Defaulted into main breadwinner

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - any news?

I don't get why this has become a flame war on SAH vs WOH. This really doesn't seem to be about that but about communication in the marriage, and making unilateral decisions.

Because SAH moms ON THIS THREAD (not universally) think their "calling" to be a wife and mother gives them the right to stop working without discussing it with their husbands and go so far as to call the man a loser/selfish for not being the "default" breadwinner.

This might be the 1st DCUM thread where a large group of women are defending the position of the man.

I agree. I think it's also making a lot of SAHMs nervous that their husbands might feel like OP.

Yup. Lots of well-reasoned WOHM points here. This thread is a trainwreck for SAHMs.

OMG, the echo chamber persists. Almost laughable.

There are about 5 posts in agreement on this page ALONE. And they're not by the same person.

No secret that there is a anti-SAH pile on pretty much daily on the DCUM. But seriously, what does it say about you if you think you've "won" the mommy wars on some random thread about marriage difficulties.

Not in agreement like this. And you've posted 12 times in the past 15 minutes - no one else is using the term "mommy wars" - shouldn't you be fixing hubby his martini?

To be fair, every other post here was along the lines of "SAHMs are nervous that their husbands might feel like OP". All posted during the work hours, mind you. I am a working parent, but I am totally siding with SAHMs here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I haven't read through the pages and pages, but I feel your pain. My DH just quit his job one day to go back to school without consulting me. He never got a job after graduating and is now a SAHD. I married and had kids with someone that was a working adult who had his crap together and had goals and even considered whether I should be SAH, which I expressed a clear desire to do and am more capable of doing (not because I'm a woman, just because I'm better at the tasks involved). I wouldn't have done that with someone who barely keeps up with the household on a good day. I was mad for years about it but finally have just made my peace. Harboring the resentment does no one any good - I chose a good guy/poor partner but I'm in it for a long haul so I focus on the good guy part. To be frank, I doubt your wife will ever understand the pressure she put on you or how much it hurt not to be consulted about a choice that you are negatively impacted by every day.

This sounds like me, except for the made my peace part. How did you get there?

I lowered my expectations an infinite amount and decided that, at the end of the day, I won't break up my family as long as this remains sustainable financially. We've been married 15 years, and both of us have changed. Part of marriage is trying to appreciate the new person on the journey. Sadly, adopting this view also means I generally don't count on him for anything that is important because I'll be disappointed or believe things he says about seeking employment. I also no longer expect him to understand how I feel about the issue, so I don't bring it up. If he is depressed or feels like less of a man (one of his reasons for being out of work so long), that is on him after this many years. If we can muddle through and he continues to be a good parent, I'll suck it up and keep trying to focus on the pleasantries of the day to day instead of dwelling on things (and a person) I cannot change. Some days are easier than others.

Thanks for posting this, and I'm sorry. Sadly, I understand and feel so much of it. The part about not counting on him or his word really kills me and physically hurts. I admire you, poster.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm OP. A lot of it is that my DW made a lot of decisions in a very passive way without my input. She stopped job hunting after leaving a job she didn't like. She just felt it was impossible to get hired pregnant. And with daycare cost, it was a wash. So, she just made the decision to stop working or looking and that was that. There are jobs she'd be qualified for but she just isn't willing to do the work to hustle for them like she used to.

But I really liked our daycare. Our older thrived and our younger one really would benefit from being in a more structured environment. I actually would have been happier taking a small loss and having the kids go because our time together would be quality time and our time apart would be spent furthering ourselves professionally as adults. And truthfully, the wear and tear on home would be so much less because we'd all be gone for large parts of the day. I can tell you right now the house is a mess and will be until this weekend when I will spend it doing a deep cleaning.

I just think that the decision was a bad one and when I try to bring it up, I get tears, demands that she needs a break and wants to just be a mom as her job (I just point our being a parent isn't a job so much as a role in a family. You don't stop being a mom just because you work). Financially, it's stupid for us to not both be working. We aren't saving for retirement beyond my 401k and we aren't saving for the kids' college or anything beyond a few months of emergency saving. That stresses me out.

I actually started therapy to deal with my resentment. It helped but the therapist mentioned that this might just be a phase. So I wanted to see if anyone else went through this...

