Toxic Masculinity

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you believe that toxic masculinity is a real thing, what are your thoughts on how to address it? Besides raising boys better what can we do? How do you confront it when it presents itself in your life?

Trump is No. 1 in toxic masculinity and he is revered by white males who also want to grab women by their kitties, rape with their fingers, and suffer no consequences. Look at the billionaire class who treat their wives like $hit. I don't have an answer and I hope my sons will remember what they were taught and behave accordingly.

[Anonymous]

I think the way out of toxic masculinity is really for men to define and call out examples of decent men. Women held up examples of great women for girls to aspire to become; men need to find the positive forms of masculinity to hold up.

I have a teenage son and it falls on my husband to encourage positive views of women and how to be a good husband (which is really a partner not an overbearing knuckle dragger who expects me to be a trad wife) and a good dad.

Society is kind of a drag these days. Everyone angry and unkind. I almost wish we could stop focusing on ourselves. It’s like 24/7 naval gazing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It starts with boys. It’s crucial we raise boys to not only respect women, but also for boys to be raised to be active feminists.

You resurrected this thread to say that? Lol

Guys don't even want to date feminists, let alone be one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would define it as men who are insecure about their own masculinity so they overcompensate by acting in what they feel is a stereotypical masculine way bullying men they feel are inferior and demeaning and not treating women as equals. This has nothing to do with how men fall on a spectrum of typical "manly" jobs, behavior or style preferences.

And this is something that fathers and older brothers pass down to their sons and that boys copy. I see my DD’s elementary school-aged male classmates picking up on language and attitudes from older boys, which clearly comes from even older boys and their parents. The constant need for men to compare themselves to each other and then try to rise up in the pecking order is a distinctly male thing. Women compare but then try to change themselves to reflect who they want to be like. Men compare and then try to kill/go faster than/beat/outearn/outspend whoever they’re comparing themselves to.

The boys in DD’s class can’t even walk down the hallway without making it into a competition, trash talking, announcing the results, and then insulting whoever didn’t win. Not being able to go through a single moment of the day without worrying about your competition is at the root toxic masculinity. The non-toxic men I know are either naturally at the very top of the pecking order or have the maturity and quiet confidence to decide that they don’t want to play the game and have sidestepped it to do things on their own terms. They’re few and far between.

Everyone else is engaged in a d—k measuring contest.

This isn’t toxic masculinity. Boys actually aren’t girls. I know that’s shocking.

Oh, you’re dumb. That’s sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you define “toxic masculinity”?

The term “toxic masculinity” points to a particular version of masculinity that is unhealthy for the men and boys who conform to it, and harmful for those around them.

The phrase emphasises the worst aspects of stereotypically masculine attributes. Toxic masculinity is represented by qualities such as violence, dominance, emotional illiteracy, sexual entitlement, and hostility to femininity.

Funny, because it seems to me that it is mostly women who are “hostile to femininity” and fear any recognition that there are differences between the sexes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still feel there is value in educating girls to recognize and avoid men who display the telltale signs of toxic masculinity.

Nevertheless, the onus is clearly on men to change/alter/correct their behaviors. Western culture defines specific characteristics to fit the patriarchal ideal masculine construct. The socialization of masculine ideals starts in boys’ at a young age and defines ideal masculinity as related to toughness, stoicism, heterosexism, self-sufficient attitudes and lack of emotional sensitivity and of connectedness. Boys learn to be men from the men in their lives, from their own experiences navigating our social norms, and from the large social and cultural context. Boys live under intensified pressure to display so-called gender-appropriate behaviors according to an anachronistic ideal male code.

Looking at the development of aggression throughout childhood, we know that not only do aggressive behaviors can emerge at an early age, they also tend to persist over time, without early prevention intervention. The socialization of the male characteristics mentioned above also onsets at an early age making it a prime time-period for prevention intervention.

What specific parenting techniques can we turn employ, to thwart toxic masculinity?

But you think girls / people can tell the difference between being a strong protective male and being a toxic male. There pinkies the problem.

Women will be blamed for not being clairvoyant and knowing because Larlo was an “athlete” or “hunted” or “had 2 divorced parents and watched a lot of football” or did “MMA” of course he 30 years later would smack her in an argument or cheat. “So many red flags” and… it’s bullshit. The red flag/green flag BS is gaslighting young women into believing they can predict future behavior. You can’t.

On the most basic of levels, I think we can all agree: if a man hunts animals or watches MMA, both are huge, obvious, red-flags.

Ridiculous. Ridiculous and stupid. My H not only hunts and watches MMA fighting, but is a former MMA fighter himself, in addition to being a US Army Ranger and combat veteran with three Purple Hearts. Are those red flags, too?


