probably incorrect) that their online programs are not legitimate.

+1000

DYK how many places run these programs? Columbia has one in general studies, believe same @ Penn. So many schools have them. Heck, does USDA still run an extension school? That said, they are extension programs.

Harvard’s extension school is over 100 years old and was created for the working people in Boston who couldn’t go to college during the day. They are all taught by Harvard professors

plenty of universities have these programs. Yale has a physicians assistant Program at night separate from the school working with themYale Medical school. Online classes and on-site requirements.

Columbia has night school classes in certain degrees where students go at their own pace. Stanford,Penn, Duke, Brown, Northwestern and many many more.

What is wrong with catering to non-traditional students who might want a change in career or to get a better job but can’t spend all day at school with 18 year olds.

Universities are in the business of education. It’s exactly what they’re doing.

There are no scholarships... It's a cash grab

Nearly all colleges offer this kind of education.

For which colleges that offer it is it a "cash grab", and for which is it a reasonable offer?

Please answer. But I know you won't.

What kind of gotcha is this?

No scholarships+ high cost is cash grab.

Make the degree free or cheap. This isn't complicated. Otherwise it's a cash grab.

Answer the damned question. Nearly all colleges offer this. For which ones is it a cash grab? All of them?

For the record HES offers financial aid and its tuition is half Harvard’s.

All of them and the point is, it's not making it accessible to more people.

Yes, a lot of online degrees are cash grabs, not only Harvard. Harvard should be running a better program.

The extension school is not an online degree program--it's a longstanding continuing/community education program. The actual grad schools at Harvard have their own reputable and strong on-line programs. The extension school is not part of that.

HES website says his masters was all online, except for one 2 week course.

Aren't you guys supposed to be all about equity? Most people can't drop their lives for a on-campus masters.

Who are “we guys?”

And what does this have to do with equity?

Bully for him for doing it. But he’s deliberately overselling his credentials while attacking another’s integrity. It’s a bad look. But all these right wingers act in bad faith, always. It’s just what they do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

I realize you are completely blind to the bad faith behavior of all right wing provocateurs like Rufo. But really? Are you this dumb?

Have you ever mocked Jill Biden for using “Dr.” as her title? Asking for a friend.

The joke is always that when the flight attendants are asking if there is a Dr on board the plane, they aren't asking for a PhD in Economics. But I will call them whatever they want, since they aren't wrong or misrepresenting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds as though Harvard University is the one running the grift here, if one buys your assumption (which is probably incorrect) that their online programs are not legitimate.

+1000

DYK how many places run these programs? Columbia has one in general studies, believe same @ Penn. So many schools have them. Heck, does USDA still run an extension school? That said, they are extension programs.

Harvard’s extension school is over 100 years old and was created for the working people in Boston who couldn’t go to college during the day. They are all taught by Harvard professors

plenty of universities have these programs. Yale has a physicians assistant Program at night separate from the school working with themYale Medical school. Online classes and on-site requirements.

Columbia has night school classes in certain degrees where students go at their own pace. Stanford,Penn, Duke, Brown, Northwestern and many many more.

What is wrong with catering to non-traditional students who might want a change in career or to get a better job but can’t spend all day at school with 18 year olds.

Universities are in the business of education. It’s exactly what they’re doing.

There are no scholarships... It's a cash grab

Nearly all colleges offer this kind of education.

For which colleges that offer it is it a "cash grab", and for which is it a reasonable offer?

Please answer. But I know you won't.

What kind of gotcha is this?

No scholarships+ high cost is cash grab.

Make the degree free or cheap. This isn't complicated. Otherwise it's a cash grab.

Answer the damned question. Nearly all colleges offer this. For which ones is it a cash grab? All of them?

For the record HES offers financial aid and its tuition is half Harvard’s.

All of them and the point is, it's not making it accessible to more people.

Yes, a lot of online degrees are cash grabs, not only Harvard. Harvard should be running a better program.

The extension school is not an online degree program--it's a longstanding continuing/community education program. The actual grad schools at Harvard have their own reputable and strong on-line programs. The extension school is not part of that.

