Friend with bad child being iced out of friend group

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Do not teach your girls that they need to make themselves smaller and put their needs second to other people's problems.

As an adult you wouldn't hang out with people that hurt you or make you feel uncomfortable. Why would you ask that of kids? Why are we asking them to do things we ourselves wouldn't do?

I actually really disagree with this. Growing up I had an aunt with severe intellectual disabilities. She sometimes did and said things that I thought were weird and made me uncomfortable. Nothing abusive, just not normal adult behavior, because obviously she had a severe disability. Instead of caving to my little kid whining that I didn't want to go visit her, invite her to our house for a meal, bring her along to an outdoor concert, whatever, my parents modeled inclusivity and made sure that my aunt was always loved and supported and included her in many aspects of our life. I really appreciate the example they set and even as a slightly older child it definitely helped me be more empathetic and actively seek to be inclusive.

Was your aunt physically violent with you? If so, your parents suck for failing to protect you. If not, what point are you trying to make, and how on earth do you think your experience is even vaguely relevant here? No one is going to learn inclusivity and empathy from being someone else's punching bag.

Literally nobody is saying OP should let her kid be a punching bag.

No, but people are saying that OP's DD needs to learn empathy and inclusivity, and that it's wrong for OP to ice out the friend's boy, despite the DD's express wish not to be around this boy.

If the parents have thus far been unable to stop their kid from hitting other kids, what exactly do you think will change the next time OP forces her DD to be around this boy?

There are many, many options in between punching bag and icing them out.

Stop throwing out extremes as strawmen.

What are these many, many options? Please do tell how OP can force her DD to be around this kid, but not have her DD at risk for getting hit.

I’m not the PP who you are replying to but you really can’t envision a world where you let the parent know that your child is feeling nervous about hitting and you would like to work together to plan a short outing that everyone can feel comfortable with? And then you talk to your DD about how hitting is never ok and we are giving a second chance because this kid is 6 (I promise you she has seen hitting at school) and what would make her feel comfortable? She can stay close to you while you go on an outing to a festival or something. Because 6 year olds are still learning and many of them are struggling with something.

You don’t have to do that. You can decide it’s not worth it to you. It’s a free country; you can ice her out for any reason you want. But if you want to give a try you certainly could.

No. If my kid expresses that she doesn't want to be around a kid who is hitting her (and apparently is hitting tons of other kids, since many families in this friend group are icing the kid out), I'm absolutely not going to look for a solution that involves ignoring my DD's wishes and forcing her to be around a violent child. In your "solution", the kids are either glued so closely to the parents so as to render the outing meaningless, or the DD could easily get hit again. Your solution is also incredibly condescending toward the mom of the boy, since you're assuming that she doesn't know that her kid's behavior is a problem, needs people to coddle her by saying that their kids are "nervous" about socializing, and then needs you to come up with a solution for how she can manage her child.

Thank you.

There may be trolls here, but they are the loserrific mothers who think it’s awesome for OP’s kindergartener to be forced around a kid who has hit her, made her cry, and done enough of the same to other kids where they won’t play with the friend’s son at all.

Thanks. I'm honestly aghast at the moms who are ignoring gender in this entire situation. If OP had a boy, I might feel a bit differently about trying to give a second chance. Normalizing boy-on-girl violence and telling the girl that she needs to continue exposing herself to it is just fundamentally wrong, especially when the violent boy is older and probably bigger. If OP's DD had to continue being around the boy, she'd learn pretty quickly that the best way to avoid violence is to be especially meek around him. She'd also feel like on some level, it's her fault if she gets hit, and that the boy's actions are her responsibility.

literally nobody said the girl should be exposed to violence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do not teach your girls that they need to make themselves smaller and put their needs second to other people's problems.

As an adult you wouldn't hang out with people that hurt you or make you feel uncomfortable. Why would you ask that of kids? Why are we asking them to do things we ourselves wouldn't do?

