Parents of small children - how are you managing RTO?

[Anonymous]

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Absolutely agree with a PP that they will cheer at women exiting the workforce, it's part of what they want.

Probably they didn't give this a thought.

Of course they did. Vance believes that women belong at home and should have more babies. He has said so explicitly.

Url or citation?

Lazy much. Find it yourself dumb b>

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I am a mom who managed this problem pre covid. It's not that I want more women to be miserable. I agree that flexibility is priceless for working families and I also agree that RTO will have the largest negative impact on women and that is sad.

But I am also annoyed at how clueless and entitled some of these posts are! This is a common problem that until very recently we all dealt with. It's not a unique attack on you. You can figure it out.

I also agree with the poster who said people used to prioritize commute when buying a home. I recall making a test drive to pick my kids up and drive by our potential new home to see what that would be like before putting in an offer. We didnt put offers in to houses that had more difficult commutes. Even if we loved the space the daily reality of needing to pick up kids and get to from the office was most important.

Sorry it's changing abruptly but not sorry you can't understand that this is life.

+1
I agree with you. WFH was never going to be forever. Wasn't it only supposed to be until the lockdowns ended? It was a real nice ride while it lasted and never going to last forever.

Fed telework started years before covid.

It became slightly more common after Covid, didn’t it?

DP. Yes, it did, because we found out that for many of us, it works. We have better tools now, better connectivity, files have been digitized. No need to be in person and remote work has allowed my team to be much more responsive and flexible, able to respond to requests in the late evening hours. With RTO, that is no more.

People in roles requiring face to face have already been back at the office for 2-3 years now. You are ignorant if you think remote workers are simply still operating under Covid conditions.

It was because there were no childcare workers as they stayed home on the stimulus check or were afraid to contract COVID. That's over get daycare or a nanny you morons and stop the entitled attitude your job will be replaced with ai

Say you know nothing about childcare without saying it. Jeez.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I find it amusing that women want school to be all day to “help” working women.

Stop making things up. Literally nobody wants this but also you have to face facts that we have a broken and insufficient childcare infrastructure that operates on the backs of underpaid women (largely women of color). People can make $15/hour at Target, so why would they choose to wipe snotty noses if they aren’t passionate about it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Absolutely agree with a PP that they will cheer at women exiting the workforce, it's part of what they want.

Probably they didn't give this a thought.

Of course they did. Vance believes that women belong at home and should have more babies. He has said so explicitly.

Url or citation?

Lazy much. Find it yourself dumb b>

Provided above.

[Anonymous]

This drama is silly. Its not just feds who are RTO. You have to pay for child care. My non-fed spouse is RTO and was working at home in the same job long before covid. We cannot move as the job isn't stable and financially it would be a huge loss. I cannot work due to everything else going on. It sucks but its life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it amusing that women want school to be all day to “help” working women.

But nearly all teachers are women and most have kids. Who will watch their kids when they are working all day?

Also amusing are complaints about day care costs. Daycare workers are almost 100 percent women and insanely underpaid with almost no benefits. They are way overworked in a stressful hard job for very little pay and working moms want them to get paid even less and work longer hours.

I don’t think making it worse for teachers and daycare workers is the answer.

Literally nobody wants school to be all day long to help working women. Working parents want adequate and affordable childcare.

Working parents need to pay for it and stop being entitled to expect people to do it for free. We have someone in a group asking that they be driven back and forth to the metro and asking for parents to step up and be back up care (again for free).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a mom who managed this problem pre covid. It's not that I want more women to be miserable. I agree that flexibility is priceless for working families and I also agree that RTO will have the largest negative impact on women and that is sad.

But I am also annoyed at how clueless and entitled some of these posts are! This is a common problem that until very recently we all dealt with. It's not a unique attack on you. You can figure it out.

I also agree with the poster who said people used to prioritize commute when buying a home. I recall making a test drive to pick my kids up and drive by our potential new home to see what that would be like before putting in an offer. We didnt put offers in to houses that had more difficult commutes. Even if we loved the space the daily reality of needing to pick up kids and get to from the office was most important.

Sorry it's changing abruptly but not sorry you can't understand that this is life.

+1,000

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Unless you worked at a company that outright banned telework and required you be on site 42.5 hours per week, monitored by badging out with time cards that are a felony to misrepresent on, I don’t want to hear how you managed pre covid. Jesus christ, people. Your quite cushy lives in 2019 are not comparable in this situation. Not at all.

Every defense contractor requires badging in and out. Nothing was cushy and nothing is new or harder for you. Timecards are as old as time. Get over your stupid self.