HES website says his masters was all online, except for one 2 week course.

Aren't you guys supposed to be all about equity? Most people can't drop their lives for a on-campus masters.

Who are “we guys?”

And what does this have to do with equity?

Bully for him for doing it. But he’s deliberately overselling his credentials while attacking another’s integrity. It’s a bad look. But all these right wingers act in bad faith, always. It’s just what they do.

Why is it an oversell, you've decided that some graduates aren't as worthy of the name?

[Anonymous]

Why does someone have a bee in their bonnet over what school from Harvard the degree comes from? How you get in matters less than what you do while there and what you do when you leave. The degree itself is just paper. It’s evidence that you have acquired a specific body of knowledge. Harvard’s administration seems just fine with certifying that its Extension School conveys the appropriate knowledge and skills in its degree programs. So much so that it grants the recipients all the same rights and distinctions as any other alumni, including stamping the degree with its seal.

Someone here seems weirdly concerned with Harvard’s reputation for reasons that seem to have nothing to do with academics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds as though Harvard University is the one running the grift here, if one buys your assumption (which is probably incorrect) that their online programs are not legitimate.

+1000

DYK how many places run these programs? Columbia has one in general studies, believe same @ Penn. So many schools have them. Heck, does USDA still run an extension school? That said, they are extension programs.

Harvard’s extension school is over 100 years old and was created for the working people in Boston who couldn’t go to college during the day. They are all taught by Harvard professors

plenty of universities have these programs. Yale has a physicians assistant Program at night separate from the school working with themYale Medical school. Online classes and on-site requirements.

Columbia has night school classes in certain degrees where students go at their own pace. Stanford,Penn, Duke, Brown, Northwestern and many many more.

What is wrong with catering to non-traditional students who might want a change in career or to get a better job but can’t spend all day at school with 18 year olds.

Universities are in the business of education. It’s exactly what they’re doing.

There are no scholarships... It's a cash grab

Nearly all colleges offer this kind of education.

For which colleges that offer it is it a "cash grab", and for which is it a reasonable offer?

Please answer. But I know you won't.

What kind of gotcha is this?

No scholarships+ high cost is cash grab.

Make the degree free or cheap. This isn't complicated. Otherwise it's a cash grab.

Answer the damned question. Nearly all colleges offer this. For which ones is it a cash grab? All of them?

For the record HES offers financial aid and its tuition is half Harvard’s.

All of them and the point is, it's not making it accessible to more people.

Yes, a lot of online degrees are cash grabs, not only Harvard. Harvard should be running a better program.

The extension school is not an online degree program--it's a longstanding continuing/community education program. The actual grad schools at Harvard have their own reputable and strong on-line programs. The extension school is not part of that.

HES website says his masters was all online, except for one 2 week course.

Aren't you guys supposed to be all about equity? Most people can't drop their lives for a on-campus masters.

Who are “we guys?”

And what does this have to do with equity?

Bully for him for doing it. But he’s deliberately overselling his credentials while attacking another’s integrity. It’s a bad look. But all these right wingers act in bad faith, always. It’s just what they do.

Why is it an oversell, you've decided that some graduates aren't as worthy of the name?

he doesn't have a master's in government, he has it in extension studies. he appears to have dropped "government" now and says he got an ALM. The only ALM degree offered @ Harvard is through the extension studies program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds as though Harvard University is the one running the grift here, if one buys your assumption (which is probably incorrect) that their online programs are not legitimate.

+1000

DYK how many places run these programs? Columbia has one in general studies, believe same @ Penn. So many schools have them. Heck, does USDA still run an extension school? That said, they are extension programs.

Harvard’s extension school is over 100 years old and was created for the working people in Boston who couldn’t go to college during the day. They are all taught by Harvard professors

plenty of universities have these programs. Yale has a physicians assistant Program at night separate from the school working with themYale Medical school. Online classes and on-site requirements.

Columbia has night school classes in certain degrees where students go at their own pace. Stanford,Penn, Duke, Brown, Northwestern and many many more.

