Admissions to change at Thomas Jefferson High, and others

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your kid is *not* more meritorious than a poor kid just because you paid for AOPS, Kumon, and an expensive home in a neighborhood with a middle school that has mathcounts, model UN, etc. Repeat that until it sinks in.

This exactly.

BINGO BINGO

The disparity among FCPS middle schools is appalling. It was difficult finding information about TJ at our Title 1 middle school. When I asked, the principal said the kids are more interested in staying at their own pyramid. Information on the school's website was nearly non-existent. (This was before they standardized the school websites.) At TJ feeders, information on TJ was front and center. There were 2 information meetings - spring and fall when we had only the fall meeting at our school.

There are no Math Counts or AMC testing to speak of at our school. These activities, however, exist at all major TJ feeder middle schools where teachers lead after school clubs and hone skills.

Mainly bc these are parent run and organized. While a teacher nominally has to "sponsor" it, my experience is that these activities don't run if parents don't step up to do 99% of the work. If you want it, set it up. Or lobby FCPS to pay folks to run it. But it's not like they magically appear.

So we're back to the fact that TJ admissions are made due to the work of the parents, not the students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ The county pays for after school middle school clubs, BTW.

FCPS gives the middle schools in the lower-income areas extra money for after-school clubs and activities that they leave to parents to organize and subsidize in the higher-income schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

Yet, some irrational people in NOVA want to almost force your kid to attend TJ.

that's a good post to wrap it up on. Who exactly thinks there are problems at TJ again.... is it actual black and Hispanic people.... no once again it is stupid mostly white woke morons who have no concept of TJ and no intention of sending their kids there, all on the altar of some huge white guilt. Get a grip and take out your guilt somewhere else.

Interesting take. So you’re basically saying it’s fine that the environment at TJ is so unwelcoming to students like PP’s Hispanic daughter that she has no interest in the school, despite her strong academic record and interest in STEM. All while gratuitously bashing white people in the process.

I guess we all know who you think does and doesn’t belong at TJ.

Environment at TJ is not unwelcoming for Hispanic or black students. Those saying that should go and actually see how things are are at TJ before saying things like that. Asians are often stereotyped as passive, quiet, obedient etc. yet now they are bullies because they are in the majority? Can't have it both ways. In fact, I know of a black kid who harassed my kid when he was a student at TJ and this black kid shoved an Asian kid into a locker (this was when the renovations were going on and TJ still had tall lockers) and this black kid received no discipline and went on to attend an Ivy League school despite being a below average student and having a history of bullying Asian kids and physically assaulting one Asian kid that I know of.

Relatively small percentage by itself does not mean unwelcoming environment and remember TJ students, teachers/staff are totally excluded form the admissions decisions. The admissions decisions are made by the review panesl made up of mostly white people and some black and hsipanic people and NO Asian people as usual.

If being in a relatively small group, Asians would be the ones that should be complaining of "unwelcoming" environment since Asians students often find themselves as part of a small group at most Northern Virginia schools including Loudoun, Prince William, Arlington counties as well as Fairfax county schools.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

Teenagers that go to TJ care about STEM not the races of their classmates.

If the race of a classmate would prevent one from going, then no one wants their racist and xenophobic presence there anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

Yet, some irrational people in NOVA want to almost force your kid to attend TJ.

that's a good post to wrap it up on. Who exactly thinks there are problems at TJ again.... is it actual black and Hispanic people.... no once again it is stupid mostly white woke morons who have no concept of TJ and no intention of sending their kids there, all on the altar of some huge white guilt. Get a grip and take out your guilt somewhere else.

Interesting take. So you’re basically saying it’s fine that the environment at TJ is so unwelcoming to students like PP’s Hispanic daughter that she has no interest in the school, despite her strong academic record and interest in STEM. All while gratuitously bashing white people in the process.

I guess we all know who you think does and doesn’t belong at TJ.

Environment at TJ is not unwelcoming for Hispanic or black students. Those saying that should go and actually see how things are are at TJ before saying things like that. Asians are often stereotyped as passive, quiet, obedient etc. yet now they are bullies because they are in the majority? Can't have it both ways. In fact, I know of a black kid who harassed my kid when he was a student at TJ and this black kid shoved an Asian kid into a locker (this was when the renovations were going on and TJ still had tall lockers) and this black kid received no discipline and went on to attend an Ivy League school despite being a below average student and having a history of bullying Asian kids and physically assaulting one Asian kid that I know of.

