Parents- nix these behaviors in your kids before they go to college

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:dear college professor,

why did you go into education if you are not willing to do the job of educating people?

you sound like the kind of professor that nobody says take their class, they are awesome.

signed most people

Profs are subject matter experts, not etiquette or communication educators.

What? If all you want to be is a subject matter expert, go get a job in industry.
Professors are EDUCATORS - both in their subject matter and in other skills their students need to succeed, including etiquette and communication.

If you want your child to learn etiquette, and you feel unequipped to teach them, buy them a book by Emily Post. Etiquette was not taught in any course I took 30 years ago, and it is not included in my course now. How ridiculous. What the hell have you been doing as a parent?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:College professor year. I've been a professor for 24 years and every year it's worse! Parents please try to nix these behaviors in your HS kids before they go to college AND teach them a few basic life skills. I promise spending some time on these will ensure your kid has a better experience in college and in life.

Behaviors to nix:
1. Asking a question instead of looking at the syllabus or, frankly, using google. I can't tell you how many times a lazy kid will ask me something in class that is on the syllabus, and/or I've said repeatedly in class, and/or has nothing to do with the class that they could easily figure out on their own. It all comes down to pure LAZINESS.

2. Give your kid consequences for bad behavior like being disrespectful, being late, talking during class, getting up and stomping out of the classroom, anything like that. These kids today are clearly being raised without consequence.

3. Have your kid practice sending you and email, with you being the professor. Make sure they know how to properly address the person. Make sure they know how to type full sentences and make their question clear.

I routinely get emails like this:

Yo, whats on the test and do I need to read the textbook please let me know right away.

Notice that they 1) don't identify what class they are referring to, they don't really have a question I can answer, and they clearly didn't spend much time thinking about or writing the email. I usually just ignore this or send a quick reply to refer to the syllabus.

4) Do NOT, and I mean do NOT, tell them that if they have an issue with a professor that they should call you (the parent) and let you (the parent) contact the professor. I don't care who you are, there's this law called FERPA which means I can't discuss your kid's academic record unless they are present and have given permission to do so. Furthermore, I like to treat your kid as an adult and you probably should too.

I could go on but I won't.

Now for essential life skills:

A. For god's sakes teach them how to do laundry and have basic pride in their personal cleanliness. I can't tell you how many times some kid walks into my office stinking to high heaven and wearing clothes that look like they haven't been washed for weeks. Now I would normally think perhaps they struggle financially but when they whip out their iphone 14 or 15 and talk to with me airpods in, it makes me think they probably can afford to do laundry. They just don't and/or they don't know how.

B. How to set an alarm clock. Every quarter some kid misses an exam because they slept in and then they get mad when I won't let them take a makeup exam.

C. Same thing with how to use a calendar and write down important dates.

D. Finally, tell them to take out their airpods and put their phone down when speaking to someone. It's really disrespectful when a kid comes to my office and won't even lift their head up from their phone.

I'm also a college professor.

It is so easy to just teach some of these skills, instead of berating our students. In some cases, it even takes less time! Email norms, professionalism, time management, and social skills are embedded in my courses. When I began to notice some of the struggles you mention, I devoted some class time each week to explicitly address them. Students share their tips for staying organized, I show them a feature of our LMS, we look at educational research demonstrating ways to study, and we look at examples of school-appropriate emails.We may be teaching math or science or history, but those things are part of their classroom success, and I think it is valuable to include.

I could make a similar list of things that have gotten better in my 20 years of teaching. Students tend to be better self advocates, have a stronger grasp of technology, are more flexible regarding content format, and - most notably - are better classmates. In recent years, my students have been overwhelmingly accommodating and inclusive toward their peers with noticeable learning differences such as ASD. They work well in groups. They share resources. They organize outside of class. They are a joy.

I hope you can shift your focus to helping your students develop in all ways, not just in your subject. Being a parent is tough, being a college student is tough, and being a professor is tough. We could all use some patience and grace.

What course are you teaching?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fine and agreed with most of these things (though your tone is a bit much)

-mom of 2 college students (including one new freshman)

In exchange, please

do not cancel office hours without letting students know
respond to student's emails in a timely manner, even if the answer is no or you don't know
timely grade work so students can learn from mistakes

And maybe give new kids time to settle in - despite doing laundry and being a good high school student, new freshman are learning to live alone and navigate academic and social realities and a little grace wouldn't hurt, especially at the beginning of the year.

Totally agree. College kids need to show up with some of these basic skills but the OP sounds incredibly jaded and maybe a little entitled themselves.

