Why is there such a racial/ethnic disconnect with TJ Admissions?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:it is illegal to discriminate in employment.
It is illegal to discriminate in housing.
It is not illegal to discriminate in admission to a special advanced academic program within the public school system. It's based on merit. Yes that will discriminate against the less advanced. Not illegal.

That is why what is happening with TJ admission is illegal. Many of the Asain students there are not really qualified for TJ. They just crammed the test. Also HUGE number of mixed race kids. The students talk about it all the time : Blaision, Wasain, Fasion, Haole you name it.

it is not illegal to cram for a test or admit students with high test scores.

But it is illegal to turn away qualified students to make an ethnic mix that does not match that of the county where the school is located.

There is no requirement that the composition of a specialized academic program match the ethnicity of the county in which the school is located, any more than the basketball team has to have a certain percentage of Asians and Whites because of their proportion of the student body.
As for "turning away" qualified students, if they don't apply they can't get in. Nobody is stopping them from applying.

Other than that it is illegal and discriminatory. Many students who are qualified do not get in.

well, not qualified enough apparently.

[Anonymous]

^^ Troll

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ Troll

I was referring to the PP to whom you responded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In fact, it's outlived its original purpose and can be put to alternative, superior uses.

ITA

[Anonymous]

Qualification changes depending on who applied duh. What kind dumb shit is that.

[Anonymous]

There are hoops one has to jump through to get into TJ, just as there are certain hoops one must jump through to get on the varsity basketball team.
It appears that members of some groups just do better than other in these respective endeavors. It is what it is. Not illegal and not "discriminatory" in the legal sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not just politicians and judges and teachers at TJ. What about police officers, they should be 16% Asians. I think it's about 1 or 2% Asian. What about the county employees, they should be representative of the Asian population of the county and be 16% not 2 or 3%. What about all the employees that work at the Gatehouse? They should be 16% Asians. It's outrageous there is such a disproportionate gap in virtually everything except for a place where semi-meritocracy is practiced. If this is not a demonstrable evidence of disparate impact I don't know what is. There should be an immediate Complaint filed with the Civil Rights Division of the US Justice Department alleging racial discrimination alleging wide spread and pervasive discrimination.

Why is discrimination against Asian Americans ok and acceptable. Why shouldn't there be proportional representation of Asians in all facets of life? Why is over presentation of Asian (magnet school) always a problem (especially if Asians have no say in the matter and 0 influence in policy making) but under presentation is never a problem? Why the double standard?

In fact, the admission process was changed several times to increase blacks/Hispanics at TJ:

It was originally purely based on test scores and GPA from the beginning to 2006
In 2007, the process changed to "holistic" review with essays, teacher recs and SIS (subjective components) added to make the process subjective and allow admissions office wiggle room to admit more blacks/Hispanics. (This led to weaker math/science students being admitted and ultimately led to the 2011-2012 teacher protest regarding weak math students being admitted and remediation issue)
It was changed again and the different components were given designated weight in 2010 with subjective components making up 65-75% depending on how you derive the weight to further increase blacks/Hispanics
It was changed again in 2013 to make the process "holistic review" once again since ALL the tinkering to reduce Asians and increase blacks/Hispanic were not working adequately. Also, non-math/science grades were considered in the final selection (change from before) to further try to reduce Asians and increase non-Asians.

Guess what would happen if we went back to the ORIGINAL admissions process of only using test scores and GPAs. We would have more stronger students but we would also have more Asians. That's the problem.

*1

[Anonymous]

I think the PP wants affirmative action for all racial groups so that they don't have to compete with Asians. In fact, what PP wants is a quota system where the number of kids who are accepted into TJ are in proportion to the student population of that particular racial group.

In other words, PP is advocating a system that supports mediocrity.

You notice that all this push to create a more level field started after Asians began to constitute the majority of students at TJ.

If you can't beat them then change the rules!

[Anonymous]

Disproportionate number of Asians among the 2014 presidential scholars:

http://www2.ed.gov/programs/psp/2014/scholars.pdf

Let's limit them as well ....... why stop at limiting them at TJ.

OR

A better idea:

Why not really try and compete with all the Asians and prove that you are as good if not better than them?

It can be done: just get a couple of tiger moms to tutor you on how to do it.

[Anonymous]

Essay: There are expensive programs that teach either one on one or in small groups exactly how to ace the essay. These are quite expensive (run by whites not the ones run by Chinese or Koreans which are mostly ineffective) and only benefit ones with lot of money. Certainly will not help most blacks or Hispanic. It is unfair for these groups.

I've never heard of these expensive programs talked about here, but that doesn't really mean anything since I'm not in the market for this type of program. Such programs are quite unnecessary, though. All a child needs is a library card, which is free. The best writers spend lots of time reading. Kids who read a lot will pick up a lot about what constitutes good writing. While reading one good book after another, kids will absorb vocabulary, grammar, and usage without even realizing how much they are learning. The ability to write clearly is important throughout life, not merely for the application to a selective school.
My child did not need expensive tutoring to get accepted to TJ and neither did many of his friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Essay: There are expensive programs that teach either one on one or in small groups exactly how to ace the essay. These are quite expensive (run by whites not the ones run by Chinese or Koreans which are mostly ineffective) and only benefit ones with lot of money. Certainly will not help most blacks or Hispanic. It is unfair for these groups.

I've never heard of these expensive programs talked about here, but that doesn't really mean anything since I'm not in the market for this type of program. Such programs are quite unnecessary, though. All a child needs is a library card, which is free. The best writers spend lots of time reading. Kids who read a lot will pick up a lot about what constitutes good writing. While reading one good book after another, kids will absorb vocabulary, grammar, and usage without even realizing how much they are learning. The ability to write clearly is important throughout life, not merely for the application to a selective school.
My child did not need expensive tutoring to get accepted to TJ and neither did many of his friends.