Relatively small percentage by itself does not mean unwelcoming environment and remember TJ students, teachers/staff are totally excluded form the admissions decisions. The admissions decisions are made by the review panesl made up of mostly white people and some black and hsipanic people and NO Asian people as usual.

If being in a relatively small group, Asians would be the ones that should be complaining of "unwelcoming" environment since Asians students often find themselves as part of a small group at most Northern Virginia schools including Loudoun, Prince William, Arlington counties as well as Fairfax county schools.

This is just totally false and betrays a lack of understanding of the TJ environment. It's not like students from underrepresented groups are shoved up against lockers or have their heads stuck in toilet bowls, but they are subjected to frequent assumptions that they only got in because of their race, comments that they don't belong, exclusion from study groups, skepticism about the legitimacy of their college acceptances.....all of this happens. Having very few kids who look like them is difficult too, but the actively racist behavior of white, East Asian, and South Asian students at TJ impacts those students.

You have no idea who is on the review panel. It is very sad that what happened to your student happened, but you're talking about one student and what I'm talking about is consistent over decades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your kid is *not* more meritorious than a poor kid just because you paid for AOPS, Kumon, and an expensive home in a neighborhood with a middle school that has mathcounts, model UN, etc. Repeat that until it sinks in.

This exactly.

BINGO BINGO

The disparity among FCPS middle schools is appalling. It was difficult finding information about TJ at our Title 1 middle school. When I asked, the principal said the kids are more interested in staying at their own pyramid. Information on the school's website was nearly non-existent. (This was before they standardized the school websites.) At TJ feeders, information on TJ was front and center. There were 2 information meetings - spring and fall when we had only the fall meeting at our school.

There are no Math Counts or AMC testing to speak of at our school. These activities, however, exist at all major TJ feeder middle schools where teachers lead after school clubs and hone skills.

Mainly bc these are parent run and organized. While a teacher nominally has to "sponsor" it, my experience is that these activities don't run if parents don't step up to do 99% of the work. If you want it, set it up. Or lobby FCPS to pay folks to run it. But it's not like they magically appear.

So we're back to the fact that TJ admissions are made due to the work of the parents, not the students.

BINGO

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

Teenagers that go to TJ care about STEM not the races of their classmates.

If the race of a classmate would prevent one from going, then no one wants their racist and xenophobic presence there anyway.

Nobody wants to be an "only," and if TJ can't attract kids from all races, something is wrong with the system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

Teenagers that go to TJ care about STEM not the races of their classmates.

If the race of a classmate would prevent one from going, then no one wants their racist and xenophobic presence there anyway.

Teenagers that go to TJ care about their friends getting into TJ with them, and about admission to elite universities. They believe that students from underrepresented groups have unfair advantages when it comes to both and treat them miserably as a consequence. If you don't understand that this happens, you don't understand TJ.

[Anonymous]

and again I say so what. If mostly early generation asians think accelerating math prep is the ticket to life success go for it

do we stop or complain about white parents from pushing athletics and then complain about the diversity of high school sports teams? nope

and the biggest point is there this giant pool of black and hispanic kids/famililes clamoring for TJ and upset that they aren't going..... ???? answer nope

so once again we have people in search of a problem when there is none.

and side note TJ already pours tons of time and resources into tutoring/mentoring/math prepping across the county with special focus in traditionally URM areas

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

Teenagers that go to TJ care about STEM not the races of their classmates.

If the race of a classmate would prevent one from going, then no one wants their racist and xenophobic presence there anyway.

Teenagers that go to TJ care about their friends getting into TJ with them, and about admission to elite universities. They believe that students from underrepresented groups have unfair advantages when it comes to both and treat them miserably as a consequence. If you don't understand that this happens, you don't understand TJ.

and how is changing admissions to make this become a reality going to address this issue. It's going to make it worse and make the URM that actually belong there face even more pressure.

I know people move in and out of this area all the time so for those that are unaware

We tried this already. It failed miserably, too many kids had to take remedial classes. Kids were dropping out left and right

It does not work

"FAIRFAX COUNTY tweaked the admission policy to Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in the hopes that it would increase diversity at the elite magnet school. Not only did the changes not have the desired effect, but something equally troubling may have occurred: The wrong students may be getting accepted at the expense of students better suited to the school’s rigor and mission. Fairfax school officials are right to revisit this issue."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/an-uneven-base-of-knowledge-at-thomas-jefferson-high-school/2012/05/29/gJQAl2H0zU_story.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People go into STEM because they love it. Not to get into the top 1%. Sheesh.