Dude, look what you just wrote. If your wife worked, her salary would go to paying daycare costs. If your wife doesn't work, you don't have to pay for daycare. If it is a true wash and what comes in goes immediately out, how can you fault your wife for being a SAHM mom if she is not interested in, as she may look at it, working for free? If this statement is true, then you're the breadwinner anyway whether she works or not because her role - whether working to pay for daycare or not working to not have to pay for daycare - has nothing to do with how much money you as a family have each month.

You may not think that a SAHM is sexy, but I'd loooove to see how sexy you think your wife is when she is working 40 hours a week, doing childcare at nights and weekends, and has even less time to cook and clean for you.




+ 1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm OP. A lot of it is that my DW made a lot of decisions in a very passive way without my input. She stopped job hunting after leaving a job she didn't like. She just felt it was impossible to get hired pregnant. And with daycare cost, it was a wash. So, she just made the decision to stop working or looking and that was that. There are jobs she'd be qualified for but she just isn't willing to do the work to hustle for them like she used to.

But I really liked our daycare. Our older thrived and our younger one really would benefit from being in a more structured environment. I actually would have been happier taking a small loss and having the kids go because our time together would be quality time and our time apart would be spent furthering ourselves professionally as adults. And truthfully, the wear and tear on home would be so much less because we'd all be gone for large parts of the day. I can tell you right now the house is a mess and will be until this weekend when I will spend it doing a deep cleaning.

I just think that the decision was a bad one and when I try to bring it up, I get tears, demands that she needs a break and wants to just be a mom as her job (I just point our being a parent isn't a job so much as a role in a family. You don't stop being a mom just because you work). Financially, it's stupid for us to not both be working. We aren't saving for retirement beyond my 401k and we aren't saving for the kids' college or anything beyond a few months of emergency saving. That stresses me out.

I actually started therapy to deal with my resentment. It helped but the therapist mentioned that this might just be a phase. So I wanted to see if anyone else went through this...

Dude, look what you just wrote. If your wife worked, her salary would go to paying daycare costs. If your wife doesn't work, you don't have to pay for daycare. If it is a true wash and what comes in goes immediately out, how can you fault your wife for being a SAHM mom if she is not interested in, as she may look at it, working for free? If this statement is true, then you're the breadwinner anyway whether she works or not because her role - whether working to pay for daycare or not working to not have to pay for daycare - has nothing to do with how much money you as a family have each month.

You may not think that a SAHM is sexy, but I'd loooove to see how sexy you think your wife is when she is working 40 hours a week, doing childcare at nights and weekends, and has even less time to cook and clean for you.




+ 1000

I think you missed the part where the wife is not really good at being home. The older kid thrived at daycare, they younger one needs structure. She is not contributing to a 401K, he is making less because he has to cover health care, they only have a few month emergency funds... not an ideal situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - any news?

I don't get why this has become a flame war on SAH vs WOH. This really doesn't seem to be about that but about communication in the marriage, and making unilateral decisions.

Because SAH moms ON THIS THREAD (not universally) think their "calling" to be a wife and mother gives them the right to stop working without discussing it with their husbands and go so far as to call the man a loser/selfish for not being the "default" breadwinner.

This might be the 1st DCUM thread where a large group of women are defending the position of the man.

I agree. I think it's also making a lot of SAHMs nervous that their husbands might feel like OP.

Yup. Lots of well-reasoned WOHM points here. This thread is a trainwreck for SAHMs.

OMG, the echo chamber persists. Almost laughable.

There are about 5 posts in agreement on this page ALONE. And they're not by the same person.

No secret that there is a anti-SAH pile on pretty much daily on the DCUM. But seriously, what does it say about you if you think you've "won" the mommy wars on some random thread about marriage difficulties.

Not in agreement like this. And you've posted 12 times in the past 15 minutes - no one else is using the term "mommy wars" - shouldn't you be fixing hubby his martini?

To be fair, every other post here was along the lines of "SAHMs are nervous that their husbands might feel like OP". All posted during the work hours, mind you. I am a working parent, but I am totally siding with SAHMs here.

What are you talking about?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - any news?

I don't get why this has become a flame war on SAH vs WOH. This really doesn't seem to be about that but about communication in the marriage, and making unilateral decisions.

Because SAH moms ON THIS THREAD (not universally) think their "calling" to be a wife and mother gives them the right to stop working without discussing it with their husbands and go so far as to call the man a loser/selfish for not being the "default" breadwinner.