A lot of these sounds like the kinds of things professors complained about when I went to school in the 90s, especially the stuff about not dressing appropriately for class and being bad at communication (a lot of us got our FIRST email account ever while attending college, so it was an extremely new thing and no one knew how to use it).

I am certain I made a lot of boneheaded mistakes in college and yet I became I an upstanding citizen who communicates very well both at work in my private life, is appropriately dressed for all events, is punctual, etc. Some of this is just kids learning through failure and college is the appropriate place to do that because they are no longer living in their parents' homes. You can teach your child so much, but once you are no longer there to reinforce, it's sink or swim.

Been teaching 30+ years.

It's much much much worse now. I put the students in groups day one and ask them to set up group chat so they can ask each other about assignments if they miss class (even though it is on the syllabus). They can also ask me, but I am just one person, and they can get an answer from the group faster. I still get questions like "what's on the test?" and "what is the assignment?" and like OP said, they don't identify what class.

They also e-mail me for IT questions when they have problems with Zoom, Canvas, and Blackboard and I have to explain to them that they need to contact the help desk.

Another thing is coming in 4-6 weeks after class started and expecting that they can just make up for all the classes they never attended and they don't have medical reasons. If it's an online class many will say "I thought it was asynchronous" when it is clearly labelled as synchronous and has a set schedule. The class requires participation and cameras on.

What colleges are these? My DC is a junior in college at a good SLAC and this type of stuff does not happen. Kids are not missing class and nobody is emailing professors such stupid questions.

How do you know? Good students rarely know what they bad students are doing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professors are exhausting.

Sorry you have to teach in addition to your research nobody will ever read.

If they need to learn something, guess what.., you’re a teacher, teach them.

I think professors should have to work in the real world instead of being in their lame academia bubble.

If professors took the time to talk to every student about every breach of common courtesy/common sense, they would have no time left for doing what they're being paid to do.

Maybe there ought to be a remedial one-credit 'how to be a college student' class that college instructors can mandate for students who consistently show that they don't have the skills they need.

Sorry the job is hard, they can always dig ditches, that's so much easier. FFS. Are you kidding me. It's an f'ing email. Did you understand the context, move on. Again professors are so exhausting. We really need to hire teachers for college I am so sick of these full of themselves blow hard "researchers" who never learned how to teach or to live in the real world. We pay them all this money, they do a 1/2 arsed job at teaching and conduct "research" nobody cares about.

Tell me again how the students are the problem.

I teach at a liberal arts college. I do research, but teaching comes first - teaching my SUBJECT. And if my student reviews and numerous awards for teaching and student mentorship/advising are any indication, I am damn good at teaching said subject and forming relationships with students. Yes, a professor's job is to teach and to mentor. But is not, and never has been, a professor's job (or a high school teacher's job, for that matter) to teach your kid how to shower, show up on time, be respectful, or dress for the occasion.

I’m a HS teacher. I try to help the kids wherever I can. They are not fully formed adults. Some kids have crappy parents or even no parents. Have some grace. And unfortunately we are limited in what we are allowed to do in HS due to the current overly progressive climate (no deadlines, multiple retakes, etc)

I do too. But at the end of the day, there is only so much me, and if it comes down to it and I have to pick between student A and Student B for a spot in my lab, and student B has awful personal hygiene, sends me "hey professor srry i missed class did i miss anything important can we meet at 8am tomorrow so i can get the notes lol" emails, and has their mom call me about their final exam grade...yeah, I'm taking student A. Life is too short.

This is exactly it--students are in a competition for opportunities. Some will lose out because of these basics of being conscientious. Seems fair. OP is just warning parents about what could be happening.

[Anonymous]

Some students assume they are on a first-name basis with the prof until otherwise notified. Please tell your kid it’s the opposite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fine and agreed with most of these things (though your tone is a bit much)

-mom of 2 college students (including one new freshman)

In exchange, please

do not cancel office hours without letting students know
respond to student's emails in a timely manner, even if the answer is no or you don't know
timely grade work so students can learn from mistakes

And maybe give new kids time to settle in - despite doing laundry and being a good high school student, new freshman are learning to live alone and navigate academic and social realities and a little grace wouldn't hurt, especially at the beginning of the year.

Totally agree. College kids need to show up with some of these basic skills but the OP sounds incredibly jaded and maybe a little entitled themselves.

A lot of these sounds like the kinds of things professors complained about when I went to school in the 90s, especially the stuff about not dressing appropriately for class and being bad at communication (a lot of us got our FIRST email account ever while attending college, so it was an extremely new thing and no one knew how to use it).

