The helicopter parents won - a look back

[Anonymous]

It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here I’ve been accused of being a “laid back snow plow parent” and “checking out on my kids” the trolling on this site is ponderous.

My post is part lament and part warning. I thought that we were active parents with well adjusted kids that were doing pretty well. Particularly in early elementary school I thought the parents pushing their kids into ever higher math groups and scheming to get their 2nd graders into the most competitive travel team were slightly unhinged. But now looking at the results I think I was wrong.

The facts are these.

1. Up through middle school I had good and happy kids they did well in schools and standardized tests and participated in rec sports every season. We sat with them while they did thier homework, went to thier games met with their teachers and even coached a few of their teams.


2. In high school- They did well academically and took a few APs. But they were not among the most advanced kids. My eldest never made the highschool baseball team and my youngest seeing his brother ‘s struggles switched to lacrosse. Both participated in varsity sports (cross country, track and lacrosse for our youngest)

3. Both were accepted to good but not elite colleges. Whereas many of the kids we started with are going to elite school and/or recruited athletes.

4. I’m not unhappy with their experience or results but In retrospect I think if we had pushed more in elementary school we would’ve gotten better results. I think they would have certainly played highschool baseball if we had taken it more seriously.

As I wrote before - when they were smaller we didn’t want hectic nights and weekends so we didn’t prioritize travel sports. The kids were happy and doing well in school so we thought there was no need to push them into more advanced classes.

I understand that we are very fortunate that our kids are happy healthy and going to good schools but looking back we missed opportunities. Would pushing have substantially changed the outcome- I don’t know. But the cost for that pushing would not have been that much more than we were already doing.

This is nuts. Why do you think if you pushed baseball they'd have made the high school baseball team? Did they actually have enough talent to make the team? Did they have the desire to go to baseball practices regularly? If not, I doubt they would have made the team no matter how hard you pushed.

How many people leave all the decisions to their kids? Don't want the vaccines? Eat vegetables? Go to bed on time? Kids don't really know what's best and by the time they wake up they will be too far behind to catch up. Even the greats will say there were times they wanted to quit, not practice, sleep in, but the ones who persevere credit their parents for their sacrifices and believing in them.

There will always be times that even the "greats" will not want to practice, etc. But if you really listen to the greats, they will say the number of those times is far less than most people, because in the end, they were driven to do what they want to do. This is the key.

As for things like vegetables -- you should be treating them similarly. The fastest way to get a person to hate a vegetable is to force them to eat it. Most parents know this and will keep offering the kid a variety of vegetables, and letting the kid try one or another, but not forcing them to finish the entire serving.

It's weird that the lax parent are so defensive here. You do you, but after you read the OP you can't say you weren't warned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I made my kid take piano lessons starting at age six. She has some natural ability/talent, but has never had a lot of interest, and as the years went by pushback grew (I bribed her with tv time in exchange for practice time ). I told her she had to keep taking lessons until she started high school/9th grade. My thinking was I wanted her to have the tools/foundation so that if she wanted to play in a band or whatever in high school, she could (my brother was in a band in high school and had an absolute blast - I was so envious!). She is in 9th grade now, and took the fall semester off from the piano - but recently (in January) requested to/restarted lessons - she decided she wants to play in one of the school bands next year - my long game paid off - wowee! Same with travel soccer - her interest has waxed and waned - but we made her stick with it (reassessing every year) - she made the high school varsity team in 9th grade and played a ton and had an absolute blast. I guess I offer these examples in support of OP's post/topic, though I also agree with what some of the PPs have said - the kid has to have some talent/internal motivation to go along with the parental support/push (as a parent you can't make it happen if the kid doesn't have at least a modicum of interest and ability).

Why not let her try different instruments and let her pick.

Maybe she didn't want to try a different instrument? I have a kid who is talented at piano but hates to practice. It's not that she doesn't like playing, just that she would rather be a kid and goof around. I have been pushing her to continue and to practice 20-30 minutes a day. Kids who are phenoms, practice for hours. She practices just enough to improve each week and keep up with her lessons. If she really hated it I'd let her stop, but that's not the case. She does enjoy piano, especially when playing with others. It's just a lot to expect a kid to have the discipline to remember and make time to practice nightly all on their own.

It's no different than me and working out. I like the outcomes and feel better when I do it, but sometimes it's hard to get off the couch.

This is what parenting is: recognizing when a kid actually likes to practice but is just goofing around vs when a kid hates piano and forcing practice would be detrimental. The former isn't pushing; it's just teaching a kid how to manage their time and emotions so that they can do what they actually want to do. The latter is detrimental pushing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I made my kid take piano lessons starting at age six. She has some natural ability/talent, but has never had a lot of interest, and as the years went by pushback grew (I bribed her with tv time in exchange for practice time ). I told her she had to keep taking lessons until she started high school/9th grade. My thinking was I wanted her to have the tools/foundation so that if she wanted to play in a band or whatever in high school, she could (my brother was in a band in high school and had an absolute blast - I was so envious!). She is in 9th grade now, and took the fall semester off from the piano - but recently (in January) requested to/restarted lessons - she decided she wants to play in one of the school bands next year - my long game paid off - wowee! Same with travel soccer - her interest has waxed and waned - but we made her stick with it (reassessing every year) - she made the high school varsity team in 9th grade and played a ton and had an absolute blast. I guess I offer these examples in support of OP's post/topic, though I also agree with what some of the PPs have said - the kid has to have some talent/internal motivation to go along with the parental support/push (as a parent you can't make it happen if the kid doesn't have at least a modicum of interest and ability).

