I'm amazed by all the "social engineering" on here

[Anonymous]

I haven't read all 14 pages, so I don't know if this article was posted already...

https://community.today.com/parentingteam/post/being-left-out-hurts-lets-stop-social-engineering-now?cid=sm_npd_td_fb_ma&fbclid=IwAR0x20ImkZch7E7eV1N5aQxDUho1J4Km5PQjU0TXPLCThi83M07b9L7JJRM

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all 14 pages, so I don't know if this article was posted already...

https://community.today.com/parentingteam/post/being-left-out-hurts-lets-stop-social-engineering-now?cid=sm_npd_td_fb_ma&fbclid=IwAR0x20ImkZch7E7eV1N5aQxDUho1J4Km5PQjU0TXPLCThi83M07b9L7JJRM

I think it's great she invited 150 kids to her bbq. But that's not realistic for most. Just like with weddings, sometimes we have to create a guest list with a cut off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all 14 pages, so I don't know if this article was posted already...

https://community.today.com/parentingteam/post/being-left-out-hurts-lets-stop-social-engineering-now?cid=sm_npd_td_fb_ma&fbclid=IwAR0x20ImkZch7E7eV1N5aQxDUho1J4Km5PQjU0TXPLCThi83M07b9L7JJRM

Isn’t that what happened to sandy in Grease? She was fine for a summer girlfriend...

Nary a parent in the movie, that I recall.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

Meh. Sounds like you’re projecting. In a situation like that it’s most often a queen bee trying to dictate what goes on in a group of friends and everyone else being too afraid to make a stink.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

Meh. Sounds like you’re projecting. In a situation like that it’s most often a queen bee trying to dictate what goes on in a group of friends and everyone else being too afraid to make a stink.

And sometimes a parent might assume it's a mean queen bee situation, and not realize their OWN kid is the mean one and that's why the others are drifting away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

Meh. Sounds like you’re projecting. In a situation like that it’s most often a queen bee trying to dictate what goes on in a group of friends and everyone else being too afraid to make a stink.

And sometimes a parent might assume it's a mean queen bee situation, and not realize their OWN kid is the mean one and that's why the others are drifting away.

And sometimes a kid drifts away because she doesn’t want to be part of the queen bees
Sometimes the isolated girl was the one who changed
Sometimes the queen bees change

See - there is no one right answer but requiring the kids to hang out at 15 or 16 is insane, regardless of the reason. At some point you let go and hopefully they all have the tools to do the right thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

Meh. Sounds like you’re projecting. In a situation like that it’s most often a queen bee trying to dictate what goes on in a group of friends and everyone else being too afraid to make a stink.

And sometimes a parent might assume it's a mean queen bee situation, and not realize their OWN kid is the mean one and that's why the others are drifting away.

Or just that the girls aren’t friends anymore. Some moms want their daughters to be friends with the girls of their mom friends and this is not healthy for the girls because it puts a lot of pressure on them because they want to please their parents. By seventh grade parents need to let girls decide their own activities and create their own groups because these groups and friendships change in middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

Meh. Sounds like you’re projecting. In a situation like that it’s most often a queen bee trying to dictate what goes on in a group of friends and everyone else being too afraid to make a stink.

And sometimes a parent might assume it's a mean queen bee situation, and not realize their OWN kid is the mean one and that's why the others are drifting away.

DP - seems like you're talking about a specific situation. If someone is hurt about being excluded (from a relatively small group), it's rarely their own fault. Seems like victim blaming.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see difference when you invite 10 out of 20 kids is OK, but when you invite 18 out of 20, than you're excluding two people on purpose.

Correct. Or if it's always been a group of 8, and then you start only including 6 of the 8.

+2

Maybe. Sometimes the two of 8 begin changing. Could be that the left out kid has been lying, stealing, cheating, being mean, bullying, sneaking around, etc - completely changing.

Meh. Sounds like you’re projecting. In a situation like that it’s most often a queen bee trying to dictate what goes on in a group of friends and everyone else being too afraid to make a stink.

And sometimes a parent might assume it's a mean queen bee situation, and not realize their OWN kid is the mean one and that's why the others are drifting away.