I am certain I made a lot of boneheaded mistakes in college and yet I became I an upstanding citizen who communicates very well both at work in my private life, is appropriately dressed for all events, is punctual, etc. Some of this is just kids learning through failure and college is the appropriate place to do that because they are no longer living in their parents' homes. You can teach your child so much, but once you are no longer there to reinforce, it's sink or swim.

Been teaching 30+ years.

It's much much much worse now. I put the students in groups day one and ask them to set up group chat so they can ask each other about assignments if they miss class (even though it is on the syllabus). They can also ask me, but I am just one person, and they can get an answer from the group faster. I still get questions like "what's on the test?" and "what is the assignment?" and like OP said, they don't identify what class.

They also e-mail me for IT questions when they have problems with Zoom, Canvas, and Blackboard and I have to explain to them that they need to contact the help desk.

Another thing is coming in 4-6 weeks after class started and expecting that they can just make up for all the classes they never attended and they don't have medical reasons. If it's an online class many will say "I thought it was asynchronous" when it is clearly labelled as synchronous and has a set schedule. The class requires participation and cameras on.

What colleges are these? My DC is a junior in college at a good SLAC and this type of stuff does not happen. Kids are not missing class and nobody is emailing professors such stupid questions.

How do you know? Good students rarely know what they bad students are doing.

DP, but at a SLAC classes are small. With only 25-30 kids in a class, it is obvious when a student is not in class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fine and agreed with most of these things (though your tone is a bit much)

-mom of 2 college students (including one new freshman)

In exchange, please

do not cancel office hours without letting students know
respond to student's emails in a timely manner, even if the answer is no or you don't know
timely grade work so students can learn from mistakes

And maybe give new kids time to settle in - despite doing laundry and being a good high school student, new freshman are learning to live alone and navigate academic and social realities and a little grace wouldn't hurt, especially at the beginning of the year.

Totally agree. College kids need to show up with some of these basic skills but the OP sounds incredibly jaded and maybe a little entitled themselves.

A lot of these sounds like the kinds of things professors complained about when I went to school in the 90s, especially the stuff about not dressing appropriately for class and being bad at communication (a lot of us got our FIRST email account ever while attending college, so it was an extremely new thing and no one knew how to use it).

I am certain I made a lot of boneheaded mistakes in college and yet I became I an upstanding citizen who communicates very well both at work in my private life, is appropriately dressed for all events, is punctual, etc. Some of this is just kids learning through failure and college is the appropriate place to do that because they are no longer living in their parents' homes. You can teach your child so much, but once you are no longer there to reinforce, it's sink or swim.

Been teaching 30+ years.

It's much much much worse now. I put the students in groups day one and ask them to set up group chat so they can ask each other about assignments if they miss class (even though it is on the syllabus). They can also ask me, but I am just one person, and they can get an answer from the group faster. I still get questions like "what's on the test?" and "what is the assignment?" and like OP said, they don't identify what class.

They also e-mail me for IT questions when they have problems with Zoom, Canvas, and Blackboard and I have to explain to them that they need to contact the help desk.

Another thing is coming in 4-6 weeks after class started and expecting that they can just make up for all the classes they never attended and they don't have medical reasons. If it's an online class many will say "I thought it was asynchronous" when it is clearly labelled as synchronous and has a set schedule. The class requires participation and cameras on.

What colleges are these? My DC is a junior in college at a good SLAC and this type of stuff does not happen. Kids are not missing class and nobody is emailing professors such stupid questions.

LOL!!! You are cute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fine and agreed with most of these things (though your tone is a bit much)

-mom of 2 college students (including one new freshman)

In exchange, please

do not cancel office hours without letting students know
respond to student's emails in a timely manner, even if the answer is no or you don't know
timely grade work so students can learn from mistakes

And maybe give new kids time to settle in - despite doing laundry and being a good high school student, new freshman are learning to live alone and navigate academic and social realities and a little grace wouldn't hurt, especially at the beginning of the year.

Totally agree. College kids need to show up with some of these basic skills but the OP sounds incredibly jaded and maybe a little entitled themselves.

A lot of these sounds like the kinds of things professors complained about when I went to school in the 90s, especially the stuff about not dressing appropriately for class and being bad at communication (a lot of us got our FIRST email account ever while attending college, so it was an extremely new thing and no one knew how to use it).

I am certain I made a lot of boneheaded mistakes in college and yet I became I an upstanding citizen who communicates very well both at work in my private life, is appropriately dressed for all events, is punctual, etc. Some of this is just kids learning through failure and college is the appropriate place to do that because they are no longer living in their parents' homes. You can teach your child so much, but once you are no longer there to reinforce, it's sink or swim.