This! My work checked all of those boxes pre, during and post Covid. And speaking of cushy, a friend who works for the FDA and is worried about losing her job/bemoaning RTO in March told me last night at our kids' basketball practice (that I practically killed myself to get home in time to get to) that today is her Friday since she "works" remote tomorrow.

This doesn’t even make sense?! What does her “Friday” even mean. Why are you upset she has managed to find a job that allows her work/life balance.

Because as a taxpayer, I (NP) shouldn’t pay for her individual luxury of “balance.” I and apparently millions of others would prefer to pay her a part-time salary and no federal benefits — because she is in fact working part time.

Whether she wants to be all-in and miss games or lean out and watch basketball doesn’t matter to me. Her fraudulence is the problem.

A) You don't pay my salary, which is fee-funded.
B) Your payment of any fed's salary is miniscule, at best.
C) you're paying for work. If the work is getting done, the "where" is not your business. And for many feds, and all feds at my former agency, getting the work done at home worked perfectly.

None of that is fraud. You're just a bitter old hag.

For many of them (and many more to come), their supervisors/agencies disagree. Enjoy that richly deserved RTO. And choke on your nasty, childish attitude.

not the quoted PP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have an 8yo, 4yo, and 2yo. My 8yo is able to take the bus home, walk a block to our house and let herself in with the keypad. She texts me to let me know she's there (although I know bc I saw her on our security system). She does homework, reads, gets a snack, whatever for 2 hours until I am home. I pick up the 4yo/2yo from daycare on the way. So at worst, this is an 8 year problem if people are starting with a newborn (which many are not). Back to the days of teaching kids to be self sufficient rather than babying them until they are 10-12.

Many places (California, Baltimore…) don’t have school buses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a mom who managed this problem pre covid. It's not that I want more women to be miserable. I agree that flexibility is priceless for working families and I also agree that RTO will have the largest negative impact on women and that is sad.

But I am also annoyed at how clueless and entitled some of these posts are! This is a common problem that until very recently we all dealt with. It's not a unique attack on you. You can figure it out.

I also agree with the poster who said people used to prioritize commute when buying a home. I recall making a test drive to pick my kids up and drive by our potential new home to see what that would be like before putting in an offer. We didnt put offers in to houses that had more difficult commutes. Even if we loved the space the daily reality of needing to pick up kids and get to from the office was most important.

Sorry it's changing abruptly but not sorry you can't understand that this is life.

That post is 100% correct. The only lunatics here are the people screeching that they “can’t” (won’t) find childcare or that their kids will wither and die on the vine if they attend before/aftercare or don’t do multiple extracurriculars every single day chauffeured by Mommy. Ridiculous. And I didn’t vote for 45, either time. Sorry to burst your angry little bubble.


So we should all give up are low mortgage rates and buy homes closer in (since there is an abundance of homes on the market and it the COL in DC is so reasonable). Plus uproot our kids from their schools, activities and friends. What a short sighted comment

You made a decision that fit your situation at that time. But it wasn't smart to not plan for a change in situation. The situation has changed so yes you have to pivot. A low mortgage rate on a house located inconveniently isn't a positive thing.

Ohh geese guess I should have used my
Magic 8 ball ten years ago to know this was coming…silly me to think it was smart to have a family and buy a home!

Literally this is real life! You dont need to know what the change may be but you need to anticipate that family and work obligations shift with time. Assuming what you had at time of home purchase was a life long guarantee is very short sighted. Adults understand contingency plans. It's not fun or pleasant but it is real life. If you chose to have kids you should have expected that to alter your commuting or working abilities in some ways.

And now the real DCUM lunatics come out.

I guess it's clear why Trump is POTUS again.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I rode an hour long plus vanpool when I first started in the gov't. There was no telework. You had to figure it out.

Now I see people hopping off the computer and going to school pickup and then resuming work with their young kids in the house and thinking there is nothing wrong with it.

There is nothing wrong with it. Kids are allowed to be present in the home while teleworking. My kid being at home doesn't mean I'm not working.

"While the presence of dependents in the household should not be an absolute bar to teleworking, employees should not be engaging in dependent care activities when performing official duties. While an occasional, brief interruption may occur when a dependent is present in the home, teleworkers must be careful to keep interruptions to a minimum to avoid disruptions in work accomplishment."

https://www.opm.gov/telework/tmo-and-coordinators/dependent-care/

And to add, dependent care for a 6 month old is very different from a 10 year old. A 6 month old would require a lot of care all day, which obviously someone needs daycare. But a 10 year old would be at school all day and should be able to figure something out for a little bit once they got home that doesn't involve bugging mom. But now with mom's added commute, the 10 year old can't be at home completely alone for 2 hours. My point though in posting is that a 10 year old being picked up from the bus stop is completely allowable in my interpretation.