Why not let her try different instruments and let her pick.

Maybe she didn't want to try a different instrument? I have a kid who is talented at piano but hates to practice. It's not that she doesn't like playing, just that she would rather be a kid and goof around. I have been pushing her to continue and to practice 20-30 minutes a day. Kids who are phenoms, practice for hours. She practices just enough to improve each week and keep up with her lessons. If she really hated it I'd let her stop, but that's not the case. She does enjoy piano, especially when playing with others. It's just a lot to expect a kid to have the discipline to remember and make time to practice nightly all on their own.

It's no different than me and working out. I like the outcomes and feel better when I do it, but sometimes it's hard to get off the couch.

Seymour Bernstein (famous piano teacher) specifically addresses parents. He says so many seek him out for lessons and clearly he can take his pick. But he says to the parents that there will be times and probably many times that the kid will not want to practice. Of course. They are tired. They want to play video games. Or they just don’t feel like it. But he tells the parents that they need to remind and enforce the practice time, particularly at the younger ages. Even kids with crazy talent need to be pushed sometimes.

[Anonymous]

New poster.
I was ready to give the tiger parenting it all, but my kid never really cared for anything much (we tried a lot of stuff), and I gave up.
Covid killed one thing he kind of cared about and that was that (he didn’t want to do it in other environments).
So I am free range, sort of, but not by choice. I would have loved to develop my kid as much as he wanted to but he doesn’t want much.
He will be a mediocre student and probably worker and person and I am slowly coming to terms with it. Every time he actually wants to do something beyond just barely making it I am elated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

Full stop you are contradicting yourself we know about you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

What if a kid is mediocre and not driven?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

My husband loves tennis. He never had formal tennis lessons. He did make his high school tennis team. He would never make the team around here but back in the early nineties, being athletic and able to hit a tennis ball was enough.

My kids have played tennis since preschool. They played daily during Covid. We have the resources to provide them with the right coaching. A kid who is playing for fun has no chance against my kid who has played almost every day since being able to hold a racquet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

My husband loves tennis. He never had formal tennis lessons. He did make his high school tennis team. He would never make the team around here but back in the early nineties, being athletic and able to hit a tennis ball was enough.

My kids have played tennis since preschool. They played daily during Covid. We have the resources to provide them with the right coaching. A kid who is playing for fun has no chance against my kid who has played almost every day since being able to hold a racquet.

And who really cares? The commodification of sports/intense focus on success in sports as the end is doing more harm than good for your kids. They're burning out, getting injured, suffering mental health, and parents are overspending chasing the delusion that they can mold their kid into a athlete when the ultimate goal should be enjoying the process of sports. Your unathletic but well coached tennis player is not going to play in the U.S. Open and it's weird and unhinged to compare him to a casual for parental bragging rights

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

What if a kid is mediocre and not driven?

If they are mediocre and enjoy it, thats what is important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:New poster.
I was ready to give the tiger parenting it all, but my kid never really cared for anything much (we tried a lot of stuff), and I gave up.
Covid killed one thing he kind of cared about and that was that (he didn’t want to do it in other environments).
So I am free range, sort of, but not by choice. I would have loved to develop my kid as much as he wanted to but he doesn’t want much.
He will be a mediocre student and probably worker and person and I am slowly coming to terms with it. Every time he actually wants to do something beyond just barely making it I am elated.

That's pretty sad you feel that way about your child and aren't willing to do anything to help them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here I’ve been accused of being a “laid back snow plow parent” and “checking out on my kids” the trolling on this site is ponderous.

My post is part lament and part warning. I thought that we were active parents with well adjusted kids that were doing pretty well. Particularly in early elementary school I thought the parents pushing their kids into ever higher math groups and scheming to get their 2nd graders into the most competitive travel team were slightly unhinged. But now looking at the results I think I was wrong.

The facts are these.

1. Up through middle school I had good and happy kids they did well in schools and standardized tests and participated in rec sports every season. We sat with them while they did thier homework, went to thier games met with their teachers and even coached a few of their teams.


2. In high school- They did well academically and took a few APs. But they were not among the most advanced kids. My eldest never made the highschool baseball team and my youngest seeing his brother ‘s struggles switched to lacrosse. Both participated in varsity sports (cross country, track and lacrosse for our youngest)

3. Both were accepted to good but not elite colleges. Whereas many of the kids we started with are going to elite school and/or recruited athletes.