I actually really disagree with this. Growing up I had an aunt with severe intellectual disabilities. She sometimes did and said things that I thought were weird and made me uncomfortable. Nothing abusive, just not normal adult behavior, because obviously she had a severe disability. Instead of caving to my little kid whining that I didn't want to go visit her, invite her to our house for a meal, bring her along to an outdoor concert, whatever, my parents modeled inclusivity and made sure that my aunt was always loved and supported and included her in many aspects of our life. I really appreciate the example they set and even as a slightly older child it definitely helped me be more empathetic and actively seek to be inclusive.

Was your aunt physically violent with you? If so, your parents suck for failing to protect you. If not, what point are you trying to make, and how on earth do you think your experience is even vaguely relevant here? No one is going to learn inclusivity and empathy from being someone else's punching bag.

Literally nobody is saying OP should let her kid be a punching bag.

No, but people are saying that OP's DD needs to learn empathy and inclusivity, and that it's wrong for OP to ice out the friend's boy, despite the DD's express wish not to be around this boy.

If the parents have thus far been unable to stop their kid from hitting other kids, what exactly do you think will change the next time OP forces her DD to be around this boy?

There are many, many options in between punching bag and icing them out.

Stop throwing out extremes as strawmen.

What are these many, many options? Please do tell how OP can force her DD to be around this kid, but not have her DD at risk for getting hit.

Yup. You’re not a parent if you can’t think of any options.

How convenient. You provided absolutely no specific examples of how OP can force the DD to play with this boy without risking being hit. Again, if you're such an amazing parent, please enlighten us as to how you'd control the boy's behavior so no one gets hit.

How old are your kids? You haven’t figured this out yet?

Mine are 14 and 12. I totally have figured this out. I don't force my kids to spend time with violent kids. I also respect my kids' boundaries. I see zero reason to try to force friendships between my children and kids who are hitting them. Unlike a few people here, I also understand that I can't control other people's children, and there is literally no way to prevent a violent child from hitting mine if they're forced to socialize.

Also, you still haven't given examples of exactly how you can control the situation such that the DD is 100% safe from the violent kid she wants to avoid. Someone else tried to give an example, but it was horribly naive and more than a bit idiotic.

“Violent kids”? “Force friendships”? “Literally no way to prevent a violent child from hitting mine”?

Troll.

The boy has been violent. The girl wants to NOT see him. Other kids and families have already excluded. All of this is in Op’s posts.

Who is trolling, now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do not teach your girls that they need to make themselves smaller and put their needs second to other people's problems.

As an adult you wouldn't hang out with people that hurt you or make you feel uncomfortable. Why would you ask that of kids? Why are we asking them to do things we ourselves wouldn't do?

I actually really disagree with this. Growing up I had an aunt with severe intellectual disabilities. She sometimes did and said things that I thought were weird and made me uncomfortable. Nothing abusive, just not normal adult behavior, because obviously she had a severe disability. Instead of caving to my little kid whining that I didn't want to go visit her, invite her to our house for a meal, bring her along to an outdoor concert, whatever, my parents modeled inclusivity and made sure that my aunt was always loved and supported and included her in many aspects of our life. I really appreciate the example they set and even as a slightly older child it definitely helped me be more empathetic and actively seek to be inclusive.

Was your aunt physically violent with you? If so, your parents suck for failing to protect you. If not, what point are you trying to make, and how on earth do you think your experience is even vaguely relevant here? No one is going to learn inclusivity and empathy from being someone else's punching bag.

Literally nobody is saying OP should let her kid be a punching bag.

No, but people are saying that OP's DD needs to learn empathy and inclusivity, and that it's wrong for OP to ice out the friend's boy, despite the DD's express wish not to be around this boy.

If the parents have thus far been unable to stop their kid from hitting other kids, what exactly do you think will change the next time OP forces her DD to be around this boy?

There are many, many options in between punching bag and icing them out.

Stop throwing out extremes as strawmen.

