Can someone explain the mentality of never being proactive or organized to me?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not a mentality, OP. It’s a disability. Educate yourself because sh***ing on people with ADHD does nothing since they already hate themselves. But by all means, revel in your superiority while your marriage falls apart. Hope “victory” feels good.

Maybe adhd should have disclosed that more and not had kids. Or not gotten married nor had kids.

At least the current kids will be on the lookout for this and avoid it in a partner.

I'm a DW and I did not know I had ADHD until I was in my 40s. I coped just fine until work, kids, and perimenopause made everything go off the rails.

Fascinating you can admit it. You must be female

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ADHD is literally poor executive functioning. This task would have taken multiple executive functions: planning, organization, making goals, task initiation, time management, flexibility to deal with you being gone, problem solving (actually he did that, just not how you would have), maybe self-restraint. It's everything he struggles with.

oh yeah it’s such a struggle to go to Target and buy a toy, and show up at the Trampoline park on time 🙄 this dude didn’t care - it’s not adhd.

I have ADHD and that's so ineffective. It's a waste of time, gas, and energy. Everybody knows that birthday parties come up when you have kids that age, so why not grab extra gifts when they are on sale in December or for Labor Day? It's much easier to shop your closet. It sounds like OP could better manage things too. Though if she wants to be frustrated it wasn't a Target gift, it's within her right.

Obviously this guy doesn’t plan far enough in advance to order on Amazon. And lol, no, these types of men wouldn’t be buying extra gifts on sale in january wtf.

But, OP didn't do that either. If she had, she could have tasked him with something else and gotten exactly the gift she wanted.

right. weaponized incompetence gets men like this what they want. now in addition to having to pack and get ready to take the other kid out of town for the sports event, OP will also have to order the birthday present and maybe even set up a carpool to ensure the kid even gets there. that’s the direction this story goes - down, down, down. by the end of my marriage my ex literally did zero.

If you chose to continue being married to someone this severely incompetent then yes, you should probably do all the things that are important to you. Instead of spending time doing things, she wastes both time and mental space complaining about the man she chose to have children with.

Aaaaannnnd Doofus Dad for the win!

Off the hook forever!

Gets to keep the image and reputation of Successful Married Family Man.

Bingo!

I’m sorry that the women who know have no agency in their lives. He only gets to keep the reputation if you stayed married to him.

Exactly. Much better to divorce and cie la vie to the kids 50% of the time!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How is it that everyone on DCUM has ADHD/ASD?

They don’t. ADHD is really just that people were never taught executive functioning skills as children. Especially boys, who generally are held to much lower standards than girls and observed that their own fathers never did anything around the house.

Listen, you clearly have not read ANY research on ADHD. People with ADHD have brains that are actually structurally different. Study after study has shown that parenting has ZERO effect on the frontal lobe and executive functioning and absolutely does not cause ADHD. Just as a tip, please don't say this crap in public because it shows how ignorant you are. If you have a family member or close friend with ADHD I implore you to read Dr Russell Barkley's research or books because your ignorance is going to hurt people you love.

Then what does executive functioning coaching and tons of routine and steps/chinking do for them if they’re missing part of their brain development?

Anything?

Nothing?

Re-routes things?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ADHD is literally poor executive functioning. This task would have taken multiple executive functions: planning, organization, making goals, task initiation, time management, flexibility to deal with you being gone, problem solving (actually he did that, just not how you would have), maybe self-restraint. It's everything he struggles with.

oh yeah it’s such a struggle to go to Target and buy a toy, and show up at the Trampoline park on time 🙄 this dude didn’t care - it’s not adhd.

I have ADHD and that's so ineffective. It's a waste of time, gas, and energy. Everybody knows that birthday parties come up when you have kids that age, so why not grab extra gifts when they are on sale in December or for Labor Day? It's much easier to shop your closet. It sounds like OP could better manage things too. Though if she wants to be frustrated it wasn't a Target gift, it's within her right.

Obviously this guy doesn’t plan far enough in advance to order on Amazon. And lol, no, these types of men wouldn’t be buying extra gifts on sale in january wtf.

But, OP didn't do that either. If she had, she could have tasked him with something else and gotten exactly the gift she wanted.

right. weaponized incompetence gets men like this what they want. now in addition to having to pack and get ready to take the other kid out of town for the sports event, OP will also have to order the birthday present and maybe even set up a carpool to ensure the kid even gets there. that’s the direction this story goes - down, down, down. by the end of my marriage my ex literally did zero.

If you chose to continue being married to someone this severely incompetent then yes, you should probably do all the things that are important to you. Instead of spending time doing things, she wastes both time and mental space complaining about the man she chose to have children with.

Aaaaannnnd Doofus Dad for the win!

Off the hook forever!

Gets to keep the image and reputation of Successful Married Family Man.

Bingo!

