Federal judge rules that admissions changes at nation’s top public school discriminate against Asian

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who is the Asian that was discriminated against?

The only named plaintiff parent in the Coalition for TJ who was actually Asian was the mother of two TJ students at the time that the case was taken up. One of those two students had been admitted by the old process, and the other had been admitted by the new process. She was nominally listed in the case on behalf of her third child, who has since ALSO been admitted by the new process.

The other named plaintiff is very publicly a current candidate for the School Board. Go figure.

Makes you think.

That’s pathetic. Those parents and the Pacific Legal Foundation ought to be ashamed of themselves.

They are fighting racism. Jane Doe of Roe v. Wade didn’t drop her case after her baby was born.

They're fighting to institutionalize racism. If one policy is inclusive and the other is exclusive, and you're fighting for the one that is exclusive, you're the racist.

It is not exclusive.

It is manifestly exclusive. Less than 1% of incoming TJ classes for decades have come from economically disadvantaged families and there had not been enough Black students at TJ under the prior admissions process to fill a single graduating class after 33 years.

That is the definition of exclusive, if not de jure, then certainly de facto. And what the PLF is currently trying to convince the federal courts of is that the new admissions process engages in de facto discrimination against Asian students, when the evidence for such is FAR less clear than the obvious evidence of de facto segregation/discrimination under the previous process.

SO. MUCH. THIS.

If the operative term here is going to be “disparate impact”, there is approximately a thousand times more evidence to convict the prior admissions process of DI against poor kids and Black/Hispanic kids than there is with which to accuse the current admissions process of DI against Asians.

If you can’t do the math on that one, your claims of Asian supremacy are even more unfounded than I previously thought.

No one is claiming Asian supremacy. Only you people cry about "your kind" lives matter.
Don't always blame the system when you can not compete. You don't need a lot of money to get high score on exams like PSAT. Just grab a couple barron's PSAT books and study them.

More than anything, standardized exams measure test taking ability.

Test taking ability is not a translatable skill in any field beyond academic admissions processes.

So why in the world do we continue to emphasize them as some kind of measuring stick of ability when their utility can be so easily compromised through buying expensive prep materials?

Although it is not perfect, standardized exam is the most reliable and objective measurement tool that we have.
What is "test taking ability"? You need to master the subject materials well in order to get a good score.
"expensive prep materials"? Really, $15 a piece. I guess, driving a fancy car has more priority.

In short, stop playing victimhood on everything.

If $15 prep books were adequate to prepare kids for the old TJ admissions exams, you wouldn’t have had parents spending thousands of dollars on what Curie was offering.

In short, stop intentionally burying your head in the sand and engage with reality.

What is Curie? Marie Curie, the twice Nobel prize winner?

Curie is the TJ student factory that wealthy Indian families use to ensure their offspring have the best chance at admission

Fixed it for you. Curie is virtually 100% Indian, but not all of the families availing themselves of their services are wealthy.

What's the point here? Beyond Hoops basketball academy is all Black. Wolfe Ice Hockey is all White. If Indians choose to spend their bottom dollars at Curie, it's their choice.

It appears that you may have had prior experiences or concerns related to Curie and the Indian community, leading you to harbor grudge towards Asian Indians. Consider seeking advice from a mental health professional. Racism can be cured, at the least addressing the root cause of your hate can help promote understanding and overcome any biases and prejudices. Get help.

++++++10000000

I agree. As a parent, I feel obliged to ensure my children get a solid education which just doesn't happen in public these days with the emphasis on equity. Teachers are solely focused on the many students who are struggling and below grade level. They feel gifted students will be fine and basically ignore them. That being said I also don't feel that people should be able to buy access to these programs because after all this is a public school system that should serve everyone.

In order to stop this damaging progressive ideology, we need to act together and vote off all these crazy liberals in the upcoming election.

That seems like a nonsequitur. The regressive bible thumpers are behind even more harmful policies so that would only make things worse.

How so? The conservative Supreme Court Judges did pretty well recently.