What are these many, many options? Please do tell how OP can force her DD to be around this kid, but not have her DD at risk for getting hit.

I’m not the PP who you are replying to but you really can’t envision a world where you let the parent know that your child is feeling nervous about hitting and you would like to work together to plan a short outing that everyone can feel comfortable with? And then you talk to your DD about how hitting is never ok and we are giving a second chance because this kid is 6 (I promise you she has seen hitting at school) and what would make her feel comfortable? She can stay close to you while you go on an outing to a festival or something. Because 6 year olds are still learning and many of them are struggling with something.

You don’t have to do that. You can decide it’s not worth it to you. It’s a free country; you can ice her out for any reason you want. But if you want to give a try you certainly could.

No. If my kid expresses that she doesn't want to be around a kid who is hitting her (and apparently is hitting tons of other kids, since many families in this friend group are icing the kid out), I'm absolutely not going to look for a solution that involves ignoring my DD's wishes and forcing her to be around a violent child. In your "solution", the kids are either glued so closely to the parents so as to render the outing meaningless, or the DD could easily get hit again. Your solution is also incredibly condescending toward the mom of the boy, since you're assuming that she doesn't know that her kid's behavior is a problem, needs people to coddle her by saying that their kids are "nervous" about socializing, and then needs you to come up with a solution for how she can manage her child.

Thank you.

There may be trolls here, but they are the loserrific mothers who think it’s awesome for OP’s kindergartener to be forced around a kid who has hit her, made her cry, and done enough of the same to other kids where they won’t play with the friend’s son at all.

Thanks. I'm honestly aghast at the moms who are ignoring gender in this entire situation. If OP had a boy, I might feel a bit differently about trying to give a second chance. Normalizing boy-on-girl violence and telling the girl that she needs to continue exposing herself to it is just fundamentally wrong, especially when the violent boy is older and probably bigger. If OP's DD had to continue being around the boy, she'd learn pretty quickly that the best way to avoid violence is to be especially meek around him. She'd also feel like on some level, it's her fault if she gets hit, and that the boy's actions are her responsibility.

literally nobody said the girl should be exposed to violence.

Right! OP has been accused of insufficient supervision of Sconce’s Greatest Nemesis —- even though the boy’s own mother was present. Should OP also get proficient with how to administer a quick-acting tranq via blow dart and invite them all over?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread. But all I want to say is, the moral and ethical values that we claim to espouse do not always apply when things are easy. In fact they are intended to apply when things are hard. “It takes a village to raise a child.” “Visit the sick and imprisoned.” “I have not come to call the righteous, but the sinners.” Do unto others. Every major faith and ethical code calls for helping those who struggle.

That doesn’t mean that anyone has to put their children or their sconces at risk. But it does mean that you ought to make some effort to support a family in a tough situation.

“It takes a village” is BS. It’s a tired old line that only gets trotted out when someone *wants* something,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:We teach our children to have boundaries. We teach them that if they're treated badly - when someone is physically hurting them or makes them afraid - use boundaries.

This behavior is not acceptable and should not be tolerated.

Kindness and inclusion here can be extended to the mom, alone, without her child.

\

I'm really glad you just came out and said it. No kindness for the disabled child. And people wonder why parents with "bad" children don't confide in them?

Your reading comprehension is terrible.

Nope. She read it just fine.

Nope. Both of your reading comprehension is terrible.

No, it’s pretty clear.

“Kindness and inclusion here can be extended to the mom, alone, without her child.”

See the mom alone. When the kid can not hit, not repeatedly make other kids cry and not destroy property, they can reevaluate play dates.

“Kindness and inclusion,” blah blah blah.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I sympathize with you, and with the other family.

But honestly, I sometimes feel we make our kids hang out with other kids that they don't like, just so we don't feel bad.

If this boy is unable to control himself and routinely hits other children, then no, I'm not going to force my child to spend time with him....just so I can feel better about myself

I think literally no one is saying the OP should make her child hang out w/ the kid who hits them.