Going to be completely frank again here

Many Asians view STEM as the path to success when generally white Americans generally know those folks never really make it to the top. People that manage these folks make much more and generally have fewer STEM skills not to mention the other career fields I mentioned that have nothing to do with STEM

you are kidding yourself if you think many of these kids actually have an interest in STEM, much like athletics and white folks this "interest" is often pushed on kids in elementary school if not sooner.

Please don’t group us together just because TJ is majority Asian. You must not know many rich Asians. I’m the pp Asian living in McLean. There are many affluent Asians who are not trying to send our kids to TJ. We are ivy educated and have a seven figure income. There are different kinds of Asian elites. Most are not targeting TJ.

This is probably true. Asian Americans w/ seven figure income do not have to attend TJ or Ivy league schools to try to become successful; social capital, social connections are already in place for those w/ high income which are far more useful than TJ or top 10 universities.

However, most TJ Asian students' parents are not UC but MC or LMC often w/ language barrier so attending the best possible schools and getting a good "professional" job is the only way.

True.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

Teenagers that go to TJ care about STEM not the races of their classmates.

If the race of a classmate would prevent one from going, then no one wants their racist and xenophobic presence there anyway.

Nobody wants to be an "only," and if TJ can't attract kids from all races, something is wrong with the system.

This is tired.

They would not be an ‘only’. They need to be able to work with people of different races in real life.

The kids at TJ are good kids not evil demon Asians out to get your precious snowflake.

There is so much racism, stereotyping, demonizing and xenophobia towards TEENAGERS from adults on all these stupid TJ threads.

If this was a top notch school with mostly black or Hispanic kids do you even think for one second that it would be considered acceptable to demonize those kids as you are Asian kids. Would it be okay to demand in public like is being done now that there be less Black kids to make it more fair for Asians because who wants to go to a school with mostly Black kids? Those black kids are just going to ridicule them and make them feel left out, so we need to get rid of them as there are too many of those Black kids.

That’s the type of mentality we are fighting against, yet it’s the group think when it comes to Asians.

Ya’ll make me sick and I feel sorry for your kids that are internalizing your hypocrisy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do urm even want to attend TJ? I know I didn't because my interests was in the arts. And I knew a lot of super smart minorities and they had no interest in TJ either.

My Hispanic DD who attends a TJ feeder school, has straight As in all of her AAP classes and has a very strong interest in STEM, has ZERO interest in attending TJ. Why go someplace where she will be a minority race-wise and gender-wise?

I don't blame her at all for not wanting to go. It's a sad state of affairs that Hispanic students are so poorly represented that she would have no interest. But we have to start somewhere, and there are plenty who do want to go.

If you are passionate about STEM, why would you care about the colour of the skin of the kids around you? You will be surrounded by people who have the same passion that you have.

Um, because they're teenagers?

Teenagers that go to TJ care about STEM not the races of their classmates.

If the race of a classmate would prevent one from going, then no one wants their racist and xenophobic presence there anyway.

Nobody wants to be an "only," and if TJ can't attract kids from all races, something is wrong with the system.

This is tired.

They would not be an ‘only’. They need to be able to work with people of different races in real life.

The kids at TJ are good kids not evil demon Asians out to get your precious snowflake.

There is so much racism, stereotyping, demonizing and xenophobia towards TEENAGERS from adults on all these stupid TJ threads.

If this was a top notch school with mostly black or Hispanic kids do you even think for one second that it would be considered acceptable to demonize those kids as you are Asian kids. Would it be okay to demand in public like is being done now that there be less Black kids to make it more fair for Asians because who wants to go to a school with mostly Black kids? Those black kids are just going to ridicule them and make them feel left out, so we need to get rid of them as there are too many of those Black kids.

That’s the type of mentality we are fighting against, yet it’s the group think when it comes to Asians.

Ya’ll make me sick and I feel sorry for your kids that are internalizing your hypocrisy.

People already do this at schools that have mostly Black and/or Hispanic students. They move their kids or try to get them placed at different schools because of racist attitudes towards those groups.

If you're trying to engage in some sort of Oppression Olympics in America, you're not going to win that fight.