That's the only hope. Affirmative action was designed to support all minorities, but some sneaky folks at select universities decided to play the exclusion game with Asian Americans. The three-eyed raven, in all its wisdom, warned everyone not to mess with Asian Americans and their education. Did anyone listen? Nope! The Supreme Court finally had enough, got fed up that no one paid attention to the three-eyed raven, and decided to put Affirmative Action on the chopping block. Talk about messing with a mystical messenger! FAFO!

No one would have minded if affirmative action was used in moderation and removed barriers to individual hardwork in particular, but it was being used as handouts to simply based on skin color. Even then, many tolerated this misuse. But what proved to be the tipping point was when it was employed to hinder the efforts of one minority race in favor of another, relatively bigger electorate, all for political gain. The Supreme Court had to step in with the sharpest cleaver, and affirmative action underwent quite the mincing process.

Here's the thing about the new admissions process that the whiners can't wrap their heads around.

There have always been at least a few poor kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Black kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Hispanic kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids with IEPs at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids from Prince William at TJ.
There have always been at least a few English Language Learners at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids who were in Alg1 in 8th grade at TJ.

And now there are a few more of all of these. But they always used to exist in the old process that you refer to as "merit-based", as though that's somehow in opposition to the new system.

And what that means is that you have no idea which of the kids who are at TJ now wouldn't have gotten in under the old process. But you blast them all as "equity kids" as if you do know.

You are so brainwashed that nothing plain and logical ever sinks in anymore.

Repeat this line:

Merit based asian, black, hispanic, white, and all other races are not being admitted into TJ because there is no stem evaluation test to determine their merit. Instead they are being admitted on equity basis using a ridiculous essay.

Repeat above line.

Nope. Merit presents itself in many ways. A single exam taken on a single day is a snapshot and in most cases demonstrates knowledge, not ability, or passion, or grit, or determination, or anything at all, really.

But we should absolutely get teacher recommendations back into the process.

Agree. While we should also get the coloring and drawing sheets from preschool, arts and crafts from elementary schools, and Halloween costumes from middle school into the process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The kids who got in recently seem much more interested in learning compared to those who were getting in because of prep. Overall they seem like a stronger group.

You have no shame do you. You peddle a disgusting lie that kids stole the test, then changed it to Quant-Q workbooks were difficult to get to, and then Curie was selling Quant-q for $20,000. Now back to prepping. Pathetic liar!

Liars weave webs of deceit that require more lies to sustain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who is the Asian that was discriminated against?

The only named plaintiff parent in the Coalition for TJ who was actually Asian was the mother of two TJ students at the time that the case was taken up. One of those two students had been admitted by the old process, and the other had been admitted by the new process. She was nominally listed in the case on behalf of her third child, who has since ALSO been admitted by the new process.

The other named plaintiff is very publicly a current candidate for the School Board. Go figure.

Makes you think.

That’s pathetic. Those parents and the Pacific Legal Foundation ought to be ashamed of themselves.

They are fighting racism. Jane Doe of Roe v. Wade didn’t drop her case after her baby was born.

They're fighting to institutionalize racism. If one policy is inclusive and the other is exclusive, and you're fighting for the one that is exclusive, you're the racist.

It is not exclusive.

It is manifestly exclusive. Less than 1% of incoming TJ classes for decades have come from economically disadvantaged families and there had not been enough Black students at TJ under the prior admissions process to fill a single graduating class after 33 years.

That is the definition of exclusive, if not de jure, then certainly de facto. And what the PLF is currently trying to convince the federal courts of is that the new admissions process engages in de facto discrimination against Asian students, when the evidence for such is FAR less clear than the obvious evidence of de facto segregation/discrimination under the previous process.

SO. MUCH. THIS.

If the operative term here is going to be “disparate impact”, there is approximately a thousand times more evidence to convict the prior admissions process of DI against poor kids and Black/Hispanic kids than there is with which to accuse the current admissions process of DI against Asians.

If you can’t do the math on that one, your claims of Asian supremacy are even more unfounded than I previously thought.