MULTIPLE people are repeatedly saying that, and if they don’t, it’s not “kindness and inclusion.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do not teach your girls that they need to make themselves smaller and put their needs second to other people's problems.

As an adult you wouldn't hang out with people that hurt you or make you feel uncomfortable. Why would you ask that of kids? Why are we asking them to do things we ourselves wouldn't do?

I actually really disagree with this. Growing up I had an aunt with severe intellectual disabilities. She sometimes did and said things that I thought were weird and made me uncomfortable. Nothing abusive, just not normal adult behavior, because obviously she had a severe disability. Instead of caving to my little kid whining that I didn't want to go visit her, invite her to our house for a meal, bring her along to an outdoor concert, whatever, my parents modeled inclusivity and made sure that my aunt was always loved and supported and included her in many aspects of our life. I really appreciate the example they set and even as a slightly older child it definitely helped me be more empathetic and actively seek to be inclusive.

Was your aunt physically violent with you? If so, your parents suck for failing to protect you. If not, what point are you trying to make, and how on earth do you think your experience is even vaguely relevant here? No one is going to learn inclusivity and empathy from being someone else's punching bag.

Literally nobody is saying OP should let her kid be a punching bag.

No, but people are saying that OP's DD needs to learn empathy and inclusivity, and that it's wrong for OP to ice out the friend's boy, despite the DD's express wish not to be around this boy.

If the parents have thus far been unable to stop their kid from hitting other kids, what exactly do you think will change the next time OP forces her DD to be around this boy?

There are many, many options in between punching bag and icing them out.

Stop throwing out extremes as strawmen.

What are these many, many options? Please do tell how OP can force her DD to be around this kid, but not have her DD at risk for getting hit.

I’m not the PP who you are replying to but you really can’t envision a world where you let the parent know that your child is feeling nervous about hitting and you would like to work together to plan a short outing that everyone can feel comfortable with? And then you talk to your DD about how hitting is never ok and we are giving a second chance because this kid is 6 (I promise you she has seen hitting at school) and what would make her feel comfortable? She can stay close to you while you go on an outing to a festival or something. Because 6 year olds are still learning and many of them are struggling with something.

You don’t have to do that. You can decide it’s not worth it to you. It’s a free country; you can ice her out for any reason you want. But if you want to give a try you certainly could.

No. If my kid expresses that she doesn't want to be around a kid who is hitting her (and apparently is hitting tons of other kids, since many families in this friend group are icing the kid out), I'm absolutely not going to look for a solution that involves ignoring my DD's wishes and forcing her to be around a violent child. In your "solution", the kids are either glued so closely to the parents so as to render the outing meaningless, or the DD could easily get hit again. Your solution is also incredibly condescending toward the mom of the boy, since you're assuming that she doesn't know that her kid's behavior is a problem, needs people to coddle her by saying that their kids are "nervous" about socializing, and then needs you to come up with a solution for how she can manage her child.

Thank you.

There may be trolls here, but they are the loserrific mothers who think it’s awesome for OP’s kindergartener to be forced around a kid who has hit her, made her cry, and done enough of the same to other kids where they won’t play with the friend’s son at all.

Thanks. I'm honestly aghast at the moms who are ignoring gender in this entire situation. If OP had a boy, I might feel a bit differently about trying to give a second chance. Normalizing boy-on-girl violence and telling the girl that she needs to continue exposing herself to it is just fundamentally wrong, especially when the violent boy is older and probably bigger. If OP's DD had to continue being around the boy, she'd learn pretty quickly that the best way to avoid violence is to be especially meek around him. She'd also feel like on some level, it's her fault if she gets hit, and that the boy's actions are her responsibility.

literally nobody said the girl should be exposed to violence.

