UVA Gang rape

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm only concerned about justice. And of course there are rapists on campus. For for 7 (or more, if more were in the room witnessing) rapists to be together at the same time, and none thought it wrong or thought to stop it or try to stop it, just seems unbelievable. More unbelievable than the Duke rape case years ago.

It's actually not in the least unbelievable. You're inexperienced and/or naive to think it is.

The Duke rape case was he said/she said.. No judgement of innocence. The fact is , an all white lacrosse team of rich kids had a party where they purchased African American strippers for objectification and entertainment. You can imagine the toxic atmosphere.

The Duke case was proven to be a complete fabrication. As this will likely be.

She may not have been raped as was reported but I think something did happen.

For those of you wondering why the victims didn't come forward in these cases, behold this conversation and the "she must be mentally ill" conversation. Both of which are based on nothing but the posters' discomfort with the idea that this could even happen, and even the extensive vetting of the RS article isn't enough to overcome their "truthiness." There is absolutely no evidence to discredit their accounts, and yet the rape apologists are already waiving the "she's lying/she's crazy" banners.

Yep. Even though it is not unheard of for college fraternities to create schemes to rape women students.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2014/09/wisconsin-frat-investigated-for-roofie-scheme.html

[Anonymous]

I don't necessarily believe the story, but I don't wonder why victims don't come forward either. I'm inclined to believe most accusations of rape, but I also realize that there are women out there who would lie about such things. I reserve judgement in this case. It just doesn't seem that there is enough evidence presented in this article to come down on a particular side. Why are you so certain that the accusations are valid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't necessarily believe the story, but I don't wonder why victims don't come forward either. I'm inclined to believe most accusations of rape, but I also realize that there are women out there who would lie about such things. I reserve judgement in this case. It just doesn't seem that there is enough evidence presented in this article to come down on a particular side. Why are you so certain that the accusations are valid?

It happened to me. I didn't report. Two fraternity members raped me, with my ex-boyfriend's permission. It was planned. I didn't report it because they said no one would believe it. They were right. Nothing ever changes in American society.

[Anonymous]

It's time to LOWER the drinking age to fight binge drinking. I was a binge drinker starting in my teens. It was such a big deal when we could get our hands on alcohol that we just went crazy. It's a miraCle I wasn't assaulted. Kids in the US have such obsessions with booze it leads to horrible behavior.

[Anonymous]

To the pp who never reported it:

What would you tell your teenage daughter before sending her away to college to not only prevent such an attack, but also in terms of how she should handle such an attack in terms of who to call and what to do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't necessarily believe the story, but I don't wonder why victims don't come forward either. I'm inclined to believe most accusations of rape, but I also realize that there are women out there who would lie about such things. I reserve judgement in this case. It just doesn't seem that there is enough evidence presented in this article to come down on a particular side. Why are you so certain that the accusations are valid?

It happened to me. I didn't report. Two fraternity members raped me, with my ex-boyfriend's permission. It was planned. I didn't report it because they said no one would believe it. They were right. Nothing ever changes in American society.

Permission? He did not own you. What sorry excuses for human beings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's really hard to believe a group of young men who worked hard to get into UVA and presumably care about their future do something so violent and criminal. I mean that's like a war crime type situation.

If it's true, those guys should get life sentences. I'm just having a hard time believing the story as written.

I went to UVA 15+ years ago and not only do I believe it but I am shocked it has taken this long to come out. And, perhaps equally sad in the reaction of her peers, which, IMO, is a very accurate reflection of the mindset of many at that school. I love UVA for so many reasons, but the frat culture there is disgusting. I was in a top sorority and socialized with the guys in these frats a lot. Looking back, as an adult, what went on then and what I am sure goes on now, makes me sick.

[Anonymous]

So you're saying that it is common of the mindset of girls at UVA to try and talk their friend who is bloody and bruised, out of reporting a gang rape, because they might not be invited to parties?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the pp who never reported it:

What would you tell your teenage daughter before sending her away to college to not only prevent such an attack, but also in terms of how she should handle such an attack in terms of who to call and what to do?

First, I have a son. I am working on teaching him his own body Integrity and that of others. And he's only 3, so that's where I'm starting.

Should I have a girl, I'll do the same.

With both, I'll talk about inhibitions and judgment, and how alcohol affects them. It isn't healthy or safe to drink to that extent, but the main focus of the conversation is respect for yourself and the Integrity of others. Not any false words about how staying out of frat houses or staying sober will keep you safe.

[Anonymous]

I'd like someone to name one thing that is sure to prevent rape. I don't think it exists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's really hard to believe a group of young men who worked hard to get into UVA and presumably care about their future do something so violent and criminal. I mean that's like a war crime type situation.