No one is claiming Asian supremacy. Only you people cry about "your kind" lives matter.
Don't always blame the system when you can not compete. You don't need a lot of money to get high score on exams like PSAT. Just grab a couple barron's PSAT books and study them.

More than anything, standardized exams measure test taking ability.

Test taking ability is not a translatable skill in any field beyond academic admissions processes.

So why in the world do we continue to emphasize them as some kind of measuring stick of ability when their utility can be so easily compromised through buying expensive prep materials?

Although it is not perfect, standardized exam is the most reliable and objective measurement tool that we have.
What is "test taking ability"? You need to master the subject materials well in order to get a good score.
"expensive prep materials"? Really, $15 a piece. I guess, driving a fancy car has more priority.

In short, stop playing victimhood on everything.

If $15 prep books were adequate to prepare kids for the old TJ admissions exams, you wouldn’t have had parents spending thousands of dollars on what Curie was offering.

In short, stop intentionally burying your head in the sand and engage with reality.

What is Curie? Marie Curie, the twice Nobel prize winner?

Curie is the TJ student factory that wealthy Indian families use to ensure their offspring have the best chance at admission

Fixed it for you. Curie is virtually 100% Indian, but not all of the families availing themselves of their services are wealthy.

What's the point here? Beyond Hoops basketball academy is all Black. Wolfe Ice Hockey is all White. If Indians choose to spend their bottom dollars at Curie, it's their choice.

It appears that you may have had prior experiences or concerns related to Curie and the Indian community, leading you to harbor grudge towards Asian Indians. Consider seeking advice from a mental health professional. Racism can be cured, at the least addressing the root cause of your hate can help promote understanding and overcome any biases and prejudices. Get help.

++++++10000000

I agree. As a parent, I feel obliged to ensure my children get a solid education which just doesn't happen in public these days with the emphasis on equity. Teachers are solely focused on the many students who are struggling and below grade level. They feel gifted students will be fine and basically ignore them. That being said I also don't feel that people should be able to buy access to these programs because after all this is a public school system that should serve everyone.

In order to stop this damaging progressive ideology, we need to act together and vote off all these crazy liberals in the upcoming election.

That seems like a nonsequitur. The regressive bible thumpers are behind even more harmful policies so that would only make things worse.

How so? The conservative Supreme Court Judges did pretty well recently.

That's the only hope. Affirmative action was designed to support all minorities, but some sneaky folks at select universities decided to play the exclusion game with Asian Americans. The three-eyed raven, in all its wisdom, warned everyone not to mess with Asian Americans and their education. Did anyone listen? Nope! The Supreme Court finally had enough, got fed up that no one paid attention to the three-eyed raven, and decided to put Affirmative Action on the chopping block. Talk about messing with a mystical messenger! FAFO!

No one would have minded if affirmative action was used in moderation and removed barriers to individual hardwork in particular, but it was being used as handouts to simply based on skin color. Even then, many tolerated this misuse. But what proved to be the tipping point was when it was employed to hinder the efforts of one minority race in favor of another, relatively bigger electorate, all for political gain. The Supreme Court had to step in with the sharpest cleaver, and affirmative action underwent quite the mincing process.

Here's the thing about the new admissions process that the whiners can't wrap their heads around.

There have always been at least a few poor kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Black kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Hispanic kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids with IEPs at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids from Prince William at TJ.
There have always been at least a few English Language Learners at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids who were in Alg1 in 8th grade at TJ.

And now there are a few more of all of these. But they always used to exist in the old process that you refer to as "merit-based", as though that's somehow in opposition to the new system.

And what that means is that you have no idea which of the kids who are at TJ now wouldn't have gotten in under the old process. But you blast them all as "equity kids" as if you do know.

You are so brainwashed that nothing plain and logical ever sinks in anymore.

Repeat this line:

Merit based asian, black, hispanic, white, and all other races are not being admitted into TJ because there is no stem evaluation test to determine their merit. Instead they are being admitted on equity basis using a ridiculous essay.

Repeat above line.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The kids who got in recently seem much more interested in learning compared to those who were getting in because of prep. Overall they seem like a stronger group.

