Why do western people have such disregard for family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Wow, glad you know more about my family than I do. My parents didn't raise a successful litigator by encouraging me to be a doormat FFS. They probably engaged me in argument more than your parents did My guess is that if you met me, you would just assume I am not Indian because I don't fit your neat stereotype of what Indian women are like.

Are you the poster who started this topic?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please. Its because we have choices and laws that protect us. South Asian women need their families for survival and murders of DILs and daughters are not uncommon. You have no choice but to put up with crap from your elders and in laws. We dont have to. We can easily be completely financially independent and (unless there is a psychopath in our family) dont have to worry about being murdered for "honor" or for not producing a son.

"Not uncommon"? They're also not common.

Yeah, too bad with my J.D. from a top ten law school and an established legal career I totally financially dependent on my family

And your JD may make you capable of financial independence but it doesn't change the attitudes about your role in your family and the shame you will bring down upon them if you don't act the bowing and scraping doormat daughter or DIL. It is ingrained in those culture to such a deeply psychological extent that it takes generations of living in truly free societies for individuals to break away.

Wow, glad you know more about my family than I do. My parents didn't raise a successful litigator by encouraging me to be a doormat FFS. They probably engaged me in argument more than your parents did My guess is that if you met me, you would just assume I am not Indian because I don't fit your neat stereotype of what Indian women are like.

I don't have a stereotype if what Indian women are like. I do have a firm understanding of cultural norms in typical Indian families however.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a southasian American who, after having lived in the U.S for over 20 years is pretty baffled by the western perspective on extended family. I have seen my friends and colleagues speak at great length about troubled relations with their brothers and sisters and mothers and fathers and in laws. Most times, adult siblings only speak to each other occasionally and see each other at Christmas. Adult daughters can't stand their fathers and do not see them unless its an emergency. Siblings cutting each other off etc. Married couples not wanting to have their elderly parents live with them and more.

In the east, we LOVE our families. We live and would die for them. As an adult daughter it is a great privilege and blessing to me that my elderly parents can live with us and that I can take care of them in their old age. I love my siblings and we all live near each other.

Why is it so different in the west?

[phone]. I am a private school educated north easterner. I am engaged. And we are in couples therapy for this very issue. I cannot figure out what my fiancé is missing. My family after my fathers death has always been close. My mother had w mental health crisis. My fiancé was terrible (withholding, uncommunicative, punishing) to me and to her. I will never stop being enraged at this behavior, no matter how much I let it smolder undetected. I don't get this attitude. Out therapist took his side. Is the world insane? I am a white female late 30s well off north easterner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a southasian American who, after having lived in the U.S for over 20 years is pretty baffled by the western perspective on extended family. I have seen my friends and colleagues speak at great length about troubled relations with their brothers and sisters and mothers and fathers and in laws. Most times, adult siblings only speak to each other occasionally and see each other at Christmas. Adult daughters can't stand their fathers and do not see them unless its an emergency. Siblings cutting each other off etc. Married couples not wanting to have their elderly parents live with them and more.

In the east, we LOVE our families. We live and would die for them. As an adult daughter it is a great privilege and blessing to me that my elderly parents can live with us and that I can take care of them in their old age. I love my siblings and we all live near each other.

Why is it so different in the west?

[phone]. I am a private school educated north easterner. I am engaged. And we are in couples therapy for this very issue. I cannot figure out what my fiancé is missing. My family after my fathers death has always been close. My mother had w mental health crisis. My fiancé was terrible (withholding, uncommunicative, punishing) to me and to her. I will never stop being enraged at this behavior, no matter how much I let it smolder undetected. I don't get this attitude. Out therapist took his side. Is the world insane? I am a white female late 30s well off north easterner.

To clarify when I say northeaster I mean NY/New England.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What I see in most Asian families who I know and who continue to reside with their parents after marriage is that a lot of grandparent cannot support themselves. They worked hard and invested their money in their children education (including paying cash for Columbia or Harward). Now, when their kids have a successful carriers, they prefer to leave in one big mention in the prestigious neighborhood, rather than buy something small that they can afford after retirement. The problem that I see with these families is that children still actively using their parents. I know several Asian families, where is daughter, like OP, is happy to have parents to live with them. What does it equals to usually, that the grandparent working as a free house maids doing all cooking, grocery shopping, house cleaning, taking grandchildren to the doctors appointments, etc. In some sense, it is sad, because instead of leaving their own life after their kids grew up, they are living theirs kids life.

You don't get it. There is no "living their own life" for grandparents like this. Family is life. Seeing your kids become successful, seeing your grandkids grow up, nurturing this relationship is life. Everything else is just a minor diversion.

My mom lives with us. She doesn't do any driving or grocery shopping or cooking, but she happily spends time with the grandkids and in fact acted pretty much like their nanny when they were infants. She delights in this. Although she keeps up with her friendships, she doesn't want to spend most of her time around old people. Her words verbatim, "what do old people think and talk about? Just what's ahead of them. Decline and death. When you're around young people, you are carried by their energy because the trajectory of their lives still moves forward, not downward." She can think of no happier setup then spending her golden years with her grown kids.