Same here. My kid did not even prepare. He just went and sat the test. Maybe things are a lot more competitive now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Essay: There are expensive programs that teach either one on one or in small groups exactly how to ace the essay. These are quite expensive (run by whites not the ones run by Chinese or Koreans which are mostly ineffective) and only benefit ones with lot of money. Certainly will not help most blacks or Hispanic. It is unfair for these groups.

I've never heard of these expensive programs talked about here, but that doesn't really mean anything since I'm not in the market for this type of program. Such programs are quite unnecessary, though. All a child needs is a library card, which is free. The best writers spend lots of time reading. Kids who read a lot will pick up a lot about what constitutes good writing. While reading one good book after another, kids will absorb vocabulary, grammar, and usage without even realizing how much they are learning. The ability to write clearly is important throughout life, not merely for the application to a selective school.
My child did not need expensive tutoring to get accepted to TJ and neither did many of his friends.

Same here. My kid did not even prepare. He just went and sat the test. Maybe things are a lot more competitive now.

Quite funny how you always have posters claiming their kids never prepped for TJ. I don't recall any posters admitting their kids prepped. Nothing wrong with prepping whether for essays or test or SIS or whatever. I find this funny since My kid is at TJ and my kid tells me there are kids at TJ who did prep for TJ. In fact, lot of kids have tutors, study groups, study programs etc. to help the kids get decent/good grades since it's sink or swim there. So it is funny that kids prep to get in and kids continue with prep to stay. I guess those parents whose kids did prep do not post here. Oh and, my kid did not prep for TJ and does engage in extra/outside prep for classes either.

[Anonymous]

"does not"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Essay: There are expensive programs that teach either one on one or in small groups exactly how to ace the essay. These are quite expensive (run by whites not the ones run by Chinese or Koreans which are mostly ineffective) and only benefit ones with lot of money. Certainly will not help most blacks or Hispanic. It is unfair for these groups.

I've never heard of these expensive programs talked about here, but that doesn't really mean anything since I'm not in the market for this type of program. Such programs are quite unnecessary, though. All a child needs is a library card, which is free. The best writers spend lots of time reading. Kids who read a lot will pick up a lot about what constitutes good writing. While reading one good book after another, kids will absorb vocabulary, grammar, and usage without even realizing how much they are learning. The ability to write clearly is important throughout life, not merely for the application to a selective school.
My child did not need expensive tutoring to get accepted to TJ and neither did many of his friends.

Same here. My kid did not even prepare. He just went and sat the test. Maybe things are a lot more competitive now.

Quite funny how you always have posters claiming their kids never prepped for TJ. I don't recall any posters admitting their kids prepped. Nothing wrong with prepping whether for essays or test or SIS or whatever. I find this funny since My kid is at TJ and my kid tells me there are kids at TJ who did prep for TJ. In fact, lot of kids have tutors, study groups, study programs etc. to help the kids get decent/good grades since it's sink or swim there. So it is funny that kids prep to get in and kids continue with prep to stay. I guess those parents whose kids did prep do not post here. Oh and, my kid did not prep for TJ and does engage in extra/outside prep for classes either.

PP here who posted that kid did not prep. Quite honestly, I contacted TJ to find out if there was a prep course similar to the SAT and was told there was not. Keep in mind that he was part of the class of 2005 and entered TJ in 2001. So it was not so much that I did not want him to prep but more that there was nothing available at that time as far as I could ascertain.

So it is not a brag.....................

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Essay: There are expensive programs that teach either one on one or in small groups exactly how to ace the essay. These are quite expensive (run by whites not the ones run by Chinese or Koreans which are mostly ineffective) and only benefit ones with lot of money. Certainly will not help most blacks or Hispanic. It is unfair for these groups.

I've never heard of these expensive programs talked about here, but that doesn't really mean anything since I'm not in the market for this type of program. Such programs are quite unnecessary, though. All a child needs is a library card, which is free. The best writers spend lots of time reading. Kids who read a lot will pick up a lot about what constitutes good writing. While reading one good book after another, kids will absorb vocabulary, grammar, and usage without even realizing how much they are learning. The ability to write clearly is important throughout life, not merely for the application to a selective school.
My child did not need expensive tutoring to get accepted to TJ and neither did many of his friends.

Same here. My kid did not even prepare. He just went and sat the test. Maybe things are a lot more competitive now.

Quite funny how you always have posters claiming their kids never prepped for TJ. I don't recall any posters admitting their kids prepped. Nothing wrong with prepping whether for essays or test or SIS or whatever. I find this funny since My kid is at TJ and my kid tells me there are kids at TJ who did prep for TJ. In fact, lot of kids have tutors, study groups, study programs etc. to help the kids get decent/good grades since it's sink or swim there. So it is funny that kids prep to get in and kids continue with prep to stay. I guess those parents whose kids did prep do not post here. Oh and, my kid did not prep for TJ and does engage in extra/outside prep for classes either.

Oh, we know lots of kids who took prep classes for a couple of years before the TJ test and need tutors and outside help to stay in. My child is a student there now and did not prep for the test and does his own studying without tutors or other outside help. He spends two hours a day in sports practices and that's where we've met a lot of the kids who do well there without the outside prep and tutoring. It makes sense that the kids who can manage the hours needed to do a sport can also manage the work at TJ since they tend to be very self-motivated and self-disciplined kids.