You have no shame do you. You peddle a disgusting lie that kids stole the test, then changed it to Quant-Q workbooks were difficult to get to, and then Curie was selling Quant-q for $20,000. Now back to prepping. Pathetic liar!

Liars weave webs of deceit that require more lies to sustain.

Agree, they're making this into something else, but everyone knows that places like Curie had test banks and gave their customers access. That isn't even up for debate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who is the Asian that was discriminated against?

The only named plaintiff parent in the Coalition for TJ who was actually Asian was the mother of two TJ students at the time that the case was taken up. One of those two students had been admitted by the old process, and the other had been admitted by the new process. She was nominally listed in the case on behalf of her third child, who has since ALSO been admitted by the new process.

The other named plaintiff is very publicly a current candidate for the School Board. Go figure.

Makes you think.

That’s pathetic. Those parents and the Pacific Legal Foundation ought to be ashamed of themselves.

They are fighting racism. Jane Doe of Roe v. Wade didn’t drop her case after her baby was born.

They're fighting to institutionalize racism. If one policy is inclusive and the other is exclusive, and you're fighting for the one that is exclusive, you're the racist.

It is not exclusive.

It is manifestly exclusive. Less than 1% of incoming TJ classes for decades have come from economically disadvantaged families and there had not been enough Black students at TJ under the prior admissions process to fill a single graduating class after 33 years.

That is the definition of exclusive, if not de jure, then certainly de facto. And what the PLF is currently trying to convince the federal courts of is that the new admissions process engages in de facto discrimination against Asian students, when the evidence for such is FAR less clear than the obvious evidence of de facto segregation/discrimination under the previous process.

SO. MUCH. THIS.

If the operative term here is going to be “disparate impact”, there is approximately a thousand times more evidence to convict the prior admissions process of DI against poor kids and Black/Hispanic kids than there is with which to accuse the current admissions process of DI against Asians.

If you can’t do the math on that one, your claims of Asian supremacy are even more unfounded than I previously thought.

No one is claiming Asian supremacy. Only you people cry about "your kind" lives matter.
Don't always blame the system when you can not compete. You don't need a lot of money to get high score on exams like PSAT. Just grab a couple barron's PSAT books and study them.

More than anything, standardized exams measure test taking ability.

Test taking ability is not a translatable skill in any field beyond academic admissions processes.

So why in the world do we continue to emphasize them as some kind of measuring stick of ability when their utility can be so easily compromised through buying expensive prep materials?

Although it is not perfect, standardized exam is the most reliable and objective measurement tool that we have.
What is "test taking ability"? You need to master the subject materials well in order to get a good score.
"expensive prep materials"? Really, $15 a piece. I guess, driving a fancy car has more priority.

In short, stop playing victimhood on everything.

If $15 prep books were adequate to prepare kids for the old TJ admissions exams, you wouldn’t have had parents spending thousands of dollars on what Curie was offering.

In short, stop intentionally burying your head in the sand and engage with reality.

What is Curie? Marie Curie, the twice Nobel prize winner?

Curie is the TJ student factory that wealthy Indian families use to ensure their offspring have the best chance at admission

Fixed it for you. Curie is virtually 100% Indian, but not all of the families availing themselves of their services are wealthy.

What's the point here? Beyond Hoops basketball academy is all Black. Wolfe Ice Hockey is all White. If Indians choose to spend their bottom dollars at Curie, it's their choice.

It appears that you may have had prior experiences or concerns related to Curie and the Indian community, leading you to harbor grudge towards Asian Indians. Consider seeking advice from a mental health professional. Racism can be cured, at the least addressing the root cause of your hate can help promote understanding and overcome any biases and prejudices. Get help.

++++++10000000

I agree. As a parent, I feel obliged to ensure my children get a solid education which just doesn't happen in public these days with the emphasis on equity. Teachers are solely focused on the many students who are struggling and below grade level. They feel gifted students will be fine and basically ignore them. That being said I also don't feel that people should be able to buy access to these programs because after all this is a public school system that should serve everyone.

In order to stop this damaging progressive ideology, we need to act together and vote off all these crazy liberals in the upcoming election.