Yes! And my jerk-ass fiancé cannot understand this. We have spent years and 1000s of dollars in therapy trying to figure this out. He and the therapies make me think I am insane for suggesting this! But this is the only thing that makes sense!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Wow, glad you know more about my family than I do. My parents didn't raise a successful litigator by encouraging me to be a doormat FFS. They probably engaged me in argument more than your parents did My guess is that if you met me, you would just assume I am not Indian because I don't fit your neat stereotype of what Indian women are like.

Are you the poster who started this topic?

No. Why would you think that?

But it's not true that all Indian women are doormats, just as it is true that not all western people have disregard for their families. Anyone who says either of things is ignorant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please. Its because we have choices and laws that protect us. South Asian women need their families for survival and murders of DILs and daughters are not uncommon. You have no choice but to put up with crap from your elders and in laws. We dont have to. We can easily be completely financially independent and (unless there is a psychopath in our family) dont have to worry about being murdered for "honor" or for not producing a son.

"Not uncommon"? They're also not common.

Yeah, too bad with my J.D. from a top ten law school and an established legal career I totally financially dependent on my family

And your JD may make you capable of financial independence but it doesn't change the attitudes about your role in your family and the shame you will bring down upon them if you don't act the bowing and scraping doormat daughter or DIL. It is ingrained in those culture to such a deeply psychological extent that it takes generations of living in truly free societies for individuals to break away.

Wow, glad you know more about my family than I do. My parents didn't raise a successful litigator by encouraging me to be a doormat FFS. They probably engaged me in argument more than your parents did My guess is that if you met me, you would just assume I am not Indian because I don't fit your neat stereotype of what Indian women are like.

I don't have a stereotype if what Indian women are like. I do have a firm understanding of cultural norms in typical Indian families however.

Where did you obtain this "firm understanding"? An Indian co-worker ten years ago? An article in reader's digest? And even if you do know about "typical" Indian families, what on earth makes you think you know about mine?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What I see in most Asian families who I know and who continue to reside with their parents after marriage is that a lot of grandparent cannot support themselves. They worked hard and invested their money in their children education (including paying cash for Columbia or Harward). Now, when their kids have a successful carriers, they prefer to leave in one big mention in the prestigious neighborhood, rather than buy something small that they can afford after retirement. The problem that I see with these families is that children still actively using their parents. I know several Asian families, where is daughter, like OP, is happy to have parents to live with them. What does it equals to usually, that the grandparent working as a free house maids doing all cooking, grocery shopping, house cleaning, taking grandchildren to the doctors appointments, etc. In some sense, it is sad, because instead of leaving their own life after their kids grew up, they are living theirs kids life.

You don't get it. There is no "living their own life" for grandparents like this. Family is life. Seeing your kids become successful, seeing your grandkids grow up, nurturing this relationship is life. Everything else is just a minor diversion.

My mom lives with us. She doesn't do any driving or grocery shopping or cooking, but she happily spends time with the grandkids and in fact acted pretty much like their nanny when they were infants. She delights in this. Although she keeps up with her friendships, she doesn't want to spend most of her time around old people. Her words verbatim, "what do old people think and talk about? Just what's ahead of them. Decline and death. When you're around young people, you are carried by their energy because the trajectory of their lives still moves forward, not downward." She can think of no happier setup then spending her golden years with her grown kids.

Yes! And my jerk-ass fiancé cannot understand this. We have spent years and 1000s of dollars in therapy trying to figure this out. He and the therapies make me think I am insane for suggesting this! But this is the only thing that makes sense!

I know PLENTY of older, retired people who make their own life IN ADDITION to visits/spending time with/communicating with family:
Church activities
Volunteering/charities
Community engagement
Vacations and travel
Writing their memoirs/family ancestry/"caretaking" history projects for the family
Hobbies like photography, knitting

Hell, you know what's a great day for my parents? Spending time together, brewing a second pot of coffee, playing "Words with Friends", dinner and a movie. Just a relaxed life that they have earned! They LIKE peace, quiet and order, and they have that now after 3 rowdy kids! They are super fun grandparents, but they always will be introverts, and don't want to live with anyone but themselves, at least for now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Wow, glad you know more about my family than I do. My parents didn't raise a successful litigator by encouraging me to be a doormat FFS. They probably engaged me in argument more than your parents did My guess is that if you met me, you would just assume I am not Indian because I don't fit your neat stereotype of what Indian women are like.

Are you the poster who started this topic?

No. Why would you think that?

But it's not true that all Indian women are doormats, just as it is true that not all western people have disregard for their families. Anyone who says either of things is ignorant.

QED.
I admire Asian, Middle Eastern etc. women who have the courage to adjust to the new way of life and forge their own path to impressive career success. Sometimes they have the support of their families, but often they do not. It is wrong to generalize either way, but that's what OP did.