This might be the 1st DCUM thread where a large group of women are defending the position of the man.

I agree. I think it's also making a lot of SAHMs nervous that their husbands might feel like OP.

Yup. Lots of well-reasoned WOHM points here. This thread is a trainwreck for SAHMs.

OMG, the echo chamber persists. Almost laughable.

There are about 5 posts in agreement on this page ALONE. And they're not by the same person.

No secret that there is a anti-SAH pile on pretty much daily on the DCUM. But seriously, what does it say about you if you think you've "won" the mommy wars on some random thread about marriage difficulties.

Not in agreement like this. And you've posted 12 times in the past 15 minutes - no one else is using the term "mommy wars" - shouldn't you be fixing hubby his martini?

To be fair, every other post here was along the lines of "SAHMs are nervous that their husbands might feel like OP". All posted during the work hours, mind you. I am a working parent, but I am totally siding with SAHMs here.

What are you talking about?

I am saying that while some "should be fixing martinis", others should be working. Instead, they post the same line over and over again.

[Anonymous]

OP, I've only read the first and last pages of this thread, but you sound like you need some perspective. The fact that your wife organizes and does crafts with your kids is infinitely more important than a load of laundry getting done and the floor being scrubbed. This comes from a person whose mother never spent any time with her because she was too busy cooking and cleaning. I would've appreciated delivery and an hour to actually talk with my mother over her being "good" at being a SAHM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - any news?

I don't get why this has become a flame war on SAH vs WOH. This really doesn't seem to be about that but about communication in the marriage, and making unilateral decisions.

Because SAH moms ON THIS THREAD (not universally) think their "calling" to be a wife and mother gives them the right to stop working without discussing it with their husbands and go so far as to call the man a loser/selfish for not being the "default" breadwinner.

This might be the 1st DCUM thread where a large group of women are defending the position of the man.

I agree. I think it's also making a lot of SAHMs nervous that their husbands might feel like OP.

Yup. Lots of well-reasoned WOHM points here. This thread is a trainwreck for SAHMs.

OMG, the echo chamber persists. Almost laughable.

There are about 5 posts in agreement on this page ALONE. And they're not by the same person.

No secret that there is a anti-SAH pile on pretty much daily on the DCUM. But seriously, what does it say about you if you think you've "won" the mommy wars on some random thread about marriage difficulties.

Not in agreement like this. And you've posted 12 times in the past 15 minutes - no one else is using the term "mommy wars" - shouldn't you be fixing hubby his martini?

To be fair, every other post here was along the lines of "SAHMs are nervous that their husbands might feel like OP". All posted during the work hours, mind you. I am a working parent, but I am totally siding with SAHMs here.

What are you talking about?

I am saying that while some "should be fixing martinis", others should be working. Instead, they post the same line over and over again.

Wow, you missed the point by a mile.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I've only read the first and last pages of this thread, but you sound like you need some perspective. The fact that your wife organizes and does crafts with your kids is infinitely more important than a load of laundry getting done and the floor being scrubbed. This comes from a person whose mother never spent any time with her because she was too busy cooking and cleaning. I would've appreciated delivery and an hour to actually talk with my mother over her being "good" at being a SAHM.

Absolutely. Take this to heart op.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I've only read the first and last pages of this thread, but you sound like you need some perspective. The fact that your wife organizes and does crafts with your kids is infinitely more important than a load of laundry getting done and the floor being scrubbed. This comes from a person whose mother never spent any time with her because she was too busy cooking and cleaning. I would've appreciated delivery and an hour to actually talk with my mother over her being "good" at being a SAHM.

Absolutely. Take this to heart op.

x2000000000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Get over it you whiny little bitch.

x200000

Say the leeches who expect their husbands to earn the money to support their lazy asses forever. Great examples for your daughters, ladies.