That seems like a nonsequitur. The regressive bible thumpers are behind even more harmful policies so that would only make things worse.

How so? The conservative Supreme Court Judges did pretty well recently.

That's the only hope. Affirmative action was designed to support all minorities, but some sneaky folks at select universities decided to play the exclusion game with Asian Americans. The three-eyed raven, in all its wisdom, warned everyone not to mess with Asian Americans and their education. Did anyone listen? Nope! The Supreme Court finally had enough, got fed up that no one paid attention to the three-eyed raven, and decided to put Affirmative Action on the chopping block. Talk about messing with a mystical messenger! FAFO!

No one would have minded if affirmative action was used in moderation and removed barriers to individual hardwork in particular, but it was being used as handouts to simply based on skin color. Even then, many tolerated this misuse. But what proved to be the tipping point was when it was employed to hinder the efforts of one minority race in favor of another, relatively bigger electorate, all for political gain. The Supreme Court had to step in with the sharpest cleaver, and affirmative action underwent quite the mincing process.

Here's the thing about the new admissions process that the whiners can't wrap their heads around.

There have always been at least a few poor kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Black kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Hispanic kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids with IEPs at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids from Prince William at TJ.
There have always been at least a few English Language Learners at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids who were in Alg1 in 8th grade at TJ.

And now there are a few more of all of these. But they always used to exist in the old process that you refer to as "merit-based", as though that's somehow in opposition to the new system.

And what that means is that you have no idea which of the kids who are at TJ now wouldn't have gotten in under the old process. But you blast them all as "equity kids" as if you do know.

You are so brainwashed that nothing plain and logical ever sinks in anymore.

Repeat this line:

Merit based asian, black, hispanic, white, and all other races are not being admitted into TJ because there is no stem evaluation test to determine their merit. Instead they are being admitted on equity basis using a ridiculous essay.

Repeat above line.

Nope. Merit presents itself in many ways. A single exam taken on a single day is a snapshot and in most cases demonstrates knowledge, not ability, or passion, or grit, or determination, or anything at all, really.

But we should absolutely get teacher recommendations back into the process.

Agree teacher recs would be helpful. The problem is they have also been shown to be biased. If only there were a way to use them while reducing the bias?

[Anonymous]

https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/petitions-were-watching/


Lots of cases listed, no TJ. Is there any source that thinks the court will actually grant cert?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/petitions-were-watching/


Lots of cases listed, no TJ. Is there any source that thinks the court will actually grant cert?

We already know 3 conservative Justices voted to grant stay already with the earlier TRO matter so only 1 more out of 3 remaining conservative justices is all that is necessary. Likely to be grated cert.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The kids who got in recently seem much more interested in learning compared to those who were getting in because of prep. Overall they seem like a stronger group.

You have no shame do you. You peddle a disgusting lie that kids stole the test, then changed it to Quant-Q workbooks were difficult to get to, and then Curie was selling Quant-q for $20,000. Now back to prepping. Pathetic liar!

Liars weave webs of deceit that require more lies to sustain.

Agree, they're making this into something else, but everyone knows that places like Curie had test banks and gave their customers access. That isn't even up for debate.

You lying piece of gunk. Curie like kumon, AoPs, Princeton Review, etc has study material with tests included. You lying scumbag!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The kids who got in recently seem much more interested in learning compared to those who were getting in because of prep. Overall they seem like a stronger group.

You have no shame do you. You peddle a disgusting lie that kids stole the test, then changed it to Quant-Q workbooks were difficult to get to, and then Curie was selling Quant-q for $20,000. Now back to prepping. Pathetic liar!

Liars weave webs of deceit that require more lies to sustain.

Agree, they're making this into something else, but everyone knows that places like Curie had test banks and gave their customers access. That isn't even up for debate.

You lying piece of gunk. Curie like kumon, AoPs, Princeton Review, etc has study material with tests included. You lying scumbag!

Link to the Quant Q prep materials for any of those? DP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The kids who got in recently seem much more interested in learning compared to those who were getting in because of prep. Overall they seem like a stronger group.