DP - seems like you're talking about a specific situation. If someone is hurt about being excluded (from a relatively small group), it's rarely their own fault. Seems like victim blaming.

Another DP.

+1

[Anonymous]

We need to teach our kids to be resilient.

Sometimes people are mean. It sucks. For whatever reason, people sometimes hurt each other's feelings. Sometimes they do so by accident, sometimes because they don't quite have the skills to navigate tricky social situations, and sometimes on purpose.

It happens with adults, and it happens with kids. All the time.

To me, the best thing we can do is help our kids learn that they can handle these things. They can survive being hurt, disappointed, angry, and even temporary lonely. These are all normal feelings in response to other people and events - social and othewise. Sometimes things go smoothly and in our favor, and we feel comfortable and happy. And sometimes they don't. But we're strong enough handle both without falling apart. And we absolutely don't have to chase people who are unkind or uninterested in us in order to be happy or even ok.

To me, our job as parents is to give our kids a safe and loving home base with the family. A place where they'll be loved and accepted for who they are, imperfections, social disappointments (even social "failures") and all. Not everything is a problem to be solved immediately. They can be loved and accepted right where they are until the tides change.

And on that note, past the age of 9 or 10, I think the ball is in our kids' courts - not ours - when it comes to their social life. Rather than try to work with the other parents to get our kid included, we should instead encourage our kid to find ONE person who is kind, open-minded, inclusive, or just plain not caught up in the social BS of the day. We don't need a crowd to be happy, and neither do teens. They just need someone they can feel safe and comfortable with.

I have a friend who is trying so hard to get her DD included in a group of other girls (my kid is in another grade, so it's not her group of friends.) And though I like my friend a lot, I am seeing first hand how much her efforts are hurting her DD. The other girls find it weird (they make their own plans, they no longer do it through their moms), and it's only reinforcing her DD's belief that it's super important she be accepted by this particular group.

Personally, I think she would be far better off encouraging her daughter to find ONE girl at a time who she genuinely connects with. For a bunch of reasons this isn't happening authentically with this group of girls -- they're all really into sports and have been playing together for years, while my friend's DD hates sports but is now being forced by her mom to "try" them in order to be with the other girls. It's a terrible fit and again seems to be signaling to her daughter that SHE needs to change to fit in with THEM rather than just be herself and find friends who are similar, even if it means not being part of that group.

Finally, I think my friend's motives are nothing but good and pure. She wants to help her daughter feel socially happy and accepted. But to me, she's really undermining both her DD's social life and her confidence -- in her own "likeability" and also in her ability to cope with the inevitable disappointments that come when we don't click with a particular person or group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We need to teach our kids to be resilient.

Sometimes people are mean. It sucks. For whatever reason, people sometimes hurt each other's feelings. Sometimes they do so by accident, sometimes because they don't quite have the skills to navigate tricky social situations, and sometimes on purpose.

It happens with adults, and it happens with kids. All the time.

To me, the best thing we can do is help our kids learn that they can handle these things. They can survive being hurt, disappointed, angry, and even temporary lonely. These are all normal feelings in response to other people and events - social and othewise. Sometimes things go smoothly and in our favor, and we feel comfortable and happy. And sometimes they don't. But we're strong enough handle both without falling apart. And we absolutely don't have to chase people who are unkind or uninterested in us in order to be happy or even ok.

To me, our job as parents is to give our kids a safe and loving home base with the family. A place where they'll be loved and accepted for who they are, imperfections, social disappointments (even social "failures") and all. Not everything is a problem to be solved immediately. They can be loved and accepted right where they are until the tides change.

And on that note, past the age of 9 or 10, I think the ball is in our kids' courts - not ours - when it comes to their social life. Rather than try to work with the other parents to get our kid included, we should instead encourage our kid to find ONE person who is kind, open-minded, inclusive, or just plain not caught up in the social BS of the day. We don't need a crowd to be happy, and neither do teens. They just need someone they can feel safe and comfortable with.