4. I’m not unhappy with their experience or results but In retrospect I think if we had pushed more in elementary school we would’ve gotten better results. I think they would have certainly played highschool baseball if we had taken it more seriously.

As I wrote before - when they were smaller we didn’t want hectic nights and weekends so we didn’t prioritize travel sports. The kids were happy and doing well in school so we thought there was no need to push them into more advanced classes.

I understand that we are very fortunate that our kids are happy healthy and going to good schools but looking back we missed opportunities. Would pushing have substantially changed the outcome- I don’t know. But the cost for that pushing would not have been that much more than we were already doing.

This is nuts. Why do you think if you pushed baseball they'd have made the high school baseball team? Did they actually have enough talent to make the team? Did they have the desire to go to baseball practices regularly? If not, I doubt they would have made the team no matter how hard you pushed.

How many people leave all the decisions to their kids? Don't want the vaccines? Eat vegetables? Go to bed on time? Kids don't really know what's best and by the time they wake up they will be too far behind to catch up. Even the greats will say there were times they wanted to quit, not practice, sleep in, but the ones who persevere credit their parents for their sacrifices and believing in them.

We're not talking about a need though. Kids don't need to participate in sports or extracurriculars. This is supposed to be a fun and enjoyable experience. It's up to them whether they participate or not

That's one parenting philosophy. There are others. But the world needs ditch diggers, so you're welcome to parent in the way that works for you.

Pp must have young kids. Your kid won’t make the team in high school if you are just playing for fun.

Exactly. I think it's the same PP saying their kids don't know anything other than rec. Clearly they must be about 6 years old.

I have a first grader as well as a kid in middle school and a kid in high school. Until age 10, kids can play for fun and all is good. By middle school, the better kids are all on travel, AAU, etc. kids specialize since sports require practice 3-5x per week. My kids will have team practice, skills clinic and matches, games and tournaments.

High level practices are 7-10 or more days a week (twice in a day) for the high level sports we are in. Mine does it a few times a week for fun and exercise. Kids don't need to be at a high level to enjoy it and get something out of it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

My husband loves tennis. He never had formal tennis lessons. He did make his high school tennis team. He would never make the team around here but back in the early nineties, being athletic and able to hit a tennis ball was enough.

My kids have played tennis since preschool. They played daily during Covid. We have the resources to provide them with the right coaching. A kid who is playing for fun has no chance against my kid who has played almost every day since being able to hold a racquet.

And who really cares? The commodification of sports/intense focus on success in sports as the end is doing more harm than good for your kids. They're burning out, getting injured, suffering mental health, and parents are overspending chasing the delusion that they can mold their kid into a athlete when the ultimate goal should be enjoying the process of sports. Your unathletic but well coached tennis player is not going to play in the U.S. Open and it's weird and unhinged to compare him to a casual for parental bragging rights

DP but what about PPs kid suggested they were "unathletic" seems like you're just looking to be a jerk. Do you have any data to support that student athletes are in worse shape mentally and physically compared to the non-student athletes? I haven't heard of a kid on the tennis team shooting up a school recently, have you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

My husband loves tennis. He never had formal tennis lessons. He did make his high school tennis team. He would never make the team around here but back in the early nineties, being athletic and able to hit a tennis ball was enough.

My kids have played tennis since preschool. They played daily during Covid. We have the resources to provide them with the right coaching. A kid who is playing for fun has no chance against my kid who has played almost every day since being able to hold a racquet.

And who really cares? The commodification of sports/intense focus on success in sports as the end is doing more harm than good for your kids. They're burning out, getting injured, suffering mental health, and parents are overspending chasing the delusion that they can mold their kid into an athlete when the ultimate goal should be enjoying the process of sports. Your unathletic but well coached tennis player is not going to play in the U.S. Open and it's weird and unhinged to compare him to a casual for parental bragging rights

Truth right here

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is all about inner drive. Full stop.
Beyond that, if you do happen to have a genuinely driven kid it is a parents' core responsibility to support them in time, money and encouragement to fulfill their potential.

Rationalize as many do, but any parent who does not do so has seriously done a disservice to their child.

My husband loves tennis. He never had formal tennis lessons. He did make his high school tennis team. He would never make the team around here but back in the early nineties, being athletic and able to hit a tennis ball was enough.

My kids have played tennis since preschool. They played daily during Covid. We have the resources to provide them with the right coaching. A kid who is playing for fun has no chance against my kid who has played almost every day since being able to hold a racquet.

And who really cares? The commodification of sports/intense focus on success in sports as the end is doing more harm than good for your kids. They're burning out, getting injured, suffering mental health, and parents are overspending chasing the delusion that they can mold their kid into an athlete when the ultimate goal should be enjoying the process of sports. Your unathletic but well coached tennis player is not going to play in the U.S. Open and it's weird and unhinged to compare him to a casual for parental bragging rights

Truth right here

Actually sports are good for mental and physical health. Where are you getting this non-sense or is it to justify your unwillingness to parent?