You have no shame do you. You peddle a disgusting lie that kids stole the test, then changed it to Quant-Q workbooks were difficult to get to, and then Curie was selling Quant-q for $20,000. Now back to prepping. Pathetic liar!

Liars weave webs of deceit that require more lies to sustain.

Agree, they're making this into something else, but everyone knows that places like Curie had test banks and gave their customers access. That isn't even up for debate.

You lying piece of gunk. Curie like kumon, AoPs, Princeton Review, etc has study material with tests included. You lying scumbag!

Link to the Quant Q prep materials for any of those? DP.

https://www.google.com/search?q=quant+q+prep+material

Quant Q is a third party test and prep material has been available in the market way before TJ selected it as admissions test for math component. It is not a TJHSST created test. You have been peddling a lie about Curie students. You pathetic liar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/petitions-were-watching/


Lots of cases listed, no TJ. Is there any source that thinks the court will actually grant cert?

We already know 3 conservative Justices voted to grant stay already with the earlier TRO matter so only 1 more out of 3 remaining conservative justices is all that is necessary. Likely to be grated cert.

Very likeley.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/petitions-were-watching/


Lots of cases listed, no TJ. Is there any source that thinks the court will actually grant cert?

We already know 3 conservative Justices voted to grant stay already with the earlier TRO matter so only 1 more out of 3 remaining conservative justices is all that is necessary. Likely to be grated cert.

It will be Robertis since he wants to further clarify the boundaries of what is not permitted and what is permitted under the Harvard/UNC case's holding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/petitions-were-watching/


Lots of cases listed, no TJ. Is there any source that thinks the court will actually grant cert?

I think it's 50-50. It's worth noting that it would have been much easier for the Court to have an impact in this case by voting to grant the emergency stay - and would have had an impact on probably two and maybe three more full classes of incoming freshmen - than it is for them to have an impact via Supreme Court review. I don't think it's likely that Roberts votes to grant cert in this case, and I'm not sure which of Kavanaugh or Coney Barrett are more likely to move off their position on the emergency stay. I think it's fascinating that Roberts voted not to grant the emergency stay but then wrote the opinion of the Court in SFFA, suggesting that he (in my opinion, correctly) sees significant daylight between SFFA and Coalition. It's also important to remember that while the Coalition requires one change of vote for a grant of cert, they require two changes for a judgment in their favor.

According to SCOTUSBlog analysis (which is nonpartisan and highly reliable) the Court has granted cert to approximately half of the number of cases that they are likely to hear in this term. It appears that Verrilli and his team working on behalf of FCPS has until October 23 to file a response to the petition for cert: https://www.supremecourt.gov/docket/docketfiles/html/public/23-170.html

The strongest argument for SCOTUS not to grant cert in this case is the weakness of the facts. The Coalition's entire argument - and this is the problem that Heytens and King raised in their excoriation of Hilton's ruling - essentially rests on two points:

1) The simplistic "before and after" comparison of the demographic numbers yielded by the old process versus the new process. Ruling in favor of the Coalition on this point would introduce the possibility for any selection process in any area of public life at all to be scrutinized if the demographics of the selected population were found to be impacted at all, which is a Pandora's Box that the Court would be unlikely to want to open in a case as relatively meaningless as this one.

2) The text messages and emails between School Board members and the Superintendent provide evidence of discriminatory intent. Ruling in favor of the Coalition on this point, given that the communications were largely describing the School Board's dissatisfaction on the basis of potential appearance of anti-Asian discrimination with a process that was eventually not adopted, would be extraordinarily weak and would limit the Court's ruling in this case essentially only to the TJ matter and would severly limit its applicability elsewhere.

Put differently, for this Court to find for the Coalition would, depending on its reasoning, either introduce an extremely limited ruling that would have no impact even on other school systems or would introduce an unintentionally broad doctrine that might have cascading impacts across various sectors.