Literally you keep saying that despite the fact that the boy has been violent to numerous kids, and despite DD's attempt to set a reasonable boundary, it is wrong for the OP to let her DD avoid the boy who has made her and numerous other kids cry. Saying that the DD simply needs to be around this boy *IS* saying that the girl should be exposed to violence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: do you believe your child should never encounter situations she doesn’t want to be in? It is sentiments like this that lead to the massive anxiety problems in young adults that other PPs have referred to. I think a lot of parents genuinely believe their kids should never encounter a “bad” kid, or a challenging interaction, and they become wildly unprepared for adulthood.

Do you believe your child should be put in an abusive situation to make yourself feel inclusive?

A wild child who behaves a little bit wilder than other kids isn't an abusive situation. You are proving PP's point about raising unprepared children into unprepared adults.

Hurting people and destroying property doesn't qualify as "a little bit wilder".

If you tell me that your kids and their friends have never broken anything in your house, I'm going to tell you that you have girls. Calm girls. "Destroying property" is a part of raising children. It happens.

I have 2 boys.

I can swear on the holy bible that neither of my boys, nor any of their friends (also boys), has ever ripped a light fixture off the wall.

So they've broken some stuff, just not a wall sconce. Got it.

I'm sure you iced out that kid and his family. Right?

I’m a NP but will reply anyway. I’ve iced out my own brother and his family because his younger son (now 10) is a night mare. Destructive, rude, unthinking. And his parents do NOTHING about it. No effort to get him tested for anything, no discipline, no redirecting. We live in the same area and multiple people have told us they moved their kids from the same school as my nephew to get away from him. Others say other unpleasant, but likely true, things about him and his behavior. My kids hated spending time with him because he is such a brat and destroys everything in his wake, with no apology (from him or his parents). So I don’t make my kids spend time with them and I have little relationship with my brother for his wife or, most unfortunately, their older kid who is much different and at least not wild.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Likely the play tme is running a bit too long for the kid. How long are your get-togethers? Does his acting out start the minute he arrives, or does it begin surfacing after 45 to an hour, or longer? If it takes awhile, then he's reached his limit and maxxed out on sensory overload.

One of my kids was like that, and I had to watch closely for when she was ramping up toward meltdown, and we would go home before that point. We might be there for one hour and then sorry, we have to get going. Some children are just more sentitive to stimuli -- maybe they're a tiny bit on the spectrum, etc. -- and they melt down after too much exposure time to social chaos, loudness, etc.

Since this is a friend's child, you might gently hint that maybe her son is getting tired and needs to go home?

Better yet, limit these get-togethers to OUTSIDE the house, at a local park with a nice playground, where he cannot do damage to anyone's home. That's a no-brainer that should have already happened here. Put on a coat, meet at the playground.

If this mom is showing up, the gathering is going to be outside.

I would encourage you to find ways not to drop this mom, who is probably rather isolated already due to her son's behavior.

Not to pick on you, but this is an example of a post that puts OP's DD in a situation that she doesnt want to be in, to make either OP or the other mom, or the other kid feel better.

Unless you're suggesting that OP meet at a playground but not bring her DD?

+ 1.

NP. Question for both of you: do you believe your child should never encounter situations she doesn’t want to be in? It is sentiments like this that lead to the massive anxiety problems in young adults that other PPs have referred to. I think a lot of parents genuinely believe their kids should never encounter a “bad” kid, or a challenging interaction, and they become wildly unprepared for adulthood.

I get the sense a lot of PPs who are telling OP to cut off the relationship haven’t seen the outcomes in teens these days. They are so fragile.

They will be in plenty of “situations they don’t want to be in” in school and in life. No, play dates with a child they DO NOT WANT TO PLAY WITH BECAUSE THEY HIT should not be forced. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Likely the play tme is running a bit too long for the kid. How long are your get-togethers? Does his acting out start the minute he arrives, or does it begin surfacing after 45 to an hour, or longer? If it takes awhile, then he's reached his limit and maxxed out on sensory overload.