If it's true, those guys should get life sentences. I'm just having a hard time believing the story as written.

I went to UVA 15+ years ago and not only do I believe it but I am shocked it has taken this long to come out. And, perhaps equally sad in the reaction of her peers, which, IMO, is a very accurate reflection of the mindset of many at that school. I love UVA for so many reasons, but the frat culture there is disgusting. I was in a top sorority and socialized with the guys in these frats a lot. Looking back, as an adult, what went on then and what I am sure goes on now, makes me sick.

Likewise. I never witnessed anything untoward myself, but I heard some rumors about pledging rituals that made me beyond cringe. I don't question the veracity of the article, but will definitely say details were exaggerated for effect, like the business about the perpetrators being from a "top-tier" fraternity. At least when I attended, Phi Psi was fairly low key and off the radar, other than its location on the Mad Bowl. I can't imagine any of the guys I knew doing something like that. I guess that's why people often find such heinous acts to be literally so unbelievable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am stunned that the victim's friends were so cold and uncaring, despite her obvious distress and what sounds like visible injuries from being beaten. When I think back to my freshman year of college i can not imagine even one of my friends reacting that way, let alone a whole group of them. Telling her she should have enjoyed it? That she'll be "that girl" and ruin their chances at getting into a sorority or fraternity? I just can't wrap my brain around the fact that it wasn't just one crappy (personality disordered) friend who treated her this way, but several, according to the article. And that their own social status was the first thing they thought of upon seeing her immediately afterward in obvious physical and emotional distress. Unfathomable.

Not to mention that these seven men behaved so monstrously, as a pack. How is that possible? I always thought it would take a sociopath to rape, beat and torture a woman, but that these seven young men did this together is chilling.

Go read about the Stanford Prison Experiment. Go read about Abu Ghraib. Then get back to us.

Those people weren't sociopaths. They were just people who were in a social situation that gave them permission to abuse someone in a "lesser" position. So they did.

So you're saying that in the right circumstances, any of our sons could participate in such a brutal crime?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am stunned that the victim's friends were so cold and uncaring, despite her obvious distress and what sounds like visible injuries from being beaten. When I think back to my freshman year of college i can not imagine even one of my friends reacting that way, let alone a whole group of them. Telling her she should have enjoyed it? That she'll be "that girl" and ruin their chances at getting into a sorority or fraternity? I just can't wrap my brain around the fact that it wasn't just one crappy (personality disordered) friend who treated her this way, but several, according to the article. And that their own social status was the first thing they thought of upon seeing her immediately afterward in obvious physical and emotional distress. Unfathomable.

Not to mention that these seven men behaved so monstrously, as a pack. How is that possible? I always thought it would take a sociopath to rape, beat and torture a woman, but that these seven young men did this together is chilling.

Go read about the Stanford Prison Experiment. Go read about Abu Ghraib. Then get back to us.

Those people weren't sociopaths. They were just people who were in a social situation that gave them permission to abuse someone in a "lesser" position. So they did.

So you're saying that in the right circumstances, any of our sons could participate in such a brutal crime?

Yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am stunned that the victim's friends were so cold and uncaring, despite her obvious distress and what sounds like visible injuries from being beaten. When I think back to my freshman year of college i can not imagine even one of my friends reacting that way, let alone a whole group of them. Telling her she should have enjoyed it? That she'll be "that girl" and ruin their chances at getting into a sorority or fraternity? I just can't wrap my brain around the fact that it wasn't just one crappy (personality disordered) friend who treated her this way, but several, according to the article. And that their own social status was the first thing they thought of upon seeing her immediately afterward in obvious physical and emotional distress. Unfathomable.

Not to mention that these seven men behaved so monstrously, as a pack. How is that possible? I always thought it would take a sociopath to rape, beat and torture a woman, but that these seven young men did this together is chilling.

Go read about the Stanford Prison Experiment. Go read about Abu Ghraib. Then get back to us.

Those people weren't sociopaths. They were just people who were in a social situation that gave them permission to abuse someone in a "lesser" position. So they did.

So you're saying that in the right circumstances, any of our sons could participate in such a brutal crime?

Placed in the right social situation and given an organization or authority position to hide behind, anyone can do horrible things.

[Anonymous]

There is something seriously wrong with the Greek system at UVa. In the last couple of years, Sigma Nu and PKA both pulled the charters for their chapters on campus. PKA pulled the charter on their ALPHA chapter. That's unheard of.

http://www.cavalierdaily.com/article/2014/05/sigma-nu-suspends-charter-of-university-chapter