Further complicating the issue, and this is a matter for discussion here, is: What is the remedy if the Court rules in favor of the Coalition? In SFFA it was fairly simple: Colleges and universities can no longer use race in their selection processes. Will SCOTUS assert that geographic set-asides are illegal? Or perhaps the "experience factors"? I can't imagine the Court would take jurisdiction for itself to demand that a standardized exam must be used, as that introduces a mandated expense for the County and thus either the applicants or the taxpayers.

It's just such a weak case, and unlike SFFA, its scope is so limited. Even Judge Rushing, in her dissent that essentially copied and pasted the PLF's brief, stated clearly "None of this freezes the TJ admissions policy in its prior form or forecloses future changes to the school’s admissions plan."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who is the Asian that was discriminated against?

The only named plaintiff parent in the Coalition for TJ who was actually Asian was the mother of two TJ students at the time that the case was taken up. One of those two students had been admitted by the old process, and the other had been admitted by the new process. She was nominally listed in the case on behalf of her third child, who has since ALSO been admitted by the new process.

The other named plaintiff is very publicly a current candidate for the School Board. Go figure.

Makes you think.

That’s pathetic. Those parents and the Pacific Legal Foundation ought to be ashamed of themselves.

They are fighting racism. Jane Doe of Roe v. Wade didn’t drop her case after her baby was born.

They're fighting to institutionalize racism. If one policy is inclusive and the other is exclusive, and you're fighting for the one that is exclusive, you're the racist.

It is not exclusive.

It is manifestly exclusive. Less than 1% of incoming TJ classes for decades have come from economically disadvantaged families and there had not been enough Black students at TJ under the prior admissions process to fill a single graduating class after 33 years.

That is the definition of exclusive, if not de jure, then certainly de facto. And what the PLF is currently trying to convince the federal courts of is that the new admissions process engages in de facto discrimination against Asian students, when the evidence for such is FAR less clear than the obvious evidence of de facto segregation/discrimination under the previous process.

SO. MUCH. THIS.

If the operative term here is going to be “disparate impact”, there is approximately a thousand times more evidence to convict the prior admissions process of DI against poor kids and Black/Hispanic kids than there is with which to accuse the current admissions process of DI against Asians.

If you can’t do the math on that one, your claims of Asian supremacy are even more unfounded than I previously thought.

No one is claiming Asian supremacy. Only you people cry about "your kind" lives matter.
Don't always blame the system when you can not compete. You don't need a lot of money to get high score on exams like PSAT. Just grab a couple barron's PSAT books and study them.

More than anything, standardized exams measure test taking ability.

Test taking ability is not a translatable skill in any field beyond academic admissions processes.

So why in the world do we continue to emphasize them as some kind of measuring stick of ability when their utility can be so easily compromised through buying expensive prep materials?

Although it is not perfect, standardized exam is the most reliable and objective measurement tool that we have.
What is "test taking ability"? You need to master the subject materials well in order to get a good score.
"expensive prep materials"? Really, $15 a piece. I guess, driving a fancy car has more priority.

In short, stop playing victimhood on everything.

If $15 prep books were adequate to prepare kids for the old TJ admissions exams, you wouldn’t have had parents spending thousands of dollars on what Curie was offering.

In short, stop intentionally burying your head in the sand and engage with reality.

What is Curie? Marie Curie, the twice Nobel prize winner?

Curie is the TJ student factory that wealthy Indian families use to ensure their offspring have the best chance at admission

Fixed it for you. Curie is virtually 100% Indian, but not all of the families availing themselves of their services are wealthy.

What's the point here? Beyond Hoops basketball academy is all Black. Wolfe Ice Hockey is all White. If Indians choose to spend their bottom dollars at Curie, it's their choice.

It appears that you may have had prior experiences or concerns related to Curie and the Indian community, leading you to harbor grudge towards Asian Indians. Consider seeking advice from a mental health professional. Racism can be cured, at the least addressing the root cause of your hate can help promote understanding and overcome any biases and prejudices. Get help.

++++++10000000

I agree. As a parent, I feel obliged to ensure my children get a solid education which just doesn't happen in public these days with the emphasis on equity. Teachers are solely focused on the many students who are struggling and below grade level. They feel gifted students will be fine and basically ignore them. That being said I also don't feel that people should be able to buy access to these programs because after all this is a public school system that should serve everyone.