Yeah I don't have sympathy here. I do not blame employers at all for calling for RTO for employees that do this. It is one thing to slowly give kids independence but to be completely unavailable to a child that can't be alone for 2 hours is irresponsible.

Reread the policy. Minimal interruptions while not preferrable, are allowed while teleworking. That's really all the supervision a 10 year old needs. But thanks to RTO, a lot of 10 years olds will be home alone for 2 hours. I agree that is irresponsible.

If their particular 10-year-old needs childcare, and the parent doesn’t arrange it, then yes, that parent is irresponsible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unless you worked at a company that outright banned telework and required you be on site 42.5 hours per week, monitored by badging out with time cards that are a felony to misrepresent on, I don’t want to hear how you managed pre covid. Jesus christ, people. Your quite cushy lives in 2019 are not comparable in this situation. Not at all.

Every defense contractor requires badging in and out. Nothing was cushy and nothing is new or harder for you. Timecards are as old as time. Get over your stupid self.

This! My work checked all of those boxes pre, during and post Covid. And speaking of cushy, a friend who works for the FDA and is worried about losing her job/bemoaning RTO in March told me last night at our kids' basketball practice (that I practically killed myself to get home in time to get to) that today is her Friday since she "works" remote tomorrow.

This doesn’t even make sense?! What does her “Friday” even mean. Why are you upset she has managed to find a job that allows her work/life balance.

Because as a taxpayer, I (NP) shouldn’t pay for her individual luxury of “balance.” I and apparently millions of others would prefer to pay her a part-time salary and no federal benefits — because she is in fact working part time.

Whether she wants to be all-in and miss games or lean out and watch basketball doesn’t matter to me. Her fraudulence is the problem.

A) You don't pay my salary, which is fee-funded.
B) Your payment of any fed's salary is miniscule, at best.
C) you're paying for work. If the work is getting done, the "where" is not your business. And for many feds, and all feds at my former agency, getting the work done at home worked perfectly.

None of that is fraud. You're just a bitter old hag.

I mean, I'm not the one who's bitter here. I have a fantastic close-in SFH and a 10 minute commute to my federal workplace. The nature of our work means we've been in-person all along.

It's the HR, IT and credentialing people at my agency who are bitter, because they've all been called back and will need to produce work now in a way that conforms with their PD. Their 90 minute drive and childcare stress isn't my concern.

Sure you are bitter. You're pissed someone had a better gig than you. I know I had a better gig than you. I was an attorney, making decent money, and working solely at home. I had not parking, dry cleaning, childcare, etc. issues. My bar dues were paid for. I had ISP reimbursement. And received numerous performance awards b/c I was working and working well. (And FTR, I'm in a fantastic SFH home in an amazing neighborhood that isn't Arlington, but also not an Exburb. My home is worth a million bucks and we paid about $300K for it 25 years ago and it is paid off. So, don't worry about my living arrangement, we're fine).

Trump wanted me to come back 5 days (in addition to other things that I didn't like, like the blatant illegal actions being taken) and I qualified for early retirement. So I took it. The only loss is my agency and the people who relied on me to do my work. But, as you say, that's not my concern. I'm coming out of this just fine. But you're still a bitter, nosy hag.

You quit. You solved your own problem. Why are you *so* angry? It’s incredibly childish.

P.S. Your list of your own “accomplishments” to a stranger on the internet just makes you look pathetic. FYI.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it amusing that women want school to be all day to “help” working women.

But nearly all teachers are women and most have kids. Who will watch their kids when they are working all day?

Also amusing are complaints about day care costs. Daycare workers are almost 100 percent women and insanely underpaid with almost no benefits. They are way overworked in a stressful hard job for very little pay and working moms want them to get paid even less and work longer hours.

I don’t think making it worse for teachers and daycare workers is the answer.

Literally nobody wants school to be all day long to help working women. Working parents want adequate and affordable childcare.

Working parents need to pay for it and stop being entitled to expect people to do it for free. We have someone in a group asking that they be driven back and forth to the metro and asking for parents to step up and be back up care (again for free).