Shut up you dumb misogynist pig. I know you're butthurt that the times are a changin, but whinging about it isn't gonna change it!

x2000000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your post is honestly just bitter and hate filled. You married a person. Not a job or a static situation. A person. After that, you had two children together. Those enormous changes impact who that person is. It sounds like your wife is a great mom who takes care of the kids wonderfully during the day. She expects your help when you come home. That is appropriate. Her staying home should not make her 100% responsible for child care. You take a turn when you come home because it is not a job, it is loving and caring for your children. You need to develop some respect for the person you married, or you are right, it is really over between the two of you. You can't force someone to never change or to want different things. But you can control your reaction. If you had been honest with your wife about your feelings and expectations, I doubt she ever would have had children with you. Nobody wants that kind of controlling personality. And you should never have had children if you were going to resent the impact their lives had upon your own. You need to grow up.

Signed, a full time working mom.

His wife forced him to become a 100% breadwinner without consulting or discussing him and HE is controlling and needs to grow up? For real?
His wife needs to develop some respect for her husband before treating him like an ATM or a wordless donkey who is just there to pull the cart without questioning its mistress.

If you read what OP has actually said, his wife lost her job and the new ones she could find would be a wash after childcare. Their CIRCUMSTANCES are dictating their choice, which is true of most families where the wife SAH, although many women decide to describe it as their "calling" and something they do because they "couldn't stomach having someone else raise their children" and "#blessed." That aside, OP had no business having kids with a woman who did not earn enough to work after having children if it was such a complete and utter deal breaker and he would be furious if left to earn the income for the family. OP's wife could have or may die, and he will be left earning the income. She could be injured critically, etc. etc. etc. They could get divorced, she could get full custody, and he would still have to pay child support. This is the risk you assume when you have children, and if you want some kind of "guarantee" that it will not happen, you better at least be marrying a top paying professional who would be giving up a sizeable salary, so at least the numbers would be in your favor. OP, right now your financial situation is not impacted by your wife staying home. You probably could not afford to pay a nanny to do all the cleaning cooking and taking care of the kids after you get home. You need to internalize and accept that reality. Talk with your wife about changes that can be made once the kids start school that you will not be paying for. And do her a favor and start exploring your exit plan. You will divorce, share custody, and still be financially responsible for your children, only your income will be divided to two households.

OMGGGGGG. She did not lose her job, she quit. He doesn't have a problem with being financially responsible for his children. He has a problem with being financially responsible for HER (which he will not be for long if they do split - it's hard to get alimony as an able-bodied adult) while she isn't holding up her part of the bargain. It boggles my mind how anyone could defend a woman who made a unilateral decision to stop working. What if all your meal tickets (ie, husbands, for those who can't keep up) did that? Where would you be then?

I have NEVER been able to quit a job without another job. NEVER!

And when I watch all the women SAH in our neighborhood drop off the kids and head off for the morning walk or exercise you realize feminism is not about equal work.

[Anonymous]

OP,

I don't know if you're still reading, but I think what you resent is the loss of attention from your wife on you and the things that made life worthwhile for you: more free time, a pleasant house with pleasant dinners, etc. It's a very common complaint among new fathers and one which should not elicit such deep resentment on your part.

Perhaps the trick is to try and understand the value of what your wife does currently with your children, and her future as their principal caregiver. There is great potential there!

An involved, educated and sensible parent will trump a daycare any day, and organize playdates, outings, activities. A SAHM parent can pick up the children from school and do enrichment, help with homework, drive them to activities, etc, all before dinner and a reasonable bedtime. It makes life so much less stressful! For the children's wellbeing, money is not everything.

Do you realize that most elementary-school children I know have concomitantly one sport, one musical instrument and one language to learn after school, in addition to their homework? Do you want to pay a nanny to drive them around and "help" them with their homework? Or will you or your wife be able to find a part-time or flexible job that will allow one of you to do this?

I understand she is not keeping the house or taking care of you as you would wish right now. Remember these skills may develop themselves in a few years, when the babies don't need her round the clock. The mental sharpness and lively dinner conversations will come back, but not now - she's deep in the trenches.

I was your wife years ago: I stopped working because my job was too stressful - I was totally focused on my children for the first 2 years. I will remember that precious time as long as I live, and the fact that the house was messy and dinners sometimes forgotten is really completely unimportant compared to the extraordinary bond I developed with my children. It made me so happy and fulfilled. My husband, though lamenting that he wasn't getting as much TLC as before, was happy that I was happy (much better than a grouchy, super-stressed wife that won't make dinner anyway!).

Also keep in mind that having two working parents with young children is very stressful! It won't be same as before, when you had no kids, one just one kid in daycare.