I’m sorry that the women who know have no agency in their lives. He only gets to keep the reputation if you stayed married to him.

Exactly. Much better to divorce and cie la vie to the kids 50% of the time!

Is that the story you tell yourself not to have to take responsibility for your choice to stay with him?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

NP.

Make them plan a week long vacation.
It’s eye opening.

I just didn’t know what to call it and thank gawd I packed a guidebook and knew the top 5+ things to do as I had been in the vicinity before 15 years earlier.

The problem is I am very high functioning and we met in grad school, then was his hyper focus. Fast FW and I had capacity to plan the wedding, travel, bethesda home purchase, kid 1c nanny, keep working and then WHAM!!! Needed him to take the baton sometimes and he had NO CLUE. He’d go into shutdown mode, lash out, forget decisions we discussed, hide at work more and more. It was so nuts he went to take a neuropsych test as a 38 yo. He was asd/adhd, he still won’t do anything of the things his therapist suggested or anything we (I) read.

Am counting down the days until I think the youngest child can advocate for herself well. kid 1 has the same asd/adhd, dinner neuropsych test in 4th grade.

Not the life I envisioned but I kept my career, entity and clarity in his bad behavior patterns. The incompetency is so constant thought it’s unbelievable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

Yes they will lie
.
So will their mother.
My MIL said some things like he’s stubborn or “what kind of smart” or “I didn’t know he had it in him.”

FIL was the absent minded professor type who can’t follow a conversation on anything, and “took a package” at age 50 never worked again. Just sat around the house reading the news in a computer. Once told my then 4 yo to out a raw steak in the grill for him and I had to put the keibash down.

My spouse told my my BIL (when we had to go over family history for our oldest), had tutoring and dyslexia throaty three times a week when a child. And still records any lectures. I asked what the dyslexia consisted of and he said BiL “was hyper and always bouncing off the walls, he would only focus on stuff he wanted to and nothing else.” I said this was called dyslexia? And my spouse said Yeah, that’s what his Mom called it.

Ugh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ADHD is literally poor executive functioning. This task would have taken multiple executive functions: planning, organization, making goals, task initiation, time management, flexibility to deal with you being gone, problem solving (actually he did that, just not how you would have), maybe self-restraint. It's everything he struggles with.

oh yeah it’s such a struggle to go to Target and buy a toy, and show up at the Trampoline park on time 🙄 this dude didn’t care - it’s not adhd.

I have ADHD and that's so ineffective. It's a waste of time, gas, and energy. Everybody knows that birthday parties come up when you have kids that age, so why not grab extra gifts when they are on sale in December or for Labor Day? It's much easier to shop your closet. It sounds like OP could better manage things too. Though if she wants to be frustrated it wasn't a Target gift, it's within her right.

Obviously this guy doesn’t plan far enough in advance to order on Amazon. And lol, no, these types of men wouldn’t be buying extra gifts on sale in january wtf.

But, OP didn't do that either. If she had, she could have tasked him with something else and gotten exactly the gift she wanted.

right. weaponized incompetence gets men like this what they want. now in addition to having to pack and get ready to take the other kid out of town for the sports event, OP will also have to order the birthday present and maybe even set up a carpool to ensure the kid even gets there. that’s the direction this story goes - down, down, down. by the end of my marriage my ex literally did zero.

If you chose to continue being married to someone this severely incompetent then yes, you should probably do all the things that are important to you. Instead of spending time doing things, she wastes both time and mental space complaining about the man she chose to have children with.

Aaaaannnnd Doofus Dad for the win!

Off the hook forever!

Gets to keep the image and reputation of Successful Married Family Man.

Bingo!

I’m sorry that the women who know have no agency in their lives. He only gets to keep the reputation if you stayed married to him.

Exactly. Much better to divorce and cie la vie to the kids 50% of the time!

Is that the story you tell yourself not to have to take responsibility for your choice to stay with him?

Exactly. Kids are resilient! Especially special needs kids with a special needs divorced dad!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How is it that everyone on DCUM has ADHD/ASD?

Because if you are not a robot you must be neurodivergent, like many people claim their kids are

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

NP.

Make them plan a week long vacation.
It’s eye opening.

I just didn’t know what to call it and thank gawd I packed a guidebook and knew the top 5+ things to do as I had been in the vicinity before 15 years earlier.

The problem is I am very high functioning and we met in grad school, then was his hyper focus. Fast FW and I had capacity to plan the wedding, travel, bethesda home purchase, kid 1c nanny, keep working and then WHAM!!! Needed him to take the baton sometimes and he had NO CLUE. He’d go into shutdown mode, lash out, forget decisions we discussed, hide at work more and more. It was so nuts he went to take a neuropsych test as a 38 yo. He was asd/adhd, he still won’t do anything of the things his therapist suggested or anything we (I) read.