Seriously, women are our own worst enemies.

Yes. And please spare us the predictable tripe about how he’s pRoTeCtiNg oUr fReEdUmB. Thanks in advance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still feel there is value in educating girls to recognize and avoid men who display the telltale signs of toxic masculinity.

Nevertheless, the onus is clearly on men to change/alter/correct their behaviors. Western culture defines specific characteristics to fit the patriarchal ideal masculine construct. The socialization of masculine ideals starts in boys’ at a young age and defines ideal masculinity as related to toughness, stoicism, heterosexism, self-sufficient attitudes and lack of emotional sensitivity and of connectedness. Boys learn to be men from the men in their lives, from their own experiences navigating our social norms, and from the large social and cultural context. Boys live under intensified pressure to display so-called gender-appropriate behaviors according to an anachronistic ideal male code.

Looking at the development of aggression throughout childhood, we know that not only do aggressive behaviors can emerge at an early age, they also tend to persist over time, without early prevention intervention. The socialization of the male characteristics mentioned above also onsets at an early age making it a prime time-period for prevention intervention.

What specific parenting techniques can we turn employ, to thwart toxic masculinity?

But you think girls / people can tell the difference between being a strong protective male and being a toxic male. There pinkies the problem.

Women will be blamed for not being clairvoyant and knowing because Larlo was an “athlete” or “hunted” or “had 2 divorced parents and watched a lot of football” or did “MMA” of course he 30 years later would smack her in an argument or cheat. “So many red flags” and… it’s bullshit. The red flag/green flag BS is gaslighting young women into believing they can predict future behavior. You can’t.

On the most basic of levels, I think we can all agree: if a man hunts animals or watches MMA, both are huge, obvious, red-flags.

Ridiculous. Ridiculous and stupid. My H not only hunts and watches MMA fighting, but is a former MMA fighter himself, in addition to being a US Army Ranger and combat veteran with three Purple Hearts. Are those red flags, too?


Seriously, women are our own worst enemies.

Ick. He’s probably a maga.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I assume the “marching band is a sport” people are just being facetious. Although I suppose it tracks with our current climate of “words mean whatever the speaker says they mean”…

No, I meant what I wrote. It is a VARSITY sport.

It is also extremely athletic and requires tremendous discipline.

I am a band parent; I know these things for a fact.

What schools consider it a varsity sport? That’s hilarious! If it is it would be either to 1) fulfill Title IX requirements or 2) to allow unathletic kids and their parents to essentially lie on the college applications and say they played a varsity sport

Wrong.

Marching Band earns a varsity letter in county schools. Everyone knows that.

Plus: it’s a sport everywhere, not just FCPS

https://www.campustimes.org/2019/09/22/marching-band-is-too-a-sport/

Please cite your sources. It is NOT a sport anywhere, and it’s not considered a sport everywhere. Schools handing out varsity letters for this the athletic equivalent of grade inflation.

Just give it up and admit that your little snowflake has no athletic ability whatsoever.

I have no dog in this fight, have never had any sort of even tangential association with marching bad culture, etc.

But I will say that for someone to be so virulently anti-Marching Bad is very, very odd. You seem insistent on denigrating the endeavour, for no apparent reason. You also seem extremely unpleasant and, conjecture but likely 100 percent correct, incredibly unhappy. Be better.

WTH? I am “not anti marching band”, you tool. I was in marching band in high school for four years.

But it’s not a sport. Jesus Christ.

Marching band can be considered a sport because it involves significant physical exertion, requires a high level of skill and coordination, and features competitive elements where teams compete against each other in competitions, with clear judging criteria to determine a winner, even though the focus is on performance rather than directly opposing another team in a traditional sporting manner.

Key points supporting marching band as a sport:

Physical demands:
Carrying heavy instruments for extended periods, marching in precise formations, and performing complex movements all require considerable physical endurance and agility.
Technical skill:
Mastering musical techniques while marching in sync with the group demands a high level of coordination, timing, and musical ability.
Competitive nature:
Marching bands participate in competitions with set rules and scoring systems where judges evaluate their performance against other bands, determining a clear winner.
Training regimen:
Similar to other sports, marching band members undergo rigorous practice schedules to improve their physical fitness and performance skills.

Sounds like a hobby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still feel there is value in educating girls to recognize and avoid men who display the telltale signs of toxic masculinity.