What is wrong with catering to non-traditional students who might want a change in career or to get a better job but can’t spend all day at school with 18 year olds.

Universities are in the business of education. It’s exactly what they’re doing.

There are no scholarships... It's a cash grab

Nearly all colleges offer this kind of education.

For which colleges that offer it is it a "cash grab", and for which is it a reasonable offer?

Please answer. But I know you won't.

What kind of gotcha is this?

No scholarships+ high cost is cash grab.

Make the degree free or cheap. This isn't complicated. Otherwise it's a cash grab.

Answer the damned question. Nearly all colleges offer this. For which ones is it a cash grab? All of them?

For the record HES offers financial aid and its tuition is half Harvard’s.

All of them and the point is, it's not making it accessible to more people.

Yes, a lot of online degrees are cash grabs, not only Harvard. Harvard should be running a better program.

Your post makes no sense. Are you an eliteist who thinks schools should not offer classes to the general public?

Did you see the post explaining HES is over 100 years old?

Did you see the post stating they give financial aid and the tuition is half to begin with?

This is an odd bee to have stuck in your bonnet.

You should look at the history of the school. The will of the person who founded it said that no course should cost more than 2 bushels of wheat. That would be around 20 dollars in today's money. (Look up the price of two bushels of wheat. Suppose you adjusted to a crazy extent, you're still not getting past 200 Dollars)

For most of the history of HES, there was a sliding scare for low income so that everyone could take classes.

At 40k and no sliding scale or scholarships (and yes, I'm sure there's financial aid, but it's not transparent at all), it's out of reach for most people.

Bushels of wheat?

That’s your argument?

You’re not serious.

The point is, as PP said, it's a cash grab now. In the past, it was a charity.

Harvard has an endowment that requires thousands of people to manage. It owns property throughout Boston.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

I realize you are completely blind to the bad faith behavior of all right wing provocateurs like Rufo. But really? Are you this dumb?

Have you ever mocked Jill Biden for using “Dr.” as her title? Asking for a friend.

Biden has an Ed.D. from the University of Delaware so she can correctly call herself Dr.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

I realize you are completely blind to the bad faith behavior of all right wing provocateurs like Rufo. But really? Are you this dumb?

Have you ever mocked Jill Biden for using “Dr.” as her title? Asking for a friend.

Biden has an Ed.D. from the University of Delaware so she can correctly call herself Dr.

You may not be aware of the back story here. Some GOPers go nuts that she requests to be called Dr. Biden. "She is not a doctor, blah blah blah who does she think she is." And yes, there are some folks who think the only doctors are MDs. But I'm fairly confident that GOP elite attending HYPSMs are not calling their professors by their first name. Maybe they say professor, but probably a lot also using doctor as many introduce themselves that way.

There are some folks who will not extend respect to any Democrat in any fashion. Heck, the former president couldn't even attend the inauguration of his opponent - total break with precedent for folks obsessed with originalism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We know he took the back door. He knows it. Harvard Lite.

Pathetic.

Harvard is selling out, that's what's pathetic. Cheapening their own brand.

Naw. It’s the representation on his part. He knows he didn’t do the real Harvard. He did Harvard Lite. That’s fine. Nothing wrong with that. Just don’t represent it like you did the full Harvard.

Look if you know people like this you can figure out with a few questions what kind of program they actually did. Then you know what they know.

???

What's not understood? If you know people who say they went to Harvard and you ask what they studied, you will find out what program. If you think a degree from the extension school is "Harvard Lite" then you can sneer at them that it wasn't "the full Harvard." It's not a secret. I know people who have done these courses and they don't try to pretend it's anything else but they do say then went to Harvard (even if it was all online).

I can't imagine saying "I went to Harvard" if my degree was from the extension school. Look, the real sure way to know that someone went to Harvard is if they tell you they went to school in Boston.

Maybe I just hold myself to higher standards.

The people I know with these degrees have many degrees from lots of schools. They just decide to further learning in an area of interest, but they already have what you would consider full degrees from prestigious universities. They have law degrees, MBAs, etc but they wanted another notch in their belt, it's not really a big deal since it's not the only degree they have.