Am counting down the days until I think the youngest child can advocate for herself well. kid 1 has the same asd/adhd, dinner neuropsych test in 4th grade.

Not the life I envisioned but I kept my career, entity and clarity in his bad behavior patterns. The incompetency is so constant thought it’s unbelievable.

So your ADHD kid is destined to get divorced too? Or, shouldn’t expect to get married because they’ll never be able to do what is expected of them by their spouse? I find this so sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

NP.

Make them plan a week long vacation.
It’s eye opening.

I just didn’t know what to call it and thank gawd I packed a guidebook and knew the top 5+ things to do as I had been in the vicinity before 15 years earlier.

The problem is I am very high functioning and we met in grad school, then was his hyper focus. Fast FW and I had capacity to plan the wedding, travel, bethesda home purchase, kid 1c nanny, keep working and then WHAM!!! Needed him to take the baton sometimes and he had NO CLUE. He’d go into shutdown mode, lash out, forget decisions we discussed, hide at work more and more. It was so nuts he went to take a neuropsych test as a 38 yo. He was asd/adhd, he still won’t do anything of the things his therapist suggested or anything we (I) read.

Am counting down the days until I think the youngest child can advocate for herself well. kid 1 has the same asd/adhd, dinner neuropsych test in 4th grade.

Not the life I envisioned but I kept my career, entity and clarity in his bad behavior patterns. The incompetency is so constant thought it’s unbelievable.

So your ADHD kid is destined to get divorced too? Or, shouldn’t expect to get married because they’ll never be able to do what is expected of them by their spouse? I find this so sad.

Great question. My asd/adhd kid is female.

On one hand, society still conditions females to be orderly, domestic and caring for others.

On the other hand, she can’t remember what day she last brushed her teeth. Must have been today. So you tell me what the bar is for asd/adhd women is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How is it that everyone on DCUM has ADHD/ASD?

Because if you are not a robot you must be neurodivergent, like many people claim their kids are

Nice vice versa robot joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

NP.

Make them plan a week long vacation.
It’s eye opening.

I just didn’t know what to call it and thank gawd I packed a guidebook and knew the top 5+ things to do as I had been in the vicinity before 15 years earlier.

The problem is I am very high functioning and we met in grad school, then was his hyper focus. Fast FW and I had capacity to plan the wedding, travel, bethesda home purchase, kid 1c nanny, keep working and then WHAM!!! Needed him to take the baton sometimes and he had NO CLUE. He’d go into shutdown mode, lash out, forget decisions we discussed, hide at work more and more. It was so nuts he went to take a neuropsych test as a 38 yo. He was asd/adhd, he still won’t do anything of the things his therapist suggested or anything we (I) read.

Am counting down the days until I think the youngest child can advocate for herself well. kid 1 has the same asd/adhd, dinner neuropsych test in 4th grade.

Not the life I envisioned but I kept my career, entity and clarity in his bad behavior patterns. The incompetency is so constant thought it’s unbelievable.

So your ADHD kid is destined to get divorced too? Or, shouldn’t expect to get married because they’ll never be able to do what is expected of them by their spouse? I find this so sad.

ADHD is more treatable and respondent to medicine than ASD. But i guess they could always get married and live with you! You could keep taking care of them and any grandchildren!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

NP.

Make them plan a week long vacation.
It’s eye opening.

I just didn’t know what to call it and thank gawd I packed a guidebook and knew the top 5+ things to do as I had been in the vicinity before 15 years earlier.

The problem is I am very high functioning and we met in grad school, then was his hyper focus. Fast FW and I had capacity to plan the wedding, travel, bethesda home purchase, kid 1c nanny, keep working and then WHAM!!! Needed him to take the baton sometimes and he had NO CLUE. He’d go into shutdown mode, lash out, forget decisions we discussed, hide at work more and more. It was so nuts he went to take a neuropsych test as a 38 yo. He was asd/adhd, he still won’t do anything of the things his therapist suggested or anything we (I) read.

Am counting down the days until I think the youngest child can advocate for herself well. kid 1 has the same asd/adhd, dinner neuropsych test in 4th grade.

Not the life I envisioned but I kept my career, entity and clarity in his bad behavior patterns. The incompetency is so constant thought it’s unbelievable.

So your ADHD kid is destined to get divorced too? Or, shouldn’t expect to get married because they’ll never be able to do what is expected of them by their spouse? I find this so sad.

ADHD is more treatable and respondent to medicine than ASD. But i guess they could always get married and live with you! You could keep taking care of them and any grandchildren!

Life’s too short to deal with this crap.

I told my kids if anyone admits they have any of these issues, just move on to someone else.

Will make sure to give them a primer for anyone that is trying to lie through it or otherwise shows signs of these problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Serious question…other than just outright asking someone you are dating to tell you if they have ADHD or whatever…is there some other less rude way to figure this out? Will people lie to you about it, even if you ask?