One of my kids was like that, and I had to watch closely for when she was ramping up toward meltdown, and we would go home before that point. We might be there for one hour and then sorry, we have to get going. Some children are just more sentitive to stimuli -- maybe they're a tiny bit on the spectrum, etc. -- and they melt down after too much exposure time to social chaos, loudness, etc.

Since this is a friend's child, you might gently hint that maybe her son is getting tired and needs to go home?

Better yet, limit these get-togethers to OUTSIDE the house, at a local park with a nice playground, where he cannot do damage to anyone's home. That's a no-brainer that should have already happened here. Put on a coat, meet at the playground.

If this mom is showing up, the gathering is going to be outside.

I would encourage you to find ways not to drop this mom, who is probably rather isolated already due to her son's behavior.

Not to pick on you, but this is an example of a post that puts OP's DD in a situation that she doesnt want to be in, to make either OP or the other mom, or the other kid feel better.

Unless you're suggesting that OP meet at a playground but not bring her DD?

+ 1.

NP. Question for both of you: do you believe your child should never encounter situations she doesn’t want to be in? It is sentiments like this that lead to the massive anxiety problems in young adults that other PPs have referred to. I think a lot of parents genuinely believe their kids should never encounter a “bad” kid, or a challenging interaction, and they become wildly unprepared for adulthood.

I get the sense a lot of PPs who are telling OP to cut off the relationship haven’t seen the outcomes in teens these days. They are so fragile.

Np and no. I’m not going put my kids in a situation where they will be hit. What kind of a parent does that?

DP. Saying that the boy "hits" is, as someone else pointed out, nonspecific and non-unique (other kids hit too, especially when the adults don't see). Another complaint against this boy is that he made other kids cry - besties make their friends cry, boyfriend/girlfriends make their GF/BF cry, losing makes some kids cry, getting the wrong color candy makes some other kids cry, etc.

There are a lot of protected kids on this thread - they are whisked away whenever another kid is bad and does something wrong, hurtful, dangerous, intentionally or unintentionally, at any time in the present or past.

No wonder teens stare at their phones all day. Dealing with people IRL is too difficult, too messy, too unpredictable and scary.

I hope you stretched before this massive reach, because it’s totally laughable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: do you believe your child should never encounter situations she doesn’t want to be in? It is sentiments like this that lead to the massive anxiety problems in young adults that other PPs have referred to. I think a lot of parents genuinely believe their kids should never encounter a “bad” kid, or a challenging interaction, and they become wildly unprepared for adulthood.

Do you believe your child should be put in an abusive situation to make yourself feel inclusive?

A wild child who behaves a little bit wilder than other kids isn't an abusive situation. You are proving PP's point about raising unprepared children into unprepared adults.

Hurting people and destroying property doesn't qualify as "a little bit wilder".

If you tell me that your kids and their friends have never broken anything in your house, I'm going to tell you that you have girls. Calm girls. "Destroying property" is a part of raising children. It happens.

Being violent enough to rip sconces out of walls is not. Just stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Likely the play tme is running a bit too long for the kid. How long are your get-togethers? Does his acting out start the minute he arrives, or does it begin surfacing after 45 to an hour, or longer? If it takes awhile, then he's reached his limit and maxxed out on sensory overload.

One of my kids was like that, and I had to watch closely for when she was ramping up toward meltdown, and we would go home before that point. We might be there for one hour and then sorry, we have to get going. Some children are just more sentitive to stimuli -- maybe they're a tiny bit on the spectrum, etc. -- and they melt down after too much exposure time to social chaos, loudness, etc.

Since this is a friend's child, you might gently hint that maybe her son is getting tired and needs to go home?

Better yet, limit these get-togethers to OUTSIDE the house, at a local park with a nice playground, where he cannot do damage to anyone's home. That's a no-brainer that should have already happened here. Put on a coat, meet at the playground.

If this mom is showing up, the gathering is going to be outside.

I would encourage you to find ways not to drop this mom, who is probably rather isolated already due to her son's behavior.