Been teaching 30+ years.

It's much much much worse now. I put the students in groups day one and ask them to set up group chat so they can ask each other about assignments if they miss class (even though it is on the syllabus). They can also ask me, but I am just one person, and they can get an answer from the group faster. I still get questions like "what's on the test?" and "what is the assignment?" and like OP said, they don't identify what class.

They also e-mail me for IT questions when they have problems with Zoom, Canvas, and Blackboard and I have to explain to them that they need to contact the help desk.

Another thing is coming in 4-6 weeks after class started and expecting that they can just make up for all the classes they never attended and they don't have medical reasons. If it's an online class many will say "I thought it was asynchronous" when it is clearly labelled as synchronous and has a set schedule. The class requires participation and cameras on.

What colleges are these? My DC is a junior in college at a good SLAC and this type of stuff does not happen. Kids are not missing class and nobody is emailing professors such stupid questions.

Welcome to our planet. I knew the government was hiding evidence of alien life forms!

Yes, it’s hard to believe, but sometimes an earthling kid’s parents pay tens of thousands of our dollars for the kid to learn chemistry & economics, but the kid has what we call a “hangover” & sleeps through his alarm.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fine and agreed with most of these things (though your tone is a bit much)

-mom of 2 college students (including one new freshman)

In exchange, please

do not cancel office hours without letting students know
respond to student's emails in a timely manner, even if the answer is no or you don't know
timely grade work so students can learn from mistakes

And maybe give new kids time to settle in - despite doing laundry and being a good high school student, new freshman are learning to live alone and navigate academic and social realities and a little grace wouldn't hurt, especially at the beginning of the year.

Totally agree. College kids need to show up with some of these basic skills but the OP sounds incredibly jaded and maybe a little entitled themselves.

A lot of these sounds like the kinds of things professors complained about when I went to school in the 90s, especially the stuff about not dressing appropriately for class and being bad at communication (a lot of us got our FIRST email account ever while attending college, so it was an extremely new thing and no one knew how to use it).

I am certain I made a lot of boneheaded mistakes in college and yet I became I an upstanding citizen who communicates very well both at work in my private life, is appropriately dressed for all events, is punctual, etc. Some of this is just kids learning through failure and college is the appropriate place to do that because they are no longer living in their parents' homes. You can teach your child so much, but once you are no longer there to reinforce, it's sink or swim.

Been teaching 30+ years.

It's much much much worse now. I put the students in groups day one and ask them to set up group chat so they can ask each other about assignments if they miss class (even though it is on the syllabus). They can also ask me, but I am just one person, and they can get an answer from the group faster. I still get questions like "what's on the test?" and "what is the assignment?" and like OP said, they don't identify what class.

They also e-mail me for IT questions when they have problems with Zoom, Canvas, and Blackboard and I have to explain to them that they need to contact the help desk.

Another thing is coming in 4-6 weeks after class started and expecting that they can just make up for all the classes they never attended and they don't have medical reasons. If it's an online class many will say "I thought it was asynchronous" when it is clearly labelled as synchronous and has a set schedule. The class requires participation and cameras on.

What colleges are these? My DC is a junior in college at a good SLAC and this type of stuff does not happen. Kids are not missing class and nobody is emailing professors such stupid questions.

How do you know? Good students rarely know what they bad students are doing.

DP, but at a SLAC classes are small. With only 25-30 kids in a class, it is obvious when a student is not in class.

Do all SLAC classes have class participation as a grade? Plenty of "good" students skip class, especially in quantitative classes if perhaps the class is reviewing material they already know...or perhaps they don't need to attend the recitation that week (is that considered a class?), etc.

[Anonymous]

I'm also a professor, and I've been teaching for 20 years. I'm tenured (in the humanities) at an R-1.
I'm guessing that OP had a bad day or a series of incidents with bad students. I totally empathize.
I will say that 98% of my students are good eggs. They are engaged, smart, do the work, etc. Most don't even come to my office hours or stop by to talk to me after class. A small fraction are notably ill-prepared for college, whether it be academically, socially, or psychologically. Those that really require help I do notify admin about through various means--an all reputable universities will have deans, support services, etc., in place for faculty to flag students who are in need of help.
We are most definitely, however, not trained counselors or even teachers. We receive minimal pedagogical training, and we are rewarded with tenure (at research universities) not for teaching, but for publishing. Our pay raises are for publishing and for winning grants, not for teaching.
Parents who expect professors to intercede on behalf of their children who need to shower, do laundry, learn manners (via email or otherwise) do not understand the role of faculty in a college. University is not an extension of high school. We are not "partnering" with parents to raise your children. We are experts in our chosen fields, and we transmit knowledge to young adults.
And while I sympathize with parents who have SN children, we are never to assume that a student of ours has SN and therefore treat your SN with courtesies that we would not provide to other students. If you child does have SN, then you as a parent must communicate with the college's disabilities office. That office will then send a letter to your student to send to professors about any academic accommodations. Academic accommodations, not social ones.