It's normal not to see the benefits of a stay at home parent right away, OP, since your children can't hold intellectual conversations and show off what they've leaned right now. But you'll get there and be glad your children had that luxury.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - any news?

I don't get why this has become a flame war on SAH vs WOH. This really doesn't seem to be about that but about communication in the marriage, and making unilateral decisions.

Because SAH moms ON THIS THREAD (not universally) think their "calling" to be a wife and mother gives them the right to stop working without discussing it with their husbands and go so far as to call the man a loser/selfish for not being the "default" breadwinner.

This might be the 1st DCUM thread where a large group of women are defending the position of the man.

I agree. I think it's also making a lot of SAHMs nervous that their husbands might feel like OP.

Yup. Lots of well-reasoned WOHM points here. This thread is a trainwreck for SAHMs.

OMG, the echo chamber persists. Almost laughable.

There are about 5 posts in agreement on this page ALONE. And they're not by the same person.

No secret that there is a anti-SAH pile on pretty much daily on the DCUM. But seriously, what does it say about you if you think you've "won" the mommy wars on some random thread about marriage difficulties.

Not in agreement like this. And you've posted 12 times in the past 15 minutes - no one else is using the term "mommy wars" - shouldn't you be fixing hubby his martini?

To be fair, every other post here was along the lines of "SAHMs are nervous that their husbands might feel like OP". All posted during the work hours, mind you. I am a working parent, but I am totally siding with SAHMs here.

What are you talking about?

I am saying that while some "should be fixing martinis", others should be working. Instead, they post the same line over and over again.

Wow, you missed the point by a mile.

Wow, there was another point in your martini comment besides trying to put down the SAH poster! Who else were you trying to offend?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
OP,

I don't know if you're still reading, but I think what you resent is the loss of attention from your wife on you and the things that made life worthwhile for you: more free time, a pleasant house with pleasant dinners, etc. It's a very common complaint among new fathers and one which should not elicit such deep resentment on your part.

Perhaps the trick is to try and understand the value of what your wife does currently with your children, and her future as their principal caregiver. There is great potential there!

An involved, educated and sensible parent will trump a daycare any day, and organize playdates, outings, activities. A SAHM parent can pick up the children from school and do enrichment, help with homework, drive them to activities, etc, all before dinner and a reasonable bedtime. It makes life so much less stressful! For the children's wellbeing, money is not everything.

Do you realize that most elementary-school children I know have concomitantly one sport, one musical instrument and one language to learn after school, in addition to their homework? Do you want to pay a nanny to drive them around and "help" them with their homework? Or will you or your wife be able to find a part-time or flexible job that will allow one of you to do this?

I understand she is not keeping the house or taking care of you as you would wish right now. Remember these skills may develop themselves in a few years, when the babies don't need her round the clock. The mental sharpness and lively dinner conversations will come back, but not now - she's deep in the trenches.

I was your wife years ago: I stopped working because my job was too stressful - I was totally focused on my children for the first 2 years. I will remember that precious time as long as I live, and the fact that the house was messy and dinners sometimes forgotten is really completely unimportant compared to the extraordinary bond I developed with my children. It made me so happy and fulfilled. My husband, though lamenting that he wasn't getting as much TLC as before, was happy that I was happy (much better than a grouchy, super-stressed wife that won't make dinner anyway!).

Also keep in mind that having two working parents with young children is very stressful! It won't be same as before, when you had no kids, one just one kid in daycare.

It's normal not to see the benefits of a stay at home parent right away, OP, since your children can't hold intellectual conversations and show off what they've leaned right now. But you'll get there and be glad your children had that luxury.

Why on earth should OP realize anything, anything at all about elementary-school age children YOU know?

Do YOU realize plenty of children don't take one sport, one musical instrument and one language, all at the same time? Why are you deciding how his children will be raised?

I love how you deftly move from "it's great to have a mom at home when the kids are young" to selling the idea of a SAH parent for essentially eternity. Oh no worries if dinner isn't cooked right now. She'll learn to cook it later. All while he has to work twice as hard and not see his children as much to fund another adult's refusal to find paid employment without as much as discussing it with her husband. Yes, walking ATM, how dare you have feelings and thoughts about this! Just work and make money. This is your function in my life.

Whether or not children can have intellectual conversations has zero to do with whether their mother stayed at home.