Not to pick on you, but this is an example of a post that puts OP's DD in a situation that she doesnt want to be in, to make either OP or the other mom, or the other kid feel better.

Unless you're suggesting that OP meet at a playground but not bring her DD?

+ 1.

NP. Question for both of you: do you believe your child should never encounter situations she doesn’t want to be in? It is sentiments like this that lead to the massive anxiety problems in young adults that other PPs have referred to. I think a lot of parents genuinely believe their kids should never encounter a “bad” kid, or a challenging interaction, and they become wildly unprepared for adulthood.

I get the sense a lot of PPs who are telling OP to cut off the relationship haven’t seen the outcomes in teens these days. They are so fragile.

They will be in plenty of “situations they don’t want to be in” in school and in life. No, play dates with a child they DO NOT WANT TO PLAY WITH BECAUSE THEY HIT should not be forced. Period.

+1 The kids see plenty of things out in the real world, but they should be able to feel safe in their own home. That's where the line is drawn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do not teach your girls that they need to make themselves smaller and put their needs second to other people's problems.

As an adult you wouldn't hang out with people that hurt you or make you feel uncomfortable. Why would you ask that of kids? Why are we asking them to do things we ourselves wouldn't do?

I actually really disagree with this. Growing up I had an aunt with severe intellectual disabilities. She sometimes did and said things that I thought were weird and made me uncomfortable. Nothing abusive, just not normal adult behavior, because obviously she had a severe disability. Instead of caving to my little kid whining that I didn't want to go visit her, invite her to our house for a meal, bring her along to an outdoor concert, whatever, my parents modeled inclusivity and made sure that my aunt was always loved and supported and included her in many aspects of our life. I really appreciate the example they set and even as a slightly older child it definitely helped me be more empathetic and actively seek to be inclusive.

Was your aunt physically violent with you? If so, your parents suck for failing to protect you. If not, what point are you trying to make, and how on earth do you think your experience is even vaguely relevant here? No one is going to learn inclusivity and empathy from being someone else's punching bag.

Literally nobody is saying OP should let her kid be a punching bag.

No, but people are saying that OP's DD needs to learn empathy and inclusivity, and that it's wrong for OP to ice out the friend's boy, despite the DD's express wish not to be around this boy.

If the parents have thus far been unable to stop their kid from hitting other kids, what exactly do you think will change the next time OP forces her DD to be around this boy?

There are many, many options in between punching bag and icing them out.

Stop throwing out extremes as strawmen.

What are these many, many options? Please do tell how OP can force her DD to be around this kid, but not have her DD at risk for getting hit.

Yup. You’re not a parent if you can’t think of any options.

How convenient. You provided absolutely no specific examples of how OP can force the DD to play with this boy without risking being hit. Again, if you're such an amazing parent, please enlighten us as to how you'd control the boy's behavior so no one gets hit.

How old are your kids? You haven’t figured this out yet?

Mine are 14 and 12. I totally have figured this out. I don't force my kids to spend time with violent kids. I also respect my kids' boundaries. I see zero reason to try to force friendships between my children and kids who are hitting them. Unlike a few people here, I also understand that I can't control other people's children, and there is literally no way to prevent a violent child from hitting mine if they're forced to socialize.

Also, you still haven't given examples of exactly how you can control the situation such that the DD is 100% safe from the violent kid she wants to avoid. Someone else tried to give an example, but it was horribly naive and more than a bit idiotic.

“Violent kids”? “Force friendships”? “Literally no way to prevent a violent child from hitting mine”?

Troll.

The boy has been violent. The girl wants to NOT see him. Other kids and families have already excluded. All of this is in Op’s posts.

Who is trolling, now?

“Violent”? “Literally no way to prevent a violent child from hitting my child”?

He’s 5 or 6. GMAFB.

Troll.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Do not teach your girls that they need to make themselves smaller and put their needs second to other people's problems.