[Anonymous]

Recently at a high end steakhouse. Watched a large table next to me which looked like a group of big 4 consulting team. One young guy really stood out and not in a good way. He was eating his food like a popsicle. Obviously he did not know how to cut his food so he would put the big chunk of meat on his fork and take bites from it. Even the people at his table were glaring at him. He also talked with his knife and pointed it at people when they talked. Really, table manners just seem so basic to teach your children.

[Anonymous]

I'm going to take this with a grain of salt because I went to grad school in my late 40s and have a lot to say about how bad professors can be. My sister who is in the middle of her MBA, at another university, is constantly railing on her profs.

Aside from the wearing headphones and relying on parents, I think OP is FOS. OP could very well be guilty of writing unclear syllabi (maybe the problem is you?!), and likely has slept through an alarm in her life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm also a professor, and I've been teaching for 20 years. I'm tenured (in the humanities) at an R-1.
I'm guessing that OP had a bad day or a series of incidents with bad students. I totally empathize.
I will say that 98% of my students are good eggs. They are engaged, smart, do the work, etc. Most don't even come to my office hours or stop by to talk to me after class. A small fraction are notably ill-prepared for college, whether it be academically, socially, or psychologically. Those that really require help I do notify admin about through various means--an all reputable universities will have deans, support services, etc., in place for faculty to flag students who are in need of help.
We are most definitely, however, not trained counselors or even teachers. We receive minimal pedagogical training, and we are rewarded with tenure (at research universities) not for teaching, but for publishing. Our pay raises are for publishing and for winning grants, not for teaching.
Parents who expect professors to intercede on behalf of their children who need to shower, do laundry, learn manners (via email or otherwise) do not understand the role of faculty in a college. University is not an extension of high school. We are not "partnering" with parents to raise your children. We are experts in our chosen fields, and we transmit knowledge to young adults.
And while I sympathize with parents who have SN children, we are never to assume that a student of ours has SN and therefore treat your SN with courtesies that we would not provide to other students. If you child does have SN, then you as a parent must communicate with the college's disabilities office. That office will then send a letter to your student to send to professors about any academic accommodations. Academic accommodations, not social ones.

For me, it's not at all about the kids who very obviously need extra support, accommodations due to a disability, etc. Clearly there are going to be exceptions. I think the spirit of the OP is more about the kids who just need manners and some humility. Things that parents SHOULD be teaching their kids, but clearly aren't. They don't need a referral for support, deans don't need to be notified - they just need to grow up. And the number of these students is skyrocketing.

- professor of 23 years

[Anonymous]

My kid needs a cost-benefit analysis to do anything. He is well groomed, does his laundry, cleans his room etc. Benefit - There are a bunch of girls in his social group and they hang out in his room. Aside from that, they laugh at the guys who are dirty and have gross rooms. He is paying attention to what the girls are saying.

He attends class, is never late, can self advocate, aces tests and assignments, does his due diligence, does not ask stupid question, is super organized for work. Benefit - 4.0 in CS is my expectation for him to remain in a dorm/apartment in a college that is 45 minutes from home, and also have access to my credit card. He can continue to not use his earnings and invest it, if his academic performance remains good in school.

He dresses and behaves in a professional manner. Benefit - he stands out from other students and gets recommended for prestigious internships or research work, because mentors don't find him irritating or disrespectful. Lesson - Dress to mimic your employer to gain their trust. The employers or people in power are not your peers. They are the peers of your parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"For god's sakes teach them how to do laundry and have basic pride in their personal cleanliness. I can't tell you how many times some kid walks into my office stinking to high heaven and wearing clothes that look like they haven't been washed for weeks. Now I would normally think perhaps they struggle financially but when they whip out their iphone 14 or 15 and talk to with me airpods in, it makes me think they probably can afford to do laundry. They just don't and/or they don't know how."

As a parent of a child who has struggled mightily with depression since they started college, please know that lack of personal hygiene is often sign of a mental health issue. As a parent, I implore you to ask these students if they are okay and, if necessary, help them reach out to mental health services (simply telling them such services are available is of no use to a young person struggling with severe depression).

Just stop. This is your job, Mom. Not a college professor, some of whom have 150 kids in a class.