In order to stop this damaging progressive ideology, we need to act together and vote off all these crazy liberals in the upcoming election.

That seems like a nonsequitur. The regressive bible thumpers are behind even more harmful policies so that would only make things worse.

How so? The conservative Supreme Court Judges did pretty well recently.

That's the only hope. Affirmative action was designed to support all minorities, but some sneaky folks at select universities decided to play the exclusion game with Asian Americans. The three-eyed raven, in all its wisdom, warned everyone not to mess with Asian Americans and their education. Did anyone listen? Nope! The Supreme Court finally had enough, got fed up that no one paid attention to the three-eyed raven, and decided to put Affirmative Action on the chopping block. Talk about messing with a mystical messenger! FAFO!

No one would have minded if affirmative action was used in moderation and removed barriers to individual hardwork in particular, but it was being used as handouts to simply based on skin color. Even then, many tolerated this misuse. But what proved to be the tipping point was when it was employed to hinder the efforts of one minority race in favor of another, relatively bigger electorate, all for political gain. The Supreme Court had to step in with the sharpest cleaver, and affirmative action underwent quite the mincing process.

Here's the thing about the new admissions process that the whiners can't wrap their heads around.

There have always been at least a few poor kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Black kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few Hispanic kids at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids with IEPs at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids from Prince William at TJ.
There have always been at least a few English Language Learners at TJ.
There have always been at least a few kids who were in Alg1 in 8th grade at TJ.

And now there are a few more of all of these. But they always used to exist in the old process that you refer to as "merit-based", as though that's somehow in opposition to the new system.

And what that means is that you have no idea which of the kids who are at TJ now wouldn't have gotten in under the old process. But you blast them all as "equity kids" as if you do know.

You are so brainwashed that nothing plain and logical ever sinks in anymore.

Repeat this line:

Merit based asian, black, hispanic, white, and all other races are not being admitted into TJ because there is no stem evaluation test to determine their merit. Instead they are being admitted on equity basis using a ridiculous essay.

Repeat above line.

Nope. Merit presents itself in many ways. A single exam taken on a single day is a snapshot and in most cases demonstrates knowledge, not ability, or passion, or grit, or determination, or anything at all, really.

But we should absolutely get teacher recommendations back into the process.

Agree teacher recs would be helpful. The problem is they have also been shown to be biased. If only there were a way to use them while reducing the bias?

To me, this is easily solved by creating a teacher recommendation form that asks teachers not to write at length about the students, but rather to evaluate them against their peers on a Likert scale across many areas. For example, teachers could be asked to evaluate students along metrics like:

Command of Course Material
Participation in Class Discussions
Passion for STEM
Collaboration With Other Students
Etc. etc. etc

... and could ask them to rate each student relative to their classmates as:

Below Average
Average
Above Average
Among the Top of the Class
Among the Strongest I've Ever Taught

A math teacher at a school like Carson might fill out 50-75 of these recommendations. The Admissions Office would then easily be able to identify both patterns of discrimination; i.e. "This teacher clearly rates Asian students poorly on Participation in Class Discussions"; and lack of real thought placed into the evaluation; i.e. "This teacher has rated 40 separate applicants as "Among the Strongest I've ever taught".

As an added bonus, such a form would be relatively easy to fill out, probably taking 5-10 minutes at most as opposed to the intense amount of time placed into essay writing, and would eliminate the inherent bias of teachers with tons of experience writing TJ recommendation letters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/petitions-were-watching/


Lots of cases listed, no TJ. Is there any source that thinks the court will actually grant cert?

We already know 3 conservative Justices voted to grant stay already with the earlier TRO matter so only 1 more out of 3 remaining conservative justices is all that is necessary. Likely to be grated cert.

It will be Robertis since he wants to further clarify the boundaries of what is not permitted and what is permitted under the Harvard/UNC case's holding.

Interesting analysis. How do you square it with his vote not to grant the emergency stay, allowing a potentially discriminatory process to continue for an additional 2-3 years?