Nevertheless, the onus is clearly on men to change/alter/correct their behaviors. Western culture defines specific characteristics to fit the patriarchal ideal masculine construct. The socialization of masculine ideals starts in boys’ at a young age and defines ideal masculinity as related to toughness, stoicism, heterosexism, self-sufficient attitudes and lack of emotional sensitivity and of connectedness. Boys learn to be men from the men in their lives, from their own experiences navigating our social norms, and from the large social and cultural context. Boys live under intensified pressure to display so-called gender-appropriate behaviors according to an anachronistic ideal male code.

Looking at the development of aggression throughout childhood, we know that not only do aggressive behaviors can emerge at an early age, they also tend to persist over time, without early prevention intervention. The socialization of the male characteristics mentioned above also onsets at an early age making it a prime time-period for prevention intervention.

What specific parenting techniques can we turn employ, to thwart toxic masculinity?

But you think girls / people can tell the difference between being a strong protective male and being a toxic male. There pinkies the problem.

Women will be blamed for not being clairvoyant and knowing because Larlo was an “athlete” or “hunted” or “had 2 divorced parents and watched a lot of football” or did “MMA” of course he 30 years later would smack her in an argument or cheat. “So many red flags” and… it’s bullshit. The red flag/green flag BS is gaslighting young women into believing they can predict future behavior. You can’t.

On the most basic of levels, I think we can all agree: if a man hunts animals or watches MMA, both are huge, obvious, red-flags.

Ridiculous. Ridiculous and stupid. My H not only hunts and watches MMA fighting, but is a former MMA fighter himself, in addition to being a US Army Ranger and combat veteran with three Purple Hearts. Are those red flags, too?


Seriously, women are our own worst enemies.

Ick. He’s probably a maga.

Almost all men are. They don't all admit it though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I assume the “marching band is a sport” people are just being facetious. Although I suppose it tracks with our current climate of “words mean whatever the speaker says they mean”…

No, I meant what I wrote. It is a VARSITY sport.

It is also extremely athletic and requires tremendous discipline.

I am a band parent; I know these things for a fact.

What schools consider it a varsity sport? That’s hilarious! If it is it would be either to 1) fulfill Title IX requirements or 2) to allow unathletic kids and their parents to essentially lie on the college applications and say they played a varsity sport

Wrong.

Marching Band earns a varsity letter in county schools. Everyone knows that.

Plus: it’s a sport everywhere, not just FCPS

https://www.campustimes.org/2019/09/22/marching-band-is-too-a-sport/

Please cite your sources. It is NOT a sport anywhere, and it’s not considered a sport everywhere. Schools handing out varsity letters for this the athletic equivalent of grade inflation.

Just give it up and admit that your little snowflake has no athletic ability whatsoever.

I have no dog in this fight, have never had any sort of even tangential association with marching bad culture, etc.

But I will say that for someone to be so virulently anti-Marching Bad is very, very odd. You seem insistent on denigrating the endeavour, for no apparent reason. You also seem extremely unpleasant and, conjecture but likely 100 percent correct, incredibly unhappy. Be better.

WTH? I am “not anti marching band”, you tool. I was in marching band in high school for four years.

But it’s not a sport. Jesus Christ.

Marching band can be considered a sport because it involves significant physical exertion, requires a high level of skill and coordination, and features competitive elements where teams compete against each other in competitions, with clear judging criteria to determine a winner, even though the focus is on performance rather than directly opposing another team in a traditional sporting manner.

Key points supporting marching band as a sport:

Physical demands:
Carrying heavy instruments for extended periods, marching in precise formations, and performing complex movements all require considerable physical endurance and agility.
Technical skill:
Mastering musical techniques while marching in sync with the group demands a high level of coordination, timing, and musical ability.
Competitive nature:
Marching bands participate in competitions with set rules and scoring systems where judges evaluate their performance against other bands, determining a clear winner.
Training regimen:
Similar to other sports, marching band members undergo rigorous practice schedules to improve their physical fitness and performance skills.

This is hilarious. It’s no more physically taxing than standing in line at the checkout or walking slowly down the street. I assume the tuba and percussionists are superior athletes to the flute and piccolo players? Are the theater kids athletes, too? How about the debate team?

The era of words meaning whatever you want them to mean (because otherwise your feelings might be hurt) is coming to an end, I think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still feel there is value in educating girls to recognize and avoid men who display the telltale signs of toxic masculinity.

Nevertheless, the onus is clearly on men to change/alter/correct their behaviors. Western culture defines specific characteristics to fit the patriarchal ideal masculine construct. The socialization of masculine ideals starts in boys’ at a young age and defines ideal masculinity as related to toughness, stoicism, heterosexism, self-sufficient attitudes and lack of emotional sensitivity and of connectedness. Boys learn to be men from the men in their lives, from their own experiences navigating our social norms, and from the large social and cultural context. Boys live under intensified pressure to display so-called gender-appropriate behaviors according to an anachronistic ideal male code.