For folks going on and on about merit, this seems to be a fairly weak answer and an ambiguous standard.

Who do you think gets these degrees? It's usually older people who already have at least one degree or more already. Such as Rufo. Where would the con be? Arguably these degrees don't really offer much benefit to the students. Can you really change careers after a short course?

so all good with misrepresenting here, but not when other folks (allegedly) do it? Is that the standard?

What has been misrepresented? He has a degree from Harvard. You may just not be very impressed with it.

He has a graduate degree from the Extension School. When someone receives a graduate degree from Harvard, it is from a specific school @ Harvard, not from generic Harvard University.

It's still part of the university, even if you wish it wasn't.

Right. It is Harvard Extension School. I read a lot of CVs. Folks don't list "Master's Degree, Harvard University," they list the degree, the school issuing it, then Harvard University. IYKYK.

Or maybe that's the reason why some of these folks are at the extension school - they can't follow directions.

Ok, show us where Rufo's resume had this listed.

NP. Given the type of work he does, I don't know exactly what kind of "resume" he has (I'm just a regular guy with a normal job, I've never been a "Senior Fellow"), but he definitely lists it simply as "Harvard University" on his bios for the various groups he works with and where he's published:

https://manhattan.institute/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://christopherrufo.com/about
https://www.city-journal.org/person/christopher-f-rufo
https://www.ncf.edu/about/leadership/board-of-trustees/

So not resumes just informal bios. And people really care about this?

He's a public figure. "Informal" bios are how he's introduced to the public not resumes. Personally, I think people should represent themselves honestly, so yeah I do care.

Especially when the person has put in a lot of effort to pointing out others' honesty or lack thereof.

Again, where is the lie?

I realize you are completely blind to the bad faith behavior of all right wing provocateurs like Rufo. But really? Are you this dumb?

Have you ever mocked Jill Biden for using “Dr.” as her title? Asking for a friend.

Biden has an Ed.D. from the University of Delaware so she can correctly call herself Dr.

Thanks, Whoopi.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds as though Harvard University is the one running the grift here, if one buys your assumption (which is probably incorrect) that their online programs are not legitimate.

+1000

DYK how many places run these programs? Columbia has one in general studies, believe same @ Penn. So many schools have them. Heck, does USDA still run an extension school? That said, they are extension programs.

Harvard’s extension school is over 100 years old and was created for the working people in Boston who couldn’t go to college during the day. They are all taught by Harvard professors

plenty of universities have these programs. Yale has a physicians assistant Program at night separate from the school working with themYale Medical school. Online classes and on-site requirements.

Columbia has night school classes in certain degrees where students go at their own pace. Stanford,Penn, Duke, Brown, Northwestern and many many more.

What is wrong with catering to non-traditional students who might want a change in career or to get a better job but can’t spend all day at school with 18 year olds.

Universities are in the business of education. It’s exactly what they’re doing.

There are no scholarships... It's a cash grab

Nearly all colleges offer this kind of education.

For which colleges that offer it is it a "cash grab", and for which is it a reasonable offer?

Please answer. But I know you won't.

What kind of gotcha is this?

No scholarships+ high cost is cash grab.

Make the degree free or cheap. This isn't complicated. Otherwise it's a cash grab.

Answer the damned question. Nearly all colleges offer this. For which ones is it a cash grab? All of them?

For the record HES offers financial aid and its tuition is half Harvard’s.

All of them and the point is, it's not making it accessible to more people.

Yes, a lot of online degrees are cash grabs, not only Harvard. Harvard should be running a better program.

The extension school is not an online degree program--it's a longstanding continuing/community education program. The actual grad schools at Harvard have their own reputable and strong on-line programs. The extension school is not part of that.

HES website says his masters was all online, except for one 2 week course.

Aren't you guys supposed to be all about equity? Most people can't drop their lives for a on-campus masters.

Indeed. DCUMers while theoretically pining for a class-less society, cling like glue to their miserable fragments of social prestige.