Did I say anywhere that I want it to be free? Nope, all I said was adequate and affordable. My husband works from home (not a Fed) and our kids are old enough to come home and fend for themselves for a couple hours, so our childcare days are over, but I recognize that childcare is harder to find than it was pre-Covid and that it's also more expensive. All that to say is that I get that it's hard for new moms who have never had to worry about childcare before, especially without having time to do that search and get on waitlists, and I wish them the best of luck.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:you pay for childcare like everyone else before covid

There are so many bitter people here. Before Covid I was able to telework two days a week. So could my husband. Now he has to return to the office full time and I probably will too (haven’t heard from my agency yet). So no it’s not like before covid. My commute is an hour long and his is an hour and 20 minutes long one way. We live right next to the metro but they moved my husband’s office so now it’s just much further. That’s two hours a day commuting for me and almost 3 hrs for him. In that time we can make dinner, do the laundry etc. We are both in litigation so our jobs are actually stressful and don’t have much time during the day. But those two hours that I save mean everything. Also my eldest two are in elementary school and extended day is completely full. There is a waitlist to get in. I pick them up from the bus stop at 3 pm and bring them home. Since they are in 3rd and 4th grade they are self sufficient and even set the table for dinner and make the salad. Since we are a bilingual family, a tutor comes at 3:30 three days a week to tutor them in my native language. My youngest who is three is at daycare and my husband picks her up at 5:30 while I prep dinner. It’s tough having three kids but telework makes it much it much easier. Sure I can find childcare but it’s not easy. Who would want to work for two hours only? And it’s not cheap. And when would I find the time to cook? Republicans pretend to care about families but people don’t have kids or as many kids as they want because it’s so hard to balance working with having a family. Our school calls us and tells us to pick the kids up for every sniffle. What happens now? I would have to leave work (takes an hour) pick them up and drive them home. All that time wasted when I could have just driven 5 minutes and gone right back to work. Since my work has so many deadlines I will have to make up for the lost time in the evening. How do I balance that with spending time with my kids, making dinner, giving my 3 year old a bath? Cleaning up…. The entire thing is insane and people like PP who want us all to suffer are just disgusting. Society is going to have to resolve this issue. How do people have kids while two spouses are working full time? Republicans have the answer to that. They want women to stay at home. That’s what may end up happening because many of us may just have no choice. I’m sure PP will be celebrating

OK, deep breath.
I was very much in your shoes. What worked for me was to pay the tutor to pick my daughter up from car line (or in your case perhaps the bus stop), bring her home, get her a small snack and start the tutoring lesson at 3:30 as planned then help her with homework till I got home at 5:30. Yes, I had to pay her for 2.5 hours 5 days a week instead of paying her for 1 hour 3 days a week but to know she was being reliably picked up and when I got home all the homework was done and tutoring was done was really helpful.
For years I have meal prepped on weekends and planned lunches and meals around leftovers.
It felt weird to ask the tutor to do this, I was really hesitant to do it. I led in by acknowledging it was an odd request and I would pay her hourly rate. We had that arrangement for 2 years.

Thanks so much PP for the advice. I’m just so stressed I can’t think straight. I didn’t think about asking the tutor to babysit. That would honestly be the best solution. Paying her the hourly rate makes sense since that’s how much her time costs. It would only be an extra say 45 minutes so I think it’s doable. Need to muster the courage to ask though! I feel a bit embarrassed asking her :/

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:You should manage childcare for RTO the same way you manage it for WFH. You are not supposed to be dropping off and picking up on the clock. Nor are you supposed to be caring for your kids at home. You were supposed to have a childcare plan this whole time. WFH is not your childcare plan. Why are you just now trying to figure it out.

This. I’m really aghast that so many people were cheating the system!

How were they cheating the system?

its illegal (in the case of govt related jobs or contracting) to perform childcare duties and bill hours. It's against most company policies to do the same.

+1 Even if your employer doesn't have a policy against this, I really don't have sympathy for people who are getting paid for a full time job but don't have full time child care for their young children
- working parent of a young child

Misery loves company is not a valid argument. It's just not. You want everyone to suffer like you instead of everyone to have a better work/life balance. I feel sorry for you that you're such a miserable person.

Sorry, I want to work with people who are available to work. If you are caring for a young child during the same hours you are working you are doing your child, your employer and your coworkers a disservice.

No one is advocating for this. People are advocating for not having to add hours of unnecessary commuting to their day, which makes coordinating childcare more difficult because parents are unavailable longer each day.

You should buy a house close to work not my problem

Not PP. But we did. We bought a house right next to the metro in Arlington. My husband’s office just moved this year and is now a 20 minute walk from union station. So now his commute will be an 1 and 20 minutes. Before it was much less. I know this is confusing for some but federal government offices relocate. Also i moved from one agency to another. Before my metro stop was foggy bottom now it’s union station. Should we be expected to buy a new home and sell our old one very time our office moves or we have a new job?