Looking at the development of aggression throughout childhood, we know that not only do aggressive behaviors can emerge at an early age, they also tend to persist over time, without early prevention intervention. The socialization of the male characteristics mentioned above also onsets at an early age making it a prime time-period for prevention intervention.

What specific parenting techniques can we turn employ, to thwart toxic masculinity?

But you think girls / people can tell the difference between being a strong protective male and being a toxic male. There pinkies the problem.

Women will be blamed for not being clairvoyant and knowing because Larlo was an “athlete” or “hunted” or “had 2 divorced parents and watched a lot of football” or did “MMA” of course he 30 years later would smack her in an argument or cheat. “So many red flags” and… it’s bullshit. The red flag/green flag BS is gaslighting young women into believing they can predict future behavior. You can’t.

On the most basic of levels, I think we can all agree: if a man hunts animals or watches MMA, both are huge, obvious, red-flags.

Ridiculous. Ridiculous and stupid. My H not only hunts and watches MMA fighting, but is a former MMA fighter himself, in addition to being a US Army Ranger and combat veteran with three Purple Hearts. Are those red flags, too?


Seriously, women are our own worst enemies.

Ick. He’s probably a maga.

Almost all men are. They don't all admit it though.

Not my husband. He cried when trump was announced winner of the election.

My bf is unfortunately very much MAGA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you believe that toxic masculinity is a real thing, what are your thoughts on how to address it? Besides raising boys better what can we do? How do you confront it when it presents itself in your life?

Trump is No. 1 in toxic masculinity and he is revered by white males who also want to grab women by their kitties, rape with their fingers, and suffer no consequences. Look at the billionaire class who treat their wives like $hit. I don't have an answer and I hope my sons will remember what they were taught and behave accordingly.

I feel like, if anything, J.D. Vance is more toxically masculine than trump.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I assume the “marching band is a sport” people are just being facetious. Although I suppose it tracks with our current climate of “words mean whatever the speaker says they mean”…

No, I meant what I wrote. It is a VARSITY sport.

It is also extremely athletic and requires tremendous discipline.

I am a band parent; I know these things for a fact.

What schools consider it a varsity sport? That’s hilarious! If it is it would be either to 1) fulfill Title IX requirements or 2) to allow unathletic kids and their parents to essentially lie on the college applications and say they played a varsity sport

Wrong.

Marching Band earns a varsity letter in county schools. Everyone knows that.

Plus: it’s a sport everywhere, not just FCPS

https://www.campustimes.org/2019/09/22/marching-band-is-too-a-sport/

Please cite your sources. It is NOT a sport anywhere, and it’s not considered a sport everywhere. Schools handing out varsity letters for this the athletic equivalent of grade inflation.

Just give it up and admit that your little snowflake has no athletic ability whatsoever.

I have no dog in this fight, have never had any sort of even tangential association with marching bad culture, etc.

But I will say that for someone to be so virulently anti-Marching Bad is very, very odd. You seem insistent on denigrating the endeavour, for no apparent reason. You also seem extremely unpleasant and, conjecture but likely 100 percent correct, incredibly unhappy. Be better.

WTH? I am “not anti marching band”, you tool. I was in marching band in high school for four years.

But it’s not a sport. Jesus Christ.

Marching band can be considered a sport because it involves significant physical exertion, requires a high level of skill and coordination, and features competitive elements where teams compete against each other in competitions, with clear judging criteria to determine a winner, even though the focus is on performance rather than directly opposing another team in a traditional sporting manner.

Key points supporting marching band as a sport:

Physical demands:
Carrying heavy instruments for extended periods, marching in precise formations, and performing complex movements all require considerable physical endurance and agility.
Technical skill:
Mastering musical techniques while marching in sync with the group demands a high level of coordination, timing, and musical ability.
Competitive nature:
Marching bands participate in competitions with set rules and scoring systems where judges evaluate their performance against other bands, determining a clear winner.
Training regimen:
Similar to other sports, marching band members undergo rigorous practice schedules to improve their physical fitness and performance skills.

Sounds like a hobby.

ITS NOT A HOBBY! It’s a sport ok?!!!!

[Anonymous]

I feel like what people are missing about the whole phenomenon is toxic masculinity is one of the many forms of oppression which are pervasive in the US at the moment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel like what people are missing about the whole phenomenon is toxic masculinity is one of the many forms of oppression which are pervasive in the US at the moment.

Really? I don’t think there is any oppression in the US currently. And certainly none that are pervasive. Toxic masculinity is not a thing. Does not exist. There are bad people and people who do bad things. But that does not make toxic masculinity.