I have a friend who is trying so hard to get her DD included in a group of other girls (my kid is in another grade, so it's not her group of friends.) And though I like my friend a lot, I am seeing first hand how much her efforts are hurting her DD. The other girls find it weird (they make their own plans, they no longer do it through their moms), and it's only reinforcing her DD's belief that it's super important she be accepted by this particular group.

Personally, I think she would be far better off encouraging her daughter to find ONE girl at a time who she genuinely connects with. For a bunch of reasons this isn't happening authentically with this group of girls -- they're all really into sports and have been playing together for years, while my friend's DD hates sports but is now being forced by her mom to "try" them in order to be with the other girls. It's a terrible fit and again seems to be signaling to her daughter that SHE needs to change to fit in with THEM rather than just be herself and find friends who are similar, even if it means not being part of that group.

Finally, I think my friend's motives are nothing but good and pure. She wants to help her daughter feel socially happy and accepted. But to me, she's really undermining both her DD's social life and her confidence -- in her own "likeability" and also in her ability to cope with the inevitable disappointments that come when we don't click with a particular person or group.

X10000

High school parents - do NOT go to the principal (!!!!!) when your child’s friend moves on.

Would you do this with a date? Are you teaching them to stalk people and get arrested?

I have seen this behavior by high school parents - STOP overcompensating and projecting. It’s NOT about you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We need to teach our kids to be resilient.

Sometimes people are mean. It sucks. For whatever reason, people sometimes hurt each other's feelings. Sometimes they do so by accident, sometimes because they don't quite have the skills to navigate tricky social situations, and sometimes on purpose.

It happens with adults, and it happens with kids. All the time.

To me, the best thing we can do is help our kids learn that they can handle these things. They can survive being hurt, disappointed, angry, and even temporary lonely. These are all normal feelings in response to other people and events - social and othewise. Sometimes things go smoothly and in our favor, and we feel comfortable and happy. And sometimes they don't. But we're strong enough handle both without falling apart. And we absolutely don't have to chase people who are unkind or uninterested in us in order to be happy or even ok.

To me, our job as parents is to give our kids a safe and loving home base with the family. A place where they'll be loved and accepted for who they are, imperfections, social disappointments (even social "failures") and all. Not everything is a problem to be solved immediately. They can be loved and accepted right where they are until the tides change.

And on that note, past the age of 9 or 10, I think the ball is in our kids' courts - not ours - when it comes to their social life. Rather than try to work with the other parents to get our kid included, we should instead encourage our kid to find ONE person who is kind, open-minded, inclusive, or just plain not caught up in the social BS of the day. We don't need a crowd to be happy, and neither do teens. They just need someone they can feel safe and comfortable with.

I have a friend who is trying so hard to get her DD included in a group of other girls (my kid is in another grade, so it's not her group of friends.) And though I like my friend a lot, I am seeing first hand how much her efforts are hurting her DD. The other girls find it weird (they make their own plans, they no longer do it through their moms), and it's only reinforcing her DD's belief that it's super important she be accepted by this particular group.

Personally, I think she would be far better off encouraging her daughter to find ONE girl at a time who she genuinely connects with. For a bunch of reasons this isn't happening authentically with this group of girls -- they're all really into sports and have been playing together for years, while my friend's DD hates sports but is now being forced by her mom to "try" them in order to be with the other girls. It's a terrible fit and again seems to be signaling to her daughter that SHE needs to change to fit in with THEM rather than just be herself and find friends who are similar, even if it means not being part of that group.

Finally, I think my friend's motives are nothing but good and pure. She wants to help her daughter feel socially happy and accepted. But to me, she's really undermining both her DD's social life and her confidence -- in her own "likeability" and also in her ability to cope with the inevitable disappointments that come when we don't click with a particular person or group.

X10000

High school parents - do NOT go to the principal (!!!!!) when your child’s friend moves on.

Would you do this with a date? Are you teaching them to stalk people and get arrested?

I have seen this behavior by high school parents - STOP overcompensating and projecting. It’s NOT about you.

There she is again! The poster with the bizarre exclamations and parentheses! What’s your beef? Time to get over it and show compassion and move on. Stop tormenting this poor kid and family.