As an adult you wouldn't hang out with people that hurt you or make you feel uncomfortable. Why would you ask that of kids? Why are we asking them to do things we ourselves wouldn't do?

I actually really disagree with this. Growing up I had an aunt with severe intellectual disabilities. She sometimes did and said things that I thought were weird and made me uncomfortable. Nothing abusive, just not normal adult behavior, because obviously she had a severe disability. Instead of caving to my little kid whining that I didn't want to go visit her, invite her to our house for a meal, bring her along to an outdoor concert, whatever, my parents modeled inclusivity and made sure that my aunt was always loved and supported and included her in many aspects of our life. I really appreciate the example they set and even as a slightly older child it definitely helped me be more empathetic and actively seek to be inclusive.

Was your aunt physically violent with you? If so, your parents suck for failing to protect you. If not, what point are you trying to make, and how on earth do you think your experience is even vaguely relevant here? No one is going to learn inclusivity and empathy from being someone else's punching bag.

Literally nobody is saying OP should let her kid be a punching bag.

No, but people are saying that OP's DD needs to learn empathy and inclusivity, and that it's wrong for OP to ice out the friend's boy, despite the DD's express wish not to be around this boy.

If the parents have thus far been unable to stop their kid from hitting other kids, what exactly do you think will change the next time OP forces her DD to be around this boy?

There are many, many options in between punching bag and icing them out.

Stop throwing out extremes as strawmen.

What are these many, many options? Please do tell how OP can force her DD to be around this kid, but not have her DD at risk for getting hit.

I’m not the PP who you are replying to but you really can’t envision a world where you let the parent know that your child is feeling nervous about hitting and you would like to work together to plan a short outing that everyone can feel comfortable with? And then you talk to your DD about how hitting is never ok and we are giving a second chance because this kid is 6 (I promise you she has seen hitting at school) and what would make her feel comfortable? She can stay close to you while you go on an outing to a festival or something. Because 6 year olds are still learning and many of them are struggling with something.

You don’t have to do that. You can decide it’s not worth it to you. It’s a free country; you can ice her out for any reason you want. But if you want to give a try you certainly could.

No. If my kid expresses that she doesn't want to be around a kid who is hitting her (and apparently is hitting tons of other kids, since many families in this friend group are icing the kid out), I'm absolutely not going to look for a solution that involves ignoring my DD's wishes and forcing her to be around a violent child. In your "solution", the kids are either glued so closely to the parents so as to render the outing meaningless, or the DD could easily get hit again. Your solution is also incredibly condescending toward the mom of the boy, since you're assuming that she doesn't know that her kid's behavior is a problem, needs people to coddle her by saying that their kids are "nervous" about socializing, and then needs you to come up with a solution for how she can manage her child.

Thank you.

There may be trolls here, but they are the loserrific mothers who think it’s awesome for OP’s kindergartener to be forced around a kid who has hit her, made her cry, and done enough of the same to other kids where they won’t play with the friend’s son at all.

Thanks. I'm honestly aghast at the moms who are ignoring gender in this entire situation. If OP had a boy, I might feel a bit differently about trying to give a second chance. Normalizing boy-on-girl violence and telling the girl that she needs to continue exposing herself to it is just fundamentally wrong, especially when the violent boy is older and probably bigger. If OP's DD had to continue being around the boy, she'd learn pretty quickly that the best way to avoid violence is to be especially meek around him. She'd also feel like on some level, it's her fault if she gets hit, and that the boy's actions are her responsibility.

literally nobody said the girl should be exposed to violence.

Literally you keep saying that despite the fact that the boy has been violent to numerous kids, and despite DD's attempt to set a reasonable boundary, it is wrong for the OP to let her DD avoid the boy who has made her and numerous other kids cry. Saying that the DD simply needs to be around this boy *IS* saying that the girl should be exposed to violence.

No, it’s not.

[Anonymous]

And no one is even saying they have to be in the same room.