Seems like 90% of the relationship threads have someone (usually the man) with some ADHD or ASG or whatever diagnosis.

these guys don’t actually have ADHD or autism. they’re just selfish and dysfunctional.

while you’re dating, pay attention to whether they successfully manage to keep their houses clean, cook, and take care of themselves. A red flag is if their mother or sister makes any reference (even if apparently flattering) about how you are “so good for him.” but most importantly - suss out how he handles any sort of domestic conflict, like planning a trip, handling chores, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I think you’re thinking about it wrong. Like PP upthread said the benefit, if there is one, is that he just doesn’t have to do much that doesn’t directly help himself. Cash in an envelope at a kids party (blech, btw, everyone who thinks this is great is wtf. It’s not the end of the world but come on people, way to lower the bar) is a great example. He was able to sleep in, didn’t have to wrap anything, etc.

But the real answer is not what the benefit is for him, but what the consequences are. Which is to say, none. Unfortunately, everything is taken care of by you so there’s no fallout for him. You have my sympathy because as a single mom who does it all, I couldn’t imagine another adult in my house sitting around benefiting from my labor. My 12-year-old DD functions like a mini adult to help with chores, her own responsibilities, etc. I’m raising her this way intentionally. When I read threads about husbands that are like this (I assume they think all they need to do is earn money? Which I do as well, so yeah, it’s not enough if you want a family), I feel deep empathy because that sounds really hard.

Everyone says “just let him feel the consequences“ but the truth is that in a family, the people who will really feel it will be the kids. So I’m not sure what the answer is except marriage counseling, and being prepared to walk away if you have to. But that’s also not an easy answer.

He didn't lower the gift bar. You and OP have a different bar for gifts than he does, which is okay, but neither of you believe it is. That's fine as your preference, but it's your responsibility to own it and not martyr yourselves.

If she wanted an expensive wrapped gift that reflected the kid's interests and was the right color, size, and brand (see how many burdens we can add to ourselves?), she could have gotten it herself. Instead she's choosing to blame him.

Relatedly, she doesn't have a choice to make him buy the "right" kind of gift or get there on time. She can only control her and what she controls is her actions and her reactions. She could change her viewpoint to any number of other ways of looking at this, but she doesn't want to. This is not blaming her, it's just explaining how the world actually works.

Yes, I'm familiar with your argument. This is the black and white, binary, "there are only two choices" argument. As if the only options are an "expensive wrapped gift in the right color/size/brand" or an envelope of cash. This is the mantra of the "let them eat pizza, what's wrong with screens, why should I sign them up for sports because I hate taking them to practice and they can just throw the ball outside" folks. What people who make this argument are trying desperately to avoid is the reality that quality parenting, not "my" or "OP's" preference, but decent quality parenting, lives in the middle ground. Just like a quality approach to life. You don't phone it in at work, and you don't have to kiss the boss's @ss. You don't make 6 extra mortgage payments a year, and you don't pay the mortgage late. You do a decent job, most of the time, and life works out pretty well. Perfect is indeed the enemy of good.

If the envelope of cash (we'll stick with that example) was a one-off, it wouldn't matter. But it's not. It might as well have been late arrival at soccer practice, not helping pick up at home, or any other number of half-@ss behaviors that ultimately fall on someone else. But they shouldn't care about shoes in the hallway!, you'll say. According to who? You? Why does that opinion matter more than the person who prefers order? For the same reason OP's husband can't grab a craft kit at Barston's Child's Play on CT ave NW (or in Arlington for those in VA) where they literally gift wrap at the counter while they're checking you out. First, laziness. Second, selfishness. And hey, be that person if you want to. But own it, recognize that it doesn't make you a good co-worker, partner, or friend, and deal with the consequences. This attitude; the "who cares if there are crumbs on the counter" approach, is always, repeat always, taken by the person who not only wants to do less, but wants to disingenuously benefit from the more done by someone else. OP should lower her standards, you say? Maybe. But no where is it suggested that the DH should raise his. And ultimately the goal here is not to grind your way through life, but to be happy, right? Again, a decent job, most of the time. They *both* get to decide what decent means. And that's not happening if it all falls on her.

The main point and the true black and white here is he controls what he does and she controls what she does. Period. She can't control him into doing what she wants. It doesn't matter the quality of what he's doing, it's futile by definition. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks he should or shouldn't do and what he does or doesn't do and why, she can only control herself. Same whether he's disabled or a jerk.

Right now she's letting herself get upset at things for which getting upset isn't the only option. That was the point of mentioning how many constraints could be put on the gift and that there's a continuum of gift choices. His preference falls on a different part of the continuum.

It doesn't matter how many gifts and other tasks there are either. Still the only things she can control are her attitude and her actions. So her time and effort would be better spent accepting that